UPS Battery Life?

Zarathustra[H]

Zarathustra[H]

Extremely [H]
Joined
Oct 29, 2000
Messages
38,859
Hey everyone,

Just had a brief power outage last night due to the snowstorm, and was surprised that my Server blew through my UPS charge WAY faster than I expected. It completed a safe shutdown in under 10 minutes (which is really all it needs to do, but I like some more uptime).

When I first set up the UPS, I had about an hour of uptime on it.

The UPS is an older APC SmartUPS SUA1500 I got a good deal on on eBay in October 2014. First thing I did was pop a fresh set of batteries in it from the Battery Store (Or Batteries Plus as they are now known).

So, the sealed lead acid batteries have been in use for ~2 years and 3 months. IN that time they have very rarely actually discharged, only once or twice really, except for my testing when I first set them up.

Is this the expected life of these batteries? Or is my older UPS maybe not doing well? Or maybe the batteries at Batteries Plus aren't the highest quality?

I'd appreciate any thoughts.
 
Should be 3 to 5 years. If you are lucky longer. I have a CyberPower 2200 VA model at work and the batteries are ~7 years old and still working.
 
drescherjm said:
Should be 3 to 5 years. If you are lucky longer. I have a CyberPower 2200 VA model at work and the batteries are ~7 years old and still working.
Click to expand...

Hmm. In your experience if you start experiencing shorter uptimes sooner than anticipated, where should I be looking for the culprit? Shitty batteries? Bad UPS?
 
Expected battery capacity vs expected power draw?

Is your server drawing more current then previously? Maybe instrument a test with a kill-a-watt or the like.

It's my understanding that most UPS devices do a poor job of maintaining batteries (overcharging, floating at too high voltage, etc). Not hard to determine if you have a multimeter and don't mind opening it up while it's running. Lot of documentation and write-ups on this. Example:
http://www.jjoseph.org/notes/apc_smartups_battery_float_voltage
 
Track Drew said:
Expected battery capacity vs expected power draw?

Is your server drawing more current then previously? Maybe instrument a test with a kill-a-watt or the like.

It's my understanding that most UPS devices do a poor job of maintaining batteries (overcharging, floating at too high voltage, etc). Not hard to determine if you have a multimeter and don't mind opening it up while it's running. Lot of documentation and write-ups on this. Example:
http://www.jjoseph.org/notes/apc_smartups_battery_float_voltage
Click to expand...


That is a good link. The "Elevated temperatures" bit is probably partially to blame as well. This server and UPS sits in my un-airconditioned basement, which can get as hot as 90 degrees during the summer.

I'd imagine great care would have to be taken if measuring the unit while active, but since it is voltage we are measuring, it is simpler.

Not looking forward to try to make a serial connection to it again though. Managing the UPS via serial terminal was a goddamned pain in the buttocks. I have the optional NIC and web management card for the UPS, so maybe I can do it that way?
 
The part that is perplexing me is that the UPS isn't telling me that the batteries are bad.

Isn't it supposed to notify you when the batteries are old, and recommend replacing them?

The web interface sadly does not seem to have a voltage calibration section. I did find the current stats on power draw though, and it looks pretty similar to where it was when I first set it up.

Code: 
Last Battery Transfer: Detection of a line voltage notch or spike
Internal Temperature: 61.1°F
Runtime Remaining: 1 hour 4 minutes
Power
Input Voltage: 116.6 VAC
Output Voltage: 116.6 VAC
Frequency: 60.0 Hz
Load
Load Power: 18.8 %Watts
Apparent Load Power: 16.2 %VA
Load Current: 1.7 Amps
Battery
Capacity: 100.0 %
Battery Voltage: 27.67 VDC
External Batteries: 0

The "Battery Voltage" there does seem a little high though, as you mentioned. There are two 12v batteries in series, so I would expect it to be 24V, not almost 28...

The UPS even thinks it has 1 hour and 4 minutes of runtime remaining, based on the calibration I did 2 years and 4 months ago, so I don't think its a change in current draw.
 
Last edited:
A 12V battery @12V is 25% discharged. 12.6-12-7 is 100% charged. All depends on cell type, this is when not connected to a load/charger.

Charging/float voltage needs to be higher and should be temperature compensated. Some general concepts about this: http://www.powerstream.com/SLA.htm

If your basement gets 90 degrees in the summer and the UPS isn't decreasing the float voltage (which it probably isn't), you're going to be overcharging which will result in premature failure.

I'm sure they're sealed and have had some electrolyte boiled off, but you "technically" can open and refill them. Maybe hook them to a conditioner for a week or two and try to rejuvenate them.
 
Track Drew said:
A 12V battery @12V is 25% discharged. 12.6-12-7 is 100% charged. All depends on cell type, this is when not connected to a load/charger.

Charging/float voltage needs to be higher and should be temperature compensated. Some general concepts about this: http://www.powerstream.com/SLA.htm

If your basement gets 90 degrees in the summer and the UPS isn't decreasing the float voltage (which it probably isn't), you're going to be overcharging which will result in premature failure.

I'm sure they're sealed and have had some electrolyte boiled off, but you "technically" can open and refill them. Maybe hook them to a conditioner for a week or two and try to rejuvenate them.
Click to expand...


What is a conditioner in this context? I am not familiar. Are they expensive?
 
Also, if your figured about 12.6-12.7 are accurate, that would suggest that my batteries are at between 108% and 110% charge. That could be the source right there.

Problem is, if I calibrate them for my winter temps, is that going to result in under-charging in the summer?
 
I use something like this on auto batteries regularly (same concept), have also used it on UPS and small sealed lead acid batteries (usually have to partially disassemble to add some distilled water): http://www.batteryminders.com/12-volt-maintenance-charger-desfulator-1500

Bunch of brands out there all with proprietary methods of conditioning/desulfating. Key for any (good) battery charger is to be temp compensated. I've used them to make my car batteries last for years, bring back batteries that don't hold a charge, etc. Google it - you'll read many a success story.

Answer as far as calibration - yes. Ideally the device should auto calibrate with a temp sensor or batteries should be climate controlled.

My understanding is that APC (and most other UPS companies) overcharge batteries to get slightly better capacity and artificially introduce an expiration date. Makes you a return customer.
 
Also, if your figured about 12.6-12.7 are accurate, that would suggest that my batteries are at between 108% and 110% charge. That could be the source right there.
Click to expand...

That is the voltage of the charging circuit. Battery voltage will be lower if you test when disconnected from the charging.

Here is the values I get for an APC 1400XL

Code: 
jmd0 ~ #
VERSION  : 3.14.14 (31 May 2016) gentoo
UPSNAME  : 1400XL 1
CABLE    : Custom Cable Smart
DRIVER   : APC Smart UPS (any)
UPSMODE  : Stand Alone
STARTTIME: 2017-02-10 00:16:55 -0500
MODEL    : SMART-UPS 1400
STATUS   : ONLINE
LINEV    : 120.9 Volts
LOADPCT  : 14.0 Percent
BCHARGE  : 100.0 Percent
TIMELEFT : 108.0 Minutes
MBATTCHG : 5 Percent
MINTIMEL : 3 Minutes
MAXTIME  : 0 Seconds
MAXLINEV : 121.5 Volts
MINLINEV : 119.6 Volts
OUTPUTV  : 120.9 Volts
SENSE    : High
DWAKE    : 0 Seconds
DSHUTD   : 180 Seconds
DLOWBATT : 2 Minutes
LOTRANS  : 103.0 Volts
HITRANS  : 132.0 Volts
RETPCT   : 15.0 Percent
ITEMP    : 28.8 C
ALARMDEL : Low Battery
BATTV    : 27.6 Volts
LINEFREQ : 60.0 Hz
LASTXFER : Automatic or explicit self test
NUMXFERS : 0
TONBATT  : 0 Seconds
CUMONBATT: 0 Seconds
XOFFBATT : N/A
SELFTEST : NO
STESTI   : 336
STATFLAG : 0x05000008
DIPSW    : 0x00
REG1     : 0x00
REG2     : 0x00
REG3     : 0x00
MANDATE  : 11/23/98
SERIALNO : XS9902016875
BATTDATE : 07/22/14
NOMOUTV  : 115 Volts
NOMBATTV : 24.0 Volts
EXTBATTS : 0
FIRMWARE : 70.11.D
END APC  : 2017-02-10 13:56:17 -0500
 
drescherjm said:
That is the voltage of the charging circuit. Battery voltage will be lower if you test when disconnected from the charging.

Here is the values I get for an APC 1400XL

Code: 
jmd0 ~ #
VERSION  : 3.14.14 (31 May 2016) gentoo
UPSNAME  : 1400XL 1
CABLE    : Custom Cable Smart
DRIVER   : APC Smart UPS (any)
UPSMODE  : Stand Alone
STARTTIME: 2017-02-10 00:16:55 -0500
MODEL    : SMART-UPS 1400
STATUS   : ONLINE
LINEV    : 120.9 Volts
LOADPCT  : 14.0 Percent
BCHARGE  : 100.0 Percent
TIMELEFT : 108.0 Minutes
MBATTCHG : 5 Percent
MINTIMEL : 3 Minutes
MAXTIME  : 0 Seconds
MAXLINEV : 121.5 Volts
MINLINEV : 119.6 Volts
OUTPUTV  : 120.9 Volts
SENSE    : High
DWAKE    : 0 Seconds
DSHUTD   : 180 Seconds
DLOWBATT : 2 Minutes
LOTRANS  : 103.0 Volts
HITRANS  : 132.0 Volts
RETPCT   : 15.0 Percent
ITEMP    : 28.8 C
ALARMDEL : Low Battery
BATTV    : 27.6 Volts
LINEFREQ : 60.0 Hz
LASTXFER : Automatic or explicit self test
NUMXFERS : 0
TONBATT  : 0 Seconds
CUMONBATT: 0 Seconds
XOFFBATT : N/A
SELFTEST : NO
STESTI   : 336
STATFLAG : 0x05000008
DIPSW    : 0x00
REG1     : 0x00
REG2     : 0x00
REG3     : 0x00
MANDATE  : 11/23/98
SERIALNO : XS9902016875
BATTDATE : 07/22/14
NOMOUTV  : 115 Volts
NOMBATTV : 24.0 Volts
EXTBATTS : 0
FIRMWARE : 70.11.D
END APC  : 2017-02-10 13:56:17 -0500
Click to expand...

Ah, here are mine. I'll have to compare.

Code: 
APC      : 001,050,1134
DATE     : 2017-02-10 13:58:50 -0500  
HOSTNAME : proxmox
VERSION  : 3.14.12 (29 March 2014) debian
UPSNAME  : SUA1500
CABLE    : Custom Cable Smart
DRIVER   : APC Smart UPS (any)
UPSMODE  : Stand Alone
STARTTIME: 2017-02-10 01:39:53 -0500  
MODEL    : Smart-UPS 1500
STATUS   : ONLINE 
LINEV    : 117.3 Volts
LOADPCT  : 18.8 Percent
BCHARGE  : 100.0 Percent
TIMELEFT : 60.0 Minutes
MBATTCHG : 4 Percent
MINTIMEL : 10 Minutes
MAXTIME  : 0 Seconds
MAXLINEV : 118.0 Volts
MINLINEV : 115.2 Volts
OUTPUTV  : 117.3 Volts
SENSE    : High
DWAKE    : 0 Seconds
DSHUTD   : 540 Seconds
DLOWBATT : 2 Minutes
LOTRANS  : 106.0 Volts
HITRANS  : 127.0 Volts
RETPCT   : 15.0 Percent
ITEMP    : 15.7 C
ALARMDEL : 5 Seconds
BATTV    : 27.7 Volts
LINEFREQ : 60.0 Hz
LASTXFER : Line voltage notch or spike
NUMXFERS : 0
TONBATT  : 0 Seconds
CUMONBATT: 0 Seconds
XOFFBATT : N/A
SELFTEST : NO
STESTI   : 336
STATFLAG : 0x05000008
REG1     : 0x00
REG2     : 0x00
REG3     : 0x00
MANDATE  : 06/17/08
SERIALNO : AS0825131199
BATTDATE : 09/01/14
NOMOUTV  : 120 Volts
NOMBATTV : 24.0 Volts
EXTBATTS : 0
FIRMWARE : 653.18.D
END APC  : 2017-02-10 13:59:02 -0500
 
Track Drew said:
Agreed. The batteries are essentially hooked up to a float charger. The voltage looks fine at the ~60 degree F temp.
Click to expand...

Just to make sure I am understanding this correctly...

If the temp went up, and no temperature based adjustment took place, it would result in a higher voltage number?
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
If the temp went up, and no temperature based adjustment took place, it would result in a higher voltage number?
Click to expand...

If the temperature increases and no temperature based float voltage decrease occurs, then the battery electrolyte will begin to boil off.


Track Drew said:
The voltage looks fine at the ~60 degree F temp.
Click to expand...

I'm going to backtrack on this. This would be fine for relative short term, but since the batteries are essentially always at this voltage, it's likely just on the edge of too high - would need to see exact battery specs (not from APC) to be sure.
 
Track Drew said:
A 12V battery @12V is 25% discharged. 12.6-12-7 is 100% charged. All depends on cell type, this is when not connected to a load/charger.
Click to expand...

Incorrect.

Battery float charge voltage is 13.5-13.8v for nearly all common 12v type sealed lead-acid batteries used in UPSes (5-18Ah), including the batteries used in the OPs UPS (which I also have one of.) If you keep the battery at 12-12.7v, you're keeping it in a constant state of discharge and will cause excessive wear on the battery. I see this problem on those battery powered kids plastic vehicles, the "charger" only outputs 12v so the battery never fully charges and dies relatively quickly since you're running it flat.

UPSes that use two batteries in series should have a voltage of ~27.6v for a float charge, if this number is more than a few volts less for an extended period of time, it indicates you have a damaged battery which needs to be replaced.
 
GiGaBiTe said:
UPSes that use two batteries in series should have a voltage of ~27.6v for a float charge, if this number is more than a few volts less for an extended period of time, it indicates you have a damaged battery which needs to be replaced.
Click to expand...

Appreciate the input.

So, if mine is 27.7V that suggests it is in good shape?

Why then is it discharging in 10 minutes, when it should have 50min to an hour of charge in it?

Something is not adding up here.
 
So, if mine is 27.7V that suggests it is in good shape?
Click to expand...

You need to at least test the battery voltage with a DVM with the unit off. Otherwise you are just testing the float voltage.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
Hey everyone,

Just had a brief power outage last night due to the snowstorm, and was surprised that my Server blew through my UPS charge WAY faster than I expected. It completed a safe shutdown in under 10 minutes (which is really all it needs to do, but I like some more uptime).

When I first set up the UPS, I had about an hour of uptime on it.

The UPS is an older APC SmartUPS SUA1500 I got a good deal on on eBay in October 2014. First thing I did was pop a fresh set of batteries in it from the Battery Store (Or Batteries Plus as they are now known).

So, the sealed lead acid batteries have been in use for ~2 years and 3 months. IN that time they have very rarely actually discharged, only once or twice really, except for my testing when I first set them up.

Is this the expected life of these batteries? Or is my older UPS maybe not doing well? Or maybe the batteries at Batteries Plus aren't the highest quality?

I'd appreciate any thoughts.
Click to expand...


UPSs are misized most of the time. Yours does not appear to be misized and is rated at: 980Watts / 1.44 kVA.

You should be seeing 60 minutes on that UPS, if the batteries are good and the replacements had equal mAh to the original ones.

Also I agree you should see 5-7 years on a set of batteries, assuming you are only failing over onto battery power a couple times a year.

I also agree with the room temperature comment. If that UPS is in a +80 degree room the lifespan will shorten.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
Appreciate the input.

So, if mine is 27.7V that suggests it is in good shape?
Click to expand...

Yes, that's a normal voltage. You can calculate lead-acid battery voltage by how many cells they have, with each cell making about 2.3v. If you look carefully at the case of the battery, you can usually see the molding lines between cells. They're more apparent if the battery starts failing, one or more cells will start to bulge the plastic walls out, in which case the battery needs to be removed from service and recycled.

Zarathustra[H] said:
Why then is it discharging in 10 minutes, when it should have 50min to an hour of charge in it?

Something is not adding up here.
Click to expand...

Unlike lithium-ion or lithium-polymer batteries, lead-acid batteries take a long time to charge. The normal charging time for a lead-acid battery is between 12-48 hours depending on the size of the battery (bigger batteries taking longer.)

I'm not sure what kind of load you're putting on the UPS, but there's one unfortunate reason you may not be getting the correct runtime.

Just like there are counterfeit power supplies for computers, there are counterfeit lead-acid batteries. I've come across many fake lead-acid batteries over the years, and by fake I mean lying about the amp-hour rating they list on the case. Some of the more nasty ones are very easy to tell because they weigh significantly less than a normal battery of the same type because they make the lead plates in the cells smaller. While the voltage will stay the same, the reduced plate length and density drastically reduces the load capability of the battery. Some of the more creative counterfeiters will try and fill the voids with something heavy (ie. sand) to try and make up for the weight loss, but this is rare in my experience (I've only seen it once or twice.)

If you notice that your replacement batteries are lighter by a significant margin, then you may have been bamboozled by Batteries Plus. I don't recommend them for any type of battery because their prices are ridiculous. The last time I went in there, a 7Ah battery was like $40 and a 12Ah was $80. I can get these batteries from ADI or Tri-ed for under $20 and $40 a piece, which I know I won't get junk batteries from.
 
GiGaBiTe said:
Yes, that's a normal voltage. You can calculate lead-acid battery voltage by how many cells they have, with each cell making about 2.3v. If you look carefully at the case of the battery, you can usually see the molding lines between cells. They're more apparent if the battery starts failing, one or more cells will start to bulge the plastic walls out, in which case the battery needs to be removed from service and recycled.



Unlike lithium-ion or lithium-polymer batteries, lead-acid batteries take a long time to charge. The normal charging time for a lead-acid battery is between 12-48 hours depending on the size of the battery (bigger batteries taking longer.)

I'm not sure what kind of load you're putting on the UPS, but there's one unfortunate reason you may not be getting the correct runtime.

Just like there are counterfeit power supplies for computers, there are counterfeit lead-acid batteries. I've come across many fake lead-acid batteries over the years, and by fake I mean lying about the amp-hour rating they list on the case. Some of the more nasty ones are very easy to tell because they weigh significantly less than a normal battery of the same type because they make the lead plates in the cells smaller. While the voltage will stay the same, the reduced plate length and density drastically reduces the load capability of the battery. Some of the more creative counterfeiters will try and fill the voids with something heavy (ie. sand) to try and make up for the weight loss, but this is rare in my experience (I've only seen it once or twice.)

If you notice that your replacement batteries are lighter by a significant margin, then you may have been bamboozled by Batteries Plus. I don't recommend them for any type of battery because their prices are ridiculous. The last time I went in there, a 7Ah battery was like $40 and a 12Ah was $80. I can get these batteries from ADI or Tri-ed for under $20 and $40 a piece, which I know I won't get junk batteries from.
Click to expand...


I suspect it is battery degradation rather than "counterfeit", as I did a calibration run when the batteries were brand new, and they supported a much longer run time. The temperature is probably to blame, which is a bummer as I don't really have the option to air condition the area. Maybe I'll put a big-ass fan blowing on it next summer. it won't reach sub-ambient, but it might help a little bit.

That being said though, where do you go for a reliable source of batteries? I picked these up locally at a Batteries Plus store, to avoid having to ship these heavy things.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
That being said though, where do you go for a reliable source of batteries? I picked these up locally at a Batteries Plus store, to avoid having to ship these heavy things.
Click to expand...

I get mine from ADI or Tri-ed, but they don't sell to the general public, you need a dealer account with them.
 
Track Drew said:
A 12V battery @12V is 25% discharged. 12.6-12-7 is 100% charged. All depends on cell type, this is when not connected to a load/charger.
Click to expand...

GiGaBiTe said:
Incorrect.
Click to expand...

I'd love to see some documentation on that, because I can't find any supporting information.

I think you missed the "not connected to a load/charger" part. Charging voltage != battery voltage at rest.

Measuring voltage of a battery on a charger or right after removing charge doesn't tell you much about the actual state of charge/health of the battery itself.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
Yeah, last time around I c
onsidered that, but considering their battery was about twice the cost of the one I could get locally, and it was "only a lead acid battery, not high tech stuff, so any old thing should do." That last assessment may have been wrong.
Click to expand...


B&B batteries are fantastic batteries from my experience when used in APC Smart UPS 2400 and 3000 units. I buy my B&B batteries from zbattery.com
http://www.zbattery.com/Batteries/12V

I've purchased other manufacturers and they fail a load test even when there new. I load test all batteries after charging them individually and letting them sit for a day. I pull up each manufacturers specifications for their battery and then I put the max load that is recommended on them. I use the 500 amp load tester below in the link for car batteries as well as my ups battery tests.

http://www.harborfreight.com/catalogsearch/result?q=battery+load+tester
 
Last edited:
JJ91284 said:
B&B batteries are fantastic batteries from my experience when used in APC Smart UPS 2400 and 3000 units. I buy my B&B batteries from zbattery.com
http://www.zbattery.com/Batteries/12V

I've purchased other manufacturers and they fail a load test even when there new. I load test all batteries after charging them individually and letting them sit for a day. I pull up each manufacturers specifications for their battery and then I put the max load that is recommended on them. I use the 500 amp load tester below in the link for car batteries as well as my ups battery tests.

http://www.harborfreight.com/catalogsearch/result?q=battery+load+tester
Click to expand...



So true...and you are my kind of crazy.

Sir I salute you!
 
Lead acid definately hate elevated temps. I installed 2 back ups pro 900s around the same time and 1 was in a cabinet that was hot. Batteries lasted about 2yrs and the other one is still going at 3.5yrs
 
I've had good luck with batteries from American Battery Company for my SUA1500's ( when I had them ) but with anything they are hit-and-miss. Some have lasted 5 years while others didn't even make it beyond their 24-month warranty. I just called them up and got a free replacement while under warranty. ABC used to make the batteries for APC but that was more than 10 years ago. I did try the Batteries Plus a couple of times when I needed replacements in a pinch. Those didn't even last two years and the warranty was only a year. The batteries in the SAU1500 can degrade quite a bit before the replacement warning goes off.

I'd say keep using the current battery unless it shows physical signs of bulging or leaking but be prepared to buy a replacement on short notice. Amazon has the ABC RBC7 batteries for $110.

Now I'm thinking that I've had my CyberPower PR-series 2200VA for a while now and the batteries are probably living on borrowed time. They still have 2 hours of run-time on backup at 6% usage.
 
jevans64 said:
I've had good luck with batteries from American Battery Company for my SUA1500's ( when I had them ) but with anything they are hit-and-miss. Some have lasted 5 years while others didn't even make it beyond their 24-month warranty. I just called them up and got a free replacement while under warranty. ABC used to make the batteries for APC but that was more than 10 years ago. I did try the Batteries Plus a couple of times when I needed replacements in a pinch. Those didn't even last two years and the warranty was only a year. The batteries in the SAU1500 can degrade quite a bit before the replacement warning goes off.

I'd say keep using the current battery unless it shows physical signs of bulging or leaking but be prepared to buy a replacement on short notice. Amazon has the ABC RBC7 batteries for $110.

Now I'm thinking that I've had my CyberPower PR-series 2200VA for a while now and the batteries are probably living on borrowed time. They still have 2 hours of run-time on backup at 6% usage.
Click to expand...

It's good to know that you had the same experience as I did with the Batteries Plus batteries. That - at least - tells me that there is nothing wrong with my equipment. I will check out ABC. I appreciate the suggestion!
 
Track Drew said:
I'd love to see some documentation on that, because I can't find any supporting information.
Click to expand...

12v-18ah-sla-batteryImageMain-515.jpg


Damn, that charge voltage sure was hard to find. Battery manufacturers should be sued for making the charge voltage impossible to find.

Track Drew said:
I think you missed the "not connected to a load/charger" part. Charging voltage != battery voltage at rest.
Click to expand...

Uh, what? Assuming a battery is fully charged, its voltage will match the charge voltage, this is true of pretty much all consumer battery technologies including Lead-acid, LiPo and Lithium ion. If your battery is not maintaining the charge voltage, there is something wrong with it and it needs to be recycled.

Track Drew said:
Measuring voltage of a battery on a charger or right after removing charge doesn't tell you much about the actual state of charge/health of the battery itself.
Click to expand...

Of course you won't know the state of the battery after a charge; That is if you have an uncontrolled charge on a garbage charger. Newer battery technologies based on Lithium can be measured very accurately due to their high coulombinc efficiency. Smart UPSes can also fairly accurately measure the charge capacity via other means, but I'll let you search for that information.
 
I noticed around 2-3 years my batteries didn't last nearly as long as they were new. They are continuously being used so they do wear down fast. I had to purchase new ones. http://www.atbatt.com
 
When I worked for a state agency, we had a lot of APC Smart UPSs. The original batteries would last for 3-4 years on average. Tried buying batteries from the local battery stores. For some reason, they rarely lasted more then a year or so before the UPS would report them as suspect. Some UPSs were never happy with 3rd party batteries. Found out there wasn't much difference in price to order APC replacement battery packs direct from APC and they worked and lasted better. And at the time, they came with a warranty. Only thing I can figure is APC keeps tighter QC control on their China supplier then the local battery stores. Never saw any 'smart chip' that would notify the UPS that it had an APC battery pack.
 
GiGaBiTe said:
...
Click to expand...

Welp, you posted about charge voltage - which again - isn't what I'm talking about. My post says that. Heck, the next line says "Charging/float voltage needs to be higher" and then I link to a page which matches exactly what you posted.

I'll take fault and say I probably should have just added originally that I totally agree with your charge voltage numbers - it's clear you didn't read my whole post.

Anyways - these are the numbers I always go by for a battery at rest (needs to have surface charge removed). I usually measure the specific gravity as well for good measure.
batt_volt.png
 
I use the smaller units...350-650VA ones through out the house. I just need it to keep the computer/tv/electronics on for the 2-3 second power outages you get several times a year during storms and stuff. With those, I only get maybe 2 years before the things won't stay on during a power blip....or start triggering when turning on.
 
Track Drew said:
Welp, you posted about charge voltage - which again - isn't what I'm talking about. My post says that. Heck, the next line says "Charging/float voltage needs to be higher" and then I link to a page which matches exactly what you posted.

I'll take fault and say I probably should have just added originally that I totally agree with your charge voltage numbers - it's clear you didn't read my whole post.

Anyways - these are the numbers I always go by for a battery at rest (needs to have surface charge removed). I usually measure the specific gravity as well for good measure.
View attachment 19203
Click to expand...


Those numbers are correct. if you see over 13v on a resting 12v battery, you have problems
 
Just as an aside, in your car, when battery is actually taking a charge from alternator, the alternator can go as high as 14.8-14.9V. Obviously you'll never measure 14+V out of a car battery.
 
jevans64 said:
I've had good luck with batteries from American Battery Company for my SUA1500's ( when I had them ) but with anything they are hit-and-miss. Some have lasted 5 years while others didn't even make it beyond their 24-month warranty. I just called them up and got a free replacement while under warranty. ABC used to make the batteries for APC but that was more than 10 years ago. I did try the Batteries Plus a couple of times when I needed replacements in a pinch. Those didn't even last two years and the warranty was only a year. The batteries in the SAU1500 can degrade quite a bit before the replacement warning goes off.

I'd say keep using the current battery unless it shows physical signs of bulging or leaking but be prepared to buy a replacement on short notice. Amazon has the ABC RBC7 batteries for $110.

Now I'm thinking that I've had my CyberPower PR-series 2200VA for a while now and the batteries are probably living on borrowed time. They still have 2 hours of run-time on backup at 6% usage.
Click to expand...


Alos, If I may ask, why did you get rid of the SUA1500's? And what did you replace them with?

Apart from this battery problem (which I suspect is battery and heat related, not UPS related) the SUA1500 has been a real champ, and it's built like a tank.

I haven't been as impressed by the newer APC models I've seen.


Power went out today again with this stupid storm.

(Not quite sure what is going on, first three years we lived here we went through several major storms without losing power, but the last two ones both knocked out the power.)

It went down so fast it's a miracle my server shut down cleanly.

I really need to order those replacement batteries and soon. I'm thinking of trying those ABC batteries you mentioned.
 
Not trying to thread-jack but I have a question pertaining to the subject (more or less).

Long story short, I work as a Maintenance Director at a local facility and we had some service done on our Fire Protection system today. The building is divided up into quadrants with each quadrant having a "PAD" that is associated with all the areas in its respective quadrant. All of those "PADS" have battery backups built in that use the same batteries a lot of standard desktop UPS's use, in this case 12v 7AH SEC1075 batteries, two in each unit run in series since the system is based on 24 volts. Anywho, we had all the batteries replaced today and the service tech left the old batteries for me.

My question is all 8 of the batteries left for me show 16.7-16.8 volts when tested with a multi-meter. This seems oddly high based off of what I know and what this thread has gone over. However, none of the batteries show signs of bulging, leakage, or anything else I know of that would make me believe they are bad. As I find it hard to believe that 4 separate charging systems are faulty in the same way, is there any other explanation for this?

Edit: The reason I asked this is because I have an APC UPS at home that is in need of its batteries being replaced and since I know the life of these batteries (temp controlled well maintained environment), I was going to snag a couple for use in my UPS since they otherwise will go for recycling. The only difference I can see between what the unit I have at home now has and these batteries is the APC at home uses batteries rated at 12v 9AH vs the 12v 7AH of these. AFAIK, that just means the batteries wouldn't last as long but that's a moot point since I just want to use the UPS on my router and cable modem along with an alarm clock, that is literally all that would be on it. But knowing the application, these batteries say on them "Specifically designed for optimal use in: Fire & Security Alarm Applications". To me, this is just branding so they can charge 5x more for the same battery because it goes in a Life & Safety piece of equipment.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top