Why Linux on the Desktop Is Dead

Red Falcon said:
Wow, apparently he didn't understand that Linux isn't an OS for noobs. :rolleyes:

The whole point is that you can mold Linux to whatever hardware and software platforms you want.

That's not the point of Linux.


Linux isn't necessarily designed to be user-friendly, depending on the distro.
It's an OS in which the user can FULLY customize the kernel, back-end, and front-end.
You can't do that with Windows and OS X, they are far too rigid to mold to anything other than x86 and ARM platforms, and even then it's limited at best and even less so with Windows.

If this idiot wants a user-friendly OS, he needs to go with OS X as even Windows will be too difficult for him to fully understand.
Mindless computing at it's finest.

It's painfully obvious that Linux is far beyond his realm of understanding and comprehension.
He reminds me of these system admins who treat their systems and operations like it was the mid-90's.

Funny, I don't see any of the world's supercomputers running Windows.
Oh wait, they ALL use custom Linux variants.

Holy shit, that article was nothing but a metric-ton of fail.
Click to expand...

No need to go farther than this post if you really want to find out the real deterrent to Linux adoption on the desktop.
 
Got to say that the article has words in it which make no sense at times and there more words but hey Linux is awesome!!!

Then it goes of to slaughter linux because it isn't windows ?
Then we get the exiting conclusion , LINUX is DEAD on desktops , OMG OMG OMG!!!

Linux is like Kenny from southpark , they kill him god nows how many times now yet he keeps coming back. Linux has been declared dead by a lot of people now for so many years. Maybe they should join the facebook page of linux is dead or make one so they can feel justified writing words in an article with words and stuff ....
 
Being a user of Archlinux, Windows 7, Android and OSX i'm just happy there is this much choice and freedom.
 
Red Falcon said:
What "facts" have you given?
Insults are not facts, and that's all you present.
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The only insults handed out have been by you, and only you.

We're still waiting for you to contribute something to the discussion. How's that list of features available on Desktop Linux that aren't available on competitors coming along?

pelo said:
You see, where you'd say "borrowed" the BSD users would say "stolen outright." And yes, it's based on the Darwin kernel but the notion that it's not heavily BSD based (the file system ffs) as well is, to use your own term, false. Does it get exaggerated? Yes, but deservedly so. crApple programmers and devs aren't ones to give back to the community and the only "open" thing about their OS and practices is that they're pushing openCL. Kudos for that but everywhere else they can go suck a fat one. They take furniture sitting on other people's lawns and place it in their own walled garden then try to impress passersby.
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You have the contributors backwards.

Apple is one of the single largest contributors to the SAMBA, CUPS, Apache, Darwin, and many other FOSS projects. They give back everything they use, and then some.

pelo said:
The biggest issue with linux entering the desktop arena is the lack of market share. Programmers won't develop for openGL unless there's people to buy their product and the same can be said for other than gaming.
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Given that the Wii and PS3 both have GL-esque graphics systems, you already have 2 major points against your argument.

Cheetoz said:
What I don't understand are statements like
Because after you configured linux exactly how you want it, how much time are you going to spend on it again if you want to? zero .
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After you configured Windows 7 exactly how you want it, how much time are you going to spend on it again if you want to? zero
 
InorganicMatter said:
You have the contributors backwards.

Apple is one of the single largest contributors to the SAMBA, CUPS, Apache, Darwin, and many other FOSS projects. They give back everything they use, and then some.
Click to expand...

Also should have mentioned that I reject your use of the word "stolen" in the context of FreeBSD. The BSD license is one of the most permissive free software licenses out there. You can't steal something that is free.
 
Lol. This idiot completely approached Linux the WRONG way. He doesn't understand the Linux has an entirely different design and philosophy, and that you can't use your usual Windows habituation with another operating system that's completely built with a VERY distinctive approach to computing in mind.

It was built with security in mind, and it was NEVER meant to be popular on the desktop. He's another one of those Windows zealots who're under the impression and false hope that Linux is a "free, open source version of Windows", setting himself for complete failure. No is it NOT windows is any way, shape, or form. Also, just because one is incapable of getting acquainted with it's different process of computing, nor spend the time to study it, it does not make it "dead" on the desktop, or that it sucks.

If he even bothered to study its fundamental purpose before making ridiculous statements about popularity and incompetency, he would realize it's current stance on the market.

Subsequently, it's philosophy (read FOSS) is the reason why Linux has it's shortcomings in regards to 3rd party support, drivers, etc due to no potential (or substantial) monetary gain. But what do you get? Freedom, choice, and a damn fine operating system w/ an amazing community.

You cannot drive a car with handle bars.
 
Gotta love snobs that think Linux is the "shit." I've been into computers since about 1982, went to school for computer science... and I don't use Linux generally because it is a pain in the ass. I guess if you have a penchant for masochism, like to be one of the "mountainmen" of the PC kingdom, or really like dull shit, then fucking with Linux is right up your alley -- that is unless you have a necessity for its use...

I will admit that there are a couple attractive things about it, like the lack of commercialism surrounding it -- but for an end-user that wants to run a bunch of different software and be able to use a spectrum of hardware -- it sucks.
 
speaking as someone who had to use linux at my last job, mainly for ou mail and web servers, i wouldnt mind using it over windows in that regard. other than for the occasional maintenance (which can be done remotely if necessary), why use a slightly less stable/more bloated GUI-oriented OS? seems unnecessary. I dont know as much about linux as most people in here, but i would set it up on my media pc (q6600, 3gb, 500gb) if i was more familiar with the linux OS beyond the few things i used it for at work. but using it on my desktop, are you fucking kidding me? :)
 
Why all the crying over an article that should have garnered a "no duh".
Linux is not dead on the desktop, because it was stillborn. It was never alive in the first place. It has seen use by so few on the desktop that it is not even worth considering a market. There is no money in it to change that, so it will not likley change.

Linux is a wonderfully flexible and useful tool, in dozens of markets, on dozens of devices. It does many things, and does them well. The average persons desktop is just not one of those things it does well. It could have, had it been first. Had it cornered the market, and had every vendor that ever thought about making a piece of hardware, or software making it with Linux in mind, like Windows did. At this point, MS is too entrenched for Nix to make the headway onto the desktop that the fans say it should.

If you like nix on the desktop great, but acting like everyone else is beneath you or wrong because they do not feel the same way, or are stupid because they see no reason to spend the time needed to properly learn an OS that has sees little use on the desktop, is kind one of the reasons people are so turned off by nix. The elitists snobs that community tends to breed. Some of you nix guys make Q3 and UT99 fanatics look like civil, cultured, members of the Harvard debate team when discussing the relative merits of Q3 compared to UT99. Some of you may even be worse than Nvidiots, and fanATIcs.

The guy was mostly right, he did come off as somewhat of an ass though.
 
InorganicMatter said:
Given that the Wii and PS3 both have GL-esque graphics systems, you already have 2 major points against your argument.
Click to expand...

Even more important are the mobile systems. Android and iOS both use GL, and that is driving lots of devs to use OpenGL instead of DirectX.
 
Starcrossed said:
Gotta love snobs that think Linux is the "shit." I've been into computers since about 1982, went to school for computer science... and I don't use Linux generally because it is a pain in the ass. I guess if you have a penchant for masochism, like to be one of the "mountainmen" of the PC kingdom, or really like dull shit, then fucking with Linux is right up your alley -- that is unless you have a necessity for its use...

I will admit that there are a couple attractive things about it, like the lack of commercialism surrounding it -- but for an end-user that wants to run a bunch of different software and be able to use a spectrum of hardware -- it sucks.
Click to expand...

There's an abundance of good alternatives to major multimedia/office applications for the Linux platform. All people need to do is ask and research.

Apparently, a lot of windows users have the "Shiny New Shit Syndrome" that just simply wants the latest and greatest with no real purpose, or applications that exceeds their specific needs.
 
@ InorganicMatter,
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscent..._adds_git_support_to_codeplex_repository.html
This is in response to "linux does not have any good programming tools". Ok, GCC anyone? LLVM? There are numerous good IDEs as well. Coding wise Linux is pretty solid these days, and gaining steam rapidly.

As for the other people saying linux is a red headed step child, you may want to reconsider given that there are numerous BIG players signed on to the linux foundation. Recently even NVidia ... color me surprised but hey why not?

@ InorganicMatter - You sound a whole lot like my brother :) I will say that recently Linux lost it's ever loving mind and went to UNITY and GNOME 3... = much H8Tred ...Then MS has a Massive brain fart and goes Metro? ? ? !!! /sigh..and to think I was actually considering Buying that steaming pile... damn ok never mind.. I have tried and tried to get Into Unity / Gnome 3...can't do it! Linus Torvalds said it best when he called them a steaming pile haha ! Just my opinion, and what really annoys me is that MS still Sorta Kinda semi has the old desktop alive...but it is somewhat excluded from some of the really cool new features that Win8 has coming. You know, if i had a Tablet then Unity / Gnome 3 / Win 8 would be just great! As it is... no thanks.

Oh and don't even get me started on the UEFI debates /sigh...

And as for BSD and iOS, you are correct in that you cannot steal what is 100% free! Apple actually asked and was told "Sure Man!" Of course BSD was kind of hoping for a bit more active ROI that it initially got. By the way I do not quite agree that apple is an awesome citizen, but I must say that they DO give back a fair bit. LLVM is looking better and better these days! The thing is, there are more and more BIG players getting into Linux / OSS these days.

By the way, LibreOffice has been really busing moves in the office space. They have a ways left to go, but they are accelerating the pace of developement quite nicely! Refreshing.

Have a good one,
Gary
- A Fedora User these days...
 
I'm a fan of Windows 7 and I like OSX except for the times when I want to pull my hair out. OSX is such a contradiction. It's elegant and intuitive in different parts only to completely go ass backwards on some small element that leaves you saying "WTF! Really?!!?."

Anyway, I have to say I am working with Ubuntu Server (64-bit) and I like. I don't mind the command line though I'm not a fan of shell programming. I don't think I was ever a fan of the Desktop versions however I did enjoy the desktop space management features.

I worked with Unix in college for an operating system course (NACHOS) and had experience with Fedora. I just haven't liked any of the desktops but so far the servers rock.


I have to agree with the article on those "special" Linux users. I remember having to fight the urge to deliver massive trauma to the class TA's with a nice surprise head butt to wipe the smirk of their faces when asking a question. Glad the professor call him on his shit and told him to either cut it out or go somewhere for a TA position..


To that TA..."Fuck you and your VI skills."
 
Gotta love snobs that think Linux is the "shit."
Click to expand...
The same could be said for Windows and OS X users as well, so I'm not quite sure what your point is.
 
Diriel said:
@ InorganicMatter,
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscent..._adds_git_support_to_codeplex_repository.html
This is in response to "linux does not have any good programming tools". Ok, GCC anyone? LLVM? There are numerous good IDEs as well. Coding wise Linux is pretty solid these days, and gaining steam rapidly.
Click to expand...

I don't recall saying Linux has "no good programming tools", just that Windows as a whole has a much more robust platform and development environment.

GCC is great, and Linux has some acceptable IDEs available on it (notably Eclipse, but that's kind of cheating since it's available on everything). But a compiler and linker doesn't make the entire ecosystem. Linux has good programming tools for Linux applications - GTK+ and Qt are acceptable, but considering the platform as a whole, it doesn't come anywhere close to .NET 4 and the forthcoming .NET 4.5.
 
InorganicMatter said:
I make $35/hour. If I have to waste more than half a day getting Linux to run on my PC (and it will since I have the latest and greatest chipset, networking, and video devices), Windows already wins the cost consideration.
Click to expand...

You make $35/hour. I make €7/hour (after taxation) and i have monthly salary above average. My mom makes €2/hour. Someone from Romania getting minimal salary gets less than 1€/hour. So, please stop looking at the problem with your blindfolds and from your specific perspective.
 
faugusztin said:
You make $35/hour. I make €7/hour (after taxation) and i have monthly salary above average. My mom makes €2/hour. Someone from Romania getting minimal salary gets less than 1€/hour. So, please stop looking at the problem with your blindfolds and from your specific perspective.
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Your point is irrelevant.

And also doesn't account for the fact that the only people who pay MSRP for Windows are the nerds who buy a copy on Newegg along with their new hardware. Consumers get it for free with their OEM PC, and businesses negotiate volume licensing agreements with Microsoft that allow them to pay pennies on the dollar.
 
Your point is irrelevant.
You compare different computers. A PC from Newegg with Windows is cheaper than a PC from Newegg without Windows, plain and simple.
That's one of the biggest reasons I buy parts and not branded computers: I can get it without an OS.

Or are you really arguing that OEM PCs are cheaper? Here?
 
nOrVow said:
Lol. This idiot completely approached Linux the WRONG way. He doesn't understand the Linux has an entirely different design and philosophy, and that you can't use your usual Windows habituation with another operating system that's completely built with a VERY distinctive approach to computing in mind.

It was built with security in mind, and it was NEVER meant to be popular on the desktop. He's another one of those Windows zealots who're under the impression and false hope that Linux is a "free, open source version of Windows", setting himself for complete failure. No is it NOT windows is any way, shape, or form. Also, just because one is incapable of getting acquainted with it's different process of computing, nor spend the time to study it, it does not make it "dead" on the desktop, or that it sucks.

If he even bothered to study its fundamental purpose before making ridiculous statements about popularity and incompetency, he would realize it's current stance on the market.

Subsequently, it's philosophy (read FOSS) is the reason why Linux has it's shortcomings in regards to 3rd party support, drivers, etc due to no potential (or substantial) monetary gain. But what do you get? Freedom, choice, and a damn fine operating system w/ an amazing community.

You cannot drive a car with handle bars.
Click to expand...

I guess I was wrong about looking no farther than my first quoted post.
 
InorganicMatter said:
I don't recall saying Linux has "no good programming tools", just that Windows as a whole has a much more robust platform and development environment.
Click to expand...
This has to be a joke.
I can agree that Linux lacks drivers, games, support from major proprietary software, etc.
But Linux is pretty much *the* platform of choice for development. The fact you only cite .NET, which is Windows-only is… weird. You should check out what developers *actually* care about and work on: http://langpop.com/ or http://www.tiobe.com/index.php/content/paperinfo/tpci/index.html
 
nOrVow said:
Subsequently, it's philosophy (read FOSS) is the reason why Linux has it's shortcomings in regards to 3rd party support, drivers, etc due to no potential (or substantial) monetary gain. But what do you get? Freedom, choice, and a damn fine operating system w/ an amazing community.
Click to expand...
It has more software and drivers than Mac OS, which isn't free. And I'm pretty sure more people are making money writing and using free software than mac software, so I don't think it's the issue.
 
Linux on the desktop will gain more traction among the general populace when Android x86 its more mature and fully developed. We can already see the first signs of the desktop push in devices like the Asus transformer series....

Give it time, with the addition of x86 compatibility and general hardware installations, the Asus Transformer style Linux on desktop will finally be able to bring in a more significant number of Linux desktop users, while uniting them with the same APIs and user interface...
 
mope54 said:
@pankkake
all of your posts are basically incorrect
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lol
That's pretty much the attitude that is saddening in this thread. Some people disagree so *everything* they say must be wrong!
I think both InorganicMatter and Red Falcon said really, really stupid things just to be "right".
 
It's my belief that the single handed savior for linux will be Apple. From what I've heard about Mountain Lion has security options to switch your desktop to "only app store apps" mode. And knowing their history with iOS... I feel like the "only app store apps" 'option' will soon become a required part of the OS, (at which point they'll drop OSX and use iOS for their computers too). This cuts out people from having good server/terminal options. At which point people who need unix underpinnings (programmers/developers) go to linux.

Granted this is all speculation, but it's definitely something I could some coming out of apple.
 
@ InorganicMatter,

There is little, if any reason to use Linux on a desktop PC, as it offers nothing over Windows. In addition to not offering any features over Windows, it is sorely lacking in two key areas (video games and software development).

Video Games and software developement....

DotNet is cool for what it is, but it most definitely is not something that any serious Game Companies use as a primary dev lang. C++ would be top dog there, with possibly an honorable side mention to DotNet, a very Side Mention... more likely than not the side is usually something like XML or HTML etc...

Anyhow, have a good one!
Gary
 
brucedeluxe169 said:
Linux on the desktop will gain more traction among the general populace when Android x86 its more mature and fully developed. We can already see the first signs of the desktop push in devices like the Asus transformer series....
Click to expand...
Sadly Android is very different from the base Linux userland. There is a *lot* of work to unite them. At least the kernel part are pretty similar nowadays.
Mobile OSes that were closer to GNU/Linux roots are Maemo, MeeGo, etc. but they are seriously lacking manpower. Which is too bad, because as a result, many existing applications could be ported quite easily, and you could use pretty much any language.
 
InorganicMatter said:
And also doesn't account for the fact that the only people who pay MSRP for Windows are the nerds who buy a copy on Newegg along with their new hardware. Consumers get it for free with their OEM PC, and businesses negotiate volume licensing agreements with Microsoft that allow them to pay pennies on the dollar.
Click to expand...

You are so disconnected with the real world...
  • Laptops - sure, they have Windows bundled, because it is next to impossible to get a laptop without Windows, except Macbooks and few specific models from laptop producers).
  • Desktop computers - now this is where you are very mistaken. Prebuilt branded computers are probably huge market in US/CAN/UK and other "rich" countries, but once you move to poorer countries you end up with custom built computers from local bigger or smaller shops or custom builds from friends, nearly all of them include an OEM version of Windows 7 Home Premium. Even an OEM version is 90€, and even that 90€ is nearly a half of the lowend computer price these days.
 
That's twice now (counting pankkake's citation of langpop) that people have referenced C++.

C++ is an argument for developing on Windows not linux.

@pankkake
what is your point in linking to langpop?
to demonstrate that java is a popular language?
to demonstrate that C++ is a popular language?

It certainly doesn't demonstrate that linux is a popular development platform.
I don't really see the need in going in to detail about your claim that more linux developers are making more money than OSX/iOS developers because a random person in the grocery store line knows that's not true.
 
Yeah, these articles are nothing but click-bait. I won't give them more hits. All three OSes are here to stay and all have found a very comfortable niche. Every-so-often we see a slight shuffle but that's about it.
 
What's your obsession with C++? I just wanted to show that .NET isn't everything. And indeed, the sum of the many languages available clearly outweighs it. I don't care about C++ much, and I'd rather kill myself that use Java.

It doesn't show what platform developers are using either, and that wasn't what I wanted to show. Only that the particular argument of .NET was invalid.

C++ development for Windows or for Linux usually has very different targets so it's not an argument for either one of them, and here we don't know what they are. It's doesn't work like "I'm writing C++, so I will use X". But if you have some information, please share it. But given your replies avoid doing anything like that, Idoubt it.

"Random person in the grocery store"... are you trying to be insulting? How would a random person know something about the computing job market? You don't seem to know much about it either. Just look at job offers.
 
Windows is for power users, people who want to do everything (for me, games).
Apple is for simpletons, people too easily confused by complexity.

Who is Linux for?
 
Stone Cold said:
Windows is for power users, people who want to do everything (for me, games).
Apple is for simpletons, people too easily confused by complexity.

Who is Linux for?
Click to expand...
linux is for elitists. or people who feel that if they can follow a how-to on a forum in order to install a fairly esoteric OS they are somehow better than someone else. by and large, the same mentality that gives rise to script-kiddies.

what they fail to realize is that knowledge comes from a particular skillset, not the tools one chooses to use.

the people a lot of these rabid linux'ers in this thread have to turn to when their how-to's don't have the information they need use a wide variety of tools.

we may use vi because we enjoy it, not because it's inherently better than something else.
we could easily do the same thing in notepad or textedit if we had to
using visual studio is due to its capability not because developers that choose it are mindless

the reality of the situation is that tools, for those of us in the professional world already, are means to an end not an end unto themselves.
 
if I could get netflix to run nativiely without using a VM inside of linux .. I'd use it .. but no linux support for silverlight
 
pankkake said:
Sadly Android is very different from the base Linux userland. There is a *lot* of work to unite them. At least the kernel part are pretty similar nowadays.
Mobile OSes that were closer to GNU/Linux roots are Maemo, MeeGo, etc. but they are seriously lacking manpower. Which is too bad, because as a result, many existing applications could be ported quite easily, and you could use pretty much any language.
Click to expand...

Much of the GNU userspace already has been made to work with Android with little to no effort... even X11, gtk, and qt work just fine.

That is irrelevant though, Android coming to the desktop/laptop, which as I pointed out is already beginning with the Asus transformer series, will bring a linux with standard and uniform APIs to a wide audience.

It will be a user friendly, easy to use, compatible, and consistent (relatively) experience, compared to Linux in its current state on the desktop. I'm not predicting it will take over the world, but greater than 1/2 percent marketshare (my guess is 8-9 percent in a few years) will be easy for Google to pull off...
 
Stone Cold said:
Windows is for power users, people who want to do everything (for me, games).
Apple is for simpletons, people too easily confused by complexity.

Who is Linux for?
Click to expand...

Linux is for those who want to go beyond End User. You choose your UI, kernel, and etc.

There was a recent set of benchmarks on phoronix that showed that Doom 3 actually runs faster on Linux then Windows 7. Saw them the other day.

Linux has the potential to become a really amazing OS, if it isn't already. The problem is that nobody will use it cause it lacks applications. Nobody will make application cause it has no users. Chicken or egg situation really.
 
Ashbringer said:
The problem is that nobody will use it cause it lacks applications. Nobody will make application cause it has no users. Chicken or egg situation really.
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I'm not sure this is a big reason for most people. A lot of them don't even know how to install applications.
For power users, it might be. But like many I'm using Linux precisely for its unique applications, so it's not that clear.

But being as good, or slightly better, will never tempt people to switch. That's why it doesn't make sense for most users, because the cost of switching outweighs the benefits. Sadly people are still fighting about being "ready" for the desktop, when it isn't the issue.
 
I don't know why everyone is commenting to the extent that they are on the validity of this article.

The author doesn't really list in detail what exactly he finds that is so problematic with Linux that is not also troublesome with MacOS or Windows. I think he does this on purpose because Windows and Mac also have many of the same pitfalls.
 
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