Rift vs Vive

Oscar Meyer

Limp Gawd
Joined
Oct 9, 2009
Messages
305
Just wanted to show you guys one aspect of the Rift that no one ever talks about. That is its portability. In the last 2 weeks I've had the Rift, I've been so amazed by VR, I want to show everyone how awesome VR can be. But in order to do so, I've got to haul the Rift around to friends and family. One great strength about the Rift is it requires hardly any space to set up. I can relocate and set up in a new location in under 5 minutes. Setting up the Rift at a friend's or family member's house is a breeze. Basically, I can set it up anywhere there is an electrical outlet. Another great thing is the Oculus software is pretty streamlined once you set it up. After that, you don't even need a monitor. I have my PC setup to boot directly into windows desktop (no login pass). After that I just put on the headset, Oculus software auto loads, and off to VR I go...no monitor required, and even better, no keyboard required.. You just need the Xbox controller. Here are some pics below to show you what I am talking about. I relocated the Rift to various locations around my house and ran the Unreal Showdown Demo. The headset tracked flawlessly in every location...

As long as the camera sensor has a straight line of sight to the headset, you are good to go....
IMG_3237.JPG


You'll have to stand up in this scenario. This is how you trick out the wife into thinking you love doing laundry.
IMG_3239.JPG

Here's one for shi@tzs and giggles. Gives new meaning to the term Potability.
IMG_3233.JPG

Here's what powers the Oculus
IMG_3240.JPG

Intel 2600k@4.7, 8 gigs ram, a couple of ssd's, silverstone sfx 600 power supply, and an EVGA Geforce 980 ti Hybrid. Case is a Sugo08 (had to modify the top so the GPU radiator can exhaust the heat).
Under intense gaming, I've never seen the GPU break 54C degrees.
IMG_3242.JPG
 

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Vega

Supreme [H]ardness
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Messages
6,531
Also really helps to have one portable PC! My PC isn't going anywhere. That is a sweet little portable rig you have there. Been thinking about doing something similar next upgrade. Any small cases like that that can handle two GPU's?
 

Oscar Meyer

Limp Gawd
Joined
Oct 9, 2009
Messages
305
Also really helps to have one portable PC! My PC isn't going anywhere. That is a sweet little portable rig you have there. Been thinking about doing something similar next upgrade. Any small cases like that that can handle two GPU's?

Problem with going that small is the heat. The Hybrid version of the 980 Ti was the only card that didn't overheat big time, I'm talking 90C plus temps on the GPU with a regular air cooled GPU. But if you're crafty you might be able to stick 3 GPU's into a Bitfenix Prodigy like this guy https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/ef/a1/84/efa1848f47516a7dbcf47b515aaa708e.jpg
 

RangerXML

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Joined
Apr 16, 2006
Messages
6,387
I used the Vive now for about a week and now am returning it (it only has a 14 day return from day it shipped, yay), wasn't satisfied. I'm going to be borrowing my friends Rift come Monday, while I doubt I'll be satisfied with the current generation resolution I am looking forward to trying a different headset. I'm returning the Vive mainly because it couldn't deliver on the type of games I'm mostly interesting in, sims and space sims, the resolution is to low and the headset is to much of a hassle to set up (waiting for the base stations and controllers to detect/wake up), not commenting on headset weight or comfort yet until I try the Rift, but the Vive was ok by itself (as long as I put the lenses out 1 notch no uncomfortable pressure on my nose of my glasses). I can see why all the games use are those basic graphics, you really notice the resolution with anything more detailed. Also on a note, I seem to always hit the eye distance nob when I took off my headset and I would realize it, this seriously messed with me.

I chose the Vive initially because of Valve, company I personally prefer and the forward facing camera (which turned out to be a lot more buggy then expected) and I ended up being able to play Elite Dangerous no problem without the camera. As for video card, I was doing fine on a first generation GTX Titan. Will get back after a week with the Rift, but I'll be honest I'm going in with some bias, lighter headset, simpler set up, same low resolution and well Facebook.
 

Vega

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Oct 12, 2004
Messages
6,531
Definitely understand why you would want to return it. The resolution is just bad. It doesn't help that virtually all of the game's graphics are basic/cheap. I also was surprised at how bad the front/camera resolution was when you use it.
 

sethk

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
May 3, 2005
Messages
1,847
Wishful thinking. Oculus Touch is vapor, the whole thing was designed as a quick PR placeholder to buy time to figure out an actual solution, after they were caught off-guard by the Vive's input solution back when first announced.

In the meantime HTC won't be sitting still on input and will continue to innovate and refine. First mover advantage tends to be huge when a new tech emerges.

Just curious as to why you think so. Most people who tried the touch thought it was a fantastic and very well developed solution (lightweight, intuitive, good materials, good tracking) - that's generally a sign that it wasn't slapped together last minute. I haven't used it myself, so of course that's just a 2nd hand opinion. I don't disagree regarding the first mover advantage, and I've got a Vive on order. I don't think the Oculus touch is vaporware, however.

Also really helps to have one portable PC! My PC isn't going anywhere. That is a sweet little portable rig you have there. Been thinking about doing something similar next upgrade. Any small cases like that that can handle two GPU's?
It's a bit bigger but still portable/luggable - the Bitfenix Prodigy has been showcased in some cool SLI rigs. With blower style coolers, it works fine due to the vertical arrangement (even 3-way with some minor mods), or separate hybrid-style closed loop coolers, of course.
 

RangerXML

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Apr 16, 2006
Messages
6,387
Ok, second day with the Rift now, what a different HMD. First thing, it took me less then 10 minutes to take everything out of the box, run the cables and plug everything in. Compare this to the mess that is the Vive, but then again, you need all that set up for something completely different. The next thing you'll notice is that the Rift is smaller and lighter compared to the Vive, its strange how much more front heavy the Vive was compared to the Rift which just feels way lighter. Even the IR emitter which I thought I'd have to set somewhere off to the side was a lot shorter that it was under the line of sight of my monitor and I like the remote, very simple and straight forward for navigation (you can just use the included XBone controller as well). On a more neutral side, the software, it was a smooth installation, its easy to navigate and install games, but that is where things start going downhill, it has no resume downloads as I found out, it always runs in the background so as soon as you put the headset on it pops up, even if you are launching an outside program, you need to take the headset off for admin promps for installing games, if you download a game you need to take off your headset to finish installing it and did I mention its always running in the background threatening to pop up at the most random times possible (I feel totally paranoid). Now the negatives, unlike the Vive I can't really wear the Rift with my glasses comfortably and it has the same low resolution as the Vive that bugged the crap out of me there. All and all, would by at between $300-400 and not at $600+tax and shipping, but between the two headsets, for me as more of a sim and space sim player, I'd go for the Rift for longer more comfortable wear (I'd get smaller glasses just to use for VR).

Honestly, with the lower resolution I really don't feel like I'm in those worlds, only when I'm moving with the Vive on AudioShield did I feel like I was a part of the "VR experience" and even in Elite Dangerous it felt very artificial because of how bad everything looked. I'm trying to get VorpX to work with the current build of StarCitizen and experience faster pace movement, but I'm holding my breath for a second generation.
 

Morphes

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Jul 16, 2001
Messages
4,204
Short term I think the vive is going to win

Long term, I think oculus has it in the bag. They have made it easier to work with, easier to setup, easier for everyone in general.

Once both players get to the point where you can order one (complete packages, with controllers) and have it within a week is when things will get really interesting.
 

Nenu

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Apr 28, 2007
Messages
19,379
I disagree.
The Vive isnt fit for sale.
The amount of image in focus is tiny and the blur level is different for each eye.
You can clearly see the fresnel rings and there is serious streaking.
It is very hard to read text because you need to view it dead centre and move your head to track each word.
The front weight is so high I have to strap it on tight otherwise it moves which makes its very uncomfortable and leaves bad face imprints.
The earphones keep falling out and are painful to use.

I'm shocked how bad this is.
I have tried the Rift and its a world apart, a much better headset. A larger view in focus, no streaking that I remember, its much lighter and comfortable.
The earphones are really good and dont go inside your ears.
The downside of the Rift is the ridiculous terms and conditions, the way their service is always connected to them, monitoring how you use your PC.
Also I tried Elite Dangerous on my Vive and its a jagged ugly mess. Reading online, it seems I am not alone and the actual reason for it is not known.
People on the Rift are reporting a superb experience.

HTC customer support so far has been terrible, a week has passed since I asked for support.
Its taken 3 messages on their website (they dont do email) before I got a response.
They got back to me after a week and ignored everything I told them, which was entered on their website where they restrict the number of characters such that I couldnt fully explain the problem.
Despite spending ages forming and formatting my support request, they completely ignored it.

Theres more that is bad, I wont bore you.
Not... at... all... impressed.
 

RangerXML

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Apr 16, 2006
Messages
6,387
The Vive definitely feels more like a dev kit then the Rift, but the lenses in both are just trying to polish shit, its just that the Vive tries to shove more features down our throats which it can't fit into as sleek of a package as the Rift. For first generation devices, both do what they advertise to do and that is give you a VR experience, but for how long we've been waiting and the reasons we were given for the wait, the first wave really is disappointing (especially with the hype they build up and the zealous fanboys at every turn).
 

Ryan7968

Limp Gawd
Joined
Sep 2, 2004
Messages
301
It took over a month for my order to be processed. Believe me, in that time I had strong considerations to cancel and not dive into VR at this time whether we are talking Vive or Rift.

In the end I let it go through, and now it is set to be delivered Monday.
 

Gatecrasher3000

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 18, 2013
Messages
329
Yeahhh after reading tons of forum posts from Rift/Vive owners I'm glad I sat generation 1 out. I mean I owned a DK2, and it was fun, but after using the DK2 I could tell there is a long way to go, and even CV1/Vive were not going to hit the mark this time. 4k screens and maybe one AA game, then I think things will really take off, until then.
Total props to you guys though for going for it and showing other manufactures there is a market for these things.
 

dr.stevil

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Sep 26, 2008
Messages
9,119
vive is set to arrive tomorrow (although, I'm actually guessing it will be Monday instead)

I can't wait! Super pumped
 

Nenu

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Messages
19,379
Thought I'd give you a headsup on my problems cancelling the order.

Tech support didnt respond to my support requests so I informed them I would return it if they didnt get back to me.
Again, no response.

I used the online cancellation method and received 3 emails.
2 saying the same thing, my cancellation request and a reference number.
The 3rd:
Dear Customer,
Please find below the answer to your request ([my ref number]). To reopen this request, reply to this email.

There was no other information except a question whether the response was satisfactory.
I emailed back asking for the address to return the Vive to because one isnt provided during the cancellation process and asked another question.

I got the same email again.
I checked the email source code in case something was hidden from me, no links, no hidden information.
I emailed back telling them that they havent provided any information for either question.
Got the same canned response again.
So I emailed complaints@htc.com, support@htc.com and the same email address again stating I cannot return the Vive unless they answer me.
Got the same canned response and the complaints email bounced.
Interestingly the support one didnt.

At this point I didnt know what to do.
Then I remembered seeing a phone number in the first response from creating the original support case.
So I called that and was left hanging on the phone with the message "...your call is very important to us, we will be with you as soon as we can".
I waited 20 minutes and gave up.


No part of their support system works.
fyi

I have 2 weeks from now to complete the return.
If they dont let me know where to return it I will inform my bank and see if they agree to take it up with them and re-imburse my card.
ffs
 

Ryan7968

Limp Gawd
Joined
Sep 2, 2004
Messages
301
My Vive was sitting in the box for 24 hours before attempting the setup, after all this anticipation I never thought that would be the case. Work, DOOM and me feeling a bit under the weather were the reasons though not lack of excitement.

My gaming PC is in the basement, and I have a fairly good area of space around the PC to work with down there. Ceilings are for the most part around 92" high, some spots at the edge of the play area are only ~81". So not a ton of reaching up and that is the only drawback to my basement setup. Got lucky with wall stud placement, I have the lighthouses at almost the max 5 meters between them. Ran the lighthouse sync cable for good measure. I can see why people would complain about the setup, but that is mostly because people are whiners. Seriously we are talking drilling 4 holes into the walls for a good mounting solution. I admit my basement setup is rather ideal for this and I also had 24 hours to consider my attack plan but it was a rather straightforward setup.

I had to unplug the HDMI cable from my GPU to my receiver in order to hook up the Vive, could have swore my cards had at least two HDMI but nope it is 3 displayports and 1 HDMI. I'm going to buy a displayport to mini displayport cable so I can use that for the Vive and continue using HDMI for my 5.1 audio (using headphones while wearing the Vive though, the included earbuds kept falling out).

Never tried VR ever, the setup tells you to put on the headset and you find yourself in that big white room with some familiar valve / aperture science touches. It was immersive immediately, I was doing the silly tutorial and at the part with the balloons I was batting them around, I jumped up to smack one as it floated away and hit the controller into the ceiling. Less than 5 minutes in and I am already forgetting about the physical room I am standing in, amazing.

I bought Audioshield, downloaded The Lab of course, and it came with Tilt Brush, Fantastic Contraption and Job Simulator. I've been eyeballing Holopoint and the Space Pirate one, I'll probably end up buying both. For seated I have Elite with a full CH Products HOTAS / pedals, have not tried that yet. I have a Thrustmaster TX for Project Cars and any other driving games, haven't tried that yet either. Plenty of software and hardware to take advantage of this thing, I am very glad I have it in my arsenal of expensive PC gaming related toys.

SDE or pixels were not a problem for me or I did not find them to be a bother. Focus and blurriness were the more troublesome aspects of the display but I hope to mitigate that with finding a sweet spot for wearing the thing.

Still very early and I am in the honeymoon phase, but I do not regret my order and I feel like this display and this tech pairs nicely with my gaming PC. They'll come out with better headsets, but I'll need a better PC to use them. I'll worry about that down the line and enjoy what I have right now.
 

shansoft

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Oct 20, 2008
Messages
5,076
I disagree.
The Vive isnt fit for sale.
The amount of image in focus is tiny and the blur level is different for each eye.
You can clearly see the fresnel rings and there is serious streaking.
It is very hard to read text because you need to view it dead centre and move your head to track each word.
The front weight is so high I have to strap it on tight otherwise it moves which makes its very uncomfortable and leaves bad face imprints.
The earphones keep falling out and are painful to use.

I'm shocked how bad this is.
I have tried the Rift and its a world apart, a much better headset. A larger view in focus, no streaking that I remember, its much lighter and comfortable.
The earphones are really good and dont go inside your ears.
The downside of the Rift is the ridiculous terms and conditions, the way their service is always connected to them, monitoring how you use your PC.
Also I tried Elite Dangerous on my Vive and its a jagged ugly mess. Reading online, it seems I am not alone and the actual reason for it is not known.
People on the Rift are reporting a superb experience.

HTC customer support so far has been terrible, a week has passed since I asked for support.
Its taken 3 messages on their website (they dont do email) before I got a response.
They got back to me after a week and ignored everything I told them, which was entered on their website where they restrict the number of characters such that I couldnt fully explain the problem.
Despite spending ages forming and formatting my support request, they completely ignored it.

Theres more that is bad, I wont bore you.
Not... at... all... impressed.

Rift is uncomfortable for me, Vive is much better with my glasses and relax on my head better.

Both of them have pixel issues. Elite Dangerous is equally bad on both experience. I can clearly see the pixel on both setup, especially Rift has weird glowing thing for me, which is weird.

Overall, Vive for me has much better experience and easier to plug and play. The pixel problem really turns me off for the VR Platform, I dont think it will be solve anytime soon.

I am more leaning toward to return for refund, but doubt I can after opening the box...
 

dr.stevil

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Sep 26, 2008
Messages
9,119
Thought I'd give you a headsup on my problems cancelling the order.

Tech support didnt respond to my support requests so I informed them I would return it if they didnt get back to me.
Again, no response.

I used the online cancellation method and received 3 emails.
2 saying the same thing, my cancellation request and a reference number.
The 3rd:
Dear Customer,
Please find below the answer to your request ([my ref number]). To reopen this request, reply to this email.

There was no other information except a question whether the response was satisfactory.
I emailed back asking for the address to return the Vive to because one isnt provided during the cancellation process and asked another question.

I got the same email again.
I checked the email source code in case something was hidden from me, no links, no hidden information.
I emailed back telling them that they havent provided any information for either question.
Got the same canned response again.
So I emailed complaints@htc.com, support@htc.com and the same email address again stating I cannot return the Vive unless they answer me.
Got the same canned response and the complaints email bounced.
Interestingly the support one didnt.

At this point I didnt know what to do.
Then I remembered seeing a phone number in the first response from creating the original support case.
So I called that and was left hanging on the phone with the message "...your call is very important to us, we will be with you as soon as we can".
I waited 20 minutes and gave up.


No part of their support system works.
fyi

I have 2 weeks from now to complete the return.
If they dont let me know where to return it I will inform my bank and see if they agree to take it up with them and re-imburse my card.
ffs

sell it on ebay and make a few dollars

HTC had to stop taking orders because they can't make them fast enough. You'll be sure to make a few dollars I'd think.
 

dr.stevil

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Sep 26, 2008
Messages
9,119
So my Vive was supposed to come on Saturday and I missed the delivery. To add insult to injury, not only did I miss out on playing around with it all weekend, but FedEx home delivery isn't even open on Monday, so now have to wait until tomorrow lol
Still excited though
 

qwidmeyer

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 24, 2009
Messages
78
Rift is uncomfortable for me, Vive is much better with my glasses and relax on my head better.

Both of them have pixel issues. Elite Dangerous is equally bad on both experience. I can clearly see the pixel on both setup, especially Rift has weird glowing thing for me, which is weird.

Overall, Vive for me has much better experience and easier to plug and play. The pixel problem really turns me off for the VR Platform, I dont think it will be solve anytime soon.

I am more leaning toward to return for refund, but doubt I can after opening the box...

Genuine question, why do you feel the Vive is easier to plug and play? Is it in regards to the eye glass issue or something additional?
 

RangerXML

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Apr 16, 2006
Messages
6,387
Rift is easier in my experience from both to just start up, headset on and software pops up and your good to go. With the Vive I started SteamVR and had to turn on the controllers, wait for base stations and controllers to connect and then I was good to go. Rift, it was near instant, Vive it took a minute plus, mind you have to take into account that you have Occulus's always on software in the background.
 

qwidmeyer

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 24, 2009
Messages
78
Rift is easier in my experience from both to just start up, headset on and software pops up and your good to go. With the Vive I started SteamVR and had to turn on the controllers, wait for base stations and controllers to connect and then I was good to go. Rift, it was near instant, Vive it took a minute plus, mind you have to take into account that you have Occulus's always on software in the background.

Which has been my experience as well, I'm trying to understand why they felt the opposite of our experiences. The only thing I can think of is a possible issue with glasses getting stuck or not situated correctly.
 
Joined
May 18, 2016
Messages
6
Vive owners can play Hover Junkers. That is all.

If you don't know what Hover Junkers is, it's an absolutely exhilarating shooter that utilizes the room-scale VR to incredible effect. If you haven't experienced it for yourself, it's hard to explain why it's so amazing. But games like it are the future of VR, and nothing on the Rift comes close.
 

Ryan7968

Limp Gawd
Joined
Sep 2, 2004
Messages
301
Vive owners can play Hover Junkers. That is all.

If you don't know what Hover Junkers is, it's an absolutely exhilarating shooter that utilizes the room-scale VR to incredible effect. If you haven't experienced it for yourself, it's hard to explain why it's so amazing. But games like it are the future of VR, and nothing on the Rift comes close.

I've heard nothing but good things about Hover Junkers but I have not yet picked it up. Today after work I will probably buy HJ and also Final Approach which looks great too.

Hover Junkers looks like a lot of crouching down, ducking behind cover and such. I find it hilarious that I need to stretch and get loose before playing some of these Vive games.
 
Joined
May 18, 2016
Messages
6
I've heard nothing but good things about Hover Junkers but I have not yet picked it up. Today after work I will probably buy HJ and also Final Approach which looks great too.

Hover Junkers looks like a lot of crouching down, ducking behind cover and such. I find it hilarious that I need to stretch and get loose before playing some of these Vive games.
Dooo eeet, games like HJ are what roomscale VR is made for. I too thought the price was a little steep for what is essentially just a multiplayer arena shooter. But it really is a glimpse of what the future of VR gaming is, IMO. Perhaps someday we will look back at HJ as the grandaddy of the genre, like Doom or Quake were for traditional FPS games.
There is a lot of ducking and crouching behind cover, though, yes. It can be quite the workout! Haha.
 

Ryan5508

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 6, 2010
Messages
208
Currently have both setups

If I had to choose to keep only one it would be the vive.

The rift is similar to a new monitor. its cool and interesting, but still basically the same.

The vive and room-scale can make something simple like job simulator interesting and an experience. My wife is not a gamer at all but would of played it for hours and really enjoyed the experience.


They both have a ways to go though. And the vive/steam can be really finicky at times
 

RangerXML

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Apr 16, 2006
Messages
6,387
Rifts latest douche DRM move really kills it for me, I hope the next Vive has a better resolution, easier to run and is lighter (or Razer's offering is good), but I'm done with Oculus.
 

Nenu

[H]ardened
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Apr 28, 2007
Messages
19,379
Thanks, that sucks.
Good job I'm sending mine back.
 

MisterDNA

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Feb 8, 2004
Messages
1,042
I tried the GearVR at Best Buy. It looked good in the demo and I wondered if the 2560x1440 thing would be a problem with my 2160x1200 Vive. No. My Vive was more impressive after I got it to work on my old-ass 2009 Radeon HD 5870 (DP worked; HDMI didn't). This feels like nVidia vs 3dfx all over again with HTC/Valve vs Faceculus. Oh, pretty! "Fuck you! *gutshot*" Why?! I trusted you!
 

Litfod

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jan 3, 2006
Messages
1,462
I finally got around to cancelling my Rift order. Not because of the hardware itself but rather because it's not going to offer anything the Vive doesn't, especially without the controllers, and along with Oculus/Facebook's recent bullshit attitude there's really no incentive to hang on to it. So I'll put the money towards the next generation instead. Or maybe a 1080Ti, if they ever see the light of day.
 

RangerXML

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Apr 16, 2006
Messages
6,387
LMAO, latest REVIVE update makes it easier to pirate actual Oculus games as part of its work around, talk about nuclear option.
 

Litfod

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jan 3, 2006
Messages
1,462
And the next Oculus update will prevent that, and the next Revive update will workaround the new Oculus update and so on and so on.
 

heatshiver

Limp Gawd
Joined
Aug 12, 2011
Messages
211
I was looking at the Rift in the beginning, but when FB snapped it up, I backed off quickly. I am hoping that Microsoft Holo Lens does some (even more) amazing stuff and blows them all out of the water!
 
Joined
May 18, 2016
Messages
6
One other thing to consider is that the Vive is backed by the almighty Gaben and the largest PC game platform on the planet - Steam.
Whereas the Rift is backed by some d-bags who think peripheral DRM is cool and their deflating social network with no real source of sustainable income.

Even if they were identical, I know which one I'd choose.
 

DPI

Nitpick Police
Joined
Apr 20, 2013
Messages
10,960
I am hoping that Microsoft Holo Lens does some (even more) amazing stuff and blows them all out of the water!

Keep dreaming. Devs aren't flocking to Hololens and consumers don't care outside of a handful of zealots.
 

Krixon

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 21, 2015
Messages
371
Keep dreaming. Devs aren't flocking to Hololens and consumers don't care outside of a handful of zealots.

Probably because devs see what MS has done in the past with their new platform initiatives. MS introduced the Windows Tablet in the early 2000's, then gave it no support for years until Apple brought out their iPad, then decided to make the Surface. Windows Mobile was supposed to revolutionize mobile computing. I was almost sold when I saw the MS keynote speaker plug his phone into a monitor and it turned into a full-fledged PC. Glad I didn't jump on that bandwagon.

Hololens might be great, but it also might not. It might revolutionize entertainment, education, and business just like their marketing videos have touted; but it also might be a failure and written off in a few years. It takes a ton of development time and money to invest in a platform like this, so I understand the trepidation around supporting it.
 
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