CPU Water Block That Installs In 12 Seconds

Ahhhh ok the light bulb went off. Gotcha thx for the paperback version icpiper lol.

With out having additional support on the mobo it is just to much weight in a concentrated area of the CPU.
 
Seems pretty darn niche to me. The amount of additional cooling you get by delidding your CPU I thought was proven to be fairly negligible when this was discussed a few years ago. Doubt that many people who are enthusiastic enough to delid their chips are going to use this water block anyway... Probably better products on the market.

I'm glad modern CPUs have lids. Those old AMD Athlon chips scared the crap out of me when I worked with them years ago, especially with all the cautionary tales about cracking cores... Never mind how F*N hot they were to begin with and they would literally explode and catch fire if you started them without a heat sink (not that I would but still). We've come a long way, this seems like a solution looking for a problem.
 
Jovian said:
This reminds me of the day when AMD had exposed cores and people were chipping the sides when placing CPU's heatsinks incorrectly on them. Never mind your warranty is voided when you remove the lid. This is too extreme of a solution to be viable.
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Forget chipping. I used to burn Durons and Thunderbirds by mismounting HSFs (slightly angled and not making full contact with bare die) :|
 
JDanser said:
TBH I haven't seen an AMD main board since I upgraded from an opty 185 to c2d. Didn't know that's how they were doing it.
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AMD stock socket mounts are still two post.
 
This thing would scare the hell out of me. Not to mention this wouldn't work with a proper soldered on lid. I really enjoy the 2011 style mounting. Simple, effective, and hard to fuck up.
 
Why would the person who takes the time to build a custom water loop, and take the time to delid a cpu, be bothered by using screws to fix the cpu block?

So the target market is people who are only too lazy to take off the other side panel of their case to install the block, but are not too lazy to do all the rest of the shit involved with building a custom loop?
 
I have a case where the motherboard is flat so no bending of anything. I still would never use a retention system like this. I want it locked down tight. No thanks.
 
Hallo to all in this forum
My name is Arek

Armenius said:
Pretty neat. Looks like a good solution to not worrying about if you'll tighten it down too much and crack the core on a delidded CPU. Now we just have to see the motherboard standing vertically like in a real-world scenario and if it stays in place
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I hope this video will explain all your concerns.




It was a big surprise that whole forum was so negative to the idea.
I hope I will put some faith in your harts :)
 
NUDEcnc said:
Hallo to all in this forum
My name is Arek



I hope this video will explain all your concerns.

It was a big surprise that whole forum was so negative to the idea.
I hope I will put some faith in your harts :)
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I want one, where/when can I get one?
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
I don't see why the default retention bracket would be insecure for a water block. I've seen beefy air coolers weighing more than a water block attached that way, and if the water block detaches, it's not as if it will automatically leak...
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Really? Please link me to the beefy air coolers that you have seen that attach this way. I am not familiar with those at all.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
I don't see why the default retention bracket would be insecure for a water block. I've seen beefy air coolers weighing more than a water block attached that way, and if the water block detaches, it's not as if it will automatically leak...
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beefy air coolers don't hang on just the retention bracket. they use the four holes and or a mounting bracket to distribute the weight across the board. but...
after seeing his demo and info idk if i'd be that worried about it. it has three thick and strong points of retention and the bracket flap is pretty damn thick. so it might just be fine. maybe if he sent one to [H] to try...
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
I don't see why the default retention bracket would be insecure for a water block. I've seen beefy air coolers weighing more than a water block attached that way, and if the water block detaches, it's not as if it will automatically leak...
Click to expand...
The concern isn't the bracket, this thing is mounted to the lid of the CPU with a lateral force applied when mounted vertically all while having a nice copper lip around the exposed core of the CPU. if it breaks from a sheer force it will take out the CPU die as well, possibly causing ~1700$ in damage. The video is nice but I don't have sound to play back but I didn't see any sheer forces applied only compression forces which aren't being debated here. I know I can strap 1kg of copper to a socket hanging off a shim on an exposed die but with loose thermal compound not solder or metal glue/weld which detaches safely as I have experiences from a violent drop of my tower. Sure the motherboard is destroyed but that is far cheaper than most CPUs.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
Well, beefy is a relative term.

Certainly not the huge rectangular heatpipe ones, but definitely ones that weigh more than a little acetal topped water block.
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OK. Please link me to any heatsink and fan cooling unit that attaches the same way this water block does.
 
The good thing with water block is the weight is right on socket, unlike a HS that hangs off.
But since your mounting on the retention bracket which also clamps the CPU die, a impact, jarring to system maybe shift the waterblcok ever so slightly to hurt die, maybe.
Would need to somehow simulate that for sure i wouldn't want to use a delid CPU on this.
 
I am waiting for the 11 second version. Using speed as a selling point is not the way I would have approached this idea.
 
I like it, once everything is installed I don't really move anything afterward anyway. My main concern is how consistent is the height difference from chip to chip? I'd hate to have poor contact or crush something.
 
I personally like the design. Too bad I'm switching over to RyZen or I would purchase one of these blocks. I'm not worried about dropping my computer and ripping the cpu die off.
 
NUDEcnc said:
... It was a big surprise that whole forum was so negative to the idea...
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This forum has a LONG history of witch hunts. Calling out scams and whatnot. It's a lot of fun. But don't feel too bad about it. It's good to be a skeptic and demand evidence. We are all learning. No one here is calling your product a scam, it's just that people are recognizing an additional risk in an already expensive situation with little gain, and voicing their concerns in colour.

I'm not so sure your video will subdue the more legitimate concerns. Folks are very well aware of the forces exerted by the retention bracket, but the retention bracket never has to deal with any additional or variable forces. Once it is clamped down, the force remains steadfast as a linear, compression force and nothing is ever redirected away from that force vector. There is never any torsion or shear on the socket. In fact, you pointed out a key design feature of the bracket hinge itself. The hinge is off center and weak to be an engineered break point. It ensures the bracket alone twists and breaks away before adequate force does the same to the socket's mounting pins into the PCB.

Your video demonstrates the kind of force applied linearly, but this is not a concern. Standard cooling mounts may increase the linear force down upon the processor and socket well in excess of what the retention bracket can, but there is very little concern for this additional, linear force. (I'm unaware of any maximum threshold, but perhaps you can use your fancy software to tell us what kind of force is applied in total between the socket bracket and various common cooling solutions. That would be cool.) What we don't want are any forces in any other direction upon the socket. Any variable forces induced by gravity pushing the HS or block are usually perpendicular to the mounting direction. Thus, ideally and intentionally mounted to pliable ("safe for flexing") areas of the PCB immediately around the socket, keeping those golden socket pins nice and exactly-where-they-are.

Ultimately, it's about peace of mind. The more flexing at this point, the more chance something occurs where nothing should occur. I've never seen a motherboard manufacturer gloat about their socket-to-PCB mounting prowess, and it's not something I've seen tested. If you would like to prepare a servo rig that gently rocks sockets all day to the point of failure, let us know who makes the best socket glue. :)

In the meantime, send me a free block and I'll test my framing skills. This would go nicely beside my Phantom stocks.
 
Kyle, get one and test it out. then the circle of trust will be complete!! lol
 
Did any of you notice in the video posted with the bricks being piled on that they were hollow?
Checkout the 5:35 mark..
upload_2017-1-9_23-15-46.png
 
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Yeah I noticed it when I watched the video. It seems a bit sketchy to me. I don't know how flat the heat spreader thing is but that bottom brick looks like it's not touching it at all. It looks like the object is in the hollow part and it has no weight on it.
 
JosiahBradley said:
Wow, I thought the video was trying to be legit but now it seems more fishy, why use hollow bricks?
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usually easier to find, where i live they don't even sell solid clay bricks anymore unless you special order large amounts of them, just the hollow ones you see in his video or the crappy fake concrete ones. but at least he showed they were hollow. but yeah i agree solid ones would of been a better idea.
 
No real action? So Arek didn't walk the talk. He just talked the walk in this video.

This is where his business hangs on his credibility.....

.....BY SHOWING US THE WHOLE 9 YARDS FROM THE START TO END IN REAL TIME.
 
It's an innovative concept. He should have shown the force distribution across the die of a delidded CPU and/or the surrounding substrate as a result of this water block installation. I also didn't see any material specification in the solidworks model, which is a major factor on how much force is required to close the clamp and what the CPU is experiencing as a result of those applied forces. THEN you need to determine static force distribution as a result of all the other shit that is added to the block, and then account for any dynamic forces due to installation or potential PC movement. To me, the stress on the actual CPU is the primary concern. I don't really foresee this thing falling off or causing issues with the bracket itself, but causing damage from excessive forces or improper contact on the die.

Also, I'd like to know what the variability of the die height is. This design might have serious issues if it were in the 25 micrometer range (roughly 1/1000 in). You might have dies that are too short and have less than optimal contact or ones that are too tall and more susceptible to damage. It's not like they are very elastic...though a determination of the degree of elasticity would be valuable as well.

Source: I am an Aerospace Engineer. I design things for a living.
 
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Speed of install and small size. Could anything be better in ITX and smaller setups?

And besides that, I'm a BIG fan of DeepCool's GAMMAXX coolers for a similar reason. They use Intel's push locks. I have literally lost count of how many people claim to have had those plastic pins fail. I can tell you, from years and countless systems installed that in the dozens and dozens of cases of so-called "failed" intel style fan mounts all but one or two (and those were OLD fans messed with who knows how much) were installed WRONG. Practically everyone who doesn't build PCs for a living pushes and twists... which both releases the clip and damages the mechanism when you do it over and over because you don't know why your fan isn't staying on.

I'm actually explaining that situation because everything I've ever seen happen to a cpu socket has been from improper installation. I've never even seen or heard of a failed Intel socket mount. It's a myth. I'm sure someone has done it, but they were either a pro overclocker doing something crazy or a bull in a china shop who did something horribly wrong installing the cooler.

If these sockets can survive having Noctua D15 sized coolers attached (in any typical standing desktop there's substantial loads immediately around and on the socket no matter how good the back plate is with something that big) then I don't see how this tiny water block is going to easily damage your socket.

How much side load or rotational force should you be expecting from your tubing? Because that's the only vector for problems unless you are doing something highly unusual.
 
LurkerLito said:
Yeah I noticed it when I watched the video. It seems a bit sketchy to me. I don't know how flat the heat spreader thing is but that bottom brick looks like it's not touching it at all. It looks like the object is in the hollow part and it has no weight on it.
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SilverSliver said:
I don't care about the product but those bricks are hollow and not even touching!
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Um.. You do realize that he wasn't actually showing a test with those bricks. He was demonstrating how much force is involved using common (only slightly more hollow than standard U.S. bricks, that are not solid either) heavy items. The fact that they were hollow and not touching the chip is otterly irrelevant to the demonstration.

Also, if your tubing is introducing so much lateral forces to your water block to be able to break the CPU mount... The problem isn't with the mount, It's with the build. If you can't heat-form your tubing to not be yanking around on your socket mount, they buy some elbows (Yeah, they'll add a little flow resistance but not enough to make any difference) and run it that way.
 
The hollow bricks are a non issue as that is how bricks are made and that was a demonstration of weight not a test. I like the design and would love to try one on my wifes computer. I think some real world testing is in order and would be very interesting. I have no concern that the bracket would hold the water block very securly I just have concern of breaking that core during install.
 
ncc0063 said:
Did any of you notice in the video posted with the bricks being piled on that they were hollow?
Checkout the 5:35 mark..
View attachment 14413
Click to expand...

They aren't hollow, their called Frogged Bricks, they are actually pretty common in certain areas / types of construction... I don't think he is trying to fool anyone, he is just pointing out that 130N is about the same as 30lbs, probably the same as about 5 of those bricks.
 
PhotoBobBarker said:
Um.. You do realize that he wasn't actually showing a test with those bricks. He was demonstrating how much force is involved using common (only slightly more hollow than standard U.S. bricks, that are not solid either) heavy items. The fact that they were hollow and not touching the chip is otterly irrelevant to the demonstration.

Also, if your tubing is introducing so much lateral forces to your water block to be able to break the CPU mount... The problem isn't with the mount, It's with the build. If you can't heat-form your tubing to not be yanking around on your socket mount, they buy some elbows (Yeah, they'll add a little flow resistance but not enough to make any difference) and run it that way.
Click to expand...
104081ecfc1d755814a1f6a8bbed3371.jpg
 
panhead said:
How much stress is the CPU package and the socket designed to accept?
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Every CPU has it's own specifications, there are data sheets online. You can check the standards for the motherboard form factor and socket type as well and find out what everything is supposed to be made to handle.

If I remember correctly, Kyle will remember better, there was an issue with some sockets awhile back that a manufacturer or two were using and the socket's weren't strong enough to keep the mounting pressure from damaging the CPU package.
 
deliding is risk. lateral forces can crack the die. on the video, the block is custom cutted but there is plenty of room for it to slide inside the retention bracket. check 4:50-4:55 to see how much lateral movement the design allows.
with that said, i still believe it is possible to mill a block that fits even more perfectly to reduce the risk of cracking the CPU. best of luck to nudeCNC.
 
Advil said:
Speed of install and small size. Could anything be better in ITX and smaller setups?

And besides that, I'm a BIG fan of DeepCool's GAMMAXX coolers for a similar reason. They use Intel's push locks. I have literally lost count of how many people claim to have had those plastic pins fail. I can tell you, from years and countless systems installed that in the dozens and dozens of cases of so-called "failed" intel style fan mounts all but one or two (and those were OLD fans messed with who knows how much) were installed WRONG. Practically everyone who doesn't build PCs for a living pushes and twists... which both releases the clip and damages the mechanism when you do it over and over because you don't know why your fan isn't staying on.

I'm actually explaining that situation because everything I've ever seen happen to a cpu socket has been from improper installation. I've never even seen or heard of a failed Intel socket mount. It's a myth. I'm sure someone has done it, but they were either a pro overclocker doing something crazy or a bull in a china shop who did something horribly wrong installing the cooler.

If these sockets can survive having Noctua D15 sized coolers attached (in any typical standing desktop there's substantial loads immediately around and on the socket no matter how good the back plate is with something that big) then I don't see how this tiny water block is going to easily damage your socket.

How much side load or rotational force should you be expecting from your tubing? Because that's the only vector for problems unless you are doing something highly unusual.
Click to expand...
To me the concern isn't the socket, it's the load the CPU itself experiences. It need to be delidded for this block to work.
 
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