SP1 really sucks. Big time

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So, you use 1 hardware firewall and 2 software firewalls ?

So your saying the hacks get through your hardware firewall and one software firewall but the second firewall stops the hacks ? if thats the case then why not dump the first firewall that the hacks are getting through and just use the second software firewall along with your router instead ?

atm I am being hit constantly from china and have been for the last 4 - 5 weeks since joining a new isp, spoofed shaw canada ip's hitting windows messenger ports, but nothing gets past the router firewall and if it has it isnt being picked up by nod32 firewall or even windows firewall when i was using that before I got nod32, their really is no need to use 1 hardware and 2 software firewalls, thats just asking for problems if you ask me.

But each to their own i guess.
 
crewzen said:
I have an good router and a hardware firewall but some of the hacks get through and that is why I load some more protection.
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I'd be fascinated to hear more details on these hacks. What router, and what ports are open? Which hardware firewall? How do these various exploits work?
 
crewzen said:
Quote:

I have an good router and a hardware firewall but some of the hacks get through and that is why I load some more protection.
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I would like to know more about this as well, how do you know that a hacker(s) is breaking through your router? I use to use Norton Internet Security, that was bad because a new pc became 6 years older once NIS is install and secondly it was just annoying with all the damn popups. Two software firewalls must drive you up to wall! I just use my DGL-4300 firewall and Vista firewall and no problems, looking at my log I see attempts here and there but nothing big that I need to worry about. Everyone gets hit now and then by scans doesn't mean you are getting invaded.
 
TechieSooner said:
If it starts BSODing even after reformatting... sounds like hardware issues, not SP1 issues. Unless by reformatting you mean reinstalling, and then reapplying SP1.

Guess you learned your lesson, eh? Don't install optional updates if you aren't ready for consequences.
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That doesn't mean not to try the updates. People have reported good things about the service pack, so why not try it out and see if I get the benefits as well? Who said I wasn't ready for the consequences of updates? It is not hardware issues because before sp1, everything was fine.

By reformatting, I meant a clean install of windows vista ultimate 64 bit, then an install of sp1 right after. Since sp1 did not workout for me, i'm going to remove it, and have my comp set up like how it was before.
 
I downloaded the entire SP and burned it to disk. It works better than the last release candidate. It even fixed the problem I was having resuming from sleep. Well . . . it fixed my computer resuming from sleep. I personally still hit the snooze button.
 
Albanu1800 said:
Vista does suck!
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Country music sucks.

See, I can play that game too.

It's funny because XP was greeted with the same type of attitude and now look at where it stands. Grant it, two service packs later, but Vista has just seen its first naked lady. Give it time and Vista will be a real Casanova.

Sorry for the terrible metaphor.
 
Skillz'n Magic said:
Laptop startup times were supposed to have been significantly decreased. I can't wait to install it on my wife's laptop. I'm expecting miracles...or hoping anyway. :p
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I haven't noticed any decrease. but what the hell, if i can't wait i guess i need to find some kind of help group. :)
 
I had trouble from Win98 until Se came out. XP I had rarely had trouble although I had a few installs freeze on me.

My destktop will not install Vista sp1. I have the icon on my desktop but did all the updates from Windows Update and I get an error message saying something like the update is installing but nothing happens.
 
Gott said:
It's funny because XP was greeted with the same type of attitude and now look at where it stands.
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I feel the same way. Has everybody forgotten about converting from Win 98Se to Win XP. The exact same problems occurred, older hardware with no updated drivers stopped working, older software stopped working, people complained about how much memory XP needed (512mb) compared to 98SE (128mb). The only difference is that Vista really is not drastically better than XP. In fact initially Vista is a small step backwards (at least before SP1), where XP was drastically better than 98SE. By the time the next version of windows is ready then the whole process will be repeated.
 
Finally got the SP1 to place with my PC (original install wasn't too smooth so I reinstalled). Vista 32bit, feels a bit snappier like people say. I do a lot of backups through USB and let me tell you all, it's not so bad now and doesn't take all day and a half. It's much closer to XP speeds if not spot on. I had a stable Vista install before with no crashes, this continues to be the case still. I did find that reinstalling Vista is a single shot solution for the problems.

SATA2 drivers are overrated for my chipset too imo, I'm running a SATA2 drive under "IDE" mode (apparently some kind of emulation mode?) and my average read speed is now 60+MB/s vs. 50MB/s in AHCI/SATA mode with drivers and I can notice the difference. My burst speed dropped from 250MB/s to 175MB/s in the "IDE" mode, but that's overrated anyway :p (no noticeable perf. drop).
 
I got a stop error after SP1 but since shutting the computer down and starting it up again today all seems ok. Now I just have to figure out why my goddamn brand new Microsoft keyboard is not recognized until I get to the welcome sreen in Vista. No such issue with it on XP. It's always something.
 
DFranch said:
I feel the same way. Has everybody forgotten about converting from Win 98Se to Win XP.
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XP was pretty much universally accepted and liked after about 6 months after release. Vista has been out for well over a year and is still hated with a passion by many so don't compare the two because it is not the same thing at all. Only fanbois make those type of claims.
 
milkweg said:
XP was pretty much universally accepted and liked after about 6 months after release.
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Not even close. Check out some studies from about two years ago, and look into how many companies didn't upgrade to XP by that point. It took several years for XP to be universally accepted, and there were MANY people in the enthusiast crowd who hung on to Win98 SE for a while, claiming XP was nothing more than fisher price eye candy. The very same criticisms of XP are now being re-used against Vista. That's why so many people are labeled as fanbois, as you say, when in fact they just simple see through the bullshit and realize this is just a repeating pattern. It is a simple concept, yet so hard for many to grasp.
 
I think XP's compatible driver support was quicker than Vista's is now, Vista is simply taking longer to get to that level of "hassle-free-ness". Stability wise, Vista's been more stable for quite some time vs. XP in my experiences and from what I understand from others as well. XP w/ SP2 would still get one of the key system files corrupted during POST. You could attempt to repair it, but that seldom succeeded.

Therefore, I think the 2 even out in some aspects. All I know is that Vista's been extremely stable. The only time I was able to even hang my system was a combination of using beta drivers not made for my card while trying to alt+tab out and in of Crysis 1.0 & 1.1. I've never had Vista just crash to a reboot or fail to boot because of a corrupted file of any kind. We all have different setups and different adjustments made to our systems so blanket statements are only valid to a point. Even if you include popular statements or a "status-quo", things will never be the same across the board 100% (although 75% or more is good enough :p).

As Deacon' said, it's a repeating process. Get used to it and expect it. Another 2yrs from now, the majority of people will be on Vista. Watch, history repeats it self (especially Windows :p).
 
DeaconFrost said:
Not even close. Check out some studies from about two years ago, and look into how many companies didn't upgrade to XP by that point. It took several years for XP to be universally accepted, and there were MANY people in the enthusiast crowd who hung on to Win98 SE for a while, claiming XP was nothing more than fisher price eye candy. The very same criticisms of XP are now being re-used against Vista. That's why so many people are labeled as fanbois, as you say, when in fact they just simple see through the bullshit and realize this is just a repeating pattern. It is a simple concept, yet so hard for many to grasp.
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OK, then explain this. Why pretty much on the first day of release of XP there was lots of praise from enthusiats like me on Usenet (that's back when web forums here didn't mean squat to people like me) and yet the opposite is true of Viista? Because you a are a Microsoft fanboi. I call them as I see them and it is not BS.
 
milkweg said:
OK, then explain this. Why pretty much on the first day of release of XP there was lots of praise from enthusiats like me on Usenet (that's back when web forums here didn't mean squat to people like me) and yet the opposite is true of Viista? Because you a are a Microsoft fanboi. I call them as I see them and it is not BS.
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There are tons of people that praised Vista on the first day.

Someone linked back to an article clear back in 2001... It was a Windows 2000 forum, and folks were bashing XP.
It was almost eerie how identical the arguments are today, the only difference is 2000 is now XP and XP is now Vista.
 
crewzen said:
Quote:
I have an good router and a hardware firewall but some of the hacks get through and that is why I load some more protection.
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You really need to spend some time learning more about what you talk shit about. :rolleyes:
 
TechieSooner said:
There are tons of people that praised Vista on the first day.

Someone linked back to an article clear back in 2001... It was a Windows 2000 forum, and folks were bashing XP.
It was almost eerie how identical the arguments are today, the only difference is 2000 is now XP and XP is now Vista.
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Add to that, forum usage has exploded in the past 7 years and many of these new posters don't actually know what they are talking about. For example, I have two friends that are highly anti-Vista yet their problems with it are all based on reading posts online and they always refer to the same information independently of each other. The same information that has been debunked time and time again. Even more telling, neither of them have even touched a Vista machine.
 
Met-AL said:
You really need to spend some time learning more about what you talk shit about. :rolleyes:
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Well I know not much about software but use a lot of it. When some of the programs report an attempt and what kind of an attempt it was, then it reports the IP address and traces it back to the origin. Then gives the local ip address to report to my isp if needed.

That is what the software is doing. Its not something I do. My days of computer programs are long over with since I have been diagnosed With MS and cant work anymore. I am not trying to pick on anyone just stated a fact as to why I load protection software right after my graphics drivers which I have burned into a dvd so I don't have to go on line to load them, and then I install the protection suite or so.

So what is so wrong with that?
 
milkweg said:
OK, then explain this. Why pretty much on the first day of release of XP there was lots of praise from enthusiats like me on Usenet (that's back when web forums here didn't mean squat to people like me) and yet the opposite is true of Viista? Because you a are a Microsoft fanboi. I call them as I see them and it is not BS.
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Could be lots of reasons. Did you upgrade an old machine to XP? If so if you did not have any compatibility problems then your machine and software must have been pretty new. I know I had to get newer versions of a couple of programs. I really can't remember if I had to replace any hardware, but I think I had to replace something.

If you got a new XP machine, then of course everything went smoothly. My parents bought a new laptop with Vista and I have not heard 1 complaint about it.

I updated a 98 machine to XP back when it first came out, I also upgraded a machine to Vista when it first came out. The experience was pretty much the same. for each upgrade there was a program or two that needed to be upgraded, or a device driver that was not upgraded to work with the new OS. With Vista most of my problems were with hardware. Logitech decided not to make vista drivers for my mouse or webcam. the mouse still works with reduced functionality, but the webcam is sitting in the closet because it useless.
 
milkweg said:
OK, then explain this. Why pretty much on the first day of release of XP there was lots of praise from enthusiats like me on Usenet (that's back when web forums here didn't mean squat to people like me) and yet the opposite is true of Viista? Because you a are a Microsoft fanboi. I call them as I see them and it is not BS.
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Ha ha ha, I wasn't aware that one person's experience dictated the entire industry. Please. I'm a fanboy of using my head to think rationally and stick to facts. I could give all kinds of examples from my own personal experience with XP, and the launch events in Philly I attended, the huge tech company I worked for at the time that was a partner of Microsoft on the XP launch, etc etc etc, but instead of using ridiculousness, I'll just stick to facts, and say it once again:

This is the same process that occured when Windows 2000 was released, and many people questioned the idea of melding the features of Win98/ME with NT's structure. It is the very same process when XP was bashed for providing nothing but eye candy and resource hogging or Windows 2000, since that was very stable, and offered things like plug and plug for home users as well. Sound familair? Yep, that's right...it is a cycle that's been repeated several times over.
 
TechieSooner: i meet a lot of other people in the IT field and a lot of people that are not but still are computer users. i would say over 90% reject vista and express hate for it.

i remember the transition from 98 to XP. the complaints lasted about 3 months. the stability of XP is what won over most users. i was a win2k user so switching XP was cake and i loved it.

vista on the other hand, going on 15 months. from IT people normal end users, i hear more complaints about vista then any other computer related problem. i put vista on my second box. i find that i never even touch that computer anymore. i dont want anything to do with vista. sure it works fine as an OS it does everything my XP machine can do. i just dont like using it.

same goes for using an apple computer, sure it is a computer has a working OS. no real big issues. i just HATE using the apple OS. that is how people feel about vista. it is not that is anything wrong with it, THEY JUST DONT LIKE IT.

there are a dozen technical reasons why people dont like vista just in this thread and reasons why XP is better but it all comes down to personal preference and that is the hardest thing for people understand. yet i think it is the biggest reason people reject vista.


their attempts at making the OS more user friendly failed horrible. if you work for a call center that logs calls with information about OS's vista people are still a small percentage of average end users but their calls make for 3x high percentage then XP users.
 
crewzen said:
When some of the programs report an attempt and what kind of an attempt it was, then it reports the IP address and traces it back to the origin. Then gives the local ip address to report to my isp if needed.
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:p, yeah, that's pretty much what I thought....that's just the run of the mill port scans and connection attempts that everyone on the internet sees, it's nothing special. You really don't need to
install 2 firewalls and a hard wired firewall and a pretty good security system
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and I think the statement
some of the hacks get through
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isn't really the case
 
gesicht said:
TechieSooner: i meet a lot of other people in the IT field and a lot of people that are not but still are computer users. i would say over 90% reject vista and express hate for it.

i remember the transition from 98 to XP. the complaints lasted about 3 months. the stability of XP is what won over most users. i was a win2k user so switching XP was cake and i loved it.

vista on the other hand, going on 15 months. from IT people normal end users, i hear more complaints about vista then any other computer related problem. i put vista on my second box. i find that i never even touch that computer anymore. i dont want anything to do with vista. sure it works fine as an OS it does everything my XP machine can do. i just dont like using it.

same goes for using an apple computer, sure it is a computer has a working OS. no real big issues. i just HATE using the apple OS. that is how people feel about vista. it is not that is anything wrong with it, THEY JUST DONT LIKE IT.

there are a dozen technical reasons why people dont like vista just in this thread and reasons why XP is better but it all comes down to personal preference and that is the hardest thing for people understand. yet i think it is the biggest reason people reject vista.


their attempts at making the OS more user friendly failed horrible. if you work for a call center that logs calls with information about OS's vista people are still a small percentage of average end users but their calls make for 3x high percentage then XP users.
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Wow, over 90% don't want to change to Vista. Think that might be a slight exaggeration? It seems like there should be no vista computers using that logic.

Of course IT people don't want to start using Vista, it would require them to do more work. XP has been around for 7 years, IT people are familiar with it. A new operating system requires people to re-learn everything and many people don't want to rock the boat. Your own quotes say it all. "i dont want anything to do with vista. sure it works fine as an OS it does everything my XP machine can do. i just dont like using it.". Why do you suppose that is?

I'll be the first to say that so far Vista does not really bring much new to the table, at least not yet. Initially vista had some problems, but from what I've seen that has gotten steadily better and with SP1 I really have no complaints with Vista. It's really a moot point, Vista is the new OS and XP's is time is drawing to a close. You will have no choice but to convert (be assimilated), so why resist?
 
has anyone noticed after installing SP1 onto vista, the boot times are significantly longer? I'm saying 2-3x or more longer
 
I think most would say, if there was a change, it was to make the boot process faster. I can't say I've noticed a change in booting on any of my three updated systems.
 
i just updated.

let the update run and cooked some dinner. when i came back i was greeted with the welcome screen. i typed in the password and was greeted with a friendly message that windows had shut down unexpectedly, citing a problem with my nForce SATA2 driver; which is up to date and has never given me a problem before.

i figure i'll just ignore that until i lose all my data and my monitor explodes. SP1 installed successfully imo, at least that's what the pop-up taskbar thingy said right before i came to that conclusion. :D
 
DFranch said:
Of course IT people don't want to start using Vista, it would require them to do more work. XP has been around for 7 years, IT people are familiar with it. A new operating system requires people to re-learn everything and many people don't want to rock the boat. Your own quotes say it all. "i dont want anything to do with vista. sure it works fine as an OS it does everything my XP machine can do. i just dont like using it.". Why do you suppose that is?

I'll be the first to say that so far Vista does not really bring much new to the table, at least not yet. Initially vista had some problems, but from what I've seen that has gotten steadily better and with SP1 I really have no complaints with Vista. It's really a moot point, Vista is the new OS and XP's is time is drawing to a close. You will have no choice but to convert (be assimilated), so why resist?
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QFT exactly right.

I'm not rolling Vista out in my company for quite some time. Like DFranch said above, users hate change.
We know all our applications (propriety ones, mainly) work on XP.

And I'll also say Vista doesn't bring a ton new to the table, but thinking back, comparatively, neither did any other new Windows release.
It's just a more "polished" OS. Runs more efficiently, less corruption problems, and more flexibility for managing the network with UAC (And tons new features, like being able to control power settings through group policy now, Server 2008/Vista).

But all in all, what we have works. For home users, if XP works... fine. But anyone getting a new machine I highly suggest Vista over XP.
 
Why are people fighting over XP and Vista? You like XP, that's fine. You like Vista, that's fine. Its your preference and use whatever works for you. Just remember sooner or later you are going to or might switch OS unless you last long enough for the next OS release. Some people don't like change and it takes them time. For me the only constant is change. I like Vista, is it better than XP? In some areas yes and in some no. I am on my second Vista Administration book and learning all kinds of new features. There are some features I really do like about Vista even if it cause the system to run "slower".

As far as SP1 going wrong. Its a computer and we all know that when something goes wrong it takes a lot of time and patience to figure out exactly what it is, not what you think it could be. There are a lot of variables and if your lucky it might be something "easy" to figure out. When you blame SP1 is causing problems to your system when others have installed it just fine your asking for debates. It makes you sound like you don't know what your talking about. Computers only do what they are program/build to do. Everything else is the users/engineer/programmers fault. We are the ones who "make" the stuff.
 
junglicious said:
Just remember sooner or later you are going to or might switch OS unless you last long enough for the next OS release.
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Only problem with this, is the folks skipping a generation of OS generally have even bigger compatibility hurdles to jump all at once...
 
TechieSooner said:
Only problem with this, is the folks skipping a generation of OS generally have even bigger compatibility hurdles to jump all at once...
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Then that will be on them. The world is not going to slow down because some people or people in general have a hard time adapting. Our technology is moving faster than before. I don't mean to sound heartless but the world is changing fast. With all the events going on and new election, its going to be a shocker to some.
 
griffinhart said:
Add to that, forum usage has exploded in the past 7 years and many of these new posters don't actually know what they are talking about.
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I hope you are not talking about me. It would be unwise of you to assume that just because my current user name says 7 months that I have only been a member here for 7 months.
 
junglicious said:
Why are people fighting over XP and Vista? You like XP, that's fine. You like Vista, that's fine. Its your preference and use whatever works for you. Just remember sooner or later you are going to or might switch OS unless you last long enough for the next OS release. Some people don't like change and it takes them time. For me the only constant is change. I like Vista, is it better than XP? In some areas yes and in some no. I am on my second Vista Administration book and learning all kinds of new features. There are some features I really do like about Vista even if it cause the system to run "slower".

As far as SP1 going wrong. Its a computer and we all know that when something goes wrong it takes a lot of time and patience to figure out exactly what it is, not what you think it could be. There are a lot of variables and if your lucky it might be something "easy" to figure out. When you blame SP1 is causing problems to your system when others have installed it just fine your asking for debates. It makes you sound like you don't know what your talking about. Computers only do what they are program/build to do. Everything else is the users/engineer/programmers fault. We are the ones who "make" the stuff.
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That's all fine and dandy with me. I use both Vista and XP and don't hate either of them but then I am a computer geek and enjoy dealing with all of the quirks and issues of computer use. But you have to admit, it's a far cry from being as easy to use as a toaster as Microsoft and Apple would like to have the masses believe . What I have an issue with is the how some of the people on this forum are derogatory to people who do have issues with Vista and immediately start to ridicule them when they post their issues of why they don't like Vista. They really do make themselves look like fanbois and I hate fanbois of any persuasion. Especially Linux fanbois. :) I install SP1 and get a stop error. Next day all is fine for no obvious reason. Somehow you equate that to it is my fault because I don't know what the fuck I am doing? Well, fuck you and the horse that you rode in on.

I've been using computers since 1989 and was originally trained to use the Mac. Two types of Mac and that is professionally trained. Also XT PC, again, in a professional capacity.
 
gesicht said:
TechieSooner: i meet a lot of other people in the IT field and a lot of people that are not but still are computer users. i would say over 90% reject vista and express hate for it.
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And how many of those actually used Vista at all ? Or for a more than a day ?

Becouse it's very easy to find Vista haters who relly on opinions from internet but it's much harder to find one with serious experience in using new OS.

I for one fell discomfortable when i have to use my XP from dual boot after using Vista for few weeks.
 
I for one like vista, I used XP since it's birth, and loved it, never really had a problem. The only dislike I've had with vista was UAC but that's easy enough to fix.

Boy this thread almost looks like a soapbox thread. :p
 
Thanks Milkweg!

I agree with you, just becuase people are having problems with Vista is no reason to bash. Vista has been out over a year and why are there websites dedicated to the hatred of Vista. I'm not an XP fanboi but I want to embrace Vista but I can't. My problems continue on my store bought pc one after the other. I'll keep going until I find a solution because all I have is time!
 
milkweg said:
I hope you are not talking about me. It would be unwise of you to assume that just because my current user name says 7 months that I have only been a member here for 7 months.
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I'm not pointing fingers at anyone in particular. It's just true. 10 years ago people that were using the internet on a daily basis tended to be tech pros and computer savvy people more than any other demographic. Today, that is just not the case. Today there are many vocal people out there, but the technical level of those people are comparatively lower than what it was a decade ago.
 
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