Verizon is Abandoning Its FiOS TV & Internet Service

[veterator]

There needs to be a way to force telecoms to reinvest their massive profits back into the infrastructure. Something like a tax they have to pay to themselves which is marked for development of their network.

I believe it's directly related to how the stock market operates now. Have to have growth growth growth, or else your company while profitable is DIEING and everyone drops your stock. Corporate Social Responsibility has shifted from servicing many facets of the world, to focusing solely on stock price. Steady small growth is more maintainable than huge profit leaps every year.

 

[overclock]

The title is misleading. Verizon isn't abandoning FiOS, they are abandoning further expansion. I thought I was going to have to go with Comcrap or Time Weiner for a minute.

 

[Tanis143]

The solution is called local loop unbundling.

In Europe this occurred in 2000. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Local-loop_unbundling . Other countries do it as well.

We do it currently with land line telephone service in that you can pick whoever your provider is for phone calls, ATT, Verizon, Bell South, ANYONE. That's how it should be for internet access. The lines should not be tied to any one provider.

But you won't see it because this sort of regulation is called "job killing" and "intrudes on the free market" or words similar to that. Yet what it really does is allows for competition and thus innovation as well as lower prices and better service among providers.

Sorry, but you are a bit wrong on this. You can do loop unbundling with phone service because you can switch the provider at the hub site. You can NOT do this with cable service. Right now cable providers are stretching their available rf spectrum just to provide the channels, phone and internet. 10 years ago there was not a cable company that went above 500 mhz on their rf spectrum, now they are pushing 1ghz (which really sucks when it comes to roll off, or signal loss as it travels down the line). There is simply not enough rf spectrum for two cable companies to share coax. And since the rf is piped to all the area's through one node, there is no way to separate one customer off the line like you can do with twisted pair service. In the few area's were there are two cable companies, such as Waco, TX, there are two physical plants, one for each company. Whats gonna happen, and probably in the next few years, is analog will cease to exist on coax as well as OTA. All they would have to do is lump all their basic channels in one segment, their complete basic in another, and put their digital tiers in an area that can be accessed by both with a cable box or cable card. With the removal of analog that would free up roughly half the rf spectrum and make way for more HD content, more channels to bond for HSI (with DOCSIS 3 able to hit 100 Mbs or higher with just 8 channels, think what 16 channels would get).

 

[thyshallsmite]

>< saw this coming as soon as the FCC said you can't be a doche on landlines. its kind of pathetic when we are already so far behind on our internet and instead of moving foward we are moving backwards

 

[Langly]

Funny thing is in my area, Comcast is rolling out its own fiber connections and network. Very slowly though.

 

[Valshistixol]

Funny thing is in my area, Comcast is rolling out its own fiber connections and network. Very slowly though.

Once they roll out the fiber they'll up your bandwidth to 50-100mbps and cut your data cap down to 50GB.

Every telecom service in the US is just pure shit from TV to internet to cell phones. Crap TV, 3rd world internet service with data caps, and carrier branded and locked cell phones. Just fuck all of them.

 

[Ryan711]

I truly hope cable companies pick up the slack because the short-sightedness of these moronic telcos is going to bite them in the ass in a few years. Despite what many think, there is a finite limit to wireless bandwidth. So when people want mutli-gigabit internet, suddenly verizon and whoever will be up shit creek when their POS cellular service can't deliver that data.

This is JUST like the case with ATTs "fiber" endeavor. They decided to roll out FTTC instead of FTTH/P. Everyone was like "No ATT, don't cheap out, please pull the fiber all the way to the house". But noooo, they went ahead with their short-sighted plan in order to save a few bucks, and guess what? Now most of their uverse customers are stuck with 12mbps or worse, and they're struggling to provide enough bandwidth for multiple HD streams. Why pay for shit uverse when you can get more HD streams and higher bandwidth for cheaper from cable?

 

[Manaknight]

As with all tech, the big guys don't want to pay to expand or improve it unless they are making insane profits....but will turn around and kill any projects anyone else tries to roll out that threatens their conclusive or near monopoly status in various areas.

I understand that it costs a lot to bury wire and what not, but it's the same with everything else. Putting up new towers, replacing hardware on the towers. All the old wiring they want people to be happy with despite it being buried 20+ years ago.

And then instead of taking all those profits to build up a network that is worth a damn, they turn around and throttle everything and starting messing with their pricing to control customer usage or further gouge the customer for lesser services.

I'm just wondering when government will get tired of being in the stone age in places and finally tell them to provide modern and affordable services or GTFO.

when we end the practice of lobbying by any means necessary. they can take 25% of the infrastructure money, give it to lobbyists an dhave them fight to make sure what they are doing is ok, or at the very least a blind eye is turned.

Do you really need more than 12Mb? i mean...really....

need? meh maybe maybe not...but seriously, why should we slow down instead of speed up, that mindset is the antithesis of progress..or in this case simply catching up to modernization. why limit something doesn't need limited.

I read an article a while ago (may have even been on here) about how little overhead telecom companies have in comparison to profits coming in. even with support services in place its still disgusting. I'm not against profit, and even a lot of it...but this is becoming too much, a few hands holding all the cards and telling us this is the way its gonna be like it or not...that's the opposite of how this is supposed to work.

 

[rudy]

The reason for this is more fundamental than various cable deals and such. The cable deals were put in place because verizon always had this plan. Here is what everyone see coming. No hardwires everything is wireless. Sure us [H] will have to be drug by our feet kicking and screaming into that world but the mass consumer will not have a clue and will consider it an upgrade. Why bother with 2 networks when you can just build a single wireless network and charge them just as much if not more.

I hope I am wrong but I was wrong about LCDs and alot of other things. The mass consumer does not care about much other than it works or it doesn't mom just does not press her connection with face book. Now verizon can focus all their cash on expanding LTE. Meanwhile the rest of us will have to choose between a single cable carrier and terrible DSL.

 

[Impulse]

Sorry, but you are a bit wrong on this. You can do loop unbundling with phone service because you can switch the provider at the hub site. You can NOT do this with cable service. Right now cable providers are stretching their available rf spectrum just to provide the channels, phone and internet. 10 years ago there was not a cable company that went above 500 mhz on their rf spectrum, now they are pushing 1ghz (which really sucks when it comes to roll off, or signal loss as it travels down the line). There is simply not enough rf spectrum for two cable companies to share coax. And since the rf is piped to all the area's through one node, there is no way to separate one customer off the line like you can do with twisted pair service. In the few area's were there are two cable companies, such as Waco, TX, there are two physical plants, one for each company. Whats gonna happen, and probably in the next few years, is analog will cease to exist on coax as well as OTA. All they would have to do is lump all their basic channels in one segment, their complete basic in another, and put their digital tiers in an area that can be accessed by both with a cable box or cable card. With the removal of analog that would free up roughly half the rf spectrum and make way for more HD content, more channels to bond for HSI (with DOCSIS 3 able to hit 100 Mbs or higher with just 8 channels, think what 16 channels would get).

Are most cable cos still supporting analog in the US? I thought our local cable operator was behind the times in finally implementing a plan to kill off analog recently, warning people they'll need DTA boxes etc. Nevermind that they offer all of half a dozen HD channels... At least there was a tangible IQ bump on digital even if its still SD (analogs are still up for now so I compared them some).

Anyway, you would think the support and box costs would be offset rather quickly by the greater spectrum available...

 

[Ryokurin]

Funny thing is in my area, Comcast is rolling out its own fiber connections and network. Very slowly though.

They aren't rolling this out for homes, By fiber they mean their own internal network. This is how they got by with commercials that stated they had a bigger fiber network than Verizon several years back. The only thing you may see in the near future is the switching of everything except local channels to digital, and further out to a switched digital system which means they only send the data needed to view the channel you are currently watching at any given time instead of all channels like they do now.

 

[xxEIEIOxx]

The title is misleading. Verizon isn't abandoning FiOS, they are abandoning further expansion. I thought I was going to have to go with Comcrap or Time Weiner for a minute.

It is misleading but I wouldn't be surprised if it happened in the future. They sold us out to Frontier here and they increased the price considerably for a lessor quality of service. I had to go to Comcast just because they were offering comparable service for half the money. Though I have had my problems with them in the past, this time around I am happy with the service and wish I had done it sooner to save some money. Still sad though as other contries pass us in average internet speed the only thing rapidly increasing here is the cost.

 

[ecmaster76]

Oh yeah... you mean that service where they use a non standard interface and login system so you are forced to use their piece of crap 2wire and can't use any alternative modems? The one that doesn't have any bridging option so you can't easily use your own router instead? The piece of crap 2 wire that you have to reset frequently since it goes down often? The 2wire thing that literally takes over 5 minutes to boot up after a reset? The service thats capped at a certain gb per month where they charge you fees if you go over? The thing where it adds significant amounts of ping to online gaming, because they use interleaving instead of the better setup they use in the AT&T DSL? You mean the thing I upgraded to thinking it was going to be much better, and instead its worse in almost every way except the slight bump in bandwidth?

Yeah sure, that's improvement all right.

Hey we are talking about competition for TV services as well, which is quite nice compared to cable.

I've not had as many issues with the 2wire modem. Its a little slow to start up but thats mostly due to the signal training it has to do to connect. I've never had to reset it as a part of regular use (just one time when we moved). If its going down frequently there is probably bad wiring somewhere in the mix or your box is defective and should be replaced.

It does have bridging options. Maybe not the best but they are in there (at least in my model, perhaps you have a different one?)

Ping isn't an absolute. In your case DSL had a better ping but depending on where you live it very well could be the other way around.

 

[ecmaster76]

The service thats capped at a certain gb per month where they charge you fees if you go over?

They are all capped. Try pulling down a terrabyte on cable or DSL and see how far you get before you get a phone call.

My point is that any competition (bad or not) is till better than none. AT&T will hopefully improve their product whereas Verizon just sent a big signal that they will not be expanding or improving which leaves cable, etc free to raise prices, stop innovating, and continue to have terrible customer service.

 

[Chiplg]

They didn't sell to Frontier. Frontier is a spinoff. I remember when it happened because I have shares of VZ, and then had FTR shares in my portfolio one day. Sure enough, when I researched it. It was a Verizon spinoff.

It is misleading but I wouldn't be surprised if it happened in the future. They sold us out to Frontier here and they increased the price considerably for a lessor quality of service. I had to go to Comcast just because they were offering comparable service for half the money. Though I have had my problems with them in the past, this time around I am happy with the service and wish I had done it sooner to save some money. Still sad though as other contries pass us in average internet speed the only thing rapidly increasing here is the cost.

 

[Langly]

They aren't rolling this out for homes, By fiber they mean their own internal network. This is how they got by with commercials that stated they had a bigger fiber network than Verizon several years back. The only thing you may see in the near future is the switching of everything except local channels to digital, and further out to a switched digital system which means they only send the data needed to view the channel you are currently watching at any given time instead of all channels like they do now.

Business lines is what they are rolling it out here for. We were approached to switch our mpls lines to them which we said no to.

 

[Bohica69]

And this was a surprise to anybody HOW?

Their plan always was to roll it out to high population density areas with higher per capita incomes so they could charge more for the service and have higher population density to defray the installation costs. Once they hit the point of diminishing returns they ditched it.

Also, local/state utility commissions regulate cable/landlines and are do a better job regulating than the FCC does.

 

[jbrukardt]

And this was a surprise to anybody HOW?

Their plan always was to roll it out to high population density areas with higher per capita incomes so they could charge more for the service and have higher population density to defray the installation costs. Once they hit the point of diminishing returns they ditched it.

Also, local/state utility commissions regulate cable/landlines and are do a better job regulating than the FCC does.

charge more? My FIOS is the cheapest service per Mbit available.

40 bucks for 50/50, thats unbeatable by anyone else.

 

[JasonPC]

They are all capped. Try pulling down a terrabyte on cable or DSL and see how far you get before you get a phone call.

My point is that any competition (bad or not) is till better than none. AT&T will hopefully improve their product whereas Verizon just sent a big signal that they will not be expanding or improving which leaves cable, etc free to raise prices, stop innovating, and continue to have terrible customer service.

at&t has abandoned deploying its uverse service as well. They have laid off their entire uverse construction force and scrapped all plans to build out any more areas that were on their list. If your area doesn't have uverse, it likely never will. They are just as bad as Verizon. At least Verizon is shifting their capital to wireless. at&t's LTE buildout is a joke compared to Verizon. at&t is still building fiber to the home in new subdivision developments however. But since the housing market is pretty bad, that won't be a very large undertaking. Also for whatever reason. at&t won't sell the "faster" speeds that copper uverse gets for their fiber to the home customers. Why, who knows??

 

[Dion]

Most people on Verizon fios are with Frontier now anyways.

 

[Ryokurin]

Business lines is what they are rolling it out here for. We were approached to switch our mpls lines to them which we said no to.

Yep, it still is just an extension of their internal network. Selling off excess capacity just helps pay it off quicker. They are kind of late in offering it too as Cox and TWC has done "Metro Ethernet" as Comcast likes to call it for a couple of years before Comcast did.

http://connectedplanetonline.com/bu...aunches-business-Ethernet-in-20-markets-0516/

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

There needs to be a way to force telecoms to reinvest their massive profits back into the infrastructure. Something like a tax they have to pay to themselves which is marked for development of their network.

It will come back to bite them in the ass over time.

It's only a matter of time until under served areas wind up being served by some entrepreneurial mind, or competitor, or even community broadband.

That being said, I am very happy to live in a neighborhood that has FiOS right now. My 35mbit down/30up basic internet package has served me well, and chances are that when it comes time to move, if that happens in the next few years, finding a house served by FiOS or a good community broadband service is going to be on the requirements list, or I won't move.

The other alternatives around here (Comcast, Charter, AT&T (some places), Cox (further south)) simply suck so bad I would never consider them again.

Unless the ISP's want to force the hands of local governments into creating community broadband, and start this down the road of becoming an expectation of town services (like trash pickup) they are going to have to pick it up again. Once that precedent is set, its going to be tough for them to push back.

A internet service provider with no profit incentive focused simply on providing its users with the best experience possible really sounds great to me, and I hope to wind up with this at some point, if for no other reason than that the big telecoms and cable companies are Satan himself and I hope they all die!

We just need to remain active and make sure that the cable companies don't succeed in bribing local and state legislators to ban community broadband like they did in North Carolina. That was the very definition of criminal corruption if you ask me, and I seriously hope it results in a federal probe.

 

[niconx]

at&t has abandoned deploying its uverse service as well. They have laid off their entire uverse construction force and scrapped all plans to build out any more areas that were on their list. If your area doesn't have uverse, it likely never will. They are just as bad as Verizon. At least Verizon is shifting their capital to wireless. at&t's LTE buildout is a joke compared to Verizon. at&t is still building fiber to the home in new subdivision developments however. But since the housing market is pretty bad, that won't be a very large undertaking. Also for whatever reason. at&t won't sell the "faster" speeds that copper uverse gets for their fiber to the home customers. Why, who knows??

They halted Uverse expansion? Do you have proof of this? I can tell you AT&T has been slow about expansion because they refused to hire enough people to do the job. They were hiring non union workers to do uverse installs in some markets. Workers are overloaded with installs. I know someone who used to install for them and he quit because they expected him to work 13 days in a row 12-16 hour days. He told me that in the course of a month 3 other employees had quit or been fired. This is down here in the Miami area.

 

[nigthstar757]

never tried to sign up for fios. It does do everything cable companies do, but was not sure how it will actually perform. Verizon could've offered aggressive pricing.

 

[Stiler]

I wish I could get Fios, if someone could cut into comcast's monopoly it'd be nice, to have competition and things.

 

[JasonPC]

They halted Uverse expansion? Do you have proof of this? I can tell you AT&T has been slow about expansion because they refused to hire enough people to do the job. They were hiring non union workers to do uverse installs in some markets. Workers are overloaded with installs. I know someone who used to install for them and he quit because they expected him to work 13 days in a row 12-16 hour days. He told me that in the course of a month 3 other employees had quit or been fired. This is down here in the Miami area.

I worked for at&t as a contractor in engineering. They will still do uverse installations in areas that have uverse but they have stopped depoloyment of it in new areas. So uverse coverage in cities basically look like swiss cheese. If your neighborhood's crossconnect does not have a so-called "VRAD" cabinet and your neighborhood's lines were never conditioned for uverse, it likely never will. Link: http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/ATTs-Stankey-Uverse-Build-Virtually-Over-114279

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

never tried to sign up for fios. It does do everything cable companies do, but was not sure how it will actually perform. Verizon could've offered aggressive pricing.

Well, when I signed up, I did so because I was tired of being comcastrated.

Also, FiOS offered about 7 times faster downstream and about 15 times faster upstream internet at the same monthly cost as I was paying comcast.

 

[Tinmann]

We've had Verizon Fios for years. No other broadband in Central Florida can compete. The customer service on the other hand is terrible. I would go to the local Verizon store to pay my bill, I know I can pay online but I came up in a time when you could actually talk face to face with a customer service agent. I go into the store with a question about my bill, there is a guy at a podium that puts me in queue, there are 4 agents at different stations, I get called up and the agent can't tell me anything about the problem with my bill. He tells me I'll have to call customer service. Okay, What the hell are you here for? To just take my payments and try to up sell me more services?
And if you ever sign up for a bundle pay very close attention to your bill after any changes to that bundle are made. Pay very close attention to your bill period .