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Time for a new socket 939?

and the time before it was with the Athlon XP.

Even though the XP was half priced, the fanboys proclaimed only the P4 as being worthwhile.
 
frappe33 said:
...
Next build I'm going to way over the top to avoid feeling this in 2-3 years. I know I am kidding myself, but maybe I can convince the Mrs?
Click to expand...

I've been building computers for damn near 30 years and that feeling NEVER goes away - there is always something new around the corner. The thing that seems to have worked for me is buy quality parts and upgrade over time, with the "old" parts going to the wife and / or kids' machines (now the GF's and kids'). True, s939 is not really being made any more, but there's life there. I picked up an Opty 175 a while back swapping out my 4000+ and I'm happy as a clam with it. The 4000+ went into a server instead of the kids. Always know that no matter what you buy, there will be something better next week for less money.

A good upgrade for your current rig would be an X2 CPU for under $100, then look at upping the video to an 8800GT when they become more readily available. Hang on to what you have and then when you are ready to jump to a DDR3 / DDR2 platform (I'm skipping DDR2...) you have a good vid card to move with you and the wife can have a nice rig too :)

If you do the upgrading right, the Mrs gets her own system, but make sure she gets to pick out her own case and gets the new monitor, seemed to make mine happy ;)





 
Yeah, I'll probably go with the Opty for my workstation.

I have to admit, though... the small performance gain between X2 and Opty hardly justifies the additional $$. But, that's why I ran the tests and also why I posted the numbers. Let each decide for themselves. I just wish I had more of the models at my disposal to include in the tests.
 
Here's just to give you an idea as to what a good X-2 AMD64 is capable of. I hope you enjoy.

3DMark8749.jpg
 
Nice numbers! DFI LanParty NF4, eh? I see a lot of NF4's on EBay... Ultra, SLI, SLI-D, SLI-DR... Which one were you using?

My Soyo boards used SmartGuardian. Those boards all had VIA chipsets. I'm surprised to see it used on a NVidia based board.

Hey, and what's up with the 33,750 rpm fan speed????? I'm assuming SmartGuardian read error?
 
I'm using the LANPARTY UT nF4 SLI-DR mobo in my current rig. Those fan speeds are mostly wrong, the only one it got right was the chipset fan. I'm running water cooling through the rest of the system with the Cool It Freezone cooler and let me tell you, this thing gets freaking cold, I had to put insulators on the whole CPU just to keep the moisture off the chip.
 
-AMD Athlon FX-60 Dual Core 2.6Ghz
-AMD Opteron 185 Dual Core 2.6Ghz (best Overclocker ~3.2ghz)
 
I rode the socket 939 gravy train from cradle to rocking chair and enjoyed it every step of the way. As many others have stated, definitely swap out CPU's for a low cost Opty or x2 and you'll be happy w/ the results.

I started w/ my first build on an Athlon 64 3000 because I didn't know much, but everyone was talking about s939 being future proof (like a Betamax I guess).

I quickly built my daughter a system around that 3000 and dropped in an Athlon 64 3500.

Then I came across a smoking deal on a "Never Overclocked" x2 4800 (Advice to sellers, NO ONE BELIEVES YOU when you say "never oc'd") and built a system around the 3500 for the wife.

Most recently, I took advantage of a NewEgg combo deal and cobbled together an x2 4200 out of some spare parts for a blazing fast Linux box.

All four machines still run well. And legitimately, none are OC'd, because I don't have the patience and HATE that feeling I get when I go to boot and just get a beep :) .

As people above have said, I have been tempted many times to buy "what's around the corner", but when I can upgrade what I've got and still hang with the big boys, it doesn't make sense.

One day I'll part out my main rig and go Quad Core, but for now, It's all good in the hood.

You have some room to grow in that upgrade cycle. Pickup that dual Core CPU, make sure you have 2gb of RAM and save your money for the next build.
 
maxinflixion said:
I r

Then I came across a smoking deal on a "Never Overclocked" x2 4800 (Advice to sellers, NO ONE BELIEVES YOU when you say "never oc'd")
Click to expand...

LOL so true, like a video card that comes with a Zalman VF700CU but it hasn't been OCed LMAO. A good seller will just say it OC'ed very well with no issues :)
 
Met-AL said:
and the time before it was with the Athlon XP.

Even though the XP was half priced, the fanboys proclaimed only the P4 as being worthwhile.
Click to expand...

It was true that if you did any video editing the P4C was much better, but the AXP 3200+ was pretty close in FPS at most resolutions to the P4 3.2c (resolution and game depending). It was the advent of the value of the mobile athlons and unlocked chips from AMD and the DFI mobos after Oskar Wu went to DFI that killed the Intel for value and bang for buck because most were getting the same if not better FPS with AMD setups, and most didn't care that it might take 25-60 seconds longer to transfer files or edit a video.
 
maxinflixion said:
I rode the socket 939 gravy train from cradle to rocking chair and enjoyed it every step of the way. As many others have stated, definitely swap out CPU's for a low cost Opty or x2 and you'll be happy w/ the results.

I started w/ my first build on an Athlon 64 3000 because I didn't know much, but everyone was talking about s939 being future proof (like a Betamax I guess).

I quickly built my daughter a system around that 3000 and dropped in an Athlon 64 3500.

Then I came across a smoking deal on a "Never Overclocked" x2 4800 (Advice to sellers, NO ONE BELIEVES YOU when you say "never oc'd") and built a system around the 3500 for the wife.

Most recently, I took advantage of a NewEgg combo deal and cobbled together an x2 4200 out of some spare parts for a blazing fast Linux box.

All four machines still run well. And legitimately, none are OC'd, because I don't have the patience and HATE that feeling I get when I go to boot and just get a beep :) .

As people above have said, I have been tempted many times to buy "what's around the corner", but when I can upgrade what I've got and still hang with the big boys, it doesn't make sense.

One day I'll part out my main rig and go Quad Core, but for now, It's all good in the hood.

You have some room to grow in that upgrade cycle. Pickup that dual Core CPU, make sure you have 2gb of RAM and save your money for the next build.
Click to expand...

Nice post Max.
 
SliWolf said:
Look at it this way, you can spend the $200 on a new S939 CPU or you can spend a little more and get yourself a nice AM2 or C2D setup, its really up to you. S939 is really getting hard to find for a decent price now due to them cutting the production line and quite frankly, I can understand why. The AM2 or C2D are vastly more powerful and at the same price if you were to do just a simple CPU and Ram upgrade on your current sys, weather or not you decide to go the little extra for the new sys is up to you.
Click to expand...


lies

AM2 is absolutely no more powerful than 939

Core 2 Duo is faster, but if you compare the price he would pay to buy a good motherboard for 775 C2D, DDR2 memory to replace the DDR, and then of course the CPU, he would spend much more money than if he lets say, got a $69 4200+ X2 and overclocked it, and the performance difference would not be as great in real world performance as you might like to think, in certain benchmarks and certain things it would be appreciably faster, but not $500 different man.....get real, dont make shit up

i was in the same situation, i had a 939 NF4 motherboard already (free) like he does, good overclocking high end DDR memory (like he does), and only needed a CPU (like he does), $69 is a ton cheaper than $400-$500 to get only some more performance in some things.....C2D is good, but if you look at real world everyday computing performance differences, it's not god, its the fastest out, but it doesnt come cheap in comparison

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103053
 
SliWolf said:
You know as well as I do that S939 is dead so why bother with old technology when these probably won't be able to run all those games and programs that are in the near future.
Click to expand...

wow, more lies

939 is only dead because AMD killed it to promote AM2 for future processor compatability (not because 939 is inferior to AM2 in any way shape or form), but now it seems anyone with a current AM2 board will not really reap the benefits from the new processors due to come out......they would need a AM3 (i believe is what it is called) platform to get the goody out of it, so the move to kill 939 so quickly was a bad move, it killed off a perfectly good platform way too early and now i am sure in retrospect was a bad move because it hurt profit margins on all the 939 CPU's and hardware out in the retailers hands

please, inform yourself before you get diarrhea of the mouth
 
nobody_here said:
lies

AM2 is absolutely no more powerful than 939

Core 2 Duo is faster, but if you compare the price he would pay to buy a good motherboard for 775 C2D, DDR2 memory to replace the DDR, and then of course the CPU, he would spend much more money than if he lets say, got a $69 4200+ X2 and overclocked it, and the performance difference would not be as great in real world performance as you might like to think, in certain benchmarks and certain things it would be appreciably faster, but not $500 different man.....get real, dont make shit up
Click to expand...

Look who's fooling who, I've seen the difference between a S939 and AM2 system side by side running the same apps. The AM2 sys is noticeably faster, not to mention has better frame rates using the exact same video cards. There's almost a 30fps difference running the graphical test on CS:S. And no, there wouldn't be much of a difference in speed between what he currently has and an X-2 4200, he would be much better off getting either a new AM2 system or a new C2D system and stop burning money on an already dead core.

Go out there and actually look at the comparison charts or build them yourself and see just what the difference is. There's more of a difference in just the mobo than the cpu, the architecture is completely different between an AM2 and S939 mobo. That alone will change how the system performs, not so much the CPU anymore, any AMD can OC to hell nowadays so long as you have a good PSU, mobo, and cooling to suffice the OC.
 
SliWolf said:
Look who's fooling who, I've seen the difference between a S939 and AM2 system side by side running the same apps. The AM2 sys is noticeably faster, not to mention has better frame rates using the exact same video cards. There's almost a 30fps difference running the graphical test on CS:S. And no, there wouldn't be much of a difference in speed between what he currently has and an X-2 4200, he would be much better off getting either a new AM2 system or a new C2D system and stop burning money on an already dead core.

Go out there and actually look at the comparison charts or build them yourself and see just what the difference is. There's more of a difference in just the mobo than the cpu, the architecture is completely different between an AM2 and S939 mobo. That alone will change how the system performs, not so much the CPU anymore, any AMD can OC to hell nowadays so long as you have a good PSU, mobo, and cooling to suffice the OC.
Click to expand...

man, you're full of it, the same two CPU's running in the same board, one 939 and one AM2 run the same or within 2% of each other tops......sure, go with a different motherboard with a faster running chipset, and you've got a faster platform, but still, the amount of money you would have to spend to get there is nowhere near worth it, he would then have to spend money on new mobo, new DDR2 memory, AND new CPU

or he could get the 4200+ X2 for $70, put a decent overclock on it, and have the same thing......

you've had people in this thread over and over tell you the same thing....i guess we are all wrong and you're the only one seeing appreciable performance increases in a AM2 CPU vs. 939....yeah....run with it mr "939 is dead"

like i said, 939 is only dead because AMD killed it prematurely, not because it lacked performance or anything of the like

do some research, dont believe the hype, 939 is only dead because AMD told you it is, you drank the cool aid
 
SliWolf said:
Look who's fooling who, I've seen the difference between a S939 and AM2 system side by side running the same apps. The AM2 sys is noticeably faster, not to mention has better frame rates using the exact same video cards. There's almost a 30fps difference running the graphical test on CS:S. And no, there wouldn't be much of a difference in speed between what he currently has and an X-2 4200, he would be much better off getting either a new AM2 system or a new C2D system and stop burning money on an already dead core.

Go out there and actually look at the comparison charts or build them yourself and see just what the difference is. There's more of a difference in just the mobo than the cpu, the architecture is completely different between an AM2 and S939 mobo. That alone will change how the system performs, not so much the CPU anymore, any AMD can OC to hell nowadays so long as you have a good PSU, mobo, and cooling to suffice the OC.
Click to expand...

OK. I didn't realize that the DDR2 mem control was a completely new Architecture but if you say so. The is almost no measurable difference between AM2 and 939. The only real advantage to AM2 is DDR2 but AMD isn't bandwidth limited so thats kind of a null point. The only real advantage to AM2 in my eyes is how cheap you can buy clock speed. But if you already have a good system and just need a new CPU there is no reason to switch from 939 to AM2 .
 
Look at the prices/performance differences if you really want to stick your neck out there. I compared this mobo/CPU/Ram on this AM2 sys with my twin eVGA 7900GT KO Superclocked cards and it ran CS:S 30+ fps faster than my current rig. But if you want to go with C2D, its just $10 or so more than the AMD system. Personally, I'd go with C2D, there much faster now than AMD but what do I know, I've only come from the tech department from the NAVY building these damn things for the service.

AM2 system $249.99
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=3163514&CatId=2430

C2D system $261.98
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=3329227&CatId=2406

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=2227141&CatId=2261
 
SliWolf said:
Look at the prices/performance differences if you really want to stick your neck out there. I compared this mobo/CPU/Ram on this AM2 sys with my twin eVGA 7900GT KO Superclocked cards and it ran CS:S 30+ fps faster than my current rig. But if you want to go with C2D, its just $10 or so more than the AMD system. Personally, I'd go with C2D, there much faster now than AMD but what do I know, I've only come from the tech department from the NAVY building these damn things for the service.

AM2 system $249.99
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=3163514&CatId=2430

C2D system $261.98
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=3329227&CatId=2406

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=2227141&CatId=2261
Click to expand...

Good job on the legwork, but how is that E4500? The C2D really likes the larger L2Cache and that E4500 only has the 2MB cache.
 
Met-AL said:
Good job on the legwork, but how is that E4500? The C2D really likes the larger L2Cache and that E4500 only has the 2MB cache.
Click to expand...

I know the C2D's like to have the larger L2Cache but this is a simple setup for someone who can't afford the better CPU like say the E6850 or Q6600. This is a relatively simple build that anyone can do, so what if it doesn't have the stock clock speed of the E6850 but it is quite capable of being overclocked to 3+GHz with minimal effort on the CPU side.
 
That is very very very tempting.

Must resist. Current rig is good enough. Must resist.
 
SliWolf said:
Look at the prices/performance differences if you really want to stick your neck out there. I compared this mobo/CPU/Ram on this AM2 sys with my twin eVGA 7900GT KO Superclocked cards and it ran CS:S 30+ fps faster than my current rig. But if you want to go with C2D, its just $10 or so more than the AMD system. Personally, I'd go with C2D, there much faster now than AMD but what do I know, I've only come from the tech department from the NAVY building these damn things for the service.

AM2 system $249.99
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=3163514&CatId=2430

C2D system $261.98
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=3329227&CatId=2406

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=2227141&CatId=2261
Click to expand...

Still don't believe the whole AM2 is faster than 939. The only diff is DDR2 and worse chipsets.

Though very nice finds on those deals. If the Intel one had a Intel chipset board with it. It would be even better.
 
SliWolf:

keep in mind most people here already have a s939 so the P/Perf ratio is slightly different for those who dont are not looking to get another cpu. And for kicks in terms of rough performance from anand on PCMARK05 comp:

AMD 6000@3.0 scores 6145
C2D E6700@2.66 scores 6779
AMD 5600@2.8 scores 5963
My s939@2.97 scores 6532

s939 has a EOL not because a 65nm chip would have been pointless but for other reasons. There are a lot of chips out there that can match am2 clock for clock.
 
I do realize this, hell, I even own a S939 as well just for the sheer fact that I'm still waiting on the 45nm C2D chips to start hitting the market. So I tweaked out my 939 to as far as I can take it with the parts I already have to keep myself from having to buy another 939 chip. I was actually looking at the Opti 170 or 180 myself until I found out that I could get 3GHz out of the chip I already have. I just have to wait for the memory I had to RMA to come back to me before I'll be able to see 3GHz out of this X-2 3800.

The truth of the matter is that AMD, the manufacture of the good old 939, has cut its production line on the chip and started making AM2 and socket F (same thing only for the quad boards). True, the 939 still has a few miles to go in them but have been surpassed in performance a long time ago. True, the AM2 isn't as fast as the C2D systems out there but is still a good deal for the performance you get out of them, not to say that the 939 isn't. But 939 is dead and is getting increasingly hard to find for a good price, that and DDR is extremely hard to find for a good price when your looking for a good set of chips.

I just can't understand why anyone would really want to go out of their way to spend $300+ on their already aging system when they could put it towards a new build. I'm used to budgeting some $200,000+ for building systems for the Navy and when I had to tell them which would be better to go with for performance per dollar amount, it always ended up being the C2D or even the old P4's. And I've been an AMD fan since they started making the Athlon. I just can't help it if they make the better chip for the price, even the military knows that.
 
Mike Armstrong said:
If I could snag one for a couple hundred bucks do you think it would be worth getting rid of my perfectly good 3700+ for a more pwerful but just as outdated 939 CPU? Thanks
Mike
Click to expand...

Dont worry about whats in style, out of date. A few months back, I bought another gig of ram and a 3800+ X2 Toledo for about $70.00, to replace my 3000+ winchester. Games arn't much faster, but its sure a hell of a lot nicer for multitasking. Even with my crappy 6600GT 128MB, I can play crysis on low settings. And, thats not all... I now have a CPU to upgrade my 1U "server" with. Im just ~$40.00 worth of motherboard short of upgrading the 500Mhz celeron to the 3000+. The 500Mhz celery-stick/socket 370 is an aging, outdated platform.

It does what I need it to do, it does it very well, it only cost me $70.00 to accomplish this, and thats all that really matters. You need to ask yourself what you are doing, that your computer isnt doing fast enough.
 
true $300 would be a bit much if going to go with s939 in which case i see your point and thanks for at least understanding mine:D

BTW, i have a opty170 and love it. She just topped out at 2.97 last night after 16hrs orthos stable and wont go any higher with current bios settings. I think i just need to finally accept it.....maybe lol
 
SliWolf said:
I just can't understand why anyone would really want to go out of their way to spend $300+ on their already aging system when they could put it towards a new build. I'm used to budgeting some $200,000+ for building systems for the Navy and when I had to tell them which would be better to go with for performance per dollar amount, it always ended up being the C2D or even the old P4's. And I've been an AMD fan since they started making the Athlon. I just can't help it if they make the better chip for the price, even the military knows that.
Click to expand...

i dont think anyone here is considering spending anywhere close to $300 in their 939 system....thats the point, i spent $70 to get a CPU to complete my 939 build.....like most others here, they already have the board, the DDR memory, and everything else, they just have an older single core A64 939 CPU

talk about not being worth it, spending $300 upgrading to a AM2 board, CPU and memory to go from an existing upgradeable 939 system that will perform the same would be a complete waste, and it would cost about the same or more to go C2D and only get marginal performance gains in most everyday tasks

you can hate 939 and call it dead all you want, but take a second and look at the realized performance increase vs. dollars spent to get there, and i think if you were honest with yourself, you would see that for most people here, upgrading their 939 system is by far the most cost effective
 
nobody_here said:
i dont think anyone here is considering spending anywhere close to $300 in their 939 system....t
Click to expand...

Actually IMO there will be thousands doing so with the advent of the 8800GT. But it will be transitional - moving on to either a C2D or AM2 fairly soon thereafter. But IMO there will be quite a number of people with 939 system snatching up 8800GT's to use with their 939 systems first instead of buying a new proc/ddr2 ram first. Had the $278.00-$300.00 8800GT not come out at it's price point and as fast as it is there I think most with 939's would have gone the C2D-AM2 route and rode out with the older GPU they already have (7600GT-7900GS-7950GT-X1650XT-X1800-X1950 cards).
 
zone_86 said:
Actually IMO there will be thousands doing so with the advent of the 8800GT. But it will be transitional - moving on to either a C2D or AM2 fairly soon thereafter. But IMO there will be quite a number of people with 939 system snatching up 8800GT's to use with their 939 systems first instead of buying a new proc/ddr2 ram first. Had the $278.00-$300.00 8800GT not come out at it's price point and as fast as it is there I think most with 939's would have gone the C2D-AM2 route and rode out with the older GPU they already have (7600GT-7900GS-7950GT-X1650XT-X1800-X1950 cards).
Click to expand...


true, but since most 939 systems still in use are already running PCI-E i was not talking about video cards, just platforms, mobo, cpu, mem, and in the case of 939, there are good cost effective CPU upgrades that are well worth using existing mobo and mem confgurations, saving time and money, and remember, people with 939 systems in the next year will have a good bit of money coming in if they watch the market and ebay them, in the long run, people who stayed with high end 939 systems will actually end up on top in terms of dollar spent for performance, because they will likely go from a high end 939 system to whatever is new, have been able to enjoy the latest PCI-E video cards (if they chose to), and will have not spent all that money on a initial AM2 or C2D mobo, cpu, and memory......
 
Haha can you just IMAGINE those with 939 AGP systems going nuts if NV decides to produce an AGP 8800GT :eek: I mean there are still a few out there running those boards and some have 939 X2 4400-4800's or the single core FX57.
 
Spend money on an old dog? How about 4 old dogs?

Yep. Just bought 4 x 1gb sticks of RAM for $140.
XP box goes to 3gb from 2gb
Linux box goes to 3gb (or 4 if I decide to go 64 bit Ubuntu vs. 32)
Wifes PC goes from to 2gb from 1gb
Daughter's goes to 1.5gb from 512mb

That'll tide me over until I part that x2 4800 machine and go next gen or next next gen.
 
nobody_here said:
welp....that OEM 4200+ X2 Toledo on Newegg just jumped to $110...i only paid $69 a couple days ago !!:eek:

Directron.com to the rescue

http://www.directron.com/ada4200daa5cd.html

4200+ X2 Manchester remains at $60

3800+ X2 Toledo still a bargain at $56 if its a good overclocker
Click to expand...

I was about to order two of those to upgrade 2 boxes for some older customers. Guess I will order from Directron they still have them for $66.99.
 
zone_86 said:
I was about to order two of those to upgrade 2 boxes for some older customers. Guess I will order from Directron they still have them for $66.99.
Click to expand...

better hurry, most online etailers follow suit once newegg changes prices, or they tend to price off each other anyways, either that 4200+ X2 is in short supply at newegg now or they sold a bunch recently and jacked up price to meet demand/profit margins :p
 
Yeah I'm checking out right now :cool: two of them. Probably the last socket 939's I'll order.
 
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