chinesepiratefood
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This phone has good hardware for sure, but all the videos I watched it lagged more than my tegra 3 Nexus 7.
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Galaxy S4 - Watch Thread....
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Mchart
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Yet those people could walk into an Apple store and pay $80 for a replacement if they are outside of the 1 year warranty period. Applecare which extends the warranty out to 2 years cost $100. Of course, that includes more then just battery replacement. If you dropped the phone in water and crushed it with a monster truck you'd walk out with a $50 replacement. Even out of warranty a full replacement is $130.
Now, i'm well aware a S3 battery replacement costs a hell of a lot less. That being said, how many of those same people walking around with broken iPhones do you think would take the time and money to go on Amazon and order a replacement battery? The reality is that most would likely walk into the store where they bought the phone and then be charged an arm and a leg for someone to replace it for them anyways. (Hint - This is why many people sitting at 1.5 years with ANY phone are just going to sit around with a half broken phone waiting for their contract expire. This doesn't just happen to Apple devices.)
A user who is smart enough to not be ripped off and order/swap the S3 battery on their own will be just as intelligent to do the same with their iPhone. (The iPhone 5 battery doesn't cost much more then the S3 battery mind you)
And really, if you want to bring up the whole discussion of warranty/support options this is the area where Apple products are entirely unmatched.
The entire point of this discussion was weighing the benefits of an easily swappable battery though. I posit that those who actually make use of being able to easily swap the battery on a phone like the S3 make up a very small number of total consumers. Thus, it would be to Samsung's benefit to stop doing that and allow for a mildly larger battery for more battery life which is an easily noted 'feature' / 'spec' used and easily appreciated by the *entire* consumer base for the product. As long as they don't go full retard with how they seal the case of the phone it's a non-issue IMO. Those that are inclined will have no problem unscrewing 2 screws after purchasing a cheap replacement battery off the web. You can't act as if the 40 million Galaxy buyers are all power users. The 40 million galaxy buyers are going to be just as inept as all the iPhone buyers. No matter how much you want to beleive otherwise. Power users are not the source of success for Samsung. The source of success for Samsung (just like Apple) are the millions they throw at advertising. Not to mention they both are delivering products which appeal to a very broad audience.
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Finally found what I was looking for. In Samsung's press release:
I'm glad to admit that I was wrong. Now, while I'm eating this crow, some unofficial numbers. Assuming that their 1.9ghz quad is Krait, and their 1.6ghz "octa" is their A15/A7 hybrid, here is a rough idea of how their CPUs should perform:
Rated DMIPs per clock:
A15 - 3.5
Krait - 3.3
A7 - 1.9
DMIPS per core (assuming 1.9ghz Krait, 1.6ghz A15, and 1.2ghz A7):
A15 - 5,600
Krait - 6,270
A7 - 2,280
DMIPS total (same assumption), and some comparative phones:
A15 - 22,400
Krait - 25,080
A7 - 9,120
SGS3 (global) - 14,000
Nexus 4: - 19,800
With that said, it looks like CPU peformance should be slightly better on the US S4, but battery scaling is potentially better on the global version (too early to be certain, we haven't seen Big.Little in action yet). GPUs are another matter entirely and I won't go that deep into it. My preference has been and still is A15 over Krait, but my demands of a phone are totally different than 99.9% of users here. You honestly cannot go wrong with either.
I'm glad to admit that I was wrong. Now, while I'm eating this crow, some unofficial numbers. Assuming that their 1.9ghz quad is Krait, and their 1.6ghz "octa" is their A15/A7 hybrid, here is a rough idea of how their CPUs should perform:
Rated DMIPs per clock:
A15 - 3.5
Krait - 3.3
A7 - 1.9
DMIPS per core (assuming 1.9ghz Krait, 1.6ghz A15, and 1.2ghz A7):
A15 - 5,600
Krait - 6,270
A7 - 2,280
DMIPS total (same assumption), and some comparative phones:
A15 - 22,400
Krait - 25,080
A7 - 9,120
SGS3 (global) - 14,000
Nexus 4: - 19,800
With that said, it looks like CPU peformance should be slightly better on the US S4, but battery scaling is potentially better on the global version (too early to be certain, we haven't seen Big.Little in action yet). GPUs are another matter entirely and I won't go that deep into it. My preference has been and still is A15 over Krait, but my demands of a phone are totally different than 99.9% of users here. You honestly cannot go wrong with either.
Godmachine
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This. I couldn't deal without being able to change out batteries or insert an SD card with my music and movies on demand.
Dislike that Samsung is doing away with features that set it apart from the Apple ecosystem nonsense.
Obviously having a removable battery doesn't hurt their sales, and not having one will be a massive PR hit for zero or minimal benefit. Perhaps you missed the fact they already have the largest batteries and battery life in Android.
And you really cannot advocate a strategy that voids warranty, no matter if it's 1 tiny screw. It's completely different and no one cares if Apple stores will do it. A 'mildly larger' battery is useless ad copy when you already have the largest one as I showed, plus it's trivial, safe and easy to swap batteries, add a bigger one etc. Yet somehow you keep insisting that breaking open your phone with tools and voiding warranties is the same thing
when did that happen? The RAZR Maxx HD has the best battery life in an android phone. Heck, even the droid dna had been benchmarked to last longer than the galaxy s3.
P.S. Samsung should have called this phone the Galaxy S3S...
ItaliaFerrari
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Why so?
Arguing semantics is useless. I could say that the iPhone 4S should have been named the iPhone 5.
The SGS4 is a big as an upgrade over the SGS3 as the SGS3 was over the SGS2.
The pure processing power, RAM, a huge array of camera options on the 13MP shooter, 5" 1080p Super AMOLED screen and 4.2.2 out of the box. What more can you expect?
The SGS4 also looks a lot more attractive than the SGS3 in terms of aesthetics. The SGS4 has a taller and slimmer bezel and more screen to bezel ratio. It isn't as curvy as the SGS3 but still has curved edges for ergonomic purposes.
In terms of aesthetic attractiveness, think the SGS4 is a refined version of the previous SGS3 formula.
And in terms of hardware, the SGS4 is a huge upgrade over the SGS3.
What did they remove?
TheMadHatterXxX
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For those moments you have to glance up at the road while driving instead of paying attention to your phone.
dandragonrage
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Why would you even consider a Cortex A9 chip in 2013? The A6 was old news before it even came out, modified or not. We've had Cortex A9 chips for far too long now.
The Apple A6 is not a Cortex A9. You're thinking of the A5.
King of Heroes
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Has anyone heard anything about what the price is on this will be (locked and unlocked)? I mean, I imagine its going to sit on the high end of the ~$650-$800 price range that most of the flagships sit at (which means its probably out of reach for me).
Eh, while I mostly agree on the advantage of having a memory card slot and a removable battery, I seriously doubt removing those will lead to a "massive" PR hit. Among enthusiasts sure, but among the much larger market that Samsung spends a crap ton of money marketing to? I don't think so.
Please remember that smartphones nowadays are less about functionality and more about status. This is why Samsung and Apple and Microsoft hold these hyped up press events. To show the public what the next cool/hip/in/<insert_whatever_terms_kids_use_these_days> thing is. They can and have removed features (or restricted them, such as not updating certain phones to the newest Android release) without suffering any huge loss of face (you need to accept that the RDF is not exclusive to Apple), and will continue to do so going forward.
Personally, as much as I would like a removable battery and a memory card slot, its more important whether or not I can actually afford to buy it. The Nexus 4, strictly for example, doesn't have a removable battery, a memory card slot or 4G LTE. But I can overlook those things because its priced like nothing else in its class. In other words, the sacrifices were actually justified (for me). Having a memory card slot and a removable battery doesn't mean a heck of alot if I can't actually buy the thing.
Eh, while I mostly agree on the advantage of having a memory card slot and a removable battery, I seriously doubt removing those will lead to a "massive" PR hit. Among enthusiasts sure, but among the much larger market that Samsung spends a crap ton of money marketing to? I don't think so.
Please remember that smartphones nowadays are less about functionality and more about status. This is why Samsung and Apple and Microsoft hold these hyped up press events. To show the public what the next cool/hip/in/<insert_whatever_terms_kids_use_these_days> thing is. They can and have removed features (or restricted them, such as not updating certain phones to the newest Android release) without suffering any huge loss of face (you need to accept that the RDF is not exclusive to Apple), and will continue to do so going forward.
Personally, as much as I would like a removable battery and a memory card slot, its more important whether or not I can actually afford to buy it. The Nexus 4, strictly for example, doesn't have a removable battery, a memory card slot or 4G LTE. But I can overlook those things because its priced like nothing else in its class. In other words, the sacrifices were actually justified (for me). Having a memory card slot and a removable battery doesn't mean a heck of alot if I can't actually buy the thing.
dandragonrage
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It's just a modified A9 (or you might say an A9/A15 hybrid), which is not good enough (though it was better than sticking with regular A9 for a bit longer like everyone else did). It's not an A15. If it's not an A15 or better, I'm not buying it, and the A6 is worse than an A15. I've had Cortex A9 crap for long enough. I wouldn't upgrade my PC to one with the same type of CPU in it, and I sure as hell won't do that with my phone, either.
Pretty sure ARM knows how to design ARM CPUs way better than Apple and Qualcomm do. Buying a non-ARM-designed ARM CPU to me is the equivalent of buying a Cyrix 6x86 back in the day. Yes, Apple improved the Cortex A9 in their A6 chip, but they were already TWO ARM generations behind when they brought that chip out, and their "improvements" were things that ARM has already done anyway, so why should Apple get much credit for anything? It's like calling AMD awesome because the K6-3 beat the Pentium 2, but the Pentium 2 wasn't Intel's current CPU anymore anyway. They may improve and start lagging behind ARM less, but for now ARM is still way ahead of any third party using ARM designs.
Personally I prefer TI for ARM chips though, because their documentation and community support is the best. Too bad they have little interest in phones these days
I'm not making my choice for A15 chip yet, but I will probably stand behind Nvidia, mainly because Tegra 4 has real graphics. Adreno and PowerVR crap have HORRIBLE incomplete drivers. Nvidia will beat the crap out of them in that category at least. Their GPU drivers will be significantly better. They will probably not be the best in all categories, but I do expect them to have that advantage, at least. We'll see, though.
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blahblahyoutoo
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if only the phone weren't so ugly...
Well for me it's overgrown S3 with gimmicks I don't need. I think Samsung went too much Apple, and just went with "lets add something useless, change design a bit and call it best thing since coming of Christ" strategy. Too bad that the build quality and design are still below rivals.
S4 shows to competition like Sony and LG that they can easily catch up and make their own flagship attractive. Next year will be interesting, very interesting in Android handset business. And this year, I think I'd pick Xperia Z over SIV. Mostly because of screen and design.
S4 shows to competition like Sony and LG that they can easily catch up and make their own flagship attractive. Next year will be interesting, very interesting in Android handset business. And this year, I think I'd pick Xperia Z over SIV. Mostly because of screen and design.
It's just a modified A9 (or you might say an A9/A15 hybrid), which is not good enough (though it was better than sticking with regular A9 for a bit longer like everyone else did). It's not an A15. If it's not an A15 or better, I'm not buying it, and the A6 is worse than an A15. I've had Cortex A9 crap for long enough. I wouldn't upgrade my PC to one with the same type of CPU in it, and I sure as hell won't do that with my phone, either.
Pretty sure ARM knows how to design ARM CPUs way better than Apple and Qualcomm do. Buying a non-ARM-designed ARM CPU to me is the equivalent of buying a Cyrix 6x86 back in the day. Yes, Apple improved the Cortex A9 in their A6 chip, but they were already TWO ARM generations behind when they brought that chip out, and their "improvements" were things that ARM has already done anyway, so why should Apple get much credit for anything? It's like calling AMD awesome because the K6-3 beat the Pentium 2, but the Pentium 2 wasn't Intel's current CPU anymore anyway. They may improve and start lagging behind ARM less, but for now ARM is still way ahead of any third party using ARM designs.
Personally I prefer TI for ARM chips though, because their documentation and community support is the best. Too bad they have little interest in phones these days
Incorrect. A6 uses the Swift MPCore, which is an A15 derivative, not A9. Multiple independent tests and benchmarks confirm performance expected of an A15 at the same clockspeed. Chip was designed by a semiconductor bought out by Apple that used to co-develop chips with Samsung. They helped design the original iPhone SOCs and Hummingbird (Exynos3).
T4rd
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This has to be the "geekiest" quote and reply I've seen in these forums. I absolutely have no idea what you guys are talking about. LOL! I wish I was as smart
Smart phones are srs bsns 'round these parts
dandragonrage
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This has to be the "geekiest" quote and reply I've seen in these forums. I absolutely have no idea what you guys are talking about. LOL! I wish I was as smart
Assuming you meant what I was talking about, to simplify, my point is that buying a Cortex A9 phone today is like buying a Core 2 Duo computer today.
King of Heroes
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Honestly, as long as the phone is fast and responsive enough, does it really matter what CPU is in it? Your Core 2 Duo comparison is actually pretty accurate, since alot of Core 2 machines are "fast enough" for certain people (probably no one on these forums though).
T4rd
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I agree, but what appeals more to me about the newer SoCs is power efficiency. These newer quad cores are much more power efficient than the older dual cores or even last gen quads. That coupled with an even higher battery capacity is a nice combo/upgrade from any previous gen phone.
ChronoReverse
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I agree about the gimmicks in the software but the GS4 is actually smaller and lighter than the GS3 despite the larger screen.
There seems to be the typical samsung gimmicks in the software with this phone. Can't wait for a review to tell us what gimmick is useful.
Tyler-Durden
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This iPhone fanboy supreme is very intrigued with the GS4. Looking forward to some reviews.
A lot of people on forums like this are used to frequent upgrades. I never understood how so many people could afford to upgrade their phones ever year, 6 months or even faster.
The GS4 is not competing with the GS3. For someone wih a 2 year old phone like GS2, this is a massive upgrade.
The GS4 is not competing with the GS3. For someone wih a 2 year old phone like GS2, this is a massive upgrade.
T4rd
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It's not too bad if you wait a month or so after launch and buy used and sell your old phone to recoup most of it back. It's no different than a lot of people on here upgrading their PCs after every new generation of hardware comes out. If you do it right, it should only cost you around $200-300 for every upgrade. That's not bad when spread out over 6 months to a year, at least to me anyways, I know we're all on different incomes here.
Is that $200-300 total or extra over the price you paid for the phone when you signed the contract? When I bought my GS3 at the end of my contract with Sprint, my Evo 4G was not even worth $40. And when the Note 2 came out 6 months later, I don't think I could've switched to it cheaply.
I actually may look into doing this if there's a really great X-Phone or Nexus at the end of this year.
txsizzler
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At this point, the hardware on the phones is so powerful, that I don't really care anymore how many cores it has, what bazillionth x bazillionth resolution and ppi it can cram on a 5" screen, how many megapixels, ultrapixels, gigapixels, the cameras have. I just want REGULAR, FULL-SUPPORT updates that goes in line with the Nexus line of phones. Is that too much to ask for? I know the manufacturer makes gobbs of $$$ off of selling folks new handsets, but enough already!
MisterClean
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It's the upgrade i've been waiting for to finally retire my aging Atrix 4g. I gave it a little kick in the pants with CM10, but it's still not as quick as the current crop, and using a hacked together version of CM10 has it's problems as well.
I'm excited to finally move to a phone with actual developer support that will (hopefully) get regular updates.
Also, wireless charging. that's the big thing I'm waiting to see about. The article on Engadget said the it will have qi wireless charging, but I'm not sure if that will be standard? or just an upcharge option. if the GS4 doesn't have wireless charging, I may skip it and wait for the next big phone that does.
T4rd
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The $200-$300 is the difference between how much you paid for the new phone and how much you sold your old phone for. This really only works if you swap phone at least every 6 months and maybe up to a year if the phone is still in demand. You could have probably sold your S3 for at least $350-$400 when the Note 2 came out, then you could have either bought a new Note 2 for around $600-$650 or maybe waited a month or so and found one used for around $500-$550 or even less depending on condition. That would put you out anywhere between $100-$300.
The Note phones are a bit better for this because they seem to be retaining value a bit more than standard smart phones because of the phablet form factor and S-Pen. The original Note still goes for at least $300. Shoot, AT&T still charges $200 on contract for the Original Note and it's still $75 on Amazon.
GotNoRice
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I'm glad I went with a Note 2 instead of waiting for this. The Note 2 still has a bigger screen, and a bigger battery - the two features that are most important to me.
Not sure why there is so much Exynos hate in this thread. The quad-core Exynos in my Note 2 is blazing fast and has not given me any problems. Given how popular the Note 2 is, I'd say US carriers are already "supporting" the Exynos.
Not sure why there is so much Exynos hate in this thread. The quad-core Exynos in my Note 2 is blazing fast and has not given me any problems. Given how popular the Note 2 is, I'd say US carriers are already "supporting" the Exynos.
dandragonrage
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My SGS2E4GT is usually fast/responsive enough, but sometimes it just absolutely crawls (and no, I don't run several apps on it at a time, nor do I do ANY 3d gaming on it). I did think out my C2D comparison when I said it
but even if C2D is good enough for someone, they'd still be crazy for buying a C2D PC for the same price as an Ivy/Sandy Bridge PC.I only upgrade phones when the new one improves several things - CPU, memory, screen, etc. SGS4 looks like it qualifies. I still friggin hate phones w/o a physical keyboard (because it's simply not acceptable for a virtual keyboard to pop up and take up 2/3 of my screen - especially on a junky 480p screen like my E4GT has) but the rest of the country are jerks who only care about how something LOOKS and not how it WORKS. But it looks like it could be an improvement in a few other things, at least.
The US S4 is confirmed to have Snapdragon 600, as suspected, which is great news. Once again we will have the best version of the S4. I hope US retail is same time as the worldwide launch in April.
Samsung also confirmed all the software features are coming to the S3 and Note. This is what makes them so great - much better support than other oem's.
Samsung also confirmed all the software features are coming to the S3 and Note. This is what makes them so great - much better support than other oem's.
dandragonrage
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Well crap. I might have to disregard it now. Qualcomm isn't actually using the A15 designs, are they? Or was that just for the 200 and/or 400 models?
I don't appreciate ARM licensees branching off and trying to save a buck by modifying an old design instead of ponying up for the real thing.
Yup, it's still Krait, not A15. Though I haven't seen anything that bothers me about this, still seems fast.
dandragonrage
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Dealbreaker for me, then, 0% chance I'll buy it. I didn't buy the Cyrix 6x86, and I'm not going to buy a "poor man's A15" either. If they want my business, they can go ahead and use the real thing. :/ sucks. But I'm sure someone will do the right thing.
T4rd
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Yeah, I dunno why either. I still see custom kernels for the Note 2 with the Exynos 4412, so how does this lack of "documentation" affect anything? The Note 2 already gets great battery life and has stellar performance with the stock kernel anyways (I've just stuck with the stock Kernel for all my ROMs for stability reasons and don't see a need to undervolt or overclock). I think I would much rather have the (seemingly) more power efficient Octa than the Snapdragon 600, I'm sure they both perform about the same anyways, esp from any real-use perspective.
Have we even seen how the Exynos 5410 compares with the Snapdragon 600 yet?
dandragonrage
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They often have to pull binary blobs of certain drivers out of official ROMs to get custom ROMs working for Samsung Exynos phones. That's the case with the E4GT I have anyway. Exynos really is bad as far as documentation and code releases go. It's arguably not even legal for these companies to modify the GPL Linux kernel code without releasing the source to it, but that is what most of them do. Samsung GPS stuff especially sucks to work with and is why a lot of custom ROMs for Galaxy phones have awful GPS performance.
TI has the best documentation, but phones don't seem to interest them anymore
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