Overclocking has virtually no affect???

S

safehaven

Limp Gawd
Joined
Apr 28, 2008
Messages
224
I have been trying to overclock my eVGA 8600 GTS 256MB. The stock clock speeds are 720/1050. I have bumped up the speeds to 860/1260 via Rivatuner. I find it odd that it is not showing artifacts at that speed, but that is beside the point. I ran a 3DMark06 test on the stock settings and scored a 6379. Then I ran it on the OC settings and only scored a 6393. That is only a 14 point difference.

Does that seem right? I did verify in nTune that the frequency changes were taking affect and they were. So, I don't know, maybe that is right. It just seems odd to me that a 20% gain on both clocks only translates to a 14 point increase in a benchmark test. Heck, I am guessing the I returned the card back to defaults, that I could conceivably get 14 points higher by just running a second test. Any thoughts??
 
try a game, don't look to 3dmark to say anything about the gaming potential of your setup.
 
rennyf77 said:
try a game, don't look to 3dmark to say anything about the gaming potential of your setup.
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Thanks for the tip. Would 3dmark be good enough to check for artifacts? I couldn't get any artifacts, and I am afraid to keep bumping up the clocks. I also was doing the "check for artifacts" function in ATITool, but could not see any artifacts or get any errors there either. In Rivatuner, however, on the memory clock slider, I show an exclamation icon if I try to take it passed 1260. I'm not sure exactly what it means, but I am guessing it means stop there.

I'll fire up Crysis. It is the only modern PC game that I have. Before I OCed my CPU and GPU I could only run in Medium settings. I have now OCed my E6320 from 1.86GHz to 3.26GHz and the GPU to the above settings. I have also installed 4GB of RAM total. Should it now be possible to get some of those settings off of medium?
 
ashmedai said:
Effect not affect.
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Y....e....s. I see that you are correct. I thought once upon a time, back in my high school days, I remembered one of my teachers saying that effect referred to emotions and that you could use the "e" in effect to know that you needed use it in an "e"motional context. Obviously, this is not the case. Thanks for the grammar lesson. <Gee, I hope that everything is grammatically correct this time.>;)
 
14pts increase doesn't sound right.
I'm pretty sure the OC clocks aren't applied when you're running 3Dmark. Thats virtually no different than stock clocks.
Did you try in-game tests using FRAPS?
 
ashmedai said:
Effect not affect.
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thank god your hear to clere that up.:rolleyes:

anyways, back on point:

3D mode vs 2D mode. all modern cards have at least two profiles, one for 3d and another for 2d. IIRC, Riva tuner will allow you to change both, and by default it selects 2D. Make sure you select 3D. Open up the hardware monitor window from Riva Tuner and customize it to display clock speeds both mem and core, and temps (if its drawing the correct values). Run ATI tool artifact scanner or even just the 3D window mode. That will kick your card into 3d Clocks.

And as for scanning for artifacts, ATI tool and Riva tuner is my favorite combo as it allows you to remain on desktop. After you've settled on your CPU and GPU overclocks, I like to run everything at once to try and get everything hitting TDP to see if my system can last.
 
Thats a huge overclock maybe you went too far.

Give stock 2 runs take an average then give 800 2 runs then go up to 860 for 2 runs

your test isn't enough to justify the Affects of your overclock.
 
Getting the exact same benchmarks overclocked is not right, especially given the massive overclock you've attempted. Perhaps your overclock has not been recognized? In fact, that's very likely...

I'd try confirming your GPU overclock settings have been recognized even before benchmarking, much less trying it out on games. I use Everest, but there should be plenty of other utilities out there. Try a slightly smaller overclock and see what happens....

p.s. no idea how trying a game will miraculously confirm that your overclock has worked, when the benchmark indicates it has failed... Sounds like a waste of time, but hey, try it if you want.
 
3dmark is heavily dependent on cpu. If he overclocks his cpu he will see his sm2/3 scores go up with his video card overclocking but for real games its not necessary.
 
I would say that you might be cpu limited, but with your chip that shouldn't be the case.
 
overclocking is not worth it at all. the benfits are so small its totally worthless. cpu overclocking isnt worth it, neither is RAM. the only thing that matters most is your video card that has to be extremely robust. NVIDIA needs to make a more powerful card more powerful than the 9800gx2.
 
Renesis13B said:
3dmark is heavily dependent on cpu. If he overclocks his cpu he will see his sm2/3 scores go up with his video card overclocking but for real games its not necessary.
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Yes but don't see how it's relevant here. The guy thinks he put in a 20%+ GPU overclock. His benchmarks are identical.

Also not sure how he can be CPU limited with a E6320 and with a reather weak GPU like the 8600.
 
Draziom said:
overclocking is not worth it at all. the benfits are so small its totally worthless. cpu overclocking isnt worth it, neither is RAM. the only thing that matters most is your video card that has to be extremely robust. NVIDIA needs to make a more powerful card more powerful than the 9800gx2.
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"not worth it" ? buuut it's free :confused: a slight amount of care & you'll never have reliability problems either :p
 
MrWizard6600 said:
thank god your hear to clere that up.:rolleyes:
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He asked what I thought, and I figured "stfu and overclock more" was too obvious. :D

Seriously though, screw 3Dmark. Anyway, the results from that are probably being affected more by the size of the video memory, which overclocking won't help...
 
MrWizard6600 said:
thank god your hear to clere that up.:rolleyes:

anyways, back on point:

3D mode vs 2D mode. all modern cards have at least two profiles, one for 3d and another for 2d. IIRC, Riva tuner will allow you to change both, and by default it selects 2D. Make sure you select 3D. Open up the hardware monitor window from Riva Tuner and customize it to display clock speeds both mem and core, and temps (if its drawing the correct values). Run ATI tool artifact scanner or even just the 3D window mode. That will kick your card into 3d Clocks.

And as for scanning for artifacts, ATI tool and Riva tuner is my favorite combo as it allows you to remain on desktop. After you've settled on your CPU and GPU overclocks, I like to run everything at once to try and get everything hitting TDP to see if my system can last.
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I was, indeed, adjusting the "3D performance" setting. I also just downloaded GPU-Z and confirmed that the adjustments are taking "E"ffect.

How long during a stress test does it take, on average, before funky things will start showing up if you have gone too far? I have read anywhere from a minute to overnight. Will ATITool actually tell you if there is an error? A couple of times, I saw that it flashed "delta" something across the 3D view window. It was too fast for me to read fully. But when it happens, it resets the timer, but still says "No errors".
 
Draziom said:
overclocking is not worth it at all. the benfits are so small its totally worthless. cpu overclocking isnt worth it, neither is RAM. the only thing that matters most is your video card that has to be extremely robust. NVIDIA needs to make a more powerful card more powerful than the 9800gx2.
Click to expand...

What?!
 
Draziom said:
overclocking is not worth it at all. the benfits are so small its totally worthless. cpu overclocking isnt worth it, neither is RAM. the only thing that matters most is your video card that has to be extremely robust. NVIDIA needs to make a more powerful card more powerful than the 9800gx2.
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That post = FAIL

GPU overclocking - usually more trouble than it's worth IMO (heat, noise, voltage, etc..) usually good for only a few fps

CPU overclocking - VERY benificial if you have the right chip. Get a $69.00 1.8GHz Intel Dual core cpu and bring it up over 3GHz with ease usually. If that isn't worth it, I don't know what is.
 
back in late 04 i made the worst decision of my life and spent practically all of my build budget on an fx55 chip, so the best card i could afford was a 6200 256 with four measly pixel pipes. i found out about unlocking the 4 extra pixel pipes using rivatuner but was surprised to see significantly poorer 3dmark numbers with all 8 pixel pipes enabled even with the card overclocked to 550/610. the 3d mark 03 tests were run on a practically barren xp install. what was even more surprising was that i saw significant performance improvements in both doom 3, farcry, and hl2. since then, i've only used 3dmark anecdotally here and there.
 
are you guys overclocking for system performance or just for benchmarking to show off? i dont see what the point of overclocking is to get high points in benchmarking.
 
Draziom said:
are you guys overclocking for system performance or just for benchmarking to show off? i dont see what the point of overclocking is to get high points in benchmarking.
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System performance for myself.

Overclocking does make a difference depending on the game and application. I don't care about benchmark scores, I care about real-word performance increases.

And of course, it's "free" performance. So why not if you know what you're doing?
 
Well an update. I remembered that when I recently blew all of the dust out of my tower that I had probably forgot to blow out the video card. So, I shut it down and blew it out. I was right, I forgot. It wasn't caked, but it wasn't clean either. So, I fired my system back up and started over. Opened up GPU-Z, ATITool, and Rivatuner. I set Rivatuner to 800 on the GPU clock. Started up the artifact scanner in ATITool, and immediately got errors. Something definitely was not working properly before. I'm not sure what though. I thought I had my maximums all figured out, but it just erred at 22 minutes. I am guessing that my card is probably already near its limit. Nevertheless, I am pretty sure that I am on the right track now. Thanks for all of the help.... and grammar lessons!
 
System performance...I do a fair bit of scientific computing & programming, and I don't normally have time to kill waiting on compiles and calculations if I can shrink it a bit. It can also help with how forgiving the computer is of me having a number of things going at the same time. Mostly this leads to CPU overclocking and not bothering with the video card.
 
overclocking can cause major heat problems and stresses CPU's and they wont last that long. same with RAM and video card OC. the performance is small and your system components wont last longer than a few weeks or months. then all the components are fried. there goes more money out the window.
 
Draziom said:
overclocking can cause major heat problems and stresses CPU's and they wont last that long. same with RAM and video card OC.
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Only if you suck and don't pay attention to whether you're causing heat issues. My E6600 sits around 30C after a 50%+ overclock.

If you think that's dangerous, try sticking a fork in an electrical outlet. Almost anything is dangerous if you don't learn some extremely basic precautions.

Are you sure you know what you think you know?
 
Draziom said:
overclocking can cause major heat problems and stresses CPU's and they wont last that long. same with RAM and video card OC. the performance is small and your system components wont last longer than a few weeks or months. then all the components are fried. there goes more money out the window.
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You really need to stop talking about what you obviously know nothing about......
my 2.66 Ghz Q6700 has been at 3.6 for 6 month at 100% load 24/7...
And my BFG 8800GTX has been at 720/1120/1650 for over a year.......

So please, stop spreading lies.
 
Draziom said:
overclocking can cause major heat problems and stresses CPU's and they wont last that long. same with RAM and video card OC. the performance is small and your system components wont last longer than a few weeks or months. then all the components are fried. there goes more money out the window.
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Not true at all. I have an old AMD XP still overclocked from several years ago - NO instabilities or any other such nonsense. And CPU overclocking is a major boost in speed. There are plenty of people around here taking ~2ghz C2Ds and pushing them past 3ghz - that is going to be a very significant boost in speed, probably a 1.5x boost at minimum.

Now, RAM and GPU overclocking gives only minimal returns in my experience, but its still free performance that doesn't cause ANY damage so long as you know what you are doing, so if you've got the time why not?

So either provide proof or STFU.
 
Crosshairs said:
You really need to stop talking about what you obviously know nothing about......
my 2.66 Ghz Q6700 has been at 3.6 for 6 month at 100% load 24/7...
And my BFG 8800GTX has been at 720/1120/1650 for over a year.......

So please, stop spreading lies.
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it wont last more than 2 years. the reality is OC hardware lasts a lot less than default manufacturers settings. now thats a fact jack.
 
Draziom said:
it wont last more than 2 years. the reality is OC hardware lasts a lot less than default manufacturers settings. now thats a fact jack.
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Proof or GTFO. I've got proof it will last more than 2 years in that my OC'd XP is still going strong, and you have none (other then the fact that you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about, jack).
 
Draziom said:
overclocking can cause major heat problems and stresses CPU's and they wont last that long. same with RAM and video card OC. the performance is small and your system components wont last longer than a few weeks or months. then all the components are fried. there goes more money out the window.
Click to expand...

Like ashmedai has said, that only happens if you suck, are an idiot, incompetent or absolutely absent minded. It is because of those possibilities that people take great care in overclocking. If you're going to OC, you better damn well know what you're doing or plan to learn about it as much as possible.

I have yet to kill any part by overclocking. My C2D E6400 has been at 3.2Ghz for the last year or so and have had no problem whatsoever. In fact, I have not heard of a single case where a C2D CPU has been killed by overclocking.

So please stop spreading that FUD around. It really doesn't sound like you know much about overclocking.
 
Draziom said:
it wont last more than 2 years. the reality is OC hardware lasts a lot less than default manufacturers settings. now thats a fact jack.
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Then I better go shut down my 8 folding computers that have been running overclocked since 2004...cause I guess no one told them it was time to blow up.

You seem to have learned quite a bit since 2 weeks ago when you didn't even know how to overclock....
Draziom said:
do you guys think it would be beneficial to overclock my computer for better gaming?

i have:

4GB OCZ 800 RAM

P5E motherboard

q6600 processor

9800gx2 graphic card

vista 32 bit ultimate with sp1

500GB hard drive

1000watt PSU

*all stock.
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Draziom said:
the other poster said its not really worth it to OC the GPU as it only gives a 2% bump in framerates. which is not much at all and not worth it. do you still think i should OC the CPU? how about the memory? should i leave everything stock? would vista 64 make my game playing better?
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Draziom said:
so just overclock the processor? what about the memory? i was thinking of buying quad, do you think its worth it?
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Draziom said:
what should i OC the RAM too?
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Quotes taken from THIS thread
 
i was talking to some hardware guru and he said OC doesnt give much performance. i thought about it and i wont be OC any of me hardwares.
 
Draziom said:
i was talking to some hardware guru and he said OC doesnt give much performance.
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Why didn't you tell us this before?......that pretty much settles it.
Try and keep this quiet though, you don't want to upset the [H]ard community.....
 
Draziom said:
it wont last more than 2 years. the reality is OC hardware lasts a lot less than default manufacturers settings. now thats a fact jack.
Click to expand...

What you seem not to realize is that Intel doesn't set up a separate production line for each individual binning they plan to sell - one chip design will get tested against a series of clock rates, and sold at that rate if it passes the tests. As an overclocker, you don't (usually) have access to the multiplier setting that the higher-binned chip would be using, but this rarely makes much of a difference - in fact, a very high portion of chips can be made to run well above the highest binning, even if you purchased a low binning chip. With modern production, a low-binned chip didn't usually *ever* get tested against the higher clock rates, that's just what they ended up locking it to so they had enough parts of each binning to meet expected sales. This allows them to bolster sales by having several price points. Overclocking sometimes requires a bit of tweaking which isn't appropriate when you want to sell to the general public or to businesses that are assembling a great many systems.

As overclockers, we can take advantage of these aspects of the market to push our systems above and beyond what they're guaranteed to be able to do - that's ALL the stock clock rate means to us.
 
When he first posted in this thread, I just smiled and knew it wouldn't go unanswered on this forum. :D
 
Draziom said:
i was talking to some hardware guru and he said OC doesnt give much performance. i thought about it and i wont be OC any of me hardwares.
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Yeah? Well, I was talking to your mom last night and she said you were adopted and that she didn't love you. Now that's a fact, jack. :rolleyes:

Sorry, but I'm going to go with personal experience, the overwhelming majority, and history to say that your hardware "guru" is full of shit. Do yourself a favor, and never talk to that guy about hardware ever again. EVER. He clearly doesn't have a clue.
 
Draziom said:
overclocking is not worth it at all. the benfits are so small its totally worthless. cpu overclocking isnt worth it, neither is RAM. the only thing that matters most is your video card that has to be extremely robust. NVIDIA needs to make a more powerful card more powerful than the 9800gx2.
Click to expand...

So if i pair my 9800 GTX with an old P4, i wont see any performance decrease from my e6700?

Or what if im decoding video? I can actually underclock my CPU and undervolt it to save power, and it will still take the same amount of time?

The only thing you said that was somewhat true was its not worth it to OC ram, and you were only half right, and you dont even know why you were right.

Draziom said:
overclocking can cause major heat problems and stresses CPU's and they wont last that long. same with RAM and video card OC. the performance is small and your system components wont last longer than a few weeks or months. then all the components are fried. there goes more money out the window.
Click to expand...

No. Just...no.





OP - FWIW, i have an e6700 and a 9800 GTX, and i dont really notice any gameplay improvements when overclocking either the CPU or GPU. It shows on benchmarks, but not really in the game. It wasnt really worth the extra heat/noise to me. I try to keep my system as silent as possible.
 
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