Would Fermi require a full system overhaul?

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MurderCityDevil

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I will quite possibly upgrade my gtx285 to Fermi (whatever number they're going to give the highest end one, GTX380?? whatever) when it comes out next year; however, I currently have no plans of upgrading the rest of my system whatsoever. As far as I can tell, even when gaming is concerned, my system is still future proofed for quite a while. However, with high end graphics card needing increasingly powerful cpus to unleash their full potential, would Fermi on my current system be a huge bottleneck? Keep in mind, a new CPU would mean a new mobo, new ram, new everything. Also, I know it's impossible to say for sure as no one knows concretely what Fermi's specs are going to be (much less the real world gaming performance), but if we assume that it's going to be at least as fast as ATI's 5 series and use that as a foundation for comparison, would I need to upgrade? My current specs are in sig.
 
criccio said:
Looks like you asked this question a bit to early... ;)
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Not necessarily, if I receive overwhelming replies that I won't get any noticeable difference from upgrading because of a bottleneck, then I'll disregard buying Fermi and instead spend the money on things that I need for Christmas, for instance.
 
No one knows at this point unless you work for nvidia. The only reason to upgrade is if you can't play the games you want to play at your preferred settings or if you want to take advantage of new features like DX11. "future proof" is very arbitrary to your needs. I'd say, let the card come out and compare people who have different machines with the card.
 
If your system is using fine threaded screws right now you might have to get a new one that will accept the course threaded wood screws.

Also no one knows because the card isn't out.
 
Since it's not out yet, waiting will save you some money.
Prices for the platform should drop some at least by the time the top end gaming Fermi is released.
 
If you think you need an overhaul then go get one. However I wouldn't bother until we actually know how well the cards perform. This will protect your wallet a little bit and then allow you to buy what is best at the time.
 
well DX11 is appealing...mainly I want to play AVP2 when that comes out, and doesn't crysis 2 have support for dx11 features?

Maybe I should rephrase my question a little bit - does a 5870 get bottlenecked by a Q6600 and DDR2? In other words, if I was to buy a 5870 or even a 5970 right now with my current hardware, would I notice a difference in gameplay or would the gain be lost because of a bottleneck?
 
There isn't a good way to answer you since anything I say will be completely based on speculation, but here goes:

There is a big difference in performance with my tri sli setup when I OC from 2.6 to 3.6. If Fermi comes out and is twice as fast as a gtx285 (pure guess), it stands to reason that you will need a very fast cpu to get the most out of it. If you compare benches between a qx9650 and i7 920 at 3.6 from this [H] article, you can see the i7 is faster by a small margin on the 4870x2.

http://hardocp.com/article/2009/05/19/real_world_gameplay_cpu_scaling/11

They don't address a more powerful gpu setup, but from what I have seen on my system I think the faster the cpu the better. I am not talking about benches, but more my experience playing games being smoother while OC. You will also note that all of the really expensive botique systems with tri sli or 5970 crossfire x use super high OCs to feed the beasts.
 
Yes you need an overhaul.your system is not worthy of the mighty Fermi oh lowly one.

:D
 
I think it's going to depend on how much this beast costs. I doubt it will be less than 500 bucks at launch, and I'd have to sell the 285 to get it...so we'll see I suppose.
 
Well if Fermi really is all about direct compute this that and the other then no one will have to upgrade any other part of their system since the new card should just do it all. :D
 
You can probably use the 5870 or the 5970 as a measuring stick.

Best case scenario would put it 10-20% faster than the 5870
and require no more than 300w TDP (PCIe Spec)

Worst case scenario is its exactly the same as the 5870 but will no doubt require more power.

if you use that you can guage if you need a system overhaul.
 
H-street said:
You can probably use the 5870 or the 5970 as a measuring stick.

Best case scenario would put it 10-20% faster than the 5870
and require no more than 300w TDP (PCIe Spec)

Worst case scenario is its exactly the same as the 5870 but will no doubt require more power.

if you use that you can guage if you need a system overhaul.
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That's pretty goddamn bad for a best case scenario. Why do you think that?
 
the [H] cpu evaluation wasn't based on the performance of one 4870x2 but two of them in crossfire x, so it should give you a good approximation of how your cpu will perform with a gpu setup as powerful as four r700 chips working together.
 
legion hardware has nothing but averages. its the extreme highs and lows that you need to be concerned about with cpu clocks.
 
rennyf77 said:
legion hardware has nothing but averages. its the extreme highs and lows that you need to be concerned about with cpu clocks.
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Better yet, a full blown Frames/Time line graph, that so few reviewers seem to do.

([H] does, though :D)
 
I also couldn't find the resolution they used, maybe I'm blind. Yeah, it's a lackluster review - but it's a decent enough answer to a silly question :-p
 
spintroniX said:
I also couldn't find the resolution they used, maybe I'm blind. Yeah, it's a lackluster review - but it's a decent enough answer to a silly question :-p
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silly or not, thanks for the effort to answer it. Looks like I'll be upgrading if the price is right.
 
MurderCityDevil said:
That's pretty goddamn bad for a best case scenario. Why do you think that?
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20% better than a 5870 is stellar performance for a single card.. looking back at history of cards and development the fermi should come in right around 10-20% of the 5870 performance, expecting anything more than that is just not being realistic.

WHy do you think 20% over the 5870 is bad should be the question?

And if moores law tells us anything it should come in about the same speed as the 295 (which is on par with the single 5870)
 
H-street said:
20% better than a 5870 is stellar performance for a single card.. looking back at history of cards and development the fermi should come in right around 10-20% of the 5870 performance, expecting anything more than that is just not being realistic.

WHy do you think 20% over the 5870 is bad should be the question?

And if moores law tells us anything it should come in about the same speed as the 295 (which is on par with the single 5870)
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Maybe my statement is not entirely educated. I was under the impression that Fermi would be the equivalent of the 8800 series in terms of performance/architecture leaps, but this may be based on old, outdated claims. From what I understand, a 5970 is around the same performance as GTX285 in SLI? I was assuming, I guess hoping is a better word, that the top-end Fermi gaming card would be around the same in terms of performance, just in single-card form. I suppose I lean towards the green side and that's why I have high hopes for Fermi, I just try to not let it show or come off as being a "fanboy". But its been said a million times - way too early to tell. I just hope it's worth the wait.
 
Let's put it this way:

I hope ANY next-gen high end card will need a new system to prevent a bottleneck, as that is a nice indicator of how much better it is compared to the previous gen.
 
MurderCityDevil said:
Maybe my statement is not entirely educated. I was under the impression that Fermi would be the equivalent of the 8800 series in terms of performance/architecture leaps, but this may be based on old, outdated claims. From what I understand, a 5970 is around the same performance as GTX285 in SLI? I was assuming, I guess hoping is a better word, that the top-end Fermi gaming card would be around the same in terms of performance, just in single-card form. I suppose I lean towards the green side and that's why I have high hopes for Fermi, I just try to not let it show or come off as being a "fanboy". But its been said a million times - way too early to tell. I just hope it's worth the wait.
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Nothing wrong with liking the green team. Their drivers are great and released frequently to add support for SLI in the latest games right when they come out. SLI also scales well. You only become a fanboy when you start ranting at other people about how much the other company sucks or refuse to see reason. If you bought a GTX 285 right now over a 5870 for the same price, that would be unreasonable (unless you already had a gtx 285 and were going to SLI or had an SLI only mobo or some other similar situation).
 
jeremyshaw said:
Let's put it this way:

I hope ANY next-gen high end card will need a new system to prevent a bottleneck, as that is a nice indicator of how much better it is compared to the previous gen.
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Amen!

I would buy a new system at that point and I have only had mine for 4 months! (I suppose I have had two of the gtx 285s for 12 months, but most of the rest is new)
 
This really is impossible to answer without knowing how hard you're going to push that graphics card.

It's fairly easy to make yourself GPU limited again when you're running three monitors ;)
 
Personally I think everything will have to be upgraded. Happens everytime a new OS like Win7 is released. DX11 means new vid cards. The 5970 is 12" long which means no more mid tower cases. Another reason for new cases is new PSU's like the 1200w Thermaltake is 1" longer than normal. Won't fit in most mid towers. And with these next gen cards the CPU is the new bottleneck. So we need new processors. New mobos have USB 3.0 and SATA 6Gb/s; gotta have that. Which means new HDD's that are also 6Gb/s. And new external drives that are USB 3.0. Good article here:

http://www.powersgaming.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=182
 
PowersGaming said:
Personally I think everything will have to be upgraded. Happens everytime a new OS like Win7 is released. DX11 means new vid cards. The 5970 is 12" long which means no more mid tower cases. Another reason for new cases is new PSU's like the 1200w Thermaltake is 1" longer than normal. Won't fit in most mid towers. And with these next gen cards the CPU is the new bottleneck. So we need new processors. New mobos have USB 3.0 and SATA 6Gb/s; gotta have that. Which means new HDD's that are also 6Gb/s. And new external drives that are USB 3.0. Good article here:

http://www.powersgaming.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=182
Click to expand...

LOL could the self promotion be any more obvious?

At least [H]ard OCP uses proper grammar in their articles!
 
PowersGaming said:
Personally I think everything will have to be upgraded. Happens everytime a new OS like Win7 is released. DX11 means new vid cards. The 5970 is 12" long which means no more mid tower cases. Another reason for new cases is new PSU's like the 1200w Thermaltake is 1" longer than normal. Won't fit in most mid towers. And with these next gen cards the CPU is the new bottleneck. So we need new processors. New mobos have USB 3.0 and SATA 6Gb/s; gotta have that. Which means new HDD's that are also 6Gb/s. And new external drives that are USB 3.0. Good article here:

http://www.powersgaming.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=182
Click to expand...

For mATX, ever heard of the SG02-F?

I got one, and it allows for upto 12" cards :p.
and if you leave the bottom (or top, depending on PSU design) 5.25 drive bay empty, then it will be able to fit the freakishly long PSUs that seem to get evermore popular.
 
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