Silverstone SST-SX600-G 600w Gold SFX

[backfeed]

So, the length can be 140mm max if I want to use a full-size GPU. And so far I haven't found any to my liking. Unless the SFX-L 500W version is absolute beast I'll either sell the Ncase or go with a mITX GPU and an ATX PSU.

Not sure if I'm making it better or worse for you, but nobody knows for sure if the SFX-L actually fits in the M1. It'll be an extremely tight fit if it does.

With a full length graphics card, that is.

 

[AFD]

Packaging by NewEgg wasn't great this time around. PSU was sliding around in the box. The air packet wrap was only on the top of the PSU box, not the sides, so the PSU would slide back and forth when you tilted the NewEgg shipping box.

God, I hate that. I'll find out tonight how mine was packaged by them.

Bought my ST45SF-G from Amazon, and it shipped the same way (rolling around loose in the box). And yes, the actual Silverstone box provides little to no protection for the PSU, depending upon how it's placed in the shipping box.

Can't comment on the APC, the Cyberpower actually uses stepped approximation to Sine Wave as well. I have it with the highest capacity, with 900W+ of load at times (3 monitors connected, etc.). My apartment frequently gets 1-2sec of power outage / spikes /dips, and the Cyberpower has been doing its job just fine.

Well that's misleading.. thanks though! Hopefully the 1000VA/600W will be enough for my M1 w/600W SFX and 1 monitor (don't think I'll ever be using anywhere near 600W). At home my power is usually decent, but a few times every year I'll go through a couple weeks of unstable power (not complete loss, but constant dips enough to trip my stand-by UPS on and off several times).

 

[invidious94]

Briefly tested the PSU. The cables are too short to properly mount the power supply in my current setup, so I only used it for half an hour or so before plugging in my old Corsair unit.

PSU worked well, powered all my components just fine. PSU fan stayed off while running Prime95 for a few minutes, didn't kick in until I started playing some games (Bioshock Infinite). It stuttered a little bit once or twice before it stayed on, didn't notice any sounds from the fan starting, or attempting to start up.

The fan itself was reasonably quiet while I was running Bioshock. That said, the noise I did hear sounded like it was from the bearing, rather than airflow. From a reasonable distance (~0.6m or so), the fan wasn't really audible above my other fans, not that the rest of my system is all that quiet. The noise, when audible (only from a short distance away), sounded a little on the scratchy side, occasionally making louder scratchy sounds. There was also some noise from the airflow thrown in there. For comparison, the fans on my graphics card sounded much better (no bearing noise, just a very quiet wooshing sound from the airflow).

Unfortunately, I've also got some coil whine thrown in there when under light load/idle, or when the PC is turned off. It's not super loud or anything, but it's there. The only time I didn't notice it was when I was gaming.

For reference, my system specs are as follows:
Core i5 2500K @ Stock, Hyper 212+ Cooler, Fractal Define Mini w/ 2 x 120mm intake and 1 x 120mm exhaust Fractal R2 fans, Samsung 840 Pro 256GB, Gigabyte GTX 760 w/ 3 fan WindForce cooler, ASUS P8P67-M PRO. All system fans idle at about 1100RPM +/- 200RPM.

 

[[Spectre]]

Thanks for chiming in Paul_Johnson, greatly appreciated !

Would it be possible to test on 230V input voltage in future reviews ? I believe Australia and most of Europe, which is quite substantial, use this voltage and some PSU's run better, some worse. So it might be worth doing the comparison, if possible.

We could use a step-up transformer but this would not provide the "exact same" electrical feed as what is produced in most 220/240v countries and in order to have one that will work at all power supply ranges we test it would be mammothly expensive...all to see the 1-2% increase in efficiency.

So, while technically possible from either a step up or an AC source we won't be doing any testing at 220v/240v until the standard in the US changes over and then it will be at the US frequency.

Thanks for your insight Paul!
But what does it mean in real terms? Is the 100,000 hours MTBF exaggerated? Can there be noticeable issues with the power delivery within the 3 year guarantee period? I mean, you mention it in your article, and so people become concerned about it, but it's hard to draw conclusions about what effects there will be that the end-user will notice.

Mean is exactly that a mean, which in statistics is a great way to hide data. That said, the load life is nowhere near 100,000 hours on things like Su'scon capacitors at their rated temp (or really most capacitors), more like in the 2,000-5,000 hour range with some in the 10,000 hour range. Now, the very short version is that when running at temperatures below their maximum rated temperature the load life increases. The devil is in the details then about how long that life will be because of the exact temperature, location of the capacitor, circuit design, the work load on the capacitor, the quality of the capacitor construction, the quality of the components, etc. All things being equal, a higher quality (ie purer aluminum and better electrolytic, constructed properly, QC'd well, and designed well) capacitor will last longer than a lower quality one. That is, of course, very much shortened and yes all capacitors age and the ESR on all of them changes as they age but like people some age gracefully and some do not.

The other point is in the QC and materials. People with better QC and materials generally see lower defect rates as in any product. And those things cost money

Yes, that's why I prefer reliable noise measurements (with a quality microphone in a controlled silent environment, using the exact same method every time to ensure comparability between reviews) + subjective comments on noise "quality" (always from the same reviewer).

It would be nice, but unfortunately there is no practical way to do so and control all of the other variables reliably while generating realistic loads without large amounts of space.

Ah, I see. It would be nice if you could mention that in the review (in the noise section).

It is outlined in the links at the top of each of the pages that involve load testing including the page with the audio.

Ok, thanks for the clarification! This is of course not good. I hope quality components (top notch motherboard and graphics card) can tolerate temporary slight out-of-spec voltages, otherwise this may be a disaster (if the 12V rail ever goes down to 11.7V, after which a transient hits).

Well, the spec is what people are supposed to design to. If they design for worse situations they can, but they may or may not. They also may tolerate it once or twice or a hundred times but each time that it does it is wearing on the item. Where is the failure point then? Who knows, but generally speaking it is best to stay within the specifications of the design as that point should be further out than if you were to go outside of them.

 

[javidan]

Unfortunately, I've also got some coil whine thrown in there when under light load/idle, or when the PC is turned off. It's not super loud or anything, but it's there. The only time I didn't notice it was when I was gaming.

For reference, my system specs are as follows:
Core i5 2500K @ Stock, Hyper 212+ Cooler, Fractal Define Mini w/ 2 x 120mm intake and 1 x 120mm exhaust Fractal R2 fans, Samsung 840 Pro 256GB, Gigabyte GTX 760 w/ 3 fan WindForce cooler, ASUS P8P67-M PRO. All system fans idle at about 1100RPM +/- 200RPM.

Thanks invidious94.
I thought I was the only one who could hear coil whine and I was wondering whether I was the extremely unlucky individual. Our setups are very different with the only two things being remotely similar being an Asus MB and a Sammy SSD.

I've placed the system away from me since I can hear it if it's on the desk beside me. Kind of defeats the purpose of such a sexy and small setup [Ncase M1] but at least the machine is still running.

 

[nerdyjem]

Thanks invidious94.
I thought I was the only one who could hear coil whine and I was wondering whether I was the extremely unlucky individual. Our setups are very different with the only two things being remotely similar being an Asus MB and a Sammy SSD.

I've placed the system away from me since I can hear it if it's on the desk beside me. Kind of defeats the purpose of such a sexy and small setup [Ncase M1] but at least the machine is still running.

Just wanted to chime in, I ended up returning my SX600-G, but I had coil whine using an Asus Maximus 6 Impact, 4790k, and 2x Samsung 840 EVO SSD's.

 

[AFD]

I'll find out tonight how mine was packaged by them.

Yup, same packaging by Newegg as Invidious94.. only 1 air packet for the top of the SX600-G box, but nothing at all protecting the bottom or sides (and only the same incredibly thin bubble wrap around the PSU).

Damn mail carrier (UPS to USPS) was too lazy to stick the shipment on my front porch like UPS and FedEx always do, and instead crammed it into my mailbox and got it stuck. So nice of Newegg to charge me for this stupid, slow-ass Smartpost shipping.. instead of using my free 2-day Shoprunner account

That said, the noise I did hear sounded like it was from the bearing, rather than airflow.

Fuck.

The noise, when audible (only from a short distance away), sounded a little on the scratchy side, occasionally making louder scratchy sounds.

Fuck.

Unfortunately, I've also got some coil whine thrown in there when under light load/idle, or when the PC is turned off. It's not super loud or anything, but it's there.

Seriously, what the fuck?

Your description of of the scratchy bearing noise sounds *exactly* like the noise my ST45SF-G makes.. it isn't all that loud, but it's incredibly annoying. I'm not sure about other boards, but my ASUS Z87i-Deluxe always has some power going to the board (lit-up LED), even when the system is powered down. I really hope I'm deaf enough to not hear coil whine when everything is shut off.

I'm strongly considering just shipping mine back for a refund, if this is the crap they're trying to give us. I would have gladly paid another $20 or so to not have shit components in my PSU.

 

[Synomenon]

^
My feelings too. Had a ST45SF-G in my SG03 to save space and give everything more breathing room, but the case was sitting on my desk and all I could hear when it was off was coil whine then the clicking fan when it was on.

I threw that ST45SF-G away and got a non-modular Corsair that didn't have any problems, though it did take up more room.

I ordered a SX600-G from Amazon a few days ago. I hope mine isn't as bad as my old ST45SF-G or what you guys are experiencing with yours.

 

[alabrand1]

So, I've looked around for a non-modular/semi-modular short PSU that might fit the bill and I think I might have found it. The Cooler Master Vxxx series. 140mm long, all but the storage cables are non-modular and it looks to be a pretty good unit all around. Will do some more research but if I can get one of those all sleeved up then I might reconsider my plans.

 

[mbondPDX]

Ugh, you guys are starting to worry me. Got mine a few days back but haven't had time to hook it up and test it out. I'll report back here as soon as I get around to it.

 

[josephclemente]

Coil whine sucks. Hopefully a new revision of this PSU is planned soon. Too bad for those who have been eagerly waiting for this PSU.

 

[tetrismaster]

I've had a ST45F (bronze) and ST45SF-G v2.0 (gold), and both had some buzzing turned off and while on, though with the PSU fan drowning out the buzz and being inside the case it was hard to hear unless I put my ear next to it.

Does anyone have a ST45SF-G with absolutely no buzzing at all? I tried a Seasonic fanless once and without the PSU fan all I could hear was the buzzing

 

[xinux]

I never heard a PSU 'buzzing' while off. I've had the ST45SF and two ST45SF-G.

 

[Phuncz]

Maybe it's important to mention if you have 120V or 230/240V and if your wall outlet is earthed or not. Not sure because I don't know much about electrical design.
More importantly mention the motherboard being used. This might help identify the cause of the buzzing when the PC is turned off.

 

[inchikiboze]

To be more specific inchikiboze: I have a good feeling you'd have no problems.

Thanks for the advice, javidan! I suppose I'll run some tests with just the stock cooler. If it's getting too hot, then I'll look into other options. Thanks for your offer, but my hardware is a couple of generations behind yours, so I'll need to do my own stress testing anyway to be sure. I may want to OC somewhere down the line, so investing in a high-quality air or liquid cooling solution now would give me that flexibility. Do let us know if you run into cooling problems with your current setup.

 

[WiSK]

Ugh, you guys are starting to worry me.

I'm getting nervous now too - have waited so long for this part, didn't want to believe there will be any issues.

Does anyone have a ST45SF-G with absolutely no buzzing at all? I tried a Seasonic fanless once and without the PSU fan all I could hear was the buzzing

ST45SF-G at 230V, not earthed, no buzzing http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9P02jVmMBuc

 

[mbondPDX]

Well, I heard some slight coil whine but it's nothing that would make me want to return it. I played 30 minutes of BF4 to test out the fan noise and I can honestly say that I can barely hear it over the other system fans. Here is a video.

 

[AFD]

Think I'm happy with my SX600-G.. so far. I mentioned most of this in the main M1 thread, but I'll reiterate it here.

Coil whine. Pretty sure I don't have any coil whine, at least nothing that sounds remotely like this example (LINK). I've been noticing an incredibly high-pitched frequency, but I cannot at all localize it to the PSU (so it could be anything).

Fan. I bought this damn thing for its 0 RPM semi-fanless operation, but the fan constantly runs at idle. The good news is, I actually have to put my ear up to the case to hear that it's still on. I'm pretty sure the first minute or so I booted up it was completely off (intake is filtered, but fresh air). The fan still sounds like a cheap piece of crap (sounds like the bearings spinning around are made of plastic.. very similar sounding to my ST45SF-G). The good news is, I can only hear the crappy fan with my ear very close to the case (like inches).. whereas I could hear my ST45SF-G at idle from several feet away. I can make no useful judgement on noise at load.. still no GPU, and the only load I can put on the PSU is running an AIDA64 stress test (not enough draw to even change the RPM it seems).

Cables. Vs the PP05-E, the 24-pin mobo cable is 50mm shorter, so that's the only one I used from the new stock set.. the rest seem longer.

In summary. The semi-fanless operation doesn't work at all for me, fan still sounds crappy, but it's still significantly quieter than my ST45SF-G. Probably not worth $140 to find this out

 

[WiSK]

Thanks for your comments AFD

I presume 120V, but is your home properly grounded? And what is your ambient temperature?

 

[ellroy80]

What size fan is in this thing? 80 x 15mm??

I thought these issues were meant to be sorted out. We were told it was vastly improved over the 450W version. Ugh.

 

[Phuncz]

The issue with the fan on the ST45SF-G is not the 80x15mm size, the issue is the bearing and rpm profile. they seem to have fixed that.

 

[backfeed]

The issue with the fan on the ST45SF-G is not the 80x15mm size, the issue is the bearing and rpm profile. they seem to have fixed that.

The rpm profile yes (though the semi-fanless operation is bullshit if AFD is right), but the bearings are still crap it seems.

Bah. I'm not as eager as before to get my pre-ordered SX600-G now. Won't cancel the order though; I want to try it myself before I give it up.

 

[AFD]

Thanks for your comments AFD

I presume 120V, but is your home properly grounded? And what is your ambient temperature?

Very welcome!

Pretty sure we're 120V in the US. No idea if the electrical wiring in the house is properly grounded.. was up to code several years ago, and all outlets are modern 3-prong w/ground (but the wires to the street could be 100 years old for all I know).

Ambient temperature is controlled to around 20C.

The issue with the fan on the ST45SF-G is not the 80x15mm size, the issue is the bearing and rpm profile. they seem to have fixed that.

Think the bearings used in the new ADDA fan revision are still potentially an issue for some. The SX600-G fan still has the same scratchy, scraping, chattery sound.. but it's just much quieter than the ST45SF-G fan. I think whether or not someone notices this will depend on whether the intake is facing to the inside or outside of the case, how close they are to the case (and how the sound is directed).

It really amazes me that they made such noticeable improvements, but just couldn't figure out how to source a quality fan. No one would balk at $150 for the added expense of a better fan, if they're already paying $140.


Now going on ~4 hours and semi-fanless fan hasn't stopped running once

EDIT: Put it to sleep for ~20 minutes. Woke it up and fan was definitely off for about a minute. Started up RealTemp immediately and CPU load has constantly been ~1% or less with CPU temps ~15° above ambient (around 35C from wake til now). So semi-fanless almost sorta works for me.. for a minute. No idea what would be causing the PSU temp to be 45C+ (or whatever the cut-off temp is) so quickly.

 

[WiSK]

Now going on ~4 hours and semi-fanless fan hasn't stopped running once

Can you try without the filter mesh?

And another idea: tomorrow when you switch PC on in the morning, put a thermometer above the PSU exhaust. See how quickly and what temperature it reaches before you hear the PSU fan? If it's a hassle, don't bother, but would be interesting to know

 

[ellroy80]

Just got mine. There is a small amount of coil whine, which is barely audible when sitting 2-3 feet away from it. And this is just sitting on my desk. I probably won't hear it once it's in my case. Fan hasn't kicked on yet.

Installing Windows now. I'll update when I've got my system under load.

Running 120V here, btw.

EDIT. Fan just kicked in. When I put my ear right up against the PSU, I can hear the chattering that others speak of. It's barely audible from 2-3 feet away, but I can hear it. Interestingly, the coil whine has gone.

 

[tetrismaster]

Do you guys suggest putting a filter for the PSU if we're drawing air from outside the case?

 

[backfeed]

Do you guys suggest putting a filter for the PSU if we're drawing air from outside the case?

Yes. It will reduce air flow, but personally I prefer that over dust covered components, which will get harder and harder to cool as dust builds up.

 

[ellroy80]

The issue with the fan on the ST45SF-G is not the 80x15mm size, the issue is the bearing and rpm profile. they seem to have fixed that.

I realize that the size of the fan is not the issue. I'm not sure the bearing noise has been fixed. I need more time with it to decide if it's an issue for me or not. I wanted to know the fan size to look for a better fan with the same dimensions. I can then swap it out, if I decide to do so.

 

[WiSK]

Notes on the AD0812UB-D91 for future reference.

Model number means: 80mm, 12V, ultra high speed (max 4500rpm), ball bearing, (D=) 15mm depth, 9 blades, driven by IC (no speed sensor, no pulse width modulation)

From the sticker we know it draws 0.36 amps. Comparing datasheets of similar products (-GL series), this current draw is very high.

Without speed sensor, it will be difficult to analyse voltage v rpm. Datasheet might be available in Eastern language, but can't find anything detailed using English search.

 

[backfeed]

Notes on the AD0812UB-D91 for future reference.

Model number means: 80mm, 12V, ultra high speed, ball bearing, (D=) 15mm depth, 9 blades, driven by IC (no speed sensor, no pulse width modulation)

From the sticker we know it draws 0.36 amps. Comparing datasheets of similar products (-GL series), this current draw is very high.

Without speed sensor, it will be difficult to analyse voltage v rpm. Datasheet might be available in Eastern language, but can't find anything detailed using English search.

Ultra high speed? It would be very interesting to know why Silverstone picked a high speed fan for a low speed job, since it seems pretty stupid to me (considering that fans designed for high speed operation often tend to have lousy noise characteristics at low speeds). I hope the reason isn't "because it's cheap".

 

[vipz]

Probably because it needs to be able to push a lot of air at worst case thermal scenarios.

 

[EdZ]

That's my guess too. 600W crammed into something that tiny? At 88% efficiency at 600w load, that's 80w+ of heat to dump. The heatsink area available isn't huge, and not everything gets a sink, so you need to move a lot of air through to avoid cooking everything.

 

[mazzy80]

Hi,
I was so eager awaiting it to be available here in Europe to start my first Mini.Itx system around a FT03 mini - Impact VII board, but now it looks like a big let down.
For top dollars I was expecting top quality and quiet operation, instead I'm reading about cheap stuffs and noise.
Really I don't know, maybe I must reconsider my plans.

In Europe there're available 2 sfx PS models from Be quiet! rated 300W and 400W but I've found no decent info about. I'm temped to take a chance on the 400W unit but the noise specs are not that great.

I want to build a mini itx just for fun, but silent at idle.
I don't think that I want to put a top of the line Graphics Card inside a so tiny and closed case like Ft03-mini so maybe I don't really need a 600W unit at all.
But 300W look a little too weak and 400W have little headroom for a mid range card(170W), a 4790K OC, H60, 2 SSD,

The Silverstone 450 isn't that great overall and more expensive.

Suggestion ?

 

[WiSK]

Ultra high speed? It would be very interesting to know why Silverstone picked a high speed fan for a low speed job, since it seems pretty stupid to me (considering that fans designed for high speed operation often tend to have lousy noise characteristics at low speeds). I hope the reason isn't "because it's cheap".

The maximum speed at 12V is 4500rpm, but that doesn't mean they actually run it at 12V. It runs between 739rpm and 2290rpm.

In fact, the rpm profile is drawn in a handy graph on the product page.

What we need to discover is the voltage to rpm relationship, then we can look for similar fans that might have a better quality.

 

[backfeed]

Probably because it needs to be able to push a lot of air at worst case thermal scenarios.

That's my guess too. 600W crammed into something that tiny? At 88% efficiency at 600w load, that's 80w+ of heat to dump. The heatsink area available isn't huge, and not everything gets a sink, so you need to move a lot of air through to avoid cooking everything.

As you can see here, the speed at 100% load is 2290 rpm.

Sure, I don't know what Adda considers to be "ultra high speed", but to me it means a LOT faster than that, I'd say 4000 rpm or more.

The fan seems to be rated 0,36A at 12V, which is 4,32W. That's a lot for a puny 80x15mm fan, so I expect the max rpm to be crazy high.

 

[backfeed]

The maximum speed at 12V is 4500rpm, but that doesn't mean they actually run it at 12V. It runs between 739rpm and 2290rpm.

That's my point exactly: a fan with an insane maximum speed often tends to have lousy noise characteristics at low speed.

So why did they not pick a fan with let's say 2500 max rpm instead, that's my question.

 

[WiSK]

That's my point exactly: a fan with an insane maximum speed often tends to have lousy noise characteristics at low speed.

So why did they not pick a fan with let's say 2500 max rpm instead, that's my question.

Not always. For example, the higher powered GTs and San Aces run quietly at 4V.

 

[backfeed]

Not always. For example, the higher powered GTs and San Aces run quietly at 4V.

According to SPCR, the high-rpm GT's they've tested had "side effect" noise at low speeds (I think they referred to it as a whining tonality, probably related to the bearings). The low-rpm GT's didn't exhibit this phenomenon, so the recommendation from SPCR was to get low-rpm GT's instead of down-volting the high-rpm models.

In my own experience, my AP-14 (max 1450 rpm) GT is more noisy than my AP-13 (max 1150 rpm), when both are running at the same rpm.

 

[Hanakuso]

Sounds like i'll go with the Silverstone SFX-L if that ever comes along or i'll just pick up the Scythe version that's already out.

 

[Phuncz]

I was so eager awaiting it to be available here in Europe to start my first Mini.Itx system around a FT03 mini - Impact VII board, but now it looks like a big let down.
For top dollars I was expecting top quality and quiet operation, instead I'm reading about cheap stuffs and noise.

I think you have misinterpreted some things. The HardOCP review was generally very positive about the PSU because it worked above spec in about all the scenarios. The lesser quality components aren't going to mean it's crap, but just that certain components are of lesser quality. But in the review, this doesn't show.

The noise people have complained about is mainly the faintest of buzzing or fan whirring, but overall people still said that it is much more quiet. People here sometimes have difficulty putting experience into the right words, so you really have to read what is being said. AFD's opinion sounded like it was loud, although he said it was still much quieter than the ST45SF-G and was listening up close.

Don't expect this to make absolutely no noise whatsoever with your ear against it, this is in the end just a consumer PSU, not lab equipment. Even though you'd pay €120-130 (my guestimate), there are still more expensive ~600W ATX PSU's like the Seasonic Platinum Series 660W. Yes, 80+Gold vs 80+Platinum but you know what I mean.

Let's also not forget that some people are overly critical and obsessive about noise.

In Europe there're available 2 sfx PS models from Be quiet! rated 300W and 400W but I've found no decent info about. I'm temped to take a chance on the 400W unit but the noise specs are not that great.

Those are said to be pretty noisy and of lesser voltage stability, Silverstone still is king of SFX.