Quebec judge authorizes class-action lawsuit over 'addictive' Fortnite game

Mr. Bluntman said:
Did someone say... FORTNITE? /trollface



I don't play it because the main audience is literally less than half my age, so yeah, I'm good. But the rhyme at the beginning is at least funny...
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I know more adults that play than kids. Actually, aside from my own kids, I don't know any.

/antipedo
 
auntjemima said:
I know more adults that play than kids. Actually, aside from my own kids, I don't know any.

/antipedo
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That actually surprises me... Everything I have heard points to it being a game played by mostly teenagers. Seems I have been misinformed. Still not playing it, though. It's not exactly my wheelhouse.
 
Mr. Bluntman said:
That actually surprises me... Everything I have heard points to it being a game played by mostly teenagers. Seems I have been misinformed. Still not playing it, though. It's not exactly my wheelhouse.
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Yeah, a lot of adults play it. It's not a kids-only type of gameplay.
 
Mr. Bluntman said:
That actually surprises me... Everything I have heard points to it being a game played by mostly teenagers. Seems I have been misinformed. Still not playing it, though. It's not exactly my wheelhouse.
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It's not for everyone, for sure. A lot of the flak was people hated building, but now them have a no build option.

Games never last more than 25 minutes (can't), so you can jump on and have a quick game when you don't have a lot of time.
 
but many things are addictive to people. Candy / chocolate is addictive, adult film is addictive, coffee is addictive, if this law suit get thru and the parents win, it will create so-called a landmark case for "anything addictive you can sue the manufacturer, and not take any personal responsibility "

However, the other landmark case of some secretary suing co. like Compaq on RSI can be used as ref. On that lawsuit, Compaq and other won, but since then, they put a RSI warning label on the keyboard itself for many years. In the recent years, we no longer see warning RSI label on keyboard, but it shows how absurd law suit can be.

There was news story of teenagers watch so many adult film that they injured their foreskin by doing too many times per day. They even make a movie out of it, does that mean the adult film industry has to pay for foreskin reconstructive surgery?

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2229499/plotsummary?ref_=tt_stry_pl
 
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Happy Hopping said:
but many things are addictive to people. Candy / chocolate is addictive, adult film is addictive, coffee is addictive, if this law suit get thru and the parents win, it will create so-called a landmark case for "anything addictive you can sue the manufacturer, and not take any personal responsibility "

However, the other landmark case of some secretary suing co. like Compaq on RSI can be used as ref. On that lawsuit, Compaq and other won, but since then, they put a RSI warning label on the keyboard itself for many years. In the recent years, we no longer see warning RSI label on keyboard, but it shows how absurd law suit can be.

There was news story of teenagers watch so many adult film that they injured their foreskin by doing too many times per day. They even make a movie out of it, does that mean the adult film industry has to pay for foreskin reconstructive surgery?

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2229499/plotsummary?ref_=tt_stry_pl
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But porn advertisements don’t play on YouTube between baby shark and monkey banana.
 
Lakados said:
But porn advertisements don’t play on YouTube between baby shark and monkey banana.
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I think what causes the issue with fortnite is the possibility to spend money in game, should a card be attached to the account.

Because those shows are also addictive, they just don't have a purchasing element.
 
auntjemima said:
I think what causes the issue with fortnite is the possibility to spend money in game, should a card be attached to the account.

Because those shows are also addictive, they just don't have a purchasing element.
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but Fortnite basic package is free, just like anything else, if it's given to you as is, you can't sue. It's free, nobody makes you to download it, you don't like it, delete it.
 
Happy Hopping said:
but Fortnite basic package is free, just like anything else, if it's given to you as is, you can't sue. It's free, nobody makes you to download it, you don't like it, delete it.
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Oh, for sure. You don't need to pay to get the same experience. But kids see skins and want them. Dances, skins, banners. I don't see the urge, but my kids want them sometimes and I explain that we aren't paying for anything short of the battle pass.
 
Stupid, simple as that..
Why not sue all companies that put sugar in their foods knowing full dam well the level of addiction sugar has?
 
MrGuvernment said:
Stupid, simple as that..
Why not sue all companies that put sugar in their foods knowing full dam well the level of addiction sugar has?
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Funny you should say this, but the "full damn well" isn't as obvious as you think. The government has in the past tried to get some labeling of sugar as such, but the sugar (and similar types) lobbies have very deep pockets and have prevented even the smallest of labeling that states how bad sugar is.
 
sfsuphysics said:
Funny you should say this, but the "full damn well" isn't as obvious as you think. The government has in the past tried to get some labeling of sugar as such, but the sugar (and similar types) lobbies have very deep pockets and have prevented even the smallest of labeling that states how bad sugar is.
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Or maybe it has nothing to do with lobbying and it's just a dumb as fuck idea to label everything addictive and dangerous. If you don't already know suger is bad for you your parents failed hard and there is already no hope for you.

See California Prop 65. EVERYTHING is labeled as cancer causing the labels to become completely pointless and ignored.
 
all these PC games c/w PG-13 warning, don't they? does the PG 13 warning compose of the product being addictive?

in the end, if we need to put that warning on it, then under Federal Constitution law, EVERYTHING should have a warning label of being addictive. And kids won't bother reading those warning label, and adult would know items are addictive.

Having said that, I do wonder why cigarette has health warning label, but sugar, alcohol, etc. has no health warning label
 
vegeta535 said:
Cause they can use a Ipad doesn't make them tech savvy.
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I agree. My niece and nephew can use the crap out of their iphone or ipad but the second they can't connect with WiFi they're calling out to Dad ... who's just as useless at fixing as they are. They know how to play the games and use the apps they want to use. They're faster than I am at navigating through those games and various menus. They can type way faster than I can on those keyboards. But, ask them HOW it works and they're just as useless as their parents. Parents who aren't tech savvy themselves think that being able to whip through menus to get what you want is somehow being smart about technology.
 
Happy Hopping said:
all these PC games c/w PG-13 warning, don't they? does the PG 13 warning compose of the product being addictive?

in the end, if we need to put that warning on it, then under Federal Constitution law, EVERYTHING should have a warning label of being addictive. And kids won't bother reading those warning label, and adult would know items are addictive.

Having said that, I do wonder why cigarette has health warning label, but sugar, alcohol, etc. has no health warning label
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It's only rated 'T' for Violence.
https://www.esrb.org/ratings/34948/fortnite/

All video games release dopamine when playing them, and becoming addicted to dopamine is a very real possibility. This has been implicitly understood for decades. If we were to start including dopamine warnings, then nearly everything in the world would come with them.
 
pacman is addictive and plenty of wrist and hand injuries from that one. It is just fun to hate on fortnite and justify the reasons for it. I just dont want to go down the road of having to test and validate 'addictive nature' of a video game. This is how you will ruin an industry by regulating it into the ground.

For me final fantasy 7 was my addiction, i would leave it on pause when i went to school so i wouldnt lose my spot cuz i didnt get to a save point before i had to get my 4hours of sleep lol

I dunno, the adding warnings to everything just makes me grumpy and eventually you will have to sign and notarize a release of liability to buy a game lol.
 
"Addictive" is a loaded word. That said, game developers who want to ensure that their game is nonaddictive should follow these simple steps:
  1. Concentrate on making the game as boring as possible. This is the most important step. If players find the experience enjoyable and rewarding, they might want to play the game again. Something is very wrong if that happens.
  2. Add an aversive stimulus. This could be a combination of audio and visual effects that induces nausea or causes a splitting headache, for example. Whatever it is, the key is that it's unpleasant enough to be memorable.
 
sharknice said:
Or maybe it has nothing to do with lobbying and it's just a dumb as fuck idea to label everything addictive and dangerous. If you don't already know suger is bad for you your parents failed hard and there is already no hope for you.
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Yeah but why do you parents think sugar is bad for you? At most because they think it rots your teeth and makes you fat if you eat too much, they probably care more about the fact it can make kids hyper, I doubt anyone is really putting the pieces together to find out how addictive it really is. I agree, labeling everything as addictive because some people "can't hold their shit together" (or whatever) is bad, but addiction is a very real thing and maybe one day we'll medically be at a point to let people know that they are more predisposed to addictive behavior than others in the same way someone can be told "yeah you're diabetic so watch your intake of sugars" so I see no problem doing research now to find out what things are addictive whether it's universally addictive like tobacco, opioids, ... and perhaps sugar, or if it's something like alcohol where if you are moderated in your usage and not genetically predisposed addiction won't be there.

FYI, I think this lawsuit is stupid and hope it gets thrown out, but I absolutely believe there are addictive qualities to games and some more so than others, and parents maybe don't realize just how much so.
 
sfsuphysics said:
Yeah but why do you parents think sugar is bad for you? At most because they think it rots your teeth and makes you fat if you eat too much, they probably care more about the fact it can make kids hyper, I doubt anyone is really putting the pieces together to find out how addictive it really is. I agree, labeling everything as addictive because some people "can't hold their shit together" (or whatever) is bad, but addiction is a very real thing and maybe one day we'll medically be at a point to let people know that they are more predisposed to addictive behavior than others in the same way someone can be told "yeah you're diabetic so watch your intake of sugars" so I see no problem doing research now to find out what things are addictive whether it's universally addictive like tobacco, opioids, ... and perhaps sugar, or if it's something like alcohol where if you are moderated in your usage and not genetically predisposed addiction won't be there.

FYI, I think this lawsuit is stupid and hope it gets thrown out, but I absolutely believe there are addictive qualities to games and some more so than others, and parents maybe don't realize just how much so.
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Not really thrown out, the lawsuit was filed in 2019 the courts have spent the last 3 years reviewing it to very there was enough merit for it to go to trial. So the chance to throw it out is already passed.

This trial is based on a few Canadian laws regarding the advertisement of addictive substances to Minors. Not weather or not it is addictive or the ramifications of that. But the fact they hired people and in their own words have tried to make it as addictive as possible probably does break those laws, it won’t require Epic to do anything but change how they advertise the game in Canada. A few years too late at this stage though because really who doesn’t know what Fortnight is at this point word of mouth does as good if not better than any ad spots they count run right now. What this will do is severely effect the next Fortnight, as they will have a trickier time navigating who and where they can advertise too.
 
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Zarathustra[H] said:
I tend to agree.

I'm just illustrating that this is what can happen even without intentional design for addiction.

With it, things get worse.

If we as a society are starting to hold casinos responsible for gaming addiction, maybe, just maybe, there is a case to go after those who try intentionally try to use psychology in order to make their games as addictive as possible, especially when there are financial consequences and if kids are involved.
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The problemn is that as a society we no longer vie humans as being capable and hold ourselves accouantable for our own actions. We now always look for Big Brother to baby sit us,
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
On the one hand this is ridiculous, but on the other we known for over a decade now that video game developers have been hiring psychologists to intentionally make their games as addictive as possible and then targeting kids with them.

It started with stupid basic flash-style games, but then moved on to bigger and more pervasive titles like free-to-play multiplayer titles with loot boxes and microtransactions.

Most people can probably resist, but there are ainority who will be completely unable to, and it can ruin lives.

Back when I was in college I saw so many of the kids on my Counter-Strike servers get so addicted to the game they failed and dropped out, and that was before this practice started. It's probably way way worse today. Kids outside of parental supervision for the first time in their lives, completely addicted to games, with no one to force them to take their worm seriously, etc.
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You know, I was about to storm on this thread and basically say that this is just a case of bad parenting and that these are ambulance-chaser type lawyers, but then I read your post.

I started gaming with the N64 back in the 90's and honestly when it came to playing my first game (Mario 64) as an elementary-school kid I was probably addicted. I would play for long hours until I was flipping out from frustration and then dream about it at night time. I basically gave up doing regular kid-stuff outdoors and Mario 64 basically became my life and I became increasingly anti-social. My parents would take the console away from me regularly and do things like limit my time on it and they definitely seemed a lot more worried about how preoccupied I was with it than I was.

But that being said, over time it stabilized. I played many, many games after Mario 64 but nothing really sucked me in to the same degree and over time, my pre-occupation with gaming became less and less of something that I struggled to control. I found new friends that enjoyed playing the same games and gaming kind of became a normal hobby for me. For me, gaming was (and still is) the thing that I do to relax where most other people do stuff like watch TV. It doesn't consume me and it doesn't interfere negatively with my other responsibilities in life. I know that there are people out there with addictions to gaming, but it always seemed to me like it was more a problem with the person and not the games, themselves.

That being said, I have to admit that I am a person that deliberately still lives my life in the 90's. I mainly play retro games and I have avoided like the plague anything that involves micro-transactions or even excessive DLC mainly because the notion disgusts me. I see the direction that technology has been going in the last 15 years and it is just not pro-human anymore and that is a big part of why I am deliberately living in the past as much as possible. New technologies used to be things that made life better or healthier but in the last decade or so every new gadget or social media platform has basically made us more dependent, more controlled, less social, less natural, more zombie-like or less healthy than we were before. I mean, even the creators of facebook admitted that it was developed to "exploit" the human psyche with targetted dopamine hits, etc and that was before smartphones and tablets took over everything.

As a result, I get it that my notion of gaming addiction as it applied to Mario 64 is probably 4 or 5 on a scale of 100 where today's kids are dealing with heavily optimized psychological manipulation that sits probably like at an 80 or 90. It's kind of like Marijuana and just how much more potent and addictive that it has become over the years due to heavy genetic modification. I am like that hippy from the 60's that hasn't clued into the changes that have occurred in the world. I think that we all maybe need to recognize that what kids are dealing with today could be in a whole different league of potential harm compared to what we had to deal with when we were that age...

I honestly believe that at some point we are all going to need to take a step back and ask if current entertainment, gadgets and social media is really worth being a part of anymore when it is becoming so potentially harmful. Maybe jumping back into the 90's and giving our kids our old Game Boys to play isn't such a bad idea anymore...
 
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