Why wifi on ATX mobos?

Ranulfo

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What is the rationale for putting wifi on so many midrange to high end atx boards these days? I get putting it on the absolute top end boards that have every little feature on them or say on itx mobos. Yet, why skimp out on vrm quality and other baseline features to toss in an AC wifii chip? I'll take extra sata ports or an intel gigabit nic instead of realtek (or killer nics) and especially better vrm and heatsink quality.

TLDR, the X570 boards out there are a mess all because of pcie 4.0 and I guess lots of people want wifi on board for atx cases.
 

jeremyshaw

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I'm really only glad for the extra Key A or E M.2 slot, so I can fit a tiny FPGA. That being said, maybe it's cheaper than actually wiring up a 2.5G or better Ethernet setup?

I'd bet most people use WiFi, even on desktops.
 

GiGaBiTe

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Ethernet hardlines in houses are a thing of the past, everyone wants wifi for everything these days, which is why a lot of boards either come with it or have some dedicated slot for it.

It's a whole lot easier to setup a home wifi network than to retrofit RJ45 jacks. I did the latter for my house and it's a gigantic PITA, a couple of jacks took up to 5 hours to install by myself. I can't imagine how difficult it would be on multi-story houses, you'd have to cut holes in the walls and ceilings.

You can go the easy way with powerline ethernet adapters but those can be pretty expensive and are generally limited on the number you can have in the same network group.
 

jeremyshaw

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It's getting harder to find powerline Ethernet equipment, in my area. Even Walmart has stopped stocking them in-store. My local Best Buys all openly carry Ryzen CPUs and X570 motherboards, but no powerline Ethernet. I guess I could buy them online, lol.

I also agree with the difficulty. It was several hours just to run Cat5e from the main switch to two rooms. Years ago, when we had Dish, the installation guy took several hours (on Dish's dime) to actually run the cable down one of the same walls. It wasn't easy, with the limited clearance in the attic (and the typical California concrete slab, so no crawlspace, either).
 

GiGaBiTe

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I always have to get them on Amazon or Newegg. Walmart only has the wifi version of the powerline ethernet adapters which don't have ethernet jacks on the wifi end. Amazon isn't bad if you have prime, many of my customers do and I get them to order them and they arrive in a day or two.

Frys used to stock them until they went bust, but that was a bit of a drive.
 

mda

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Perhaps an unpopular opinion, but with the 3900X/3950x aside, I think VRM quality has hit the point where on the low end, it is 'just enough'.

The lower end B450 boards can run the 2700X stock.

3700/3800X uses less power than a 2700X (and IIRC, will use be like a 2600X). So most B350 boards with crappy VRMs that could handle a 1600X/2600X at most should be able to handle a 3700X.

Obviously, overclockers and people running 3900/3950Xs will want something with beefier VRMs.

To answer your question though, I like WIFI on my boards. I barely use it but would like the option to do so if in case I need to move my PC somewhere where I'd need to snake a LAN cable around. Given the cost of the Intel 9260 wifi card I've upgraded my laptop to, wifi is probably cheaper to implement compared to better VRMs.
 

OhSigmaChi

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I hate wires in my house, and I think wall jacks are ugly, so I always go wifi, even on my main editing rig.
 

somebrains

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I have a buddy that’s union data/voice.
He helped me wire up my house, dug into his work truck for cat6, receptacle boxes, wire staples, etc.

Most people it’s easier to use WiFi, maybe buy Ubnt gear so your service is better.

For the record I like cutting sheetrock and I own a right angle drill.
I know how to avoid romex runs.
I do my own plumbing for fun.
 

Sloginfizz

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Installing Ethernet drops in a house = 50 ft. cheap Ethernet cable ($15) + Switch Plate ($15) plus install. I had a guy quote me $100 for two drops.

Wifi USB adapter $20. So if you have a family with multiple PCs that aren't "gamers", then its much easier and cheaper than doing drops.

That all said, installing it on a motherboard is kind of crap because wifi cards/dongles seem to die over time. Even then, it comes out cheaper than doing a drop in the house.
 

Aluminum

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The BoM on integrated wifi is very small (laptop mass market effects) and the demand is fairly high. Most motherboard designs use a single pcie for the actual wireless (BT uses USB portion of the key) which is still a better solution than shitty pure USB dongles.

I hate wireless for any serious networking, but the reality is getting a wire to the spot is not something everyone can do.
 

GiGaBiTe

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I hate wires in my house, and I think wall jacks are ugly, so I always go wifi, even on my main editing rig.
Doesn't always work. I've had to go the powerline ethernet route on several customers with McMansions which are either 3-4 floors or stupidly long single floor homes. Story is always the same, when they built the house, they expected a single wifi router would cover all of that space. Maybe if it was an open warehouse, but all of the walls and floors kill the faster 5G wifi signal and even 2.4G takes a big hit.

Even on smaller homes in suburbs have serious problems because every house has wifi and you end up with bad channel clashing, making wifi to your router drop out constantly.
 

Astral Abyss

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At first I thought wifi on mobos was pretty dumb, and I still don't use it, but... I do like having bluetooth capability and do use that. Works great for connecting an xbone controller, phone, and random other stuff.
 

Epos7

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At first I thought wifi on mobos was pretty dumb, and I still don't use it, but... I do like having bluetooth capability and do use that. Works great for connecting an xbone controller, phone, and random other stuff.
This. Bluetooth and WiFi tend to be integrated into the same chip.
 

Jandor

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Wifi because you need to be part of the global surveillance. The satellites can read your wifi and China, Russia and the US secret agencies can decrypt all those WPA standards. Not meaning that connected by ethernet keeps you safe from internet global spying.
China already forces people to comply to global surveillance, and Europe is moving forward, following chinese rules on behalf of fighting terrorism while inviting them to come to Europe.
And manufacturers need to comply with those demands.
 

Jandor

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Ethernet hardlines in houses are a thing of the past, everyone wants wifi for everything these days, which is why a lot of boards either come with it or have some dedicated slot for it.

It's a whole lot easier to setup a home wifi network than to retrofit RJ45 jacks. I did the latter for my house and it's a gigantic PITA, a couple of jacks took up to 5 hours to install by myself. I can't imagine how difficult it would be on multi-story houses, you'd have to cut holes in the walls and ceilings.

You can go the easy way with powerline ethernet adapters but those can be pretty expensive and are generally limited on the number you can have in the same network group.
Great ! Hospitals need cancers.
 

Jandor

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It has been statistically established even if not prouved how this happens that wifi, GSM and even DECT cause cancers, and especially brain cancers for phones. It also has been established that the cells communicate by emitting very small electromagnetic waves. There are some studies now to detect illnesses at cell levels with very sensitive electromagnetic detectors.
maybe in 20 or 30 years it will be established that any kind electromagnetic wave emission must be avoided, if we won't move to a totalitarian chinese communist world by then, who doesn't care.
Just look at how half of the politicians are so much fund of the Chinese system. All the Europen politicians are eager to copy the chinese system presented in Europe and especially France as our future and as the global leadership to follow.
 

Mega6

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It has been statistically established even if not prouved how this happens that wifi, GSM and even DECT cause cancers, and especially brain cancers for phones. It also has been established that the cells communicate by emitting very small electromagnetic waves. There are some studies now to detect illnesses at cell levels with very sensitive electromagnetic detectors.
maybe in 20 or 30 years it will be established that any kind electromagnetic wave emission must be avoided, if we won't move to a totalitarian chinese communist world by then, who doesn't care.
Just look at how half of the politicians are so much fund of the Chinese system. All the Europen politicians are eager to copy the chinese system presented in Europe and especially France as our future and as the global leadership to follow.

Well thank god my MB doesn't have wifi.
 

dvsman

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It's a convenience thing for me, even if I'm not actually using it long term.

I usually prefer to run ethernet to my fixed location boxes but I don't know where I might be when I'm actually building / setting up a new box. Maybe I'll be sitting on the living room floor (in front of the big screen) watching something while I work vs at my desk where there is ethernet running to a nearby switch ... if I'm at the former and not the latter, then I can still just use the wifi to do the WIN install / updates - which is convenient.

Wifi is definitely not a make or break feature but given how expensive mobos in general (and x570 in particular) have become, I hope it does have all the bells and whistles - even if I don't need or use them.
 

drescherjm

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I don't want WIFI on my desktop motherboards however I would really like to see > GBit Wired Ethernet become a standard feature.

120 MB/s is slow compared to any modern raid array or any SSD. Yes I know faster eithernet is available but I think we are a bit in a catch 22 with switches. Until greater than GBit is common place switches that can handle greater than GBit are usually very expensive.
 
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somebrains

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It must have been a wake up call when streaming became the it marketing content creation vehicle.
All those bedroom guys suddenly had to look at 2x and quad nics, setup data closets to capture their footage, and they had to basically setup a proper studio workflow.

Take a kid with gaming talent, and thrust them from their console on WiFi to a buddy with a MacBook Pro.
Add some steady donations and stream partnership and there’s not much middle ground from screwing around to needing full on wired capability.
 

thesmokingman

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I used to feel the same way but sometimes the wifi really comes in handy. And other times I don't want to eff around in the attic laying drops. I'm too old for that shit now.
 

demondrops

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still rocking the TP cabel lol. now luckily it was included in the walls when i moved here but, prety much always used that. and wifi was prety shit when it just came out also, just like wireless anything was. clearly that isnt the case today tho :eek: idk is there even a difference in ping with wifi vs. tp now? or is it just as good. my ps4 run on wifi but, i tried online with it and it was prety garbage experience. it probably is safer with TP also i figure, wireless can be breached like tp can but.. now any idiot with any knowledge can see and deploy a program to crack a wifi. tp cabel not so much, the least they need to know the IP they targeting.
 

demondrops

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i will die before i go wifi. tp ftw! just like i cant buy a god damn game in store anymore on pc without it beeing online or a download :( u cant even play them offline. fucked up.
 

Ready4Dis

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I don't want WIFI on my desktop motherboards however I would really like to see > GBit Wired Ethernet become a standard feature.

120 MB/s is slow compared to any modern raid array or any SSD. Yes I know faster
This, I have a raid 1+0 setup that I can hit 1GB/s w(yes, gigabyte, not gigabit)... And and SSD as the main/os drive ( sadly, sata in my serve). I am network constrained and have been looking into 10gbe or infiniband but cost is a bit higher especially when I would need to buy a card for every desktop. Getting 100MB/s is pushing my server to 10% disk usage, lol. I have 4 1gb nice in my server, but if have to do some upgrading of the rest of my network to make use of a bonded network setup. WiFi sucks, speeds suck, onboard wifi is mostly crappy, but is great to have in a bind. I have it in my mini itx because I can easily bring those on a trip. They are mostly hard wired at home though (5 desktops + my server).
 

Zarathustra[H]

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Yeah, among those who aren't geeks like us, who know how much more reliable, secure and higher performing wired Ethernet is, there is an active hatred of wires out there.

Lots of people won't even consider using a computer unless it has wireless everything, keyboard, mouse, headphones, Ethernet.

They are extremely misguided, but the lowest common denominator always has been.
 

drescherjm

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If you have 1 desktop PC I guess it does not matter. I don't wire my laptop but my desktops are all wired. So is my HD Homerun cablecard 3 port tuner (still waiting for the 6 port to be released).
 

Zarathustra[H]

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If you have 1 desktop PC I guess it does not matter. I don't wire my laptop but my desktops are all wired. So is my HD Homerun cablecard 3 port tuner (still waiting for the 6 port to be released).
Yeah, WiFi is great for its intended pupose. Devices (phones, tablets, laptops, etc) that need to be mobile.

Anything that is stationary always gets wired Ethernet in my house.
 

notarat

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Yeah, WiFi is great for its intended pupose. Devices (phones, tablets, laptops, etc) that need to be mobile.

Anything that is stationary always gets wired Ethernet in my house.
I'm the same way. If its location is static, it gets ethernet, mainly because I'm using 10GBe switch. My router allows me to turn on/off the wireless (I would assume most do) so I only use my wireless when connecting my phone for software updates and my Fire to download the ebooks I purchase, then I turn it right back off.

I like the convenience of Wi-Fi. But I need the speed of 10GBe because the renderings I do create large files which need to be backed up daily across the network.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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I'm the same way. If its location is static, it gets ethernet, mainly because I'm using 10GBe switch. My router allows me to turn on/off the wireless (I would assume most do) so I only use my wireless when connecting my phone for software updates and my Fire to download the ebooks I purchase, then I turn it right back off.

I like the convenience of Wi-Fi. But I need the speed of 10GBe because the renderings I do create large files which need to be backed up daily across the network.
What I think many in here forget is that most people are only using their LAN as their first hop to the Internet.

Because of this, they don't need their LAN to be any faster than their WAN speeds, and because of this WiFi is usually sufficient for most.
 

OFaceSIG

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Ethernet hardlines in houses are a thing of the past, everyone wants wifi for everything these days, which is why a lot of boards either come with it or have some dedicated slot for it.

It's a whole lot easier to setup a home wifi network than to retrofit RJ45 jacks. I did the latter for my house and it's a gigantic PITA, a couple of jacks took up to 5 hours to install by myself. I can't imagine how difficult it would be on multi-story houses, you'd have to cut holes in the walls and ceilings.

You can go the easy way with powerline ethernet adapters but those can be pretty expensive and are generally limited on the number you can have in the same network group.
MoCA adapters saved my life. I get hardwire speeds anywhere I have a Coax drop. It can change your life too.

I hate wires in my house, and I think wall jacks are ugly, so I always go wifi, even on my main editing rig.
A little sad for you brother. As I stated earlier, look into MoCA.

I have a buddy that’s union data/voice.
He helped me wire up my house, dug into his work truck for cat6, receptacle boxes, wire staples, etc.

Most people it’s easier to use WiFi, maybe buy Ubnt gear so your service is better.

For the record I like cutting sheetrock and I own a right angle drill.
I know how to avoid romex runs.
I do my own plumbing for fun.
For what little WiFi I use, I run an Ubiquiti AP.

I used to feel the same way but sometimes the wifi really comes in handy. And other times I don't want to eff around in the attic laying drops. I'm too old for that shit now.
MoCA adatpers, you're welcome.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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It has been statistically established even if not prouved how this happens that wifi, GSM and even DECT cause cancers, and especially brain cancers for phones. It also has been established that the cells communicate by emitting very small electromagnetic waves. There are some studies now to detect illnesses at cell levels with very sensitive electromagnetic detectors.
maybe in 20 or 30 years it will be established that any kind electromagnetic wave emission must be avoided, if we won't move to a totalitarian chinese communist world by then, who doesn't care.
Just look at how half of the politicians are so much fund of the Chinese system. All the Europen politicians are eager to copy the chinese system presented in Europe and especially France as our future and as the global leadership to follow.

Lolno.

Spend less time in the conspiracy parts of the Internet :p

At the levels electronics use the entire EM spectrum is safe.

You do realize we are talking no more than a couple of hundred milliwatts in most cases, right?
 

Zarathustra[H]

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MoCA adapters saved my life. I get hardwire speeds anywhere I have a Coax drop. It can change your life too.



A little sad for you brother. As I stated earlier, look into MoCA.



For what little WiFi I use, I run an Ubiquiti AP.



MoCA adatpers, you're welcome.

Interesting. Last time I played with MoCa adapters it was because that was what Verizon FiOS used when they installed in most homes.

I bought a couple of adapters to augment the FiOS system. It worked pretty well, but at the time (2009?) MoCa was only at the 1.1 revision , so max speeds were 175 mbit/s.

I did t realize MoCa had beenbfirther developed since then. Apparently the 2.0 revision went up to a gigabit, and the 2.5 revision supports 2.5 gigabit.

That can be quite nice, especially if you already have ore-routed coax cabling to every room, like a lot of oder homes do.

I'm not replacing my 10-gig fiber any time soon, but it is a nice tool to have in my arsenal of I ever need it.
 

dmdtobe

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I just spent forever looking for a reasonably priced ATX board with WiFi. I didn't want to pay for a premium B450 board but the low-end X570 boards don't have WiFi. I ended up going with an X570 board without WiFi and just added a WiFi card. I figured the modularity leaves me the option of staying up to date with the latest WiFi standards.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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I just spent forever looking for a reasonably priced ATX board with WiFi. I didn't want to pay for a premium B450 board but the low-end X570 boards don't have WiFi. I ended up going with an X570 board without WiFi and just added a WiFi card. I figured the modularity leaves me the option of staying up to date with the latest WiFi standards.

Like putting bicycle wheels on a sportscar
 

IdiotInCharge

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I just spent forever looking for a reasonably priced ATX board with WiFi. I didn't want to pay for a premium B450 board but the low-end X570 boards don't have WiFi. I ended up going with an X570 board without WiFi and just added a WiFi card. I figured the modularity leaves me the option of staying up to date with the latest WiFi standards.
That's got to be an AMD thing. I haven't seen an Intel board without Wifi when looking at the middle tiers on up in at least five years. Sometimes I use it (a little), sometimes a lot, sometimes I disable it in the BIOS, but it's been ever-present to the point that I didn't think boards came without it!
 
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