Vista hysteria among general public out of control

[Finn]

I'm constantly chuckling on the rigor some of you are showing in defending a product you're using. Some people here act like internet gods ruling whose opinnion is acceptable and whose isn't.

I posted a real problem in a real enviroment and got attacked with most of the vistaboy lingo found in the book starting from being total ignorant and ending to spreading FUD. It was funny to see how they excluded real problems and real Vista variations in their hasty attacks, defending their deeply rooted position.

Now, what really makes me wonder is what is the motivation behind this? What do they gain from it? Inquiring minds wanna know.

 

[zacdl]

Just because you can't find the first hit in Microsoft download center, it doesn't mean it's not there.



http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowsmedia/download/AllDownloads.aspx

How hard was that to do? Honestly? You trolled this thread for pages on end (As already said- 35 posts), were asked SEVERAL times for specifics, yet you still maintain "Vista sucks".

Just now you actually pull your head from wherever you kept it stored, and give us a valid argument?

All I can say, is that is what you should have done from step 1. Present facts.
You actually have a valid argument for your problem now- although it still doesn't qualify was a major Vista problem being a very scant percent of users are actually using that version...

I, for one, won't be helping with whatever problem you have, even if it is a valid problem. You've burned too many bridges.

Edit- Saw your next post:

I posted a real problem in a real enviroment and got attacked with most of the vistaboy lingo found in the book starting from being total ignorant and ending to spreading FUD.

No, you posted generalities with zero backup that wasn't based on anything.
It only becomes a "real" problem once you clarify your situation and give facts.
You didn't even bother doing that until PAGE 9!

I really don't know what else qualifies as trolling.

 

[elyrly]

crazy post, i understand the scare to upgrade from windows ~~ to vista. But from my POV i don't upgrade because the drivers otherwise i would be all over it/

****i do have a copy of vista ultimate****

 

[jimmyb]

No, you posted generalities with zero backup that wasn't based on anything.
It only becomes a "real" problem once you clarify your situation and give facts.

The problem was real regardless of whether he had provided proof of its existence. Our awareness of its existence may be retrospective, but that doesn't mean the problem only instantiated itself after this revelation.

 

[heatlesssun]

Well, heres the clincher. You've got 2gb of ram. Are you running any form of RAID striping? I've got 1gb, and I'm not going to go spend any money whatsoever to get another gb of PC3200 ram when I'm going to be getting a Mac Pro at the end of August and relegating this computer to other duties. Furthermore, I shouldnt HAVE to get 2gb of ram just to make Vista perform on par with Linux with 1gb. I do basically the same tasks, Linux is faster. Subjective? Maybe, but it's a pretty obvious difference, one that you or anyone else (including my wife, who uses this computer quite often) would notice.

I hate these speed comparisons because they are SO hard to prove in the real world. Yes, Vista Home Premium out of the box likes more RAM than say Ubuntu 7 out of the box. But before such a comparison is truly valid in my opinion, you'd need to install LinuxMCE first off, Beryl or some 3D desktop, not mention tablet and speech capability to the Ubuntu install, or turn all that of in Vista.

Turn all those things off, and Vista runs just fine with 1GB. I actually setup an install of Ubuntu the other day, on the same machine that I have Vista on (I’ve got a hard drive caddy on it so I can easily swap hard drives) and the initial install went fine.

Of course now I have to deal with getting LinuxMCE, DVD codecs and the like installed and it’s not exactly simple. Hopefully by this weekend I’ll have something to show for it. Out of the box, Ubuntu isn’t very useful from an HTPC perspective. I do want to see if how LinuxMCE performs.

Think about what you just said, then apply it to Linux.

To be honest, there is way more FUD being spread about Windows, and Vista in particular than any OS ever. Think about it. Seen any TV ads lamenting UAC? Spyware? Out of the box ease of use? Didn’t think so.

 

[calebb]

The problem was real regardless of whether he had provided proof of its existence. Our awareness of its existence may be retrospective, but that doesn't mean the problem only instantiated itself after this revelation.

What about post #147 in this thread (page 8)? I asked him for more details so we could help him diagnose and resolve his issue since this seems to be a rather unique problem he ran into!

His reply to my inquiry for more details?

Ok so now it's from total ignorance to systems expert in one post? Impressive.

How does that help us understand the issue??? (he seems to be trolling to me)

 

[LhasaCM]

The problem was real regardless of whether he had provided proof of its existence. Our awareness of its existence may be retrospective, but that doesn't mean the problem only instantiated itself after this revelation.

True - but it only becomes real to us with the later information. I think though, these points cannot be made enough.

1. Especially when dealing with operating systems, and new ones at that, blanket statements are problematic at best. This applies in either direction, good or bad. Maybe it would help if everyone just mentally appended "In my experience" to every opinionated post...
2. While frustrations when things don't work are understandable, saying "I can't do _____ running ______ with ______ and ______" is more constructive than "____ sucks" Or at least try to say both

 

[jimmyb]

It doesn't.

But the existence of something is totally independent of whether you have evidence to believe it. It either exists, or it doesn't. You're knowledge of the situation does not affect this at all.

 

[calebb]

It doesn't.

But the existence of something is totally independent of whether you have evidence to believe it. It either exists, or it doesn't. You're knowledge of the situation does not affect this at all.

I'm not denying the existence of it. I'm denying that one isolated incident makes Vista a bad OS "in general."

 

[Finn]

What about post #147 in this thread (page 8)? I asked him for more details so we could help him diagnose and resolve his issue since this seems to be a rather unique problem he ran into!

His reply to my inquiry for more details?

How does that help us understand the issue???

You left out the part where I said that was a deliberate troll made in humorous manner. I just checked the wmp install log and the only error it contained was 'unable to connect to windows update' as I had no internet connection at that time.

 

[general]

Perhaps if they were so worried about this, you should have just installed XP and made it look like 2000. Remember, just because you're a computer person, it doesn't mean that they are. It's amazing how many times techies make fun on the general public for not knowing computer things when many of them would be at a loss to do simple things like handle interpersonal conflict, public speaking, dating, etc. It's easy for all of us to look down on regular users, but I'm sure all of them know things would puzzle all of us too.

Perhaps you should install XP, install the free SpyBot and get them all to use a web based email (Yahoo, Gmail, etc, all scan for viruses in attachments) and they'll likely be happy. You don't see it as ideal, but it's what your customer wants. Sure, you got 5 service calls, but you got paid for them didn't you? It's what they want isn't it? That's what's most important.

 

[jimmyb]

True - but it only becomes real to us with the later information. I think though, these points cannot be made enough.

1. Especially when dealing with operating systems, and new ones at that, blanket statements are problematic at best. This applies in either direction, good or bad. Maybe it would help if everyone just mentally appended "In my experience" to every opinionated post...
2. While frustrations when things don't work are understandable, saying "I can't do _____ running ______ with ______ and ______" is more constructive than "____ sucks" Or at least try to say both

I agree with this. Accuse him of being uncooperative, but don't claim that problems only come into existence after one has been provided sufficient evidence.

 

[Finn]

I'm not denying the existence of it. I'm denying that one isolated incident makes Vista a bad OS "in general."

The whole problem is not that Vista would be so bad. The problem is that it's not good enough to validate an upgrade from XP. Basically it only brings driver trouble and miniscule amount of eye candy (yeah, I run bricopacks in XP and it's still faster than Vista Aero).

For consumer use - ok, if someone wants to fiddle with it fine. Afterall, people use linux too don't they?

 

[djnes]

I think we can go to a higher view and summarize these threads easily. Some people do have some real problems with Vista. Many of those problems do have workarounds. However, what kills the threads and degenerates them into flame wars is that attitudes some people have.

I'm not sure what's be going on here lately, but where do people think it's okay to come to a discussion board, post a problem, and then cop an attitude with those responding? I think it shows a general lack of people skills, and an abundance of ingorance on how to interact with others. Why do you think so many job descriptions now have to specifically mention people skills? Shouldn't that be necessary and expected from everyone? That's really sad and disheartening that it specifically has to be requested, and you can easily see from here that it's very common.

What's amazing, is that the people with the problems would rather flame others and ignorantly bash Microsoft, the vendors, the users, etc, instead of just working towards a damn solution. Is it more productive to flame others and spew hatred for a company that might not even be at fault, that it is to find an answer? I have a lot of issues with Ubuntu...so should I create some threads bitching at how ridiculous the Ubuntu organization is and how Linux sucks...or should I just try and work towards getting an answer? Those are the attitudes that derail these threads. When many of us are here to help others, the last thing we want to see is some raving lunatic spouting a bunch of BS instead of just asking the questions. That's anywhere in life, not just here.

 

[zacdl]

What about post #147 in this thread (page 8)? I asked him for more details so we could help him diagnose and resolve his issue since this seems to be a rather unique problem he ran into!
His reply to my inquiry for more details?
How does that help us understand the issue??? (he seems to be trolling to me)

You left out the part where I said that was a deliberate troll made in humorous manner. I just checked the wmp install log and the only error it contained was 'unable to connect to windows update' as I had no internet connection at that time.

You fail to provide any more information. And when calebb brings up your failure to do so once more, what do you do? You still blow it off.

Edit- and if twice wasn't enough- you ignore it yet a third time:

The whole problem is not that Vista would be so bad. The problem is that it's not good enough to validate an upgrade from XP. Basically it only brings driver trouble and miniscule amount of eye candy (yeah, I run bricopacks in XP and it's still faster than Vista Aero).

For consumer use - ok, if someone wants to fiddle with it fine. Afterall, people use linux too don't they?

I agree with this. Accuse him of being uncooperative, but don't claim that problems only come into existence after one has been provided sufficient evidence.

I think you know exactly what we are meaning, you are just beeing a word-nazi.

 

[calebb]

You left out the part where I said that was a deliberate troll made in humorous manner. I just checked the wmp install log and the only error it contained was 'unable to connect to windows update' as I had no internet connection at that time.

lol, kk I missed that.

I just browsed M$'s website a bit. Did you make sure your copy of Vista was up-to-date before installing WMP11?

"1. Go to Windows Update and install any high-priority updates that are available for your computer."

 

[calebb]

? I think it shows a general lack of people skills, and an abundance of ingorance on how to interact with others. Why do you think so many job descriptions now have to specifically mention people skills? Shouldn't that be necessary and expected from everyone? That's really sad and disheartening that it specifically has to be requested, and you can easily see from here that it's very common.

Something else I just though of - English is probably not Finn's native language since he's from Finland. His English is good, but perhaps he did not understand our requests for detailed information. (and it's possible we took some comments the wrong way for the same reasons)

 

[Finn]

Come on guys, are you blind to your own actions?

I came here and stated I did an install where basically everything failed after the first boot to desktop. From there on I got immediately bashed by the Vista support group, including personal attacks and laughing how I don't even understand WMP11 is embedded in the OS. All while the attackers themselves were ignorant to the fact that N existed. Each and every 'supporter' tried to undermine my experience and accuse me of lying basically.

This mentality on this board is psychologically very interesting to follow.

 

[Finn]

Something else I just though of - English is probably not Finn's native language since he's from Finland. His English is good, but perhaps he did not understand our requests for detailed information. (and it's possible we took some comments the wrong way for the same reasons)

I understood the requests, but I don't have the said machine at my hands to provide the information at my freetime.

 

[calebb]

Come on guys, are you blind to your own actions?

I came here and stated I did an install where basically everything failed after the first boot to desktop. From there on I got immediately bashed by the Vista support group, including personal attacks and laughing how I don't even understand WMP11 is embedded in the OS. All while the attackers themselves were ignorant to the fact that N existed. Each and every 'supporter' tried to undermine my experience and accuse me of lying basically.

This mentality on this board is psychologically very interesting to follow.

That is not correct at all, and again you are creating a situation to disprove - aka strawman argument. Speaking of psychology...

 

[Finn]

You fail to provide any more information. And when calebb brings up your failure to do so once more, what do you do? You still blow it off.
Edit- and if twice wasn't enough- you ignore it yet a third time:
I think you know exactly what we are meaning, you are just beeing a word-nazi.

Gosh! Three strikes - that means I'm out right? You got me there bud. Good.

 

[dot_Zen]

[Snip] It's amazing how many times techies make fun on the general public for not knowing computer things when many of them would be at a loss to do simple things like handle interpersonal conflict, public speaking, dating, etc. It's easy for all of us to look down on regular users, but I'm sure all of them know things would puzzle all of us too.
[Snip..]

I happen to be on both sides, as I have been labeled many things throughout life; Playboy/player, jock, skater, frat boy, country (sometimes with inbred attached to it) boy, Cook'y(as in I was a Chef for 8 years) as well as Techie/computer geek.

I agree with this statement, to a degree, as I've seen with my own eyes how "Techies" can disqualify new technology for consumers by being over-zealous or technical. Sadly, some of those same attributes ring into many a' discussion here at the [h].

A chick I was talking to recently asked me about what I do, and when I explained she also asked," why so many computers". I tried to make the conversation as simple as possible(as the goal to charming a girl is to let them do the talking Only tip I'll give toy you 'fly boys'), but to make a long story short I then proceeded to explain why and which Operating System I used. As soon as Linux was mentioned or brought into the conversation, she responded with, "Oh, that for the hardcore nerds.". You are you're own creator, critic and destroyer..

I think we can go to a higher view and summarize these threads easily. Some people do have some real problems with Vista. Many of those problems do have workarounds. However, what kills the threads and degenerates them into flame wars is that attitudes some people have.

I'm not sure what's be going on here lately, but where do people think it's okay to come to a discussion board, post a problem, and then cop an attitude with those responding? I think it shows a general lack of people skills, and an abundance of ingorance on how to interact with others. Why do you think so many job descriptions now have to specifically mention people skills? Shouldn't that be necessary and expected from everyone? That's really sad and disheartening that it specifically has to be requested, and you can easily see from here that it's very common.

What's amazing, is that the people with the problems would rather flame others and ignorantly bash Microsoft, the vendors, the users, etc, instead of just working towards a damn solution. Is it more productive to flame others and spew hatred for a company that might not even be at fault, that it is to find an answer? I have a lot of issues with Ubuntu...so should I create some threads bitching at how ridiculous the Ubuntu organization is and how Linux sucks...or should I just try and work towards getting an answer? Those are the attitudes that derail these threads. When many of us are here to help others, the last thing we want to see is some raving lunatic spouting a bunch of BS instead of just asking the questions. That's anywhere in life, not just here.

As is always the case, from the "purveyor of logic", this statement should be 'Quoted for Truth'.

QFT!

 

[duby229]

This thread is about Vista hysteria. More specifically, there is a 'vocal minority' with very specific issues that are claiming that Vista is a horrible OS, broken, poor choice for anyone.

The purpose of this thread is (I believe) to shed some light on the FUD. Over 75% of [H]ard|OCP users that have tried Vista have made it their full-time OS! And of the remaining 25%, some of them only use XP for games (SLI or other driver issues).

I have no problem discussing the merits / shortcomings of an operating system, but I will not be silent when someone claims that Vista is broken because {Dell offers XP on new systems (so what?) or Vista plays Blu-ray media (DRM) or Vista is a memory hog (Superfetch, working as intended) or 95% of all applications don't work on Vista or UAC is broken or security in Vista is broken, ad nauseum}. <--- This is the FUD we're talking about.

No its not. This is people sharing there own personal experiences. Then you cut them down, and call them liars and trolls. You should be ashamed of yourself.

I recall this thread here where the majority of people turns UAC off becouse it --IS-- broken
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1180897

I just think you need to lay off of it a little bit and stop being so vehement that everybody but you is wrong... Sorry it doesnt work that way.

 

[duby229]

What I find funniest about what Calebb just replied to is that:

A) When people talk about Windows Support, they expect it out of the box. Well, you got it, somewhat, and I don't think any OS (excpet proprietary-hardware locked) can make a claim to 100% support and compaitability.

B) When the same people talk about why Vista sucks, and why something else is a better fit they do so only after years of research, hours of troubleshooting, and nearly a decade of driver redesign.

C) Lastly, they will then compare Vista to either two variances: XP or Linux

1. Linux: Is most notably not ready out-of-the-box; it's made headway, but still far behind. In this instance, that's acceptable, but for a Windows-based OS to ever need configuring or to give a Winodws-based OS the same respect when troubleshootng or configuring is "Unacceptable".
2. XP: Had far more issues at it's conception, with far more incompatibilities, and far more need to do the research. This has been documented, and is most noteable as the need to SP2 arose. Furthermore, everything good that the same SP2 offered has been included with Windows Vista; but for an assortment of reasons it is "Unacceptable"

There really is no issue with any of you wanting to wait 'til us "masochist" -as one of my esteemed posters made mention- do all the "testing" but, if you are to demur a new technology, make the comparisons on par if not identical as you would your reasoning.

Instead, we have users with issues no longer making off-the-wall thread titles like, "OMGGGZZ HELPPZZ PLZ" but now self-proclaimed experts on all things OS who are more arrogant about troubleshooting then helpful.

Just my .02, take it for what you will....

Dude that has to be the funniest post I ever heard. XP had more problems. wow. Linux doesnt have support? eh what you say?

Funny stuff here

 

[LhasaCM]

I recall this thread here where the majority of people turns UAC off becouse it --IS-- broken
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1180897

The majority wasn't that large, and it wasn't because UAC is "broken" as such. What was established (once the childishness passed) is that for some people in some circumstances, including many "power users" (who are more apt to frequent this forum), UAC causes more headaches than it is worth to them so they turn it off. For others, it's a good idea. Once again, it's a "your mileage may vary" type of conclusion.

 

[duby229]

I think we can go to a higher view and summarize these threads easily. Some people do have some real problems with Vista. Many of those problems do have workarounds. However, what kills the threads and degenerates them into flame wars is that attitudes some people have.

I'm not sure what's be going on here lately, but where do people think it's okay to come to a discussion board, post a problem, and then cop an attitude with those responding? I think it shows a general lack of people skills, and an abundance of ingorance on how to interact with others. Why do you think so many job descriptions now have to specifically mention people skills? Shouldn't that be necessary and expected from everyone? That's really sad and disheartening that it specifically has to be requested, and you can easily see from here that it's very common.

What's amazing, is that the people with the problems would rather flame others and ignorantly bash Microsoft, the vendors, the users, etc, instead of just working towards a damn solution. Is it more productive to flame others and spew hatred for a company that might not even be at fault, that it is to find an answer? I have a lot of issues with Ubuntu...so should I create some threads bitching at how ridiculous the Ubuntu organization is and how Linux sucks...or should I just try and work towards getting an answer? Those are the attitudes that derail these threads. When many of us are here to help others, the last thing we want to see is some raving lunatic spouting a bunch of BS instead of just asking the questions. That's anywhere in life, not just here.

Becouse you call them trolls and liars. What else do you expect.. You can give it but you cant get it back? I think that is unfair and ignorant to the extreme. This is a discussion forum. If someone posts a problem then you can give them a link to the solution. Instead you call it FUD, then they respond with No its my experience.. It happened to me. Then you respond with Liar. then they say no I'm not, then you call them a troll....

It happens in every thread.

 

[duby229]

The majority wasn't that large, and it wasn't because UAC is "broken" as such. What was established (once the childishness passed) is that for some people in some circumstances, including many "power users" (who are more apt to frequent this forum), UAC causes more headaches than it is worth to them so they turn it off. For others, it's a good idea. Once again, it's a "your mileage may vary" type of conclusion.

That was the conclusion made by the *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!s. Most people who contributed to that thread flat announced that it was broken, and that is why they disabled it.

I can count the threads an tell you how many people said it was broken and how many didnt....

 

[djnes]

Becouse you call them trolls and liars.

Got proof that I said that...or is this just an attempt at a rebuttle? When someone has a problem, no one calls them a troll or a liar. When someone has a problem, and goes off on some ridiculous rant...that's when problems start. It's a very simple concept to graps...but apparently not as simple as I thought.

If I had a minor problem with my VW....should I calmly call into the service department and explain the problem, and set up an appointment? Or, should I run into their dealership, shouting VW sucks, people who drive and like VWs are assholes, and VW as a company is an evil, sadistic empire out to screw their customers? Then, anyone who tries to ask me what's wrong with my car, I just bitch at them and call them assholes too.

Which one do you think will help me resolve my problem? As I said before...it's a very simple concept to grasp...give it a shot.

 

[calebb]

No its not. This is people sharing there own personal experiences. Then you cut them down, and call them liars and trolls. You should be ashamed of yourself.

I recall this thread here where the majority of people turns UAC off becouse it --IS-- broken
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1180897

I just think you need to lay off of it a little bit and stop being so vehement that everybody but you is wrong... Sorry it doesnt work that way.

I'm not saying that everyone but me is wrong. You are also strawmaning me! You are putting words in my mouth and then disproving what I supposedly said. I've conceded MANY times (including in this thread) to good reasons to not use Vista and I've never said Vista is for everyone. I simply debunk FUD! I don't debunk legitimate issues because...they are legitimate!

UAC is not the only security change in Vista - they streamlined IPSEC so the average user is now able to create custom policies if they want. And a thread that shows 50% of [H] users disabled UAC does not mean that UAC is broken...

You can't come to a forum and ask someone to "lay off" - because in the process of doing so, you are "laying in" to me. i.e., if I run around telling people that "imposing your opinion on people is bad!" then I am a hypocrite because that **is** my opinion!

Stick to the facts and this thread won't get locked


p.s., I am **NOT** ashamed of myself thank you very much.

 

[LhasaCM]

That was the conclusion made by the *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!s. Most people who contributed to that thread flat announced that it was broken, and that is why they disabled it.

I can count the threads an tell you how many people said it was broken and how many didnt....

Again - it's a matter of degrees. Broken (to me) implies that it doesn't work at all, which is not true. It may not work perfectly, but in some instances it does work and for more than a handful of users it works well enough for them. The bigger argument made against it was it being an annoying feature that didn't provide those users much benefit, but those are personal decisions, not statements of fact that apply to everyone.

 

[duby229]

I'm not saying that everyone but me is wrong. You are also strawmaning me! You are putting words in my mouth and then disproving what I supposedly said. I've conceded MANY times (including in this thread) to good reasons to not use Vista and I've never said Vista is for everyone. I simply debunk FUD! I don't debunk legitimate issues because...they are legitimate!

UAC is not the only security change in Vista - they streamlined IPSEC so the average user is now able to create custom policies if they want. And a thread that shows 50% of [H] users disabled UAC does not mean that UAC is broken...

You can't come to a forum and ask someone to "lay off" - because in the process of doing so, you are "laying in" to me. i.e., if I run around telling people that "imposing your opinion on people is bad!" then I am a hypocrite because that **is** my opinion!

Stick to the facts and this thread won't get locked


p.s., I am **NOT** ashamed of myself thank you very much.

And there ya go... Example proved.... A legitimate conversation ended with the threat of locking the thread.

 

[duby229]

Again - it's a matter of degrees. Broken (to me) implies that it doesn't work at all, which is not true. It may not work perfectly, but in some instances it does work and for more than a handful of users it works well enough for them. The bigger argument made against it was it being an annoying feature that didn't provide those users much benefit, but those are personal decisions, not statements of fact that apply to everyone.

Thats fair enough I can agree to that.

However I can recall at least half a dozen people saying that anybody who disables UAC is stupid, or a troll, or a FUD mongerer.... And the list goes on.

I know that wasnt you, but the point is still valid... Plenty of people get absolutely slammed becouse of the experiences that they have had.

 

[calebb]

And there ya go... Example proved.... A legitimate conversation ended with the threat of locking the thread.

Legitimate? You made things up and then 'disproved' them. Show me links to posts that I (or others) have made to substantiate your claims of being called names for having actual issues.

Thats fair enough I can agree to that.

However I can recall at least half a dozen people saying that anybody who disables UAC is stupid, or a troll, or a FUD mongerer.... And the list goes on.

I know that wasnt you, but the point is still valid... Plenty of people get absolutely slammed becouse of the experiences that they have had.

Show me. I have never seen anyone say that.

Nobody gets slammed for experiences they had. (prove me wrong with a link to a post).

People get slammed for spreading FUD that they read somewhere on teh intarweb.

 

[zacdl]

I came here and stated I did an install where basically everything failed after the first boot to desktop. From there on I got immediately bashed by the Vista support group, including personal attacks and laughing how I don't even understand WMP11 is embedded in the OS. All while the attackers themselves were ignorant to the fact that N existed. Each and every 'supporter' tried to undermine my experience and accuse me of lying basically.

That is exactly right. Up into you say we don't know N existed. What we didn't know is YOU ARE USING N!
For some reason that doesn't soak into your brain. The majority of people here are US users. Every Vista in the US has WMP11 installed. It's only logical, because you failed to include any information in your profile, that you are from the US as well.

You failed to give us any information. Again, as someone else said, you put words into our mouths and then attack what we "said".
"All while the attackers are ignorant to the fact that N existed"- you imply that you also gave out this information from the start, and because we are so ignorant, and don't know that N exists, we are therefore the trolls for attacking you.
It couldn't possibly have anything to do with you. You didn't do anything to provoke it. You are completely innocent.

That is not correct at all, and again you are creating a situation to disprove - aka strawman argument. Speaking of psychology...

I really don't think you should be so easy. Because he is from Finland (do we even know this for sure???) his English might be a bit bad? I would agree with you if he made common grammar errors in his speech all over the place- but as you said- we assumed he was from the US.
If you are from Finland, I guess I can hand it to you learning to speak English so well.

However I can recall at least half a dozen people saying that anybody who disables UAC is stupid, or a troll, or a FUD mongerer...

Proof? Let's see where people said that if you disable UAC you are stupid, a troll, or FUD mongerer. There may have been disagreement, and some may have said "Disabling UAC is not the best choice". Where people were called trolls and FUD mongerers is when they made crap up (like you do), to further their agenda.
As I also recall, you were one of the ones that said UAC prompts you for EVERYTHING, startup, shutdown, log on, log off, etc. Complete and total crap.

Legitimate? You made things up and then 'disproved' them. Show me links to posts that I (or others) have made to substantiate your claims of being called names for having actual issues.

You know it's not going to happen because said posts don't exist.
Most people on here run and hide when confronted head-on to back up what they say.

Nobody gets slammed for experiences they had. (prove me wrong with a link to a post).

100% true. Finn- do you see anyone questioning your WMP11 install anymore? No.

 

[eeyrjmr]

Got proof that I said that...or is this just an attempt at a rebuttle? When someone has a problem, no one calls them a troll or a liar. When someone has a problem, and goes off on some ridiculous rant...that's when problems start. It's a very simple concept to graps...but apparently not as simple as I thought.

If I had a minor problem with my VW....should I calmly call into the service department and explain the problem, and set up an appointment? Or, should I run into their dealership, shouting VW sucks, people who drive and like VWs are assholes, and VW as a company is an evil, sadistic empire out to screw their customers? Then, anyone who tries to ask me what's wrong with my car, I just bitch at them and call them assholes too.

Which one do you think will help me resolve my problem? As I said before...it's a very simple concept to grasp...give it a shot.

ooo ooo oo a new game!

http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1030796843&postcount=6

Yay, more FUD from you. Show me where Home Premium can join a domain? It's actually more like MCE 2005 than anything else, if you must force it into a label.

http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1030796825&postcount=8

Not true at all, just more FUD. Could you please tell the people using Verizon's FiOS service that the slow down is on their end? You apparently have never seen SANs in action. If you're comments were true, then why is it a server with a SAN for storage, on a 10 GB network doesn't download a Windows update any faster than a single client PC at home????

and a few others

 

[calebb]

ooo ooo oo a new game!

http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1030796843&postcount=6



http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1030796825&postcount=8



and a few others

He never attacked the person in those examples - he attacked their argument as being FUD. Unless I'm missing something?

 

[eeyrjmr]

C) Lastly, they will then compare Vista to either two variances: XP or Linux

1. Linux: Is most notably not ready out-of-the-box; it's made headway, but still far behind. In this instance, that's acceptable, but for a Windows-based OS to ever need configuring or to give a Winodws-based OS the same respect when troubleshootng or configuring is "Unacceptable".

1. 
   
   Difference being £££ has exchanged hands in aquiring Vista so it bloody well better just work.
   Had MS given it away for free then sure you have a point, but they don't they charge alot, and for that kinda money (and since I use Virtual machines alot seems I gonna be punished with the £300 version IF I ever get Vista ) everything from hardware to software had better be supported with no major hassle! that includes the MapleV that I was given when I was at uni, like hell am I forking out £10,000 for the newest

 

[djnes]

So you posted a few unrelated threads where I used the word FUD? Do you even know what those letters stand for? Nevermind the fact I was saying them to a person who I know talk to on IM quite often.

Are you really that sick and twisted that you need to troll on in a discussion you've had no part in...just to stir it up with someone else? Wow, Dr Phil would have a freakin' field day with you. Seriously...find something productive to do with your day.

 

[eeyrjmr]

He never attacked the person in those examples - he attacked their argument as being FUD. Unless I'm missing something?

Well the original statement had duby stating that the phrase FUD is chucked around. Fair enough "Becouse you call them trolls and liars." was the only part highlighted and djnes prob hasn't called someone a liar (jury out on troll... called people lazy mind...)

point still stands djnes and the rest of the vistaboys do take the stance that Vista has no problems and if someone does post a problem they do get shot down with such terminology (although I don't see what is soo "uncertain" abt WMP11 not installing... it either does it it doesn't so maybe a missuse of "FUD" by the vistaboys is going on..??)

the Vistaboys then wander why people come out and start slating vista

 

[LhasaCM]

Difference being £££ has exchanged hands in aquiring Vista so it bloody well better just work.
Had MS given it away for free then sure you have a point, but they don't they charge alot, and for that kinda money (and since I use Virtual machines alot seems I gonna be punished with the £300 version IF I ever get Vista ) everything from hardware to software had better be supported with no major hassle! that includes the MapleV that I was given when I was at uni, like hell am I forking out £10,000 for the newest

Umm...Maple isn't that expensive in the US...so you must be getting ripped off... (The Professional edition of version 11 is just under $2k, so about 1k pounds...)

And that's part of the problem with the Windows environment: it is expected that everything just work when things change and that isn't always possible. The more backwards compatability you try to build into it, the harder it is for things to "just work" wihtout issues because that adds complexity. (A lot of older 16-bit programs didn't work when XP first launched...like a lot of my old DOS-based games.)