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SENTRY: Console-sized gaming PC case project

Why a Xeon E3-1231V3 (LGA1150-252€) for gaming and not an i7 3770 (LGA1155-261€) / i7 4770 (LGA1150-267€) besides the lack of GPU¿?

Maybe I do the same with broadwell.... if G3258 dont create bottleneck with gpu's.
 
I'd check out other resellers - E3-1230's were usually cheaper than 3770/4770 by 60-85$ with price near 4670K
 
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Thanks for the info. That Xeon is still expensive here in Spain. Inclusive Amazon Spain is over 257€. An i7 4770 is cheaper in typical resellers . See ya
 
I bought the Asus Maximus VII Impact because of the M.2 socket (PCIe 3.0 x4 and NVMe support), audio and Intel NIC, but it's very expensive. That's why I would at the moment recommend the Asus Z97I-plus more, it also has a good M.2 support (Type 2280, PCIe x4, NVMe) and also good quality overall.
 
Recommended prices from ark.intel are:
i7-4770 BOX : $312.00
i5-4670K BOX : $243.00
E3-1230 v3 BOX : $250.00

And all were launched Q2'13

1231v3 replaced 1230v3 recently with simillar price.

But yeah, in europe prices are like 300$ for those currently somehow.
 
Thanks. That's true are more affordable. Both Asus Z97I-plus (135,91€) and Asus H97I-plus (116.90€). Both with the same M.2
 
ASRock Z97E-ITX also has m.2 support, but the layout is not as ideal. As Phuncz said, the Asus Z97I-plus is good as it has good m.2 support and is more than good enough in a small case like SaperPL's or Dondan's A4 where overclocking will be limited anyway.
 
SaperPL said:
I'm thinking of doing something like this

z9h4yGw.jpg

7WO3pmK.jpg

ki5t99J.jpg


Considering that there's a lot of steambox style slim case projects supporting only itx I think I'm gonna go for supporting mATX and cards up to 270mm. It will be able to support more ram and powerfull X99 systems

It can be 8L design, current dimensions including 1.5mm outer panels on each side are at 7.5L so I have 0.5l to grow where I need a little space.



As you can see there's a lot wasted space around hard drive. I did try the TFX psu but i couldn't fit the drives with enough amount of space around. It'll be a place for drives cage and possibly slim ODD.

The main problem probably will be the pci-e riser and it will require some additional space or clever design.

There's also the problem with different flow of air through the PSU than of the other components so this gotta be investigated more.

Also it would be inverted to take air from bottom(with distancing stands) and push it out at front and back.



What do you think guys?
Click to expand...

I think that's a pretty slick design! In fact, I liked it so much I build a few a couple years ago :D Take a look at This Thread for the story

I also built a successor to the original ThreeZero that used mITX and came out to about 12" by 12" and a little taller than an SFX PSU.

A shame I've been so busy and didn't see this thread sooner... I could have shared what I learned and saved you the trouble!

Congrats on the design gentlemen! Interesting to see some actual engineers go after the SFF task :cool:
 
We've dropped this idea because of huge width and problem with generic riser length. It would rather be 440mm of width to not obstruct ram slots with PEG connectors and leave space above first pci-e slot for riser connector.

If we get good results with current case I'll try to make a one like this, which I've been talking about to Necere in his thread
Necere said:
Right, I see it now:



This allows the GPU to have an unblocked air intake. Drives could go partially over the front section of the motherboard. I get dimensions of around 310x385mm. Hm. It's an interesting layout, at least.
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This one is interesting for people with huge budgets for ultra high-end pc's, because it could fit X99 boards with DDR4 and 18-core xeons with limit for 170mm GTX970 card.
 
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Rack is 435mm wide so we would need additional structure from sides to hold it.

Also for rack you need good ventilation from rear to front, different than in such configuration as here.
 
SaperPL said:
Rack is 435mm wide so we would need additional structure from sides to hold it.

Also for rack you need good ventilation from rear to front, different than in such configuration as here.
Click to expand...

Since these cases would be for recreational use, and not high density data centers with strict cooling design, I think it would be safe to use ventilated side panels and pull air from any direction except for maybe the rear. I have used some rack appliances that pull air from the sides of the case, and you could easily use top mounted fans as long as you left the 1u above it draw from, either leaving it unoccupied with or without a solid/mesh blanking panel.

Most of the rack gear (amps, receiver, and power protection) in my living room is passively cooled anyway, and works without any issue.
 
USF-Nealio said:
Is there any chance of any of these designs being rack-mountable?
Click to expand...

I find it odd that with almost every SFF case project in this forum there is someone asking if it is rack-mountable. I can't but wonder why. Because I can't think of any scenario where a desktop case converted to a rack-mountable case is better than the already available cases designed for rack mounting.
 
Phuncz said:
I find it odd that with almost every SFF case project in this forum there is someone asking if it is rack-mountable. I can't but wonder why. Because I can't think of any scenario where a desktop case converted to a rack-mountable case is better than the already available cases designed for rack mounting.
Click to expand...

  1. Rackmount cases are not designed for gaming. 1U and 2U cases generally have either 1 full size PCI slot, or 4 half slots, so you have no where to put a graphics card. 3U cases are few and far between these days, and 4U cases are generally unnecessarily large.
  2. Because the bulk of the currently available rack-mount cases look terrible. So an attractive option is definitely welcomed.
  3. Because SFF cases such as this one share a lot of the same layout and design concerns as rackmount cases. So you have the ability to kill 2 birds with 1 stone when you are aware of the maximum dimensions.

Considering it's a rectangular chassis, how difficult is it to add rack ear mounting points?
 
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USF-Nealio said:
  1. Rackmount cases are not designed for gaming. 1U and 2U cases generally have either 1 full size PCI slot, or 4 half slots, so you have no where to put a graphics card. 3U cases are few and far between these days, and 4U cases are generally unnecessarily large.
  2. Because the bulk of the currently available rack-mount cases look terrible. So an attractive option is definitely welcomed.
  3. Because SFF cases such as this one share a lot of the same layout and design concerns as rackmount cases. So you have the ability to kill 2 birds with 1 stone when you are aware of the maximum dimensions.

Considering it's a rectangular chassis, how difficult is it to add rack ear mounting points?
Click to expand...

2U rackmount cases with full hight expansion cards are pretty easy to find. This was with a quick search of newegg. I'm sure if you broadened your search to other sites you'd find more. Each one of the following has 3 expansion slots, the first 3 have the GPU next to the PSU, the last one has the PSU next to the motherboard.

Black: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811165403
Blue: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811165589
Red: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811165590

Different front styling: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811192380
 
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USF-Nealio said:
  1. Rackmount cases are not designed for gaming. 1U and 2U cases generally have either 1 full size PCI slot, or 4 half slots, so you have no where to put a graphics card. 3U cases are few and far between these days, and 4U cases are generally unnecessarily large.
  2. Because the bulk of the currently available rack-mount cases look terrible. So an attractive option is definitely welcomed.
  3. Because SFF cases such as this one share a lot of the same layout and design concerns as rackmount cases. So you have the ability to kill 2 birds with 1 stone when you are aware of the maximum dimensions.
  4. Considering it's a rectangular chassis, how difficult is it to add rack ear mounting points?
Click to expand...
Well OK but I'm more interested in the why than the how :)

Anyway:
1. size:
1U: these can't fit 2-slot GPU's as far as I know due to height restrictions
2U: something like this: http://www.istarusa.com/istarusa/products.php?model=D-200 EDIT: apparently Screes found the exact same ones as I did :)
3U and above: those are just huge and nowhere near SFF.

2. rackservers are for industrial and commercial usage, not residential or consumer. It's like asking for a pretty power drill.

3. SFF chassis are the exact opposite of rack chassis. The latter are based on the wind-tunnel effect and generally will have heatsinks without fans attached because the chassis has a wall of fans. SFF chassis that are built efficiently, use direct access to most of the sides of the case for components to get cool air and as such are designed to be set on a table, sometimes in one or two orientations. It's just an entirely different design concept.

4. it's not that easy, those ears would need mounting points where the entire weight could be hung off on. No SFF cases are built like this and with the aluminium exterior not designed to be hung, this means an entire redesign would be needed.

Why not just get a rackmounted shelf ?
 
One question for the experts: SFX PSU are all noisy? or exist some models very quiet?. I'm talking about the levels of silence of some ATX PSU.

And not talking about semi-fanless. Im mean with the fan operational
 
I believe the problem is with the fans and their cheap bearings. I got Qoltec 420W that came with the case and it randomly started to screech and be loud. I replaced its fan with a fan that came with on of coolermaster's cases and I just plugged it as the motherboard fan - it went totally silent.

Can't say how would it work for some bigger load with 600W ones, cause I used only HD7750, GTX750 and K620, which all are below 65W cards so can't say if that's safe.

Still that's In my opinion biggest problem - if fan is too loud, then you can replace it, if that's something else that means you're either overloading the PSU or it's damaged, I think.
 
The SX600-G can't be considered noisy, but it instead has problems with coil whine (which has disappeared with time for many if not all so far though - I no longer hear it myself), a short-duration chirping noise when the fan starts spinning (which can be annoying but nothing serious) and a low-noise but persistent fan bearing chatter (which is really annoying to me personally, but most people don't seem to care or even notice it).

It has so far been impossible to find a good replacement fan for it, unfortunately.

Edit: It is however important to note that it's a LOT more silent than the SX45SF-G (even the less noisy version 2.0). Huge improvement.
 
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I had the coil whine problem on cheap 600W standard PSU and researched that at that moment. As I remember its either overloaded or faulty and some manufacturers were replacing them on warranty.

What's your problem with replacement fan?
 
The problem with finding a replacement fan is that the fan controller in the SX600-G has an 1-6V output range, and it's proven impossible so far to find a 80x80x15mm fan that works well in that range, has a similar rpm range, can start at 3V like the stock fan, actually has better acoustics and can be purchased in small quantities.

There is/was a variant of the stock fan that has sleeve bearings instead of ball bearings, which should get rid of the chattering noise (and perhaps also the chirping), but it has gone out of production (I think) and seems impossible to find.

One solution would be to amplify (double) the output voltage of the fan controller, from 1-6V to 2-12V (and the stock fan starts at 3V, so a replacement fan should then start at 6V). There are a lot of fans that would work in that range. I haven't found a simple (and reasonably cheap) voltage doubler that would work, but perhaps somebody else can?

More information can be found in the SX600-G thread, where we've been discussing this problem.
 
As I said, I replaced my fan anyway and connected it to motherboard fan power receptacle and it worked well for over a year without overheating.

j2MqOig.jpg


I know its a bit redneck but it works well.
 
Yes, that's the (too) easy way. :)

Personally I wouldn't risk doing it, without making sure that the internal temperature of the psu won't exceed the intended limits. Plus it would be hard to control the fan speed without knowing the internal temperature, and running the fan at fix speed is not a solution for me (who wants the least noise possible).

Also, you risk rapid capacitor degradation. Works for 1 year, but will it hold for another? :p
 
I dunno, that's a cheap PSU anyway and I'm using it on mid range fan speed.

We will see but I'm not overloading it when using low power components such as xeon and GTX750.

I wouldn't do that for 600W SFX due to warranty loss. We must wait for some good, silent PSU's then.

And by the way - why use 600W SFX? What do you need so much power for at the moment? 450W or 500W gold psu's should be enough for GTX 970's or even 980's
 
Because the ST45SF-G (Silverstone's 450W gold) is extremely noisy. I replaced it with the SX600-G and it is a huge improvement noise-wise, but has other soundrelated issues instead. :)

Silverstone's 500W SFX-L will be even better, according to Tony Ou. I have high hopes for that one.
 
I have the 450w sfx gold and it's noisy as hell under load and audible even on idle loads. SFX-L should be more affordable than SFX from what I've heard and read. Usually, a smaller form factor of similar tech will be more expensive due to design, space, and heating constraints.
 
We're on the additional hard drives mounting subject now.

Here's current idea of how it could be done


Adding the mounting holes to the inlet matrix requires some irregularities which sucks a little visually.

I think we also need a secondary mounting on the other side. It would enable you to mount a drive under gpu if you have a blower type cooler.
 
I dont get the inside for now without more pics.

Is the hard drive of the left a 3,5" drive for short GPU's or is a 2,5" HD?. Why the primary HD mounting is in front of the GPU and not in the back? There's space to put two 2.5" in the back of the GPU?

By the way, I take a photo of a PC in my work with similar hex holes to the first model.

The truth is that with that design of holes there are a lot less Start-Stop of the laser cut. I wish in the end of the design phase we could choose between both designs if we know the final cost of each one

T8fDFuo.jpg

3nLdSWT.jpg
 
elshekar said:
Is the hard drive of the left a 3,5" drive for short GPU's or is a 2,5" HD?. Why the primary HD mounting is in front of the GPU and not in the back? There's space to put two 2.5" in the back of the GPU?
Click to expand...
Its the 2.5", the both images are of the same thing, just showing the mounting holes for both 3.5" and 2.5"

Those are the mounting holes for additional drives as last resort. The drive is in front of the card just to visualise its possible placing, it's not the default drive mount, just the spare one.

Here's new one with second mount for 2.5" drive



As you should be able to see, just 2.5" mounts won't need air inlets alteration, its the 3.5" mount placing the problem.

Those 10mm 2.5" drives fit under the gtx titan and gtx 980, so I believe its possible to use the bottom(in this image) one with blower type cooled cards, or just use the top one with shorter cards.

We're not mounting those drives over the card because it would be closer to the heat source and also would need additional support element.

elshekar said:
By the way, I take a photo of a PC in my work with similar hex holes to the first model.

The truth is that with that design of holes there are a lot less Start-Stop of the laser cut. I wish in the end of the design phase we could choose between both designs if we know the final cost of each one
Click to expand...
We'd love to make something like this hex, as with the original design, but without a hole-punching machine it would be too expensive as stated before.
 
What's the width of the stands (what's the width - 64.5 mm for case - with the stand)?
 
The stands are 4mm high, they are standard stands with this dimension, so total height with stands is 69.5mm (63.5 SFX + 2x1mm thick plates + 4mm stands)

We were going initially for 0.5mm thick plates, but it wasn't assuring enough, so we went for 1mm instead of more complex design.

65.5mm height is for visual volume of the case. Currently we've got 6.9L of volume for the main box(visual volume), but it's total 7.55L including stands and VGA bracket handle in dimensions.We could've fit into 7L but we want to support big 305mm gpu's like ones with huge windforce coolers.

Also I'd appreciate some more input on the additional/redundant hdd mounting holes in VGA space.
 
SaperPL said:
Also I'd appreciate some more input on the additional/redundant hdd mounting holes in VGA space.
Click to expand...
I don't think the screwholes breaks the look, they are hardly visible unless you are looking for them. Mainly because they allign so well with the pattern. Human sight can often spot irregularities in a pattern and since this follows the pattern roughly, it isn't as noticeable.
 
Well i think it's breaks the look, becouse when you see a uniform pattern any difference claim your attention, but I assume some people will use this extra space for HDD.

One question. There's a way to use the stand in horizontal mode? I asume in the pics that the holes of the corners are for this reason. You will place 4 holes in both sides?
 
Stands are detachable, there will be plugs for those holes if you want to use the horizontal configuration.
Holes will be only at one, default bottom, side.
 
It would be great if you could write important updates like decided prototype screens and a release date for the kickstarter campaign to the first post so people don't have to read the whole thread to know when it will be released. Oh and btw I love the design (looks better than the upcoming N1 case) and I'm happy that i found this thread through google as I was looking for a steambox case. I hope SFX-L support is definite?
 
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Done, check out the first post.

Yeah, SFX-L up to 130mm will be supported as noted that most of those are with this dimension or below.
 
We are waiting with some more renders and other information until we will make our first prototype. We have many difficult things and weird stuff in this case, that normal companies don't have to do, and we want to check them. If we won't have so many bugs that we think we can have, than our kickstarter/indiegogo campaign will start earlier. At this point we can only say that we want to start it as fast as it can be. As someone noticed, we're engineers and we don't want to relese a crap product. We will be using this case, same as You will, so we want it to be the best product and as cheap as it can be.

Right now we're preparing DXF (2D CAD) files for cnc laser, and we will be waiting for their calculation.

p.s.

We didn't post interior renders, because as i wrote before, we have some weird things there, and we're not sure which of them can be made by the laser-cutting company...and which can't.
 
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