The New EVE: Apocrypha

SAW

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Nov 13, 2005
Messages
1,467
Just completed my 2nd and 3rd L3 missions. No problems and still in my Thorax :) I plan on either getting the Myrmidon or Brutix soon though.

Was looking at the Tier 2 drones earlier and I noticed they didnt do any more dmg than the tier 1 drones yet I need Level 5 on the scout drones to get them. Is it worth the time to train them up anyways?
 

D0n2k

Weaksauce
Joined
Sep 24, 2007
Messages
83
T2 drones are better in almost every way that counts ( Damage, speed, HP - in that order)

Base stats... Warrior II Damage Modifier 1.56 x vs Warrior I Damage Modifier 1.3 x
So although base damage is the same, modifier is larger ===> hits harder. (warrior II's are also lot faster for inty eating)

The specilisation skill that applies to the T2 drones also adds a good bite. EFT and EVEMON both show the difference.

For PVE it could get expensive if you don't manage aggro correctly, PvP T2 is pretty much standard/needed.


** edit and its Tech II, not Tier II . Tier generally refers to the different class in same ship group. eg Tier 1 BattleCruiser (ferox, prophecy, cyclone) is mostly worse than a Tier 2 BC ( Drake, Harbinger, Hurricane) - not sure about Gall, prob the Myrm considered tier 2?
 
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eggrock

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Dec 1, 2003
Messages
4,102
In case you guys are curious what I have my Thorax fitted with....

5 - 200mm Compressed Coil Guns - Tungsten Federation Faction Charges/Iridium

1 - 10mn Afterburner
2 - Cap Rechargers II

2 - Mag Stabs II
1 - N Type Kinetic Armor Hardener
1 - N Type Thermic Armor Hardener
1 - Damage Control Unit II

Rigs - 3 of them, dont recall what they are called, but one is for extra Drone range, another for Extra Dmg from Turrets and the last one gives me a slight increase to my shields recharge time.

I'm not sure of your skills, particularly cap management, but you should be cap stable (or nearly so) without the cap rechargers. The Gallente ships are 'properly' fit with armor tanks but with L2/L3 missioning you can be flexible (hence not going into armor when you mission.) If you want to live risky like that, this should fit depending on your skills:

Mark 1 Generator Reactor Control Unit
4x Magstab II

10MN AB
Medium Shield Extender
Medium Shield Booster

5x 200mm Compressed Coil

You'd only use the shield booster if you get into trouble, or fit something else there

When you get your Brutix--I mean, when you get your Myrmidon, ;) you're going to have some good options. Myrmidon has 1 more low and mid slot, more grid, way more cap, more drones and 10% drone damage per level. The Brutix gets a little more CPU, an additional high slot and a 5% hybrid bonus.

With my skills (assuming I had Gallente cruiser 3) this fit is cap stable and should be able to tank a lot of damage.

[Myrmidon]

3x Armor hardeners (mission specific)
Damage Control II
2x Medium Armor reppers

10MN Afterburner I
4x Cap rechargers

5x Heavy Neutron Blasters (AM charges)
Drone Link Augmentor I (+20k range, requires Scout Drone Operation IV)

Rigs: 3x CCC (Capacitor Control Circuit I)

Drones:
Hobgoblin I x5
Hammerhead I x5

Basically, sit back and let the drones take care of the little stuff and move in for the biggies. The blasters have an extremely short range but they deal good damage.

As a matter of fact, as soon as I get Electronics Upgrades V I'm going to get into one of these. Great ship.

By the way, your cruiser can hit harder than my Ferox (BC). :::weeps:::
 

eggrock

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Dec 1, 2003
Messages
4,102
I broke down and subbed to a second account. What would be the most beneficial career to train for? I'm thinking mining and then industry. (Anyone have a free working Dell 2405? I'll pay shipping. ;) )
 

Thuleman

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Apr 13, 2004
Messages
5,833
Imho mining is a total waste of time. Search this thread for some replies I made to essentially the same question where I went into touching on market subjects instead.
 

Volume

2[H]4U
Joined
Jan 17, 2004
Messages
4,010
I used to love getting lost in this game and forgetting about everything else. Too bad I don't have as much free time anymore (less than usual). I look forward to re-subbing in the future, though!
 

eggrock

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Dec 1, 2003
Messages
4,102
Imho mining is a total waste of time. Search this thread for some replies I made to essentially the same question where I went into touching on market subjects instead.

This one?

Who cares as long as (s)he puts out?

you cyber? :eek: :D

I found what you're talking about and it's got me thinking about EVE and human nature, namely, that trading (like EVE in general) takes a considerable amount of time upfront to learn--finding trends and sweet spots in the case of training. Further, people are typically lazy and put forth the minimum effort to achieve a goal and those willing to take advantage of that fact are in for a good time. It's like you said, people are lazy and will pay more for convenience.

My wife's cousin works in the mortgage/real estate business and told me at one point that people come to him for mortgages and don't shop around for a better deal. I basically said 'WFT, google it' and he replied that people can't be bothered to take even that simple step, and that's with a major investment that takes years to pay off if at all.

So... While I generally view EVE players as more mature, tenacious and intelligent than the average gamer (save the Amarr :p ) this principle would still apply to a greater extent and I can follow your suggestion after finishing up with this longassed wall of text.

Bonus points for fairly easy skill requirements so I can crosstrain something else.

[cliffs] It's a secret.
 

Version_3

2[H]4U
Joined
Nov 19, 2007
Messages
4,076
Imho mining is a total waste of time. Search this thread for some replies I made to essentially the same question where I went into touching on market subjects instead.

I don't mine at all, but I do reprocess loot to get mats so I can manufacture my own ammo and T1 pvp parts. Some people ask why I do that, and my answer is always "There is nothing fun about mining for me. However, if you ask me to sit cloaked while you mine, I'll be more than happy to oblige."
 

Tytalus

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Nov 1, 2006
Messages
4,257
I don't mine at all, but I do reprocess loot to get mats so I can manufacture my own ammo and T1 pvp parts. Some people ask why I do that, and my answer is always "There is nothing fun about mining for me. However, if you ask me to sit cloaked while you mine, I'll be more than happy to oblige."

Watching bait in low-sec is quite enjoyable, especially in stealth bombers. :) Get 4-6 Stealth Bombers together and sit 80-100k off the target... yeah, it's as fun as your imagination allows. :) Guy pops in, engages target and all the stealth bombers pop out of cloak and fire. Most people can't align quick enough and get OWNED in one good volley. Of course if it has a good tank it'll probably take out the miner first... but that's why they're called "bait". :)
 

mashie

Mawd Gawd
Joined
Oct 25, 2000
Messages
4,253
Watching bait in low-sec is quite enjoyable, especially in stealth bombers. :) Get 4-6 Stealth Bombers together and sit 80-100k off the target... yeah, it's as fun as your imagination allows. :)
I guess you haven't been flying stealthbombers for a while as the torps dont go that far.
 

SAW

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Nov 13, 2005
Messages
1,467
T2 drones are better in almost every way that counts ( Damage, speed, HP - in that order)

For PVE it could get expensive if you don't manage aggro correctly, PvP T2 is pretty much standard/needed.


** edit and its Tech II, not Tier II .

Thanks for the clarification on that. You'd think after 7+ months of playing, my EVE lingo would be better. For some strange reason though, when Im not in the game, I have the damnedest time remembering what things are called. Its like I go blank sitting here trying to talk about stuff in EVE. I dunno.....drugs maybe, HAHA!!! (or lack thereof ;))

How does one "manage aggro correctly"?

The way Ive been doing my missions lately is....I send 5 drones to what is seemingly the toughest ship to kill. While they break down that ships shields and armor, I pick off all the easy rats as I can usually kill them with 1-3 volleys. Once they are taken care of, I help out my drones if they havent already killed the toughy.

I'm not sure of your skills, particularly cap management.............

By the way, your cruiser can hit harder than my Ferox (BC). :::weeps:::

Here are my skills as of 1 minute ago :D (currently training Hybrid Weapons to Level 4 atm, why I didnt do this earlier in the previous months....I dunno, to busy bouncing around raising other skills I guess, heh).

Krinthe

Attributes
Intelligence: 19.80
Perception: 15.40
Charisma: 9.90
Willpower: 15.40
Memory: 17.60

Corporation Management
level2.gif
Anchoring
Total Skillpoints in Group: 4,243

Drones
level3.gif
Combat Drone Operation
level3.gif
Drone Durability
level3.gif
Drone Interfacing
level3.gif
Drone Navigation
level3.gif
Drone Sharpshooting
level5.gif
Drones
level3.gif
Heavy Drone Operation
level4.gif
Mining Drone Operation
level3.gif
Scout Drone Operation
Total Skillpoints in Group: 506,510

Electronics
level2.gif
Electronic Warfare
level5.gif
Electronics
level4.gif
Electronics Upgrades
level2.gif
Frequency Modulation
level3.gif
Long Range Targeting
level2.gif
Propulsion Jamming
level2.gif
Sensor Linking
level3.gif
Signature Analysis
level3.gif
Survey
level2.gif
Target Painting
level3.gif
Targeting
level2.gif
Weapon Disruption
Total Skillpoints in Group: 410,554

Engineering
level3.gif
Energy Emission Systems
level3.gif
Energy Grid Upgrades
level4.gif
Energy Management
level2.gif
Energy Pulse Weapons
level4.gif
Energy Systems Operation
level5.gif
Engineering
level3.gif
Shield Compensation
level3.gif
Shield Emission Systems
level3.gif
Shield Management
level4.gif
Shield Operation
level3.gif
Shield Upgrades
level3.gif
Tactical Shield Manipulation
Total Skillpoints in Group: 621,104

Gunnery
level3.gif
Controlled Bursts
level5.gif
Gunnery
level2.gif
Medium Energy Turret
level3.gif
Medium Hybrid Turret
level2.gif
Medium Projectile Turret
level3.gif
Motion Prediction
level3.gif
Rapid Firing
level3.gif
Sharpshooter
level3.gif
Small Energy Turret
level3.gif
Small Hybrid Turret
level3.gif
Small Projectile Turret
level3.gif
Surgical Strike
level2.gif
Trajectory Analysis
level4.gif
Weapon Upgrades
Total Skillpoints in Group: 577,855

Industry
level2.gif
Ice Harvesting
level5.gif
Industry
level2.gif
Jaspet Processing
level2.gif
Kernite Processing
level2.gif
Mass Production
level5.gif
Mining
level2.gif
Mining Upgrades
level3.gif
Omber Processing
level3.gif
Plagioclase Processing
level2.gif
Production Efficiency
level2.gif
Pyroxeres Processing
level2.gif
Refinery Efficiency
level5.gif
Refining
level3.gif
Scordite Processing
level4.gif
Veldspar Processing
Total Skillpoints in Group: 870,715

Leadership
level2.gif
Leadership
level4.gif
Mining Foreman
Total Skillpoints in Group: 91,925

Learning
level4.gif
Analytical Mind
level3.gif
Clarity
level4.gif
Eidetic Memory
level4.gif
Empathy
level4.gif
Instant Recall
level4.gif
Iron Will
level5.gif
Learning
level3.gif
Logic
level4.gif
Spatial Awareness
Total Skillpoints in Group: 666,040

Mechanic
level2.gif
Armor Rigging
level2.gif
Astronautics Rigging
level2.gif
Drones Rigging
level3.gif
EM Armor Compensation
level2.gif
Electronic Superiority Rigging
level2.gif
Energy Weapon Rigging
level3.gif
Explosive Armor Compensation
level2.gif
Frigate Construction
level5.gif
Hull Upgrades
level2.gif
Hybrid Weapon Rigging
level3.gif
Jury Rigging
level3.gif
Kinetic Armor Compensation
level2.gif
Launcher Rigging
level5.gif
Mechanic
level2.gif
Projectile Weapon Rigging
level2.gif
Remote Armor Repair Systems
level2.gif
Remote Hull Repair Systems
level3.gif
Repair Systems
level4.gif
Salvaging
level3.gif
Shield Rigging
level3.gif
Thermic Armor Compensation
Total Skillpoints in Group: 1,058,196

Missile Launcher Operation
level2.gif
Defender Missiles
level2.gif
FoF Missiles
level3.gif
Missile Launcher Operation
level3.gif
Rockets
level3.gif
Standard Missiles
Total Skillpoints in Group: 39,072

Navigation
level3.gif
Acceleration Control
level4.gif
Afterburner
level4.gif
Evasive Maneuvering
level3.gif
Fuel Conservation
level2.gif
High Speed Maneuvering
level4.gif
Navigation
level3.gif
Warp Drive Operation
Total Skillpoints in Group: 244,092

Science
level4.gif
Astrogeology
level3.gif
Astrometric Acquisition
level2.gif
Astrometric Rangefinding
level3.gif
Astrometrics
level2.gif
Biology
level3.gif
Cybernetics
level2.gif
Infomorph Psychology
level3.gif
Laboratory Operation
level3.gif
Metallurgy
level3.gif
Research
level5.gif
Science
Total Skillpoints in Group: 533,909

Social
level4.gif
Connections
level3.gif
Diplomacy
level3.gif
Fast Talk
level2.gif
Negotiation
level4.gif
Social
Total Skillpoints in Group: 223,849

Spaceship Command
level3.gif
Amarr Frigate
level3.gif
Battlecruisers
level3.gif
Caldari Frigate
level3.gif
Destroyers
level3.gif
Gallente Cruiser
level5.gif
Gallente Frigate
level3.gif
Gallente Industrial
level3.gif
Mining Barge
level3.gif
Minmatar Cruiser
level4.gif
Minmatar Frigate
level5.gif
Spaceship Command
Total Skillpoints in Group: 1,098,510

Trade
level2.gif
Broker Relations
level2.gif
Contracting
level3.gif
Retail
level3.gif
Trade
Total Skillpoints in Group: 28,244

Total Skillpoints: 6,974,818
Total Number of Skills: 138

Skills at Level 1: 0
Skills at Level 2: 40
Skills at Level 3: 63
Skills at Level 4: 22
Skills at Level 5: 13

Speaking of cloaking......Being a sneaky bastard is something I do have plans on doing. I hadnt quite thought about doing this with miners though as it would seem to easy since they probably are not fitted for fight back. I have had thought though of laying in wait, cloaked, by a station or jumpgate and seeing who comes thru. Scanning them down with one of those scanners which doesnt allow the other person to know they are being scanned, watching where they go and then follow/hunt them down. But first and foremost, being patient and seeing what they are up to. <---Sounds like HELLA fun to me. To hell with profit, its the hunt im after :cool:, profit comes 2nd.
 

D0n2k

Weaksauce
Joined
Sep 24, 2007
Messages
83
Manage rat agro - your drones are weak and fragile, you are tough and strong, need to protect the little bees.

goto eve-survial read the mision guide and see what the pocket Triggers are.
warp in, shoot the trigger/whatever agresses the rat pocket. They all lock and start shooting you, you tank the incoming DPS then release drones to kill said targets. Basically you want the rats to NOT target drones, and if they are already fighting you they won't do that (mission rats are stupid, unlike Sleepers in WH's which have better AI and will switch targets & pwn drones).

Also have drones focus fire (all on one taget.. its in the right click, drone bay window) - and specify which target to engage, less risk of them roaming off and triggering a 2nd or 3rd pocket.
Note, it is frigates that web/scram, often best & quickest to dispose of these easy rats early on.

& for skillsheet stuff, just use a in-eve link to the char- rather tan that ^^ monster which for some reason I can't even see skill levels !
and yea tech/tier thingy.... just me being picky really :)

Eggrock, I skilled retriever mining alt when my corp wanted to get some mins/ore for ship & mod building, that turned to crap when we worked out wasn't as much fun as shooting stuff. Tried some 'solo' mining with a hauler alt and tbh it wasn't worth the effort - level 4 missions much more isk/hour - afk domi probably less attention than Miner/hauler too. Imo unless you go the whole hog with Hulk / Orca / 0.0 you would be better off doing anything else.

I would say look into Invention / Research if you have the time, seems to be the best 2nd account isk making venture. I was considering this lately, but cba and am now skilling a raven l4 alt instead- if you find out something good & go down that route let me know, would be interested.
 

Ezteh

2[H]4U
Joined
Mar 27, 2002
Messages
2,246
So I quit playing earlier this year around the time the war in delve was on the decline and we ( goonswarm ) we're settling into our new home.

I had 2 accounts active, one my main ratting, battleship character who was training into amarr Hacs and was ~26 days away when amarr cruiser 5 finished a month after I quit.
and a character I had training covops for exploration had everything in my skill plan complete except energy management 5.

anyway onto my point whats all changed since after the release of apocrypha, worth trying to get back into the game? I sold all my assets off save a few out of the way items I left back in our former home before the move to deleve.
 

D0n2k

Weaksauce
Joined
Sep 24, 2007
Messages
83
Amarr cruiser V =>> Whole new game. opens up some cool sht.

new patch coming soon should make 0.0 lot more interesting. the summer apoc release didn't make great deal of difference really ..sized rigs? Not sure what goons been upto , fannying about prob.
Posted via [H] Mobile Device
 

Kanaric

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 19, 2005
Messages
325
Simple mantra to live for Eve PVP: Don't fly what you cannot afford to lose. I'm assuming thats what you mean by penalties?

Some more info on the Red VS Blue:
http://www.eve-tribune.com/index.php?no=4_40&page=2

EDIT: Also learned a hard lesson yesterday: When flying a frigate class ship, make sure that whoever or wherever you're warping to is not near a smart bomb equipped ship:
http://www.lf-eve.com/lfakb/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=21518

One of the things that prevents me from getting into this game is that I want to learn how to play from people who are good. If I went into pvp in any ship it would probably be a waste of time for me.
 

Spewn

2[H]4U
Joined
Jan 5, 2001
Messages
3,459
I broke down and subbed to a second account. What would be the most beneficial career to train for? I'm thinking mining and then industry. (Anyone have a free working Dell 2405? I'll pay shipping. ;) )

What's your current pilot doing? If it's combat, train a support pilot. I did that for a while and it was just silly how easily I could steamroll through any mission.
 

eggrock

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Dec 1, 2003
Messages
4,102
What's your current pilot doing? If it's combat, train a support pilot. I did that for a while and it was just silly how easily I could steamroll through any mission.

My current pilot is going to 0.0 so I'll need lots of iskies.
 

Powerslave

n00b
Joined
Jul 9, 2007
Messages
14
SAW, looking at your skills, it looks like you are only missing the assault ships skill to be able to pilot an Ishkur. For me, the Ishkur is the most fun ship to pilot. It will go through lvl 1 and lvl 2s like you wouldn't believe. It has great kinetic and good thermal resists, which make it good for Guristas and Serpentis sites. I have been able to run every Guristas site in high sec with it, even the Guristas Vigil, the 4/10 DED scout outpost,and the 4 BS spawn shattered life support radar site. You should try it out.
 

Cantonious

Gawd
Joined
Jun 22, 2003
Messages
868
SAW, looking at your skills, it looks like you are only missing the assault ships skill to be able to pilot an Ishkur. For me, the Ishkur is the most fun ship to pilot. It will go through lvl 1 and lvl 2s like you wouldn't believe. It has great kinetic and good thermal resists, which make it good for Guristas and Serpentis sites. I have been able to run every Guristas site in high sec with it, even the Guristas Vigil, the 4/10 DED scout outpost,and the 4 BS spawn shattered life support radar site. You should try it out.

Yeah the Ishkur is a blast, properly fit it can manage level 3s and 4s too. It isn't fast, but it sure is a change of pace from a battleship!
 

SAW

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Nov 13, 2005
Messages
1,467
SAW, looking at your skills, it looks like you are only missing the assault ships skill to be able to pilot an Ishkur. For me, the Ishkur is the most fun ship to pilot. It will go through lvl 1 and lvl 2s like you wouldn't believe. It has great kinetic and good thermal resists, which make it good for Guristas and Serpentis sites. I have been able to run every Guristas site in high sec with it, even the Guristas Vigil, the 4/10 DED scout outpost,and the 4 BS spawn shattered life support radar site. You should try it out.

Yeah, a fellow [H] player has told me alot about the assault ship, Ishkur. And yeap, I can get AF trained right now if I bought the skill book. Untill recently, 3.5mil for a skill book I wasnt willing to fork over. But since ive been doing these missions, Ive been preoccupied and forgot all about it, heh.
 

SAW

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Nov 13, 2005
Messages
1,467
One of the things that prevents me from getting into this game is that I want to learn how to play from people who are good. If I went into pvp in any ship it would probably be a waste of time for me.

I just re-read your post. The most of the people who have replied to this thread know what they are talkin about. It might have taken me a while to get to where im at in the game, but I couldnt have done it without these guys here. Ive talked to almost no one while Im playing, such as people in the CAS Corp. Idle chit chat here and there, but about 99% of what Ive learned about this game, came from right here. Thuelman, Old Pueblo, Donk, Cantonious, Eggrock and lots of others have shared LOTS of advise.

And nothing was a waste of time if you enjoyed the time spent. ;)
 

Apathy

Gawd
Joined
Oct 29, 2004
Messages
886
new patch coming soon should make 0.0 lot more interesting. the summer apoc release didn't make great deal of difference really ..sized rigs? Not sure what goons been upto , fannying about prob.
Posted via [H] Mobile Device

dominion has some very nice updates rolling along with it. im most interested in the pirate/faction battleship upgrades... 7 neutrons on my vindicator...mmmmmm

new dominix looks really nice as well.

i just hopped into my new proteus (t3 cruiser). lots of fun that thing is. 270k EHP, 46k armor, 90% resists across the board basically, about 960dps or so. plus it maneuvers as fast as a cruiser does.

on a side note, do not even think about getting involved with invention, it is completely unprofitable. you'd be better off sitting in jita with a scanner alt in a hauler and suicide ganking haulers with candy inside of them. the fastest way that ive ever made money was through efficient pvp. find the right targets fitting deadspace/faction mods, dec them, kill them, hope for a decent drop. this passed week netted me about 1bil isk through various drops from mission running war targets.

almost killed a freighter today in high sec. unfortunately we were in a small/fast ship gang hunting someone when we saw another war target in local which shortly landed on the gate with us in an obelisk. but with the way aggro timers currently work, he was smart... he jumped into the next system after one guy pointed him and back-tackled while we jumped through and waited to tackle on the other side. he immediately hit ctrl+q and logged. 15 seconds later his freighter shows up on our overview, and about 15 seconds after that his ship disappeared right where we had it tackled and at 30% armor. very annoying game mechanic that is. if we had been able to aggro him on the other side before he closed his client, there would have been an aggro timer that would have given us 15 minutes to kill him. :sad:
 

eggrock

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Dec 1, 2003
Messages
4,102
i just hopped into my new proteus (t3 cruiser). lots of fun that thing is. 270k EHP, 46k armor, 90% resists across the board basically, about 960dps or so. plus it maneuvers as fast as a cruiser does.

That's fucked up. Next is, what, a titan with machine-gun DD, speed and sig of an inty?
 

SAW

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Nov 13, 2005
Messages
1,467
Welp....I was just one click away from purchasing my first Battleship. Ive chosen the Myrmidon. Aside from all the different mods I can fit to it.....lets face it.....It just looks so freakin badass. Its a must buy ship.

But I stopped myself.

I had just recently went around the neighborhood buying Med. Ammo as well as some Faction Ammo and a shit load of drones along with a few modifying things for my Thorax. After subtracting the cost of the Myrmidon, I was going to be left with about 18mil isk. Thats not counting the cost of new mods, which, with the EFT fitting I made, I was using 6 of those 250mm Prototype Gauss Guns. In other words...I was going to be left being broke.....So for the time being, Im going to stick it out with doing L3's in my Thorax untill I save up enough to fit out the BC and still have some heavy change left over :)

On the bright side of things though.....I along with all the ammo n stuff, I also bought the skill book for Assault Frigs and already have it trained up to level 3.

After looking thru what the Ishkur is able to give me....Im kinda wondering how this ship is capable of doing L3's when "seemingly" it isnt all that much more powerful than a regular frig?

It has a bit of bump up in its fitting stats and better armor, but aside from that, im not seeing much of the difference.

So....what have I overlooked? I KNOW I must be missing something here....what is that something?
 

oldpablo

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
May 31, 2003
Messages
6,352
"Assfrigs" as they are so lovingly called benefit from a very small sig radius meaning they take less damage from larger ships, and then also have high resists even before you add hardeners into the mix. This makes them tough little nuts to crack. They don't generally churn out a lot of DPS but they are better then regular frigs of course. Can they do some L3's? Probably, but I personaly wouldn't use one because they won't be as efficient as doing them in a BC. Time is money, there are many ways to do many things, but whatever gets those things done faster to get the ISK into your wallet is usually best.
 

SAW

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Nov 13, 2005
Messages
1,467
Well, an AF definately wouldnt have been able to do the 2 missions I did last night. But I can see where/how they could be used.

In one of the missions I did last night, I had to warp out, heal and warp back 4 different times. The strange part was, there was only a 1/3 of the rats in this mission as there were in most of the other L3 missions I had been doing. I couldnt figure it out....untill It finally became apparent to me...

In this particular mission, there were 2, JUST 2 of those missile silos again. Mannn, those things just eat me up like an afternoon snack.

I had managed to pull the other rats out 200km from where those silos were and yet, those silos were still able to hit me with their missiles. By the time my drones and I were able to kill off just one rat, we were having to warp out so my ship didnt explode.

This was nuts....How the hell can that thing still be targeting me from such a distance. Damn silos...

I learned an important lesson last night....When a mission has you warping in on some silos...KILL THEM FIRST!!!!!!!!!

After that 4th warpout.....Thats exactly what I decided to do. So, I warped to zero on them and just tanked them till they were dead. Since I had drawn out the other rats, which included 3 BC's (Brutix's), they were over 100km away from me as I shot down the silos, so that was good. I killed them unchallenged. After the silos were destroyed....the BC's and 6 other rats were easy pickings.

Soo....Note to self.....see a silo, kill a silo FIRST!!!!!
 

Powerslave

n00b
Joined
Jul 9, 2007
Messages
14
On the bright side of things though.....I along with all the ammo n stuff, I also bought the skill book for Assault Frigs and already have it trained up to level 3.

After looking thru what the Ishkur is able to give me....Im kinda wondering how this ship is capable of doing L3's when "seemingly" it isnt all that much more powerful than a regular frig?

It has a bit of bump up in its fitting stats and better armor, but aside from that, im not seeing much of the difference.

So....what have I overlooked? I KNOW I must be missing something here....what is that something?

Well my post was more of an observation than a sugestion for lvl3s :eek: , sorry, should I have been a little more clear considering the current set of topics.
I agree with OldPueblo, you can run lvl 3s in it, but would be a lot faster in a BC. Its the low sig, high resists, and speed that makes it good. You also need good drone skills or the dps will be not that good.
For lvl1 and 2s, and high sec cosmic sigs/anomalies I use the Ishkur, for lvl 3s I use a BC.
If you want to try something different, try exploration in high sec Guristas/Serpentis space. I have only a MSE and a DCII for a tank on my exploration Ishkur, and it handles the sites easily.
BTW, where are you based at?
 
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Dangman

Ninja Editor SuperMod
Joined
Dec 15, 2005
Messages
46,062
I had just recently went around the neighborhood buying Med. Ammo as well as some Faction Ammo and a shit load of drones along with a few modifying things for my Thorax. After subtracting the cost of the Myrmidon, I was going to be left with about 18mil isk. Thats not counting the cost of new mods, which, with the EFT fitting I made, I was using 6 of those 250mm Prototype Gauss Guns. In other words...I was going to be left being broke.....So for the time being, Im going to stick it out with doing L3's in my Thorax untill I save up enough to fit out the BC and still have some heavy change left over :)

You know, you don't have to go THAT far for a mission running Myrmidon, right? You could easily outfit a mission capable Myrmidon for 35 mil sans mods using Tech 1 items.
 

SAW

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Nov 13, 2005
Messages
1,467
BTW, where are you based at?

Based in Dodixie...currently running missions in Eglendeart (sp).

You know, you don't have to go THAT far for a mission running Myrmidon, right? You could easily outfit a mission capable Myrmidon for 35 mil sans mods using Tech 1 items.

Ya know...I was thinking the same thing as I was scanning the market last night. I was thinking that the Myrmidon should be able to handle itself at a closer range to the rats than what ive been doing with the Thorax and so, I could fit some Blasters onto the ship instead of railguns. I think they hit harder for more DPS than the rails do and, as you said, make the mods I have for this fitting all Tech 1 items.

The main cost with the fitting would probably be buying the guns for the ship. Im already at 27.5mil for the ship. A few well thought out mods placed here and there on the ship shouldnt cost me too much at all. I may go ahead with this plan tonight. Im anxious to see a new ship and take her out.

I do plan on doing WH space soon. Maybe do that tonight too :)
 

SAW

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Nov 13, 2005
Messages
1,467
This is what I was planning on fitting...I'll look into what Tech 1 stuff will cost compared to this fitting.


[Myrmidon]
Damage Control II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
N-Type Thermic Hardener I
N-Type Kinetic Hardener I
400mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II

10MN Afterburner I
Cap Recharger II
Optical Tracking Computer I
Cap Recharger II
Ballistic Deflection Field I

250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M

Vespa I x5
 

Dangman

Ninja Editor SuperMod
Joined
Dec 15, 2005
Messages
46,062
Hmmmm, just drop the Prototypes down to the base 250mm Railgun I to save a ton of ISK.

For the lows, ditch the plates and the Mag Stabs. Fit one MAR or higher variant of it that fits within your budget. Use the remaining two slots for mission specific hardeners. Granted, you may lose out on some EHP but you'll end up taking less damage in the first place so it all works out. In addition, the MAR makes sure that you stay in the fight rather than warp in and out whenever you're taking heavy damage.

Highs wise, you may have to drop down to 5 x 250mm railguns to fit the above proposed changes. However in the sixth high slot, you can fit either a salvager or a drone link augmentor if you have the skills for it.

Yes the above changes will lessen your DPS but you do gain significantly more survivability.
 

mashie

Mawd Gawd
Joined
Oct 25, 2000
Messages
4,253
[Myrmidon]
Damage Control II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
N-Type Thermic Hardener I
N-Type Kinetic Hardener I
400mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Read the ship description, it has a bonus to armor repairers so not a bad idea to go for an active tank.
 

SAW

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Nov 13, 2005
Messages
1,467
A few tweaks...Added in 2 rigs to help compensate for the powergrid allows me to keep all 6 of my turrets at 250mm and I keep the mag stabs too :).

Of course, if I happened to have EVERYTHING being used at one time, EFT shows this fitting will only last me 3 min and change, but Ive rarely had the need to use the small armor repairer I have fitted on my Thorax, so chances are, I wouldnt need to use the MAR for this Myrmidon, or at least, would use it very little.

With the Armor Hardeners and MAR offline, this fitting is stable at 66%

You will also notice I have a Ballistic Deflection Field I and an Optical Tracking Computer I.

I know typically, its not a good idea to mix tanks, but the way I was thinking about it, this being a MISSION ONLY ship (at least for now), My shields do take a bit of a beating, so my thoughts were to increase the shields a tad bit. But....now that ive actually wrote that out, its not quite what I had in mind really....I dont really want "extra" shields, I just want them to recharge faster...so, that being the base, what do you guys think about using an M51 Shield Regen? Gives me a 12% increase to shield recharging.

And the Optical Tracking Computer...It just increases Tracking speed and Range. I just kinda threw that one in there. Im up for suggestions on this one. Id like to have something which helps my DPS. Will this do it or should I get something else?

Also, could someone explain to me (again) how to calculate my prime firing distance for my turrets. I know its a combination of the turret you use and the ammo, but the whole falloff thing confuses me. If Im looking to fight at a range of around 25km, which ammo should I be using? I know that Antimatter charges hit harder, but I loose half my range. Can this Myrmidon withstand closer combat? And if so, should I think about using Blasters with the Antimatter charges instead of using Railguns?

Personally, I prefer to fight from range though.

[Myrmidon, Myrmidon Level 3 Missions]
Damage Control II
Medium 'Accommodation' Vestment Reconstructer I
N-Type Thermic Hardener I
N-Type Kinetic Hardener I
Magnetic Vortex Stabilizer I
Magnetic Vortex Stabilizer I

10MN Afterburner I
Cap Recharger II
Optical Tracking Computer I
Cap Recharger II
Ballistic Deflection Field I

250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M

Ancillary Current Router I
Hybrid Collision Accelerator I
Ancillary Current Router I

Vespa I x5
 

Dangman

Ninja Editor SuperMod
Joined
Dec 15, 2005
Messages
46,062
I'm a firm believer in "NEVER MIX TANKS' so I'm gonna say using a shield recharger is not a good idea. I'd rather have my cap recharge faster so that I can keep using my MWD/AB as well as MAR when I'm ratting.

All you have to do to figure out the prime firing distance is look at the info for your gun (Right click on the gun, select info, look under Attributes tab, look for optimal range). It will change automatically depending on what ammo you have loaded. With my skills, I would have to use Thorium or Lead charges for a 25KM optimal range with those 250mm Railgun 1s.

Oh and yes the Myrm can definitely withstand close combat. In fact, that's how I'm fitting my Myrm now. However for mission running, you want to stick with Railguns so that you don't get easily swamped by dozens of ships that tends to show up in missions. For PVP and ratting, Blasters are the better choice. Often times in those situations, more than likely you'll end up very close to the red/rat and you'll want every bit of firepower possible to kill the ships.

Oh and here's my ratting ship for 0.0 in Providence against Sansha rats:

[Myrmidon, The Jayne Cobb III]
DC II
MAR
N-Type Thermic Hardener x 2
N-Type EMP Hardener x 2

10MN MWD
Cap Recharger II x 4

Heavy Ion Blaster, Antimatter Charge M x 5
Salvager

15 x Infiltrator I

With the above setup, I can easily tank 3-4 Battleships all day long. With the MAR, Salvager, and MWD off, I'm cap stable at 78%. With the MAR on but the Salvager and MWD off, my cap will last about 6 minutes and 41 seconds.
 

Atech

2[H]4U
Joined
Jul 14, 2007
Messages
3,946
A few tweaks...Added in 2 rigs to help compensate for the powergrid allows me to keep all 6 of my turrets at 250mm and I keep the mag stabs too :).

Of course, if I happened to have EVERYTHING being used at one time, EFT shows this fitting will only last me 3 min and change, but Ive rarely had the need to use the small armor repairer I have fitted on my Thorax, so chances are, I wouldnt need to use the MAR for this Myrmidon, or at least, would use it very little.

With the Armor Hardeners and MAR offline, this fitting is stable at 66%

You will also notice I have a Ballistic Deflection Field I and an Optical Tracking Computer I.

I know typically, its not a good idea to mix tanks, but the way I was thinking about it, this being a MISSION ONLY ship (at least for now), My shields do take a bit of a beating, so my thoughts were to increase the shields a tad bit. But....now that ive actually wrote that out, its not quite what I had in mind really....I dont really want "extra" shields, I just want them to recharge faster...so, that being the base, what do you guys think about using an M51 Shield Regen? Gives me a 12% increase to shield recharging.

And the Optical Tracking Computer...It just increases Tracking speed and Range. I just kinda threw that one in there. Im up for suggestions on this one. Id like to have something which helps my DPS. Will this do it or should I get something else?

Also, could someone explain to me (again) how to calculate my prime firing distance for my turrets. I know its a combination of the turret you use and the ammo, but the whole falloff thing confuses me. If Im looking to fight at a range of around 25km, which ammo should I be using? I know that Antimatter charges hit harder, but I loose half my range. Can this Myrmidon withstand closer combat? And if so, should I think about using Blasters with the Antimatter charges instead of using Railguns?

Personally, I prefer to fight from range though.

[Myrmidon, Myrmidon Level 3 Missions]
Damage Control II
Medium 'Accommodation' Vestment Reconstructer I
N-Type Thermic Hardener I
N-Type Kinetic Hardener I
Magnetic Vortex Stabilizer I
Magnetic Vortex Stabilizer I

10MN Afterburner I
Cap Recharger II
Optical Tracking Computer I
Cap Recharger II
Ballistic Deflection Field I

250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M

Ancillary Current Router I
Hybrid Collision Accelerator I
Ancillary Current Router I

Vespa I x5


I just got my first Drake last night.
Going to be traning some supporting skills to L5 first ( But not to long time;) ), before I am able to fit it like this (CPU and Powergrids needs):

[Drake, L3 Running]

Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Shield Power Relay II
Shield Power Relay II

F-90 Sensor Booster (Tageting Range Script)
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II

Heavy Missile Lauchner II (Caldari Navy Widowmaker)
Heavy Missile Lauchner II (Caldari Navy Widowmaker)
Heavy Missile Lauchner II (Caldari Navy Widowmaker)
Heavy Missile Lauchner II (Caldari Navy Widowmaker)
Heavy Missile Lauchner II (Caldari Navy Widowmaker)
Heavy Missile Lauchner II (Caldari Navy Widowmaker)
Heavy Missile Lauchner II (Caldari Navy Widowmaker)
Salvager I

Medium Core Defence Field Purger II
Medium Core Defence Field Purger II
Medium Core Defence Field Purger II

5x T2 drones


CAP stable at 43% (at current), Inv Fields, can be changedd to mission specifi resists)...tanks more than neough for L3's, have a nice range (with Missile porjecton at 5) and does +200DPS.


I am going to name it "Ibis"....just for the"lulz" of it ;)
 
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Atech

2[H]4U
Joined
Jul 14, 2007
Messages
3,946
I wouldn't use faction missiles, it'll cut into your profits. Instead of invul fields, fit rat specific hardeners.

Got some LP I can spare, so it won't be too much of a hassle ;)
I will change the INV fields, if I think it's usefull in the mission...but that is a lot of tank...that regenerates for free ;)

Otherwise, welcome to one of the best passive tanks in the game!

Thanks, I have been eying that Drake for some time and now the supporting skills are almost up to specs, the time is close ;)
 
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MrGoat

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Mar 21, 2007
Messages
1,353
[Myrmidon]
Damage Control II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
N-Type Thermic Hardener I
N-Type Kinetic Hardener I
400mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I -> Swap me for a MAR
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II

10MN Afterburner I
Cap Recharger II
Optical Tracking Computer I
Cap Recharger II
Ballistic Deflection Field I --> This needs to go. Another Cap Recharger for that Rep would be a good replacement.

250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M
250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Tungsten Charge M

Vespa I x5

Fact of the matter is that if you are in a heavy fight your sheilds are going to fail quickly anyhow, so having the extra kinetic on the sheilds wont really help much. This slot will go to much better use with a cr to feed that rep (As has already been stated your ship has bonuses for these) on your armor which has much better resists than your sheilds do.

My next point here is that at this point if you are planning on being a gun user then TechII guns proboly need to be on the short end of your skill que. These are actualy cheaper to obtain then the higher meta tech1s and have the advantages of being able to shoot tech 2 ammo and getting a skill bonus.
 

MrGoat

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Mar 21, 2007
Messages
1,353
[Drake, L3 Running]


F-90 Sensor Booster (Tageting Range Script)
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II




I am going to name it "Ibis"....just for the"lulz" of it ;)

Thats a pretty standard fit, I'd go with a Sheild Recharger over the 3rd LSE however. Remember your tank is more about the amount of passive regen you can maintain over the amount of sheilds you have.

So far as ship naming goes... I normaly pick a noob in system and name my ship xxxx's reaper or some such. Otherwise I will name it something obcene enough that enemy scouts will hesitate to say the name outloud on vent.
 
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