*Planning* an extremely low-budget mod... need some input

S

starhawk

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Oct 4, 2004
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Hello all... it's been a really long time since I've been on this forum :D

Gots me a question for ya'll though. I hope ya'll are willing to pardon my long post, but it's by necessity.

I'm thinking of building a custom SFF system for a friend's work compy. The friend has their own private business... running from a Dell PC so old that I "sorta recently" (6+ months ago) upgraded it to have a combo drive! (It originally had a CD-ROM drive in it.) Sad, I know...

Well, I feel bad that this person doesn't have a good compy to use, so I thought I'd build them something of an upgrade... what I'm picturing is not exactly spectacular, but I think it'll do. I'm going to give it to them at Christmas this year.

Here are my objectives, in order of highest priority to lowest priority...
(1) Cheap as dirt.
(2) Functional for what the person needs... word processing, email, and some low-demand Internet use... the most demanding thing I expect this machine to be handling is YouTube.
(3) Appearance.

Since I'm somewhere between dirt poor and flat broke, I'm looking for the cheapest parts possible. If anyone here has something better than what I've picked out and is willing to trade with me, post and ask... I haven't much money, but I've quite a pile of junky old hardware that I'll part with for this cause.

The case will be made of wood, because (a) I have a ready supply of it and (b) it looks really nice when you stain it right... which is what I'm gonna do.

What I've picked out for the innards is as follows:

[PSU] Just purchased a Newton Power 160W PSU. Sounds like they only come from Gateway computers (at least that's what Google sez) but it'll do quite well, methinks. Gotta be better than that Allied tin can, amirite?
[MOBO] Intel D945GCLF Mini-ITX board. Second-cheapest worthwhile Mini-ITX mainboard on eBay, although I haven't ordered it yet.
[CPU] Built into the mobo. It's a 1.6GHz Atom.
[RAM] http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148240 Yes, at this point I could buy two... but I'm too cheap.
[HDD] Since I decided to finally give up on the Never Built Mod, I decided to use the HDD from that -- it's a 160GB WD1600SB (Caviar RE series). No SATA in this thing.
[ODD] A mod I never completed (as of a couple years ago) has a nice drive that I'll use here... it's an NEC ND-3550A and it reads & writes anything that is round and shiny :D
[FDD] Floppy disks will be alien to this build.
[GFX] Built into the mobo. Yes, integrated graphics. Oh, the horror! :p
[FAN] http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835150007 Just one, please, as an intake. (Passive exhaust on this design.)
[OS] I've got an "upgrade" copy of WinXP, retail box, never used... and a Win98 CD to upgrade from, from Heaven Only Knows Where.

I will be using flat ribbon cables since I already have them and they outnumber the population of my house 2:1 at least (3 people + 2 cats, 10+ ribbon cables). The friend already owns an acceptable monitor and keyboard, and I can scrounge a cheap USB mouse if I absolutely have to.

Now... here's the twist in my yarn, if you will. The friend is thinking about jumping on the Mac bandwagon (more $$ than sense IMNSHO... Macs are expensive, essentially not upgradeable, and don't do enough to justify the price)... their reasoning is basically "all my friends have one...". So, by Christmas, this friend *may* (or may not) have a new computer already, and if I go ahead and build my wee beastie as outlined here, I'll need to find it another home.

But I really want to build it :D I've never built a Mini-ITX system before, and I've wanted to for a long time. And that is precisely where you folks come in.

What I want to know is:
(1) Assuming that the build quality is good (ignoring the cheap hardware for a minute) and the case looks nice when I'm done with it, how much money should I expect to get by selling this box?
(2) Does anyone know of a better setup I could build? My current bottom line for this build is a little more than $75 (!) not including the idiot lights and a power switch, which will be salvaged. I don't want to go above $100... but I can go up to that if there's a really good reason.
(3) To answer either question above, do you need more info, and if so, what?

Thanks, ya'll...

[EDIT1] I can't believe I forgot to mention the OS! This problem has been corrected, above.
[EDIT2] Changed mobo to an Intel D945GCLF board, and surrounding comments to fit.
[EDIT3] Different power supply (just purchased) and a *decent* HDD.
 
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I wouldn't expect much from selling it. The Celeron 330 is a single-core Netburst CPU. The fact that it's mini-ITX makes it cool, sure, but I'd think that someone who is disinterested enough in PCs to use a single-core Netburst wouldn't be the person to pay a premium for a mini-ITX version. I know I wouldn't spend $$$ on one of those when I could get a dual core Atom rig with similar performance and much lower power consumption for $250.
 
Even with a snazzy wooden case...?

Well then... can you (or anyone else) recommend a mainboard for less than $50? That's the most I can spend on the mobo...

[EDIT] What about an Intel D945GCLF board? It's at least got a 1.6GHz Atom...

[EDIT2] Made my decision for now... going with the D945GCLF instead of the D201GLY2A board. Changed 1st post to reflect this. Again, if someone wants to recommend something better that's under $50 ($60 if you include shipping) then I won't mind hearing.
 
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Not much better. Via's C7 boards are too expensive, and AMD's Geode was old stuff years ago.
 
Do you mean that there's nothing better out there, or that the new board selection is not much of an improvement?

:confused:
 
starhawk said:
Do you mean that there's nothing better out there, or that the new board selection is not much of an improvement?

:confused:
Click to expand...

Nothing better out there. The desktop Atoms are *decent* enough for what they do. First gen and second gen Atom have almost equivilent performance (due to how Intel handled the FSB for the second gen), and the IGP on both are identical. Except for the useless MPEG2 video acceleration.

Via C7 and later (Nano) are a wee bit faster, but much more expensive. In any other words, not worth it. Also, my recent and old experiences with Via, is their driver support sucks. Hard. Bad to the sewer.
 
That's what I thought you meant. It's 3am where I am... got a few cobwebs in this head o' mine. Gonna sketch out a draft of what this little beastie is gonna look like, and I'll scan it & post it tomorrow after I come to. No worries, I'm an artist -- I know pencil & paper the way most folks around here know hacksaws and Dremels ;)

BTW, while you're here, sir, what do you say to the rest of the hardware I've picked? Have I missed anything?
 
No, you haven't missed anything. Though I'll try to get another Intel build lined up in about...3 min?
I don't like the PSU, but oh, well...
 
Thanks for your help! :D I do appreciate it.

PSU came with an APEX TX-346 case. My only other spare PSU is an Antec True430 PSU, which is very nice, except that the ATX connector is slightly damaged... that, and I think that the fans light up blue, which is not what I'm looking for in this build ;)

EDIT: just saw yer new post... I'm sorry that I wasn't clear before about this, but I've been looking at mobo's with integrated processors for a reason. I can't afford to spend $85 just on the mobo & CPU! (Again, my fault, and I'm sorry for not saying it sooner...)
 
Hey... it's 87usd for a combo that can get at least Crysis running at dead min settings :p

the mobo needs 20A on the 5V line.

Either way, goodnight, fellow mITX'er :) It's getting late, here, too... got work in a few hours.
 
starhawk said:
(2) Functional for what the person needs... word processing, email, and some low-demand Internet use... the most demanding thing I expect this machine to be handling is YouTube.
Click to expand...
Better hope that your friend doesn't want the HD youtube videos. Those older Atom single cores are too slow for that.
starhawk said:
[PSU] I have a spare Allied AL-C300ATX 300W just begging for use. Yes, it came with a case... but it's actually a bit beefy for this application, methinks :cool:
Click to expand...
Yeah, I have some reservations about that PSU as well. Allied is well known for pretty shitty PSUs. It may be a low power system but at the end of the day, that's still a ticking time bomb IMO.

Is the ATX connector on that Antec True430 damaged to the point where it's unusable or unsafe to use?

starhawk said:
(1) Assuming that the build quality is good (ignoring the cheap hardware for a minute) and the case looks nice when I'm done with it, how much money should I expect to get by selling this box?
Click to expand...
$100 at most IMO. You can get faster Netbooks for around $250 give or take these days. You can also get faster Nettops for around $200 these days as well. And by faster, I mean in terms of HDD speed and CPU speed. So if your Christmas plan falls through, you're looking at $100 at most IMO for that kind of setup. Maybe $150 if the case looks really good and the buyer loves the look a lot.
 
Also the board you selected (D945GCLF) doesn't have IDE.
 
Danny Bui said:
Better hope that your friend doesn't want the HD youtube videos. Those older Atom single cores are too slow for that.

Yeah, I have some reservations about that PSU as well. Allied is well known for pretty shitty PSUs. It may be a low power system but at the end of the day, that's still a ticking time bomb IMO.

Is the ATX connector on that Antec True430 damaged to the point where it's unusable or unsafe to use?

$100 at most IMO. You can get faster Netbooks for around $250 give or take these days. You can also get faster Nettops for around $200 these days as well. And by faster, I mean in terms of HDD speed and CPU speed. So if your Christmas plan falls through, you're looking at $100 at most IMO for that kind of setup. Maybe $150 if the case looks really good and the buyer loves the look a lot.
Click to expand...

(1) My friend will not need YouTube HD capability. This is to replace their somewhat prehistoric work computer... they have their own small business in the legal industry and I really don't see that involving lots and lots of YouTube, particularly the HD stuff (that's me yer thinkin' of, not them :D )

(2) All good things must come to an end ;) including PSUs. That said, I'm looking at the Antec True430 right now, and it has three issues which need solving --
(a) the ATX connector has five missing pin shrouds... the connector pins are there, but the little stick-out bits that keep arcs and such from happening are not there. I do have a new connector for it and the tools to put it in, though.
(b) the PSU is untested. I am at least its second owner (possibly third or fourth) as I purchased it on here (for a song, as I recall) some 3+ years ago, and it's never found its way into its intended box.
(c) it looks like it has light-up fans... but I don't know what color the lights are and I'm too lazy to replace the ATX connector just to see if/how it lights up. If it does indeed light up, that would be something to work around.

(3) Considering my bottom line at this point is a little more than $75, I think I'd be OK getting a mere $150 for it. I know that's pocket change to some of ya'll, but to me, that's a small fortune. (We's be poor folks, ya'll.)

...and yes, Virginia, there is an IDE slot ;) :D
 
Pardon my putting two posts in a row, but...

I just realized, I have two Dell Dimension 4600-series desktops sitting right next to me. Both use (according to Teh Internets) a standard ATX PSU.

So I'm gonna test that sucker on a Dell :p

Well, I will after I replace the ATX connector... any tips on that (I've never done it before...) ?

EDIT: Grrr. Aarrgh. I bought my 4-Tool PSU Modding kit from FrozenCPU at least 18 months ago... never used it until now... it is utterly and shamefully worthless. I just left a smoldering review at FrozenCPU[dot]com where I had purchased it, but I don't expect money back since it's been a *long* time since I bought it. BTW, yes, I am using the right tool, and yes, I am using it correctly... or as "correctly" as is possible with this waste of metal.

Looks like the only way I'm going to get the pins off of this ****ing ATX connector is by actually cutting the pin shrouds off, and then prying at the pins with an X-Acto knife (I am not the originator of this trick). Anyone know a good way to get those pin shrouds off...? The connector is made of a good quality plastic and does *not* want to be damaged further (unfortunately for me).
 
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If it's a 1990-2004ish Dell, don't do it. To put it nicely, they screwed around with the standard connector to deliberately burn out any other "non Dell" component. It looks normal, but all the pinouts are different.
 
Look here, plz...

http://en.community.dell.com/support-forums/desktop/f/3514/p/19288392/19531709.aspx
http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/technology/569437/

FWIW, the older Dells (P2 + P3 CPUs) *did* have proprietary PSUs, but they shaped up after a bit. All that's left now is controversy.

That said, if you have a suggestion as to a different computer I could use... here's what I got.

- 2x Dell Dimension 4600's
- 1x Dell Dimension 2600
- 1x Dell Optiplex GX270
... and my own mod, which I will *not* use as a test rig. I don't have the $$$ to spend on a new build just because a PSU puked its life out on my nice machine.

All of that said, I think I'll also call my local computer shop and get their opinion. I'm fairly certain it's an A-OK swap, but I will do my homework. Wouldn't want to fry a computer, even if it is a Dell.
 
Sorry about that, I'm not sure why I thought it didn't have an IDE port. :eek:
 
Still need help w/ ATX connector on PSU, per above.

Any suggestions on how to rip that connector to bits and keep the metal pins intact? Worthless toolkit is worthless :rolleyes:
 
Got a new used PSU here on [H] for about $11 incl. shipping. It will go in this build. I have to say, I'm giddy with excitement -- can't wait to see it IRL and test it!

For the record, it is a Newton Power NPS-160CB-1A. Looks to be a Micro-ATX type, and gooooooooogle informs me that that brand is usually found almost exclusively in Gateway boxes.

Thank you cyberkost! It was truly an honor doing business with you, sir.

EDIT1 -- updating OP to reflect this and one other change -- gonna put a better HDD in it after all.
EDIT2 -- update complete. Would someone kindly re-eval how much this thing's gonna be worth? (I *promise* I'll have a sketch and/or mockup soon.)
 
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