Pump turns on bit isn't moving liquid

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
Hi all,

I was able to run a test loop with distilled water. Then I installed all my components. Now the pump turns on fine but it's not pushing any liquid. Any ideas?

Thanks.

EDIT: pump isn't turning on at all.

EDIT: tried to plug the pump directly in mobo and directly to PSU. No power either way.

Third Edit: powered just the pump using 2 pin to molex. Looks like is getting a bit of power but not enough to pump.
 

Attachments

  • IMG_1628.jpg
    IMG_1628.jpg
    57.4 KB · Views: 0
Last edited:
Joined
Nov 13, 2006
Messages
3,223
Sounds like either a failed motor or impeller. Can happen if you get an air pocket in your loop around the pump and it can't prime. Gotta be careful as a pump can fail pretty fast if run dry without liquid to push. Not saying you ran it dry, just a tip for others.

Looks like you have one of those slab reservoirs with a built in pump. Gets a bit messy to replace the pump when it isn't a separate/self-contained unit.

I typically use a stand-alone bench power supply to power up and test my water pump when first installing and filling a loop - have more control over the pump that way.
 
Last edited:

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
Damn, ok. Now its powering just fine but still isnt pumping. I have no idea it could have dry pumped. I specifically filled the res before I powered it. Now I have to figure out what kind of pump this is to replace. I think this is my first and last time experimenting with water.
 
Joined
Nov 13, 2006
Messages
3,223
Can't tell from your pic, but do you have the inlet/outlet ports of the pump/reservoir configured properly? Sometimes there are also knockout plugs that have to be removed. Could also be that you simply have a bit of debris in the pump/impeller that jammed it up. (Easy to fix once you open up the connections and/or disassemble the pump housing and have a look - it doesn't typically really hurt the motor/impeller as long as it doesn't run that way for a long time.) Regardless, you'll need to do some tinkering/inspection to find out.
 

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
So the propeller is spinning for sure. I can see it spin. I have no idea why it doesn't pump. Guess I have to drain and reassemble.
 
Joined
Nov 13, 2006
Messages
3,223
So the propeller is spinning for sure. I can see it spin. I have no idea why it doesn't pump. Guess I have to drain and reassemble.
It's not a plane Thug. There is no prop. Are you talking about a flow indicator? A pump's impeller is typically inside a housing and not visible. What brand/model of water setup are we talking about here?

Have you looked a the polarity of your wires - perhaps they were installed into your connectors wrong?
 
Last edited:

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
It's not a plane Thug. There is no prop. Are you talking about a flow indicator? A pump's impeller is typically inside a housing and not visible. What brand/model of water setup are we talking about here?

Have you looked a the polarity of your wires - perhaps they were installed into your connectors wrong?

This is the Bitspower pre-built so I'm not even sure about the pump model. Yes, I was referring to the flow indicator.
 
Joined
Nov 13, 2006
Messages
3,223
I've never like pre-built/AIO water cooling setups. When stuff goes wrong it is a pain to work on and you can't simply swap out or replace a given component easily with something else. Really sounds like you either have a bad or reversed electrical connection or perhaps some debris in your pump's impeller housing gumming things up.
 
Last edited:

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
Took the pump out to examine it. Nothing outwardly wrong with it. Re-installed the pump. Now I can't get the loop to hold any air pressure to do my leak test before firing it up again. Definitely not worth the hassle. Expensive lesson learned.
 

hititnquitit

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Apr 16, 2018
Messages
1,136
If the pump is the only thing you pulled thats probably where the leak is coming from. Pull it back off. Take your time and make sure you reinstall it completely flat so the oring stays in place. Tighten down the four screws evenly in a criss cross pattern, like a car wheel or a heatsink. Make sure there arent any cracks in the plastic housing.
 

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
If the pump is the only thing you pulled thats probably where the leak is coming from. Pull it back off. Take your time and make sure you reinstall it completely flat so the oring stays in place. Tighten down the four screws evenly in a criss cross pattern, like a car wheel or a heatsink. Make sure there arent any cracks in the plastic housing.

I stripped the screws and the thing is leaking more water than the titanic. I have myself a very heavy paperweight at this point.
 

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
just the heads are stripped. I got 2 out of 4 out but the other two are not budging.

I spent the last two hours trying to figure out what pump would be compatible and have found absolutely nothing.
 

Nobu

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jun 7, 2007
Messages
6,422
just the heads are stripped. I got 2 out of 4 out but the other two are not budging.

I spent the last two hours trying to figure out what pump would be compatible and have found absolutely nothing.
It should be a DDC (or a similar design) pump if it has a square body. D5 pumps are usually only used alone or with tube reservoirs, with very few exceptions. There are a few other variations, but they're typically used in very space constrained products, so a DDC would be more likely.
 

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
It should be a DDC (or a similar design) pump if it has a square body. D5 pumps are usually only used alone or with tube reservoirs, with very few exceptions. There are a few other variations, but they're typically used in very space constrained products, so a DDC would be more likely.
can you recommend any? I honestly cannot find anything that looks like the same form factor.
 

hititnquitit

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Apr 16, 2018
Messages
1,136
Thats a heatsink for the ddc pump. Not a bad idea to get one but not needed. Go to performance-pcs.com and check out the ddc pwm pumps. Your looking at $70 to $80. Avoid the cheap 310s, they are underpowered junk. You will be taking the top off of the pump (leaving you with the pump head) to mount it to your distro plate. So dont let the pictures confuse you. What you have connected to your dp now is referred to as the pump head. You will have to contact either bitspower or the place you bought your plate from to get some replacement screws or figure out what size you need at the hardware store. They have to match what you have exactly or you can fuck up your dp permanently and end up with leaks again. The screws that come with the new pump won't fit.
 

termite

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Aug 27, 2004
Messages
5,616
If the screws that were holding the pump to the res ended up stripped, then they were too tight.

The pump does not need to be torqued down to the res, or pump housing or whatever, in fact if it was that tight to start with then that could have been the source of the problem.

Over tightening the pump mount can cause the impeller to touch the front of the res/top etc, at best it impairs the pump, at worst it just sits there and does not spin.

Also, double check with Bitspower what pump they use, it should be in the documentation or the website, some vendors have "DDC-like" pumps they include with res/pump combos, sameish form factor, but not a DDC.
 

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
If the screws that were holding the pump to the res ended up stripped, then they were too tight.

The pump does not need to be torqued down to the res, or pump housing or whatever, in fact if it was that tight to start with then that could have been the source of the problem.

Over tightening the pump mount can cause the impeller to touch the front of the res/top etc, at best it impairs the pump, at worst it just sits there and does not spin.

Also, double check with Bitspower what pump they use, it should be in the documentation or the website, some vendors have "DDC-like" pumps they include with res/pump combos, sameish form factor, but not a DDC.
Thanks for the info. Is it possible that the pump is still functional and was not spinning due to the over tightening?
 
Joined
Nov 13, 2006
Messages
3,223
Thanks for the info. Is it possible that the pump is still functional and was not spinning due to the over tightening?
Yes, very much so. Most water pumps are designed to use magnetic induction to drive the impeller - there is no direct drive shaft. Bottom line, if the impeller is stuck or being bound, and you get it unstuck, then it should work again.
 

hititnquitit

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Apr 16, 2018
Messages
1,136
Termites right on. You likely just needed to loosen up the screws to allow it to spin freely again. The gasket was/is also probably crushed against the distro plate which caused it to leak so bad.
So when you get the replacement screws (or if your handy with a hack saw or dremel you may be able to cut slots into your existing screws) go easy when you tighten them back down. And double check that your gasket isnt damaged or pushed out of place.
 
Joined
Dec 5, 2014
Messages
40
Try using a rubber band between the screw head and the screw driver tip. Sometimes, that will give you just enough grip to get the screw out on last lime.
 

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
You guys are a wealth of knowledge. Thank you all.

The odd thing is that I didn't see a gasket between the casing that holds the pump and where it makes contact with the distro plate. There is a gasket in the interior of plate where the water flows (or should flow) into the area with the flow meter before entering the pipe.

I'm going to try the rubberband method.
 

hititnquitit

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Apr 16, 2018
Messages
1,136
Theres a round gasket thats part of the pump. That should seal against the distro plate but im just going off of how ddc pumps are mounted to reservoirs and tops. Im not familiar with your dp so it may have another gasket that seals the pump to it.
If you have a screwdriver with bits you can also use a dab of super glue(gel is easiest) to stick the appropriate sized phillips head bit to the screw and try that to get the screw out. Just dont use to much or itll be a pita to clean off.
 

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
Theres a round gasket thats part of the pump. That should seal against the distro plate but im just going off of how ddc pumps are mounted to reservoirs and tops. Im not familiar with your dp so it may have another gasket that seals the pump to it.
If you have a screwdriver with bits you can also use a dab of super glue(gel is easiest) to stick the appropriate sized phillips head bit to the screw and try that to get the screw out. Just dont use to much or itll be a pita to clean off.

Thanks for the tip. So should I add a dab of superglue then insert the screwdriver immediately and hold in place to allow the glue to dry around the screwdriver bit?
 

termite

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Aug 27, 2004
Messages
5,616
Thanks for the info. Is it possible that the pump is still functional and was not spinning due to the over tightening?

Very possible.

Just finger tight. Which I know is ridiculously case by case depending on the person.

When I re/install a pump to a res or top, I would add just enough coolant for the pump to not run dry, then power it up to make sure the pump will spin, before doing the first full fill. Just shut it off as soon as it spins up.

If it is too tight, it will either not spin at all, or will spin and you can hear an odd hiss/whine. If that is case, you can back off each screw a touch, then power back up.

I am using the EK FLT with DDC, and it is shocking how loose the screws need to be.

For the stripped phillips, you can also put some tissue paper between the bit and the screw. Sounds odd, but it can add enough bite to get the screw turning.
 

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
Very possible.

Just finger tight. Which I know is ridiculously case by case depending on the person.

When I re/install a pump to a res or top, I would add just enough coolant for the pump to not run dry, then power it up to make sure the pump will spin, before doing the first full fill. Just shut it off as soon as it spins up.

If it is too tight, it will either not spin at all, or will spin and you can hear an odd hiss/whine. If that is case, you can back off each screw a touch, then power back up.

I am using the EK FLT with DDC, and it is shocking how loose the screws need to be.

For the stripped phillips, you can also put some tissue paper between the bit and the screw. Sounds odd, but it can add enough bite to get the screw turning.
Thanks again termite. By the way, bitspower thinks the pump is not pumping because of the liquid, which doesn't make much sense to it as the XSPC solution does not appear to be any more viscous than water.
 

termite

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Aug 27, 2004
Messages
5,616
Thanks again termite. By the way, bitspower thinks the pump is not pumping because of the liquid, which doesn't make much sense to it as the XSPC solution does not appear to be any more viscous than water.

Well yes, it surely can't be their product.

One test you could do is remove any connections but one in and one out, closest to the pump. Fill up enough to cover the pump and run it. See if it is moving anything at all. Like literally a mini loop.

I have had vertically mounted DDC vapor lock where they will spin but not pump. Just takes a good air bubble to sit in the in hole in the impeller. However, usually those would pop out with some shaking/rolling of the case.

Also, once you get the pump running double check your tube runs. Double check that you do not have a run that is not dumping into the wrong channel of the distro. i.e. distro plate or not, there should be a flow path from start to finish, if one in if flipped with an out, then you can have a situation where the pump is working against itself. For a sanity check if nothing else.
 

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
Well yes, it surely can't be their product.

One test you could do is remove any connections but one in and one out, closest to the pump. Fill up enough to cover the pump and run it. See if it is moving anything at all. Like literally a mini loop.

I have had vertically mounted DDC vapor lock where they will spin but not pump. Just takes a good air bubble to sit in the in hole in the impeller. However, usually those would pop out with some shaking/rolling of the case.

Also, once you get the pump running double check your tube runs. Double check that you do not have a run that is not dumping into the wrong channel of the distro. i.e. distro plate or not, there should be a flow path from start to finish, if one in if flipped with an out, then you can have a situation where the pump is working against itself. For a sanity check if nothing else.

Fortunately, the Bitspower titan is pretty idiot proof in this regard. I'm only running tubes to the CPU (no water for the GPU) and there is only 1 way / port that each tube will run to.
 

termite

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Aug 27, 2004
Messages
5,616
Fortunately, the Bitspower titan is pretty idiot proof in this regard. I'm only running tubes to the CPU (no water for the GPU) and there is only 1 way / port that each tube will run to.

Right, one of the Bitspower titan type kits.

Do you have a picture of the backside of the plate when it was filled?

Because the pic in your OP looks off, the channel that I would assume is the out for the pump, is empty even though the coolant level is above the pump. The pump, when not running, should allow fluid to flow through it, the coolant "should" level itself, at least above the pump. It just looks off. Like, I was to troubleshoot, just from that picture, I would assume one of the lower channels has a plug, where it shouldn't.

I am absolutely not familiar with that system though.
 

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
Right, one of the Bitspower titan type kits.

Do you have a picture of the backside of the plate when it was filled?

Because the pic in your OP looks off, the channel that I would assume is the out for the pump, is empty even though the coolant level is above the pump. The pump, when not running, should allow fluid to flow through it, the coolant "should" level itself, at least above the pump. It just looks off. Like, I was to troubleshoot, just from that picture, I would assume one of the lower channels has a plug, where it shouldn't.

I am absolutely not familiar with that system though.

Oh my lord, I removed the right angle fittings that are for the video card. Could that have caused the issue? I can't fill is up now because of the leak but can you tell which chamber shouldn't be plugged? If not, I can tray to duct tape and fill the plate.
 

Attachments

  • Capture.PNG
    Capture.PNG
    167.9 KB · Views: 0
  • IMG_1633.jpg
    IMG_1633.jpg
    126 KB · Views: 0

Nobu

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jun 7, 2007
Messages
6,422
Yeah, from that graphic, looks like the cpu and gpu are ran in series, so that short section of tubing is required if you don't have a gpu in the loop.
 

jerry8169

Limp Gawd
Joined
Nov 1, 2020
Messages
226
I had to put a short hop in my distro plate before I had my gpu in the loop. It was close enough I just used 2 90s and they met up. If yours wants a bit more room, then a couple of 90s, or a couple of straight fittings, and just use some soft tube to make a loop. Hopefully your distro plate uses standard fitting sizes so you can easily get them if you don't have them already.You can see that this run I highlighted in blue doesn't have a flow path, so you need to get that going again.
 

Attachments

  • Inkedditroplate_LI.jpg
    Inkedditroplate_LI.jpg
    781.8 KB · Views: 0

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
Yeah, from that graphic, looks like the cpu and gpu are ran in series, so that short section of tubing is required if you don't have a gpu in the loop.

Yikes. Thank you. I have some hardline tubes and compression fittings. I will connect the gpu lines.
 

Corporate Thug

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2021
Messages
74
I had to put a short hop in my distro plate before I had my gpu in the loop. It was close enough I just used 2 90s and they met up. If yours wants a bit more room, then a couple of 90s, or a couple of straight fittings, and just use some soft tube to make a loop. Hopefully your distro plate uses standard fitting sizes so you can easily get them if you don't have them already.You can see that this run I highlighted in blue doesn't have a flow path, so you need to get that going again.
Thank you Jerry. This makes sense. Can you tell me how you connected your 2 90s? I have some spare tubing and it will be easy to make a small cut but I’m just curious if there is another way.
 

jerry8169

Limp Gawd
Joined
Nov 1, 2020
Messages
226
Thank you Jerry. This makes sense. Can you tell me how you connected your 2 90s? I have some spare tubing and it will be easy to make a small cut but I’m just curious if there is another way.
Mine was close enough the 2 90s touched, so I just connected them to each other. That was before I added the gpu to the loop, now all the runs are connected to things for me. This is the EK distro plate for the front of a Lian Li 011XL case that I'm using.
 

Attachments

  • 20210131_214708.jpg
    20210131_214708.jpg
    242.5 KB · Views: 0
  • 20210131_214722.jpg
    20210131_214722.jpg
    241.3 KB · Views: 0
Top