So did any 7800GT reviews mention when the AGP version was due?

Cali3350 said:
The only thing thats silly is getting a S939 board right now, when it wont offer you any more performance then a current S754 setup. Your saying upgrade everything for no gain other then PCI-e. Rather rediculous.
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for SLI dumb ass, for Nforce4, for dualchannel (dose help a tad in some stuff) Alot of us 939 users ave had SLI for a wile, and wernt going to wait for SLI on s754 (it jsut came out you know, and the board arnt all that great)

I really dont see why anyone would buy s754 now that s939 is jsut as cheap. the same could not have been said when s939 was at a price high

My thought on dual channel is, Id rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it.
 
the gain is not nessarly in PCIe by its self, but the SLI it can run :) Is there any singal AGP soultion that can even come close to Dual 7800GTXs or even dual 6800GTs? HELL NO THERE ISNT! so by defending AGP like it jsut as good is dumb because you limited on how fast your videocard is.
 
all you AGP haters need to understand not everyone has the same opinions as you, and thats ok.

I dont need to be "current" so I can be cool and pull out the e-peen on some forum. PCI-E gives NO real performance benefits over AGP other than SLI, if you choose to use it. Not everyone wants or needs SLI. Why sell a perfectly good AGP mobo and CPU/RAM combo just to upgrade the video? Sure, if AGP was a bottleneck, or had some other problems, id be all for it.

upgrading "just because" costs me money, and if theres no tangible benefit for it, I aint gonna do it
 
I(illa Bee said:
the gain is not nessarly in PCIe by its self, but the SLI it can run :) Is there any singal AGP soultion that can even come close to Dual 7800GTXs or even dual 6800GTs? HELL NO THERE ISNT! so by defending AGP like it jsut as good is dumb because you limited on how fast your videocard is.
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I dont think anyone has said anything about SLI except for you. We are well aware of the limitations of AGP in that regard. Very few people actually utilize SLI.

Seeing as how SLI is nothing id even currently consider (i am in college) S939 offers nothing over the current setup. No speed, no features, no anything. It makes far more sense to wait for M2. One last AGP upgrade, which would certainly carry me over to my next major upgrade, is what i want. I was hoping Nvidia would see that market.
 
Steel Chicken said:
all you AGP haters need to understand not everyone has the same opinions as you, and thats ok.

I dont need to be "current" so I can be cool and pull out the e-peen on some forum. PCI-E gives NO real performance benefits over AGP other than SLI, if you choose to use it. Not everyone wants or needs SLI. Why sell a perfectly good AGP mobo and CPU/RAM combo just to upgrade the video? Sure, if AGP was a bottleneck, or had some other problems, id be all for it.

upgrading "just because" costs me money, and if theres no tangible benefit for it, I aint gonna do it
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were not hatein on AGP, its great ok! been around forever and allways worked well. But to say preformence wise its the same? yes the bus itself preformes about the same. But how is the preformence of AGP sopouse to compar to PCIe when PCIe offers 2 major advantages, SLI, and NEWER VIDEOCARDS!

Yes if they dont make a AGP 7800GT ot GTX then AGP will offically suck, because it will be outdated in 1 year tops. Its like if they stoped AGP at the 5 series and the 6800GTs were only PCIe, then you have a bunch of peoeple useing there 5900s saying there jsut as good? How when the best card you got is a 5900 or 9800pro?
 
Here's how I see it. AGP or PCI-E really only matter to new system builds.

AGP users, enjoy what you've got, after all, as you say "no games need more than what AGP can provide now". AGP 6800U and AGP XT850XT PE's will continue to game at the direct X 9.0 standard for a while (until Longhorn comes along). Game developers will most likely develop for SM 2.0, since both the ATI and nVIDIA crowd can do that with the occasional option to enable SM 3.0/HDR for those that are so endowed (e-peen).

PCI-E users, stop picking on the AGP owners and enjoy your new "standard" upgrade path for future GPU's, some of you are enjoying SLI. Realize that while SLI gets you the 3dmark05 scores and unreal AA/Ansistropic enabled features at serious rez, that existing AGP Geforce6 and ATI R420 owners will continue to enjoy very decent gaming. The cost of changing at this time really doesn't make sense outside of the hardcore enthusiast.

Here's where I see people making mistakes:

New computer build based on AGP, shtupiddd. :eek: If you are buying from scratch, you really should go PCI-E, Socket 939 and whatnot. Anything else isn't a wise decision (unless you'll be going Dual Socket 940, so that with two dual-core Opterons you'll be doing the Quad core hustle :p )
 
HighTest said:
PCI-E users, stop picking on the AGP owners and enjoy your new "standard" upgrade path for future GPU's, some of you are enjoying SLI. Realize that while SLI gets you the 3dmark05 scores and unreal AA/Ansistropic enabled features at serious rez, that existing AGP Geforce6 and ATI R420 owners will continue to enjoy very decent gaming. The cost of changing at this time really doesn't make sense outside of the hardcore enthusiast.
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Wile I agree on what your saying. You need ot know that SLI gets mroe that just 3dmarks, and a 7800GTX a little more that jsut add high res, its dubble the preformence of anyhting on the AGP lineup. and the R520? im sure it will be the same if it ever comes out. Do you really think that will be AGP?

Also for alot fo us this is a hobby, I offen swap form one mobo to another jsut for jsut in trying it out and and overclocking. I had 4 Nforce3 mobos for cryin out loud, and at least 8 Nforce2 mobos back in the day. the only thing I really hold on to long term is memory and PSU.
 
I(illa Bee said:
yes the bus itself preformes about the same. But how is the preformence of AGP sopouse to compar to PCIe when PCIe offers 2 major advantages, SLI, and NEWER VIDEOCARDS!
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Are you following the thread? Most people dont care about SLI, and the whole point is to make newer cards in the AGP format.

Yes if they dont make a AGP 7800GT ot GTX then AGP will offically suck, because it will be outdated in 1 year tops. Its like if they stoped AGP at the 5 series and the 6800GTs were only PCIe, then you have a bunch of peoeple useing there 5900s saying there jsut as good? How when the best card you got is a 5900 or 9800pro?
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i dont get what your trying to say, but your logic appears circular. They wont make newer cards in AGP because if they dont make newer cards in AGP, then you couldnot get faster cards? WTF? Thats the whole damn point. There is no logical reason to STOP making high end cards for AGP, EXCEPT because they want people to upgrade to stuff they dont need.
 
Just did a little yahoo and googleing and it still appears that ATI will offer R520 in agp shortly after their launch in pci-e (last stated in July) . For me it's as simple as this. My 3700+ skt 754 agp setup will make fine use of high end next gen graphics from whichever company offers one. Currently using 6800gt oc(which at the time I bought it WAS high end) but my downstairs comp is running great with my old 9600xt (which is still the best money I ever spent on a video card) so no big sweat for me.
I would prefer to run Nvidia graphics on my Nvidia chipset. Just seems synergistic.
But that 9600XT ran just fine on Nforce 2. (matter of fact it ran better--read more stable-- than any other Nvidia card I ran in it including my beloved ti4200-8x-- 2nd best money--)
I'm through worrying about it. Don't matter for about 4-6 months anyway when stuff comes out that really needs the power g70 or r520 will provide and then we'll know for sure who is going to take care of the LARGE installed base of agp users and if no-one does, then skt M2 will be here and along with it a real reason to change motherboard et al.
 
Steel Chicken said:
i dont get what your trying to say, but your logic appears circular. They wont make newer cards in AGP because if they dont make newer cards in AGP, then you couldnot get faster cards? WTF? Thats the whole damn point. There is no logical reason to STOP making high end cards for AGP, EXCEPT because they want people to upgrade to stuff they dont need.
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Im saying if they stop makeing AGP cards then it dosnt matter if AGP is still good or not. It will not be a good bus to use because there will be no new cards for it. Within a year a 6800GT will be considered slow and if that was the last AGP card then AGP will be gone (your right, thats what im sure they want)

NV can make me eat my word words by makeing a AGP version of the 7800, who really know..any why the hell wont they jsut come out and tell us if they are or are not? and end this all
 
I(illa Bee said:
Im saying if they stop makeing AGP cards then it dosnt matter if AGP is still good or not. It will not be a good bus to use because there will be no new cards for it. Within a year a 6800GT will be considered slow and if that was the last AGP card then AGP will be gone (your right, thats what im sure they want)

NV can make me eat my word words by makeing a AGP version of the 7800, who really know..any why the hell wont they jsut come out and tell us if they are or are not? and end this all
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well im not normally a big ati fan, but if ati makes higher end cards for AGP and nividia doesnot, ATI will get my cash, so nvidia can suck on that

:D
 
Steel Chicken said:
well im not normally a big ati fan, but if ati makes higher end cards for AGP and nividia doesnot, ATI will get my cash, so nvidia can suck on that

:D
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Dont forget my cash, ATI will be sure to pick it up too.
 
Cali3350 said:
Dont forget my cash, ATI will be sure to pick it up too.
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an my Cusions cash, my bud Joe, Pat, and probely my old man...all on AGP, non intrested in upping the board and CPU to fit a PCIe soultion
 
Cali3350 said:
I would use this for a Athlon 64 claw @ 2643. Somehow i think its adequate.

ATI pledged support earlier for R520, so i guess ill have to wait for that.
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I know some mobo makers have NF4 boards on S754...it'll get you PCI express, and you can keep your Claw
 
PNut12345 said:
I know some mobo makers have NF4 boards on S754...it'll get you PCI express, and you can keep your Claw
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Yeah, but it would still be a board + video when i only want/need video. If im gonna upgrade my mobo i might as well wait for M2.
 
I hope you guys know NVidia doesn't care because you are probaly 1% of their profit. The OEM's are what matter and they have already switched to PCI-Express long ago.
 
Banko said:
I hope you guys know NVidia doesn't care because you are probaly 1% of their profit. The OEM's are what matter and they have already switched to PCI-Express long ago.
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Well then they dont get our money, and ATi will :/. Just have to wait longer.
 
Cali3350 said:
Well then they dont get our money, and ATi will :/. Just have to wait longer.
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If ATi even delivers an AGP R520. Have fun waiting a year.
 
Cali3350 said:
S939 offers nothing over the current setup. No speed, no features, no anything. It makes far more sense to wait for M2.
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Dual-core support?
 
I can only wonder how many PCI Expressers also bought sticks of Rambus memory to go with their shiny new P4s when those came out. "It's the way of the future! Get over it! DDR is dead!" If it's newer, it must be better. :rolleyes: Some of us are sick of upgrading more and more often just so we have fuzzy lines instead of blocky ones in our games. The lack of AGP cards goes directly with their goal of selling more nForce motherboards. Force people into a standard, don't let the market decide. Very Intel-like.
 
There's no reason to run and switch to PCI-E

But on the other hand, if you can spend several hundred dollars on a video card, you can easily afford PCI-E anyway.
 
iZero said:
I can only wonder how many PCI Expressers also bought sticks of Rambus memory to go with their shiny new P4s when those came out. "It's the way of the future! Get over it! DDR is dead!" If it's newer, it must be better. :rolleyes: Some of us are sick of upgrading more and more often just so we have fuzzy lines instead of blocky ones in our games. The lack of AGP cards goes directly with their goal of selling more nForce motherboards. Force people into a standard, don't let the market decide. Very Intel-like.
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but PCIe dose show primise right off the bat.. and trust me PCie is not going anywhere...
 
5150Joker said:
If ATi even delivers an AGP R520. Have fun waiting a year.
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They themselves have said to expect it. Why do you think they spent so much time on that bridge chip they almost never used.
 
Cali3350 said:
They themselves have said to expect it. Why do you think they spent so much time on that bridge chip they almost never used.
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Yeah ATi says a lot of things these days - like i said have fun waiting at least a year.
 
Get over it. If AGP was worth it business-wise it'd be there period. It's all about $$$$. High end setups use PCIe. End of story, sheesh. It doesn't frickin matter if ISA could handle a 7800 GTX, they DON"T MAKE IT for good reason.

If I hear one more person say "Wow AGP can handle XXXX np", it's not about if it can handle it, got it yet? If you don't, I'm sure you never will. Upgrade if you want the latest and greatest, don't if you don't have the funds. Pure and simple. If you have AGP, don't plan on having the baddest shit on the block ever again. Get a grip. Quit bitching about it, no one cares.
 
iZero said:
...Some of us are sick of upgrading more and more often just so we have fuzzy lines instead of blocky ones in our games...
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Bah, you know you wanna get rid of those fuzzy lines in favor of the straight ones :p
 
Eh, I like my mobo and don't really wanna tackle redoing my liquid cooling setup just so i can say online "AGP sux, get over it"...

There is nothing wrong with AGP; this has been over time and time again. I'm rather attached to my current setup and if nvida had made an AGP 7800, it would be in my box right now with a new sexy Innovatek waterblock on it. They didn't so, it's not.

When I got my 6800U a year ago, I chose nvidia over Ati, not because I knew nvidia had a better product but, because of availibility and the dual dvi (had 2x2001FP at the time, now it's 2x2005's)... Ati had neither so i got nvidia...

If Ati can produce a new card comparable to the 7800 or maybe better, that is AGP and dual dvi it will have a new home in my box.

What I'm saying is, nvidia just lost my $$$ for not so good of a reason, at all.
 
Zardoz said:
My friends AGP is going away. it's been coming and now it's starting to happen. It will not be long to where AGP will not be able to handle the bandwidth used on current video.

I know this can mean a big cost to upgrade to a PCIe system, and most will need to buy Motherboard, CPU and Video at the very least.

But it's really not good to spend money on aging technology because you will need to make the change anyway, and spend the money later...
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i will wait until switching to pci-e will net a performance advantage great enough to necessite tossing out $350 (vid/cpu/mobo) worth of components that are more than adequete for casual/mid-end gaming as is. pci-e in itself is not enough.

i understand there will come a point when agp will go the way of pci and i'll have to upgrade for the newer stuff, but if i can still lobby for agp versions of a newer cards and prolong the inevitable i'm gonna do it because it is cost beneficial to me since my processor/memory are far from being obsolete and the act of replacing them with nearly identical hardware is a waste of money in my book.

if someone gave me $500 to upgrade my system, the option of an agp 7800gt would guaruntee me a much faster system than the guy trying to use $500 migrate to pci-e and scrapping up enough change for a half-decent vid card. bang for your buck, that's what it's all about. i'm surprised you guys harbor such ill will to us lowly agp users, just trying to get my money's worth here.
 
fluxion said:
i'm surprised you guys harbor such ill will to us lowly agp users, just trying to get my money's worth here.
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Have to justify giving in to the marketing plans of these companies. That's all it was...marketing. AGP still has a lot of life in it.

But hey, you know, you can't pass DRM back and forth across the AGP bus since it's one-way. Go take a look at some of the Hi-Def stuff going on for MCE in the next rev. Your damn MONITOR will have to support DRM. Ever wonder why Dell is selling those widescreen LCDs for so little? I guess my point is, better not hear any bitching when you can't use your spiffy new PCI-e hardware that you just spent all that money on, to watch any Hi-Def video when it comes down the pipe (Blu-Ray or HD-DVD). THAT is the major reason I'd like to have one more rev of AGP. When I upgrade, I want it to be able to tie me down like a cheap criminal so I can watch HD DVDs that I'll purchase.

Maybe it's time to drag out the old Matel handheld football game and just give it up on this hobby.
 
I like how the people who bitch about the AGP'ers get so worked up and emotional. Trying to justify your unecessary expense or something?
 
I have 2 computers that I use for different purposes. One is AGP (5950Ultra) and the other is PCI express (7800GTX). If nVidia does decide to offer the 7800GT or 7800GTX in AGP in before I part out, throw away, (whatever), the AGP computer (and I don't have any plans on doing so in the next year or so), I'll buy one.

I'm currently putting together a computer for my son and I have a 7800GT ordered for it. I would NOT have gone any route other than PCI express on this one. However, there are still a lot of computers out there that are no where near out of date that have AGP cards. I'd like for nVidia to release a 7800 series card for those computers.
 
Cali3350 said:
The only thing thats silly is getting a S939 board right now, when it wont offer you any more performance then a current S754 setup. Your saying upgrade everything for no gain other then PCI-e. Rather rediculous.
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No Cali, obviously, if you throw away your current board, memory, cpu, and video card, your penis grows to PCI-e lengths!!!

You even get to buy a more expensive processor because that makes you l337!!!

The nuts can call me when my computer no longer runs current games. In the meantime, I think I'm just fine with my AGP board.
 
I love jumping into these debates :).

Anyway, both s754 and s939 have PCIe motherboards, so all this talk about upgrading the cpu/mobo/vid card is nonsense. You can keep your freaking claw at 2.6Ghz...I don't care. So really, when you decide you want a new video card, just buy a new motherboard also. It's not a matter of justifying my purchase of a PCIe card...I wanted the best (technically near the best since I got a 7800GT ;) ), so I had to get a PCIe one. Right now, you can't have the best unless you have a PCIe simply because the best isn't on AGP right now. It's almost like people are trying to revel in their lack of a new motherboard.

Also the PCIe slot delivers more power through the bus to the card which is nice....less playing around with molex connectors on cheap cards (6200-6600GT).
 
I have said this in many other threads, Its not just a simple process of getting a pci express motherboard for some people, like me for instance:

I have a shuttle PC which i use in my lounge for games, music, tv, pictures etc. For me to get a Pci express graphics card i have to do the following ( you may call me lazy for a few of the points but i dont care lol):

- Unplug and completely take apart my existing shuttle pc. (Takes more time and effort than just swapping graphics cards over)
- Order a new shuttle pc with a pci express slot. (This costs a lot more than just a standard motherboard.)
- Find a buyer for my old shuttle pc barebones as well as the old graphics card. (Yep Im Lazy!!)
- Install all the components into the new shuttle.
- Probably have to fucking ring microsoft to reactivate windows because i have changed so many components over the past year. (A 10 Minute phone call wasting more of my dam time!!!)

So my point is it takes a lot more time and money for some people than just getting a new motherboard, time is precious to me!, I cant be arsed with this upgrading shit anymore (done that for the past 10 years), i think ill get a ps3 instead when it comes out, fuck it. dont flame me its just my opinion!
 
Made metion in thier video card buyers guide today that the 7800gt agp is several weeks away on the context of presumption. The statement was like they were aware of a date.

Quote"Unfortunately for AGP holders, this card is only available in PCIe form for at least several more weeks. People should really think about making the transition to a PCIe graphics slot if they're in the market for a new high-end/extreme card right now, since AGP (for all practical purposes) is dying quickly. " end of quote
 
I've been waiting on an AGP variant of the new generation but finally gave in. I thought I could squeze a few more months out of my current rig.

Ordered an Asus A8N sli with 4000+
And 2 x XFX 7800 GTX 490/1300 :D

Cost of upgrade is $2600CDN - $800CDN for old rig. Cost of upgrading if there would of been an AGP card would of been much less. Then again the 2nd xfx was overkill but heh.

Now I'm going nuts waiting for the stuff to arrive.
 
When AGP came out PCI VGA cards died imidietly.
Though AGP gave so much more preformance. Also more features.
New chipsets where made with much more and better features.

Today 6800 generation of nVidia preforms as well on PCI-e and AGP. There is not so many new features either.

I guaranty You that if GTX would cam out in AGP it woud preform just as same as PCI-e version. So push from AGP to PCI-e isn't at this moment real preformance orienteted as it's pure politics of nVidia.
Nvidia wanted to push SLi to be shure it has longer time fasest GPU solution and that's why they have killed AGP.

What's a difference between nForce 3 Ultra 250 GB and nForce 4 Ultra SLi? SLi and ?
Memory controller is on CPU anyways. both handle same SATA, ID, USB 2,0 devices.

You want to say that somone who owns like Shuttle SN95G5 with FX57 and 2 GB RAM and SATA RAID from two Raptors doesn't have High End PC? Just because it has AGP? Would it be any slower then single PCI-e system with same GPU on it? Even with like ASUS 6800 Ultra AGP it's still dream system for a gamer. If there is going to be a AGP GTX of GT version it's going to be asfast as any todays PCI-e system with same single card solution.

I have nothing against new stuff and I look forward to new development that is going to give Us more preformance. PCI-e ain't on that place jet. Or better sad it is but just because nVidia makes new gen grafic cards PCI-e only.


Somone says go over it , yess We all will but should We be blind and accept any shit with smile on Our faces? Just because it's new?

Allthough I'm a nVidia Fan if ATI comes with AGP version of a R520 before AGP 7800 GT or GTX version and R520 is going to be seriously faster then my 6800GT AGP I gues my upgrade is going to be a ATi card.

For now I'm going to doo other updates before I update my grafic card.
Anyways I can play any game with native resolution of my screen hence no worries there.




MD
 
kirbyrj said:
Right now, you can't have the best unless you have a PCIe simply because the best isn't on AGP right now. It's almost like people are trying to revel in their lack of a new motherboard.
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which wouldn't be the case if nvidia released agp variants of the 7series. which is why we we're hoping for an agp version. make sense? i dont see where all the agp bashing is coming from, it's like you guys actually want nvidia to stop producing agp cards to we'll be shit out of luck, in which case the above logic will be applicable. at this point, however, it's still highly likely that the best (or nearly the best) will be available for agp boards and we can continue saving for a more viable upgrade path down the road.
 
heliotrope said:
I can't upgrade my Shuttle motherboard. Would have to sell it and buy a whole other Shuttle.
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Exactly. If NV offers a 7800GT in AGP....I will be replacing my XT-PE with it. End of argument. I like my Soltek SFF rig and have no plans on replacing anytime before...next June. PCI-e is not the end all (yet) of vid card options. Anyone that says otherwise is a fan boi :p
 
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