NVIDIA 3D VISION SURROUND Experience @ [H]

Unknown-One - yes that makes perfect sense.. but I wish on MMORPGs I could just toggle it off..

Got my system up and so far surround works very well and it's very smooth on two GTX470s.. I am really impressed so far... the big test for me will be LotRO and being able to enable DX10 shadows and AA again.. DL the install for that now.... and hot damn this Patriot Inferno SSD is faster than shit.
 
Hey Kyle did you also turn up the convergence when using 3d vision. Nvidia has made a huge mistake of hiding this in the drivers and is disabled by default. 3d vision really feels like a gimmick if you only use the depth control, they should have placed a second wheel on the back of the ir transmitter for convergence.

Also doom3 won't work since nvidia currently don't allow OpenGL to work with 3d vision unless you own a workstation card.
 
zehoo said:
Also doom3 won't work since nvidia currently don't allow OpenGL to work with 3d vision unless you own a workstation card.
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That's not the issue with Doom 3 that we're experiencing. It won't even work in 2D surround...heck, it doesn't work on a single monitor if the horizontal resolution is larger than 4096 pixels.
 
Unknown-One said:
That's not the issue with Doom 3 that we're experiencing. It won't even work in 2D surround...heck, it doesn't work on a single monitor if the horizontal resolution is larger than 4096 pixels.
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There used to be a problem related to multi monitor gaming where windows could only display so many pixels. I thought that was fixed in Win7, but apparently not. It will require a driver work around from Nvidia.
 
heatlesssun said:
Yeah there's a problem even with my setup. When Surround is enabled there's no way to set aside a GPU for PhysX and that's the problem. And with only 2 cards you can't set dedicate a GPU for PhysX anyway. Not a biggie, I expected as much, I do wonder if there's a way to do with with 3 or more cards or no. Need to ask around.
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So to ensure Physx is disabled while surround is on do I set it to Physx -> CPU ?
 
Well you do have physx. unless you went into the control panel and uninstalled your physx drivers, only.

The physx/surround situation is messed up and needs to be fixed. There's no excuse for Batman w/physx running fine in SLI mode, where neither card is dedicated to physx, but then coming to a halt in Surround mode, where, again, neither card is dedicated to physx. Should not need a third separate card to make the thing playable.
 
Holy crap.... just got LotRO installed and OMFG what a difference... I can crank all of the IQ up again and it's buttery smooth... need to do more testing but so far I am really happy with my 470s and surround. they do run a little warm though.. and the fans are kinda loud.. tempted to drop some EK blocks on them. :p metro 2033 DLing now..
 
The performance is definitely butter, but I do think Surround makes the cards run hotter. Running at max (Safe) voltage of 1.087mv, one card reaches 50C and the other 58C on water at 800/1950. At idle it's 31/33C.
 
everything I am testing is sooooo smooth.. I am quite happily surprised... way to go Nvidia for pulling this out of their ass... lil late... but great timing all the same because I just got the $500 newegg giftcard for winning the eyefinity contest at CyberPower and used that to fund 80% of that purchase.. lol. oh the irony. :p
 
Thnx for reviewing this Kyle, 3D gives me a headache too:mad::mad::mad:!!! I'd say it's the 'age' factor m8, we over 40's just don't have the eye tollerance, however I do like the 120hz monitors, even if they are pretty average as far as displays go...
Thnx again Kyle, love your work:cool::cool::):):)
 
Naieve said:
That's not the issue with Doom 3 that we're experiencing. It won't even work in 2D surround...heck, it doesn't work on a single monitor if the horizontal resolution is larger than 4096 pixels.
Click to expand...
There used to be a problem related to multi monitor gaming where windows could only display so many pixels. I thought that was fixed in Win7, but apparently not.
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No, you were right the first time, that problem hasn't existed for a very long time. Windows Vista and Windows 7 can support display resolutions up to 8192x8192 per-monitor, and Doom 3 will run just fine at that resolution...on an ATi card.

This is not a Windows limitation, it's a bug in Nvidia's drivers. After some testing and research, it appears that this bug has been present since the introduction of the Forceware 160 series. If I roll all the way back to the Forceware 158.24's, Doom 3 will run at resolutions higher wider than 4096 pixels on Nvidia cards.

Those old drivers obviously aren't much use here, as they don't support Surround. It does show that Nvidia should have the capability to fix their driver to allow these resolutions with the Doom 3 engine again.
 
well, so far the only thing that bothers me is my top GPU runs very hot.. it hit 98 yesterday after playing FEAR2.. I had the fans at at 70% which isn't quiet and put my hands at the exhaust area, GPU1 (top) is clearly putting out way less air than it's partner.. they are right on top of one another... so I could move GPU2 to the 8x pci-e slot at the bottom of the board, but I would really rather have a 16x/16x GPU config.. I guess I need to run the fans harder and just put on headphones. lol. or go water...

anyone replaced the TIM on the 470 yet? I hear is does make a difference on 480s... maybe that and the hi-flo brackets will help. :p
 
There is no point in running 16x/16x over 8x/8x. No human being is going to notice the 2% performance difference. You're better off overcoming this numbers obsession and moving the cards further apart.

It boggles my mind that anyone would even consider running two Fermi cards in a sandwich configuration. Brackets won't do you any good if the top card can't get air in the first place...and changing the TIM is a waste of time unless someone at the factory horribly misapplied it in the first place. I did it on 3 cards, made no difference.
 
ok - I guess I should run them further apart.. it'll be a 16x/8x config like that.. I ran my GTX260s close together and they seemed fine for years.. but these are warmer beasts. I wish they would design a cooler than draws most of the air from the end of the card and pushes it along the length of the card out the back..
 
Matrices said:
There is no point in running 16x/16x over 8x/8x. No human being is going to notice the 2% performance difference. You're better off overcoming this numbers obsession and moving the cards further apart.

It boggles my mind that anyone would even consider running two Fermi cards in a sandwich configuration. Brackets won't do you any good if the top card can't get air in the first place...and changing the TIM is a waste of time unless someone at the factory horribly misapplied it in the first place. I did it on 3 cards, made no difference.
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Mine are sandwiched together lol *gulp*


I really wonder if these cards will last like 2-3 years sandwiched together! Damn you Gigabyte for making the ud5 board x16 slots next to eachother!
 
bizzmeister said:
[snip] Damn you Gigabyte for making the ud5 board x16 slots next to eachother!
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^^^^ this :D


"i swapped my second 470 to the 3rd slot(8x) on my asus rampage 2 extreme MB cause i wanted some space for the 1st 470 to breath (it used to run 3 degrees higher at idle and 10 degrees higher at load)
now both cards run at same temperatures and hardly any loss in performance(vantage score 100 points less with the second card in 8x slot compared to 16x-16x) "

take from: http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?high=&m=376355&mpage=2

so when my hi-flo plates come in I will be moving my bottom card to pci-e slot_3
 
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revenant said:
^^^^ this :D


"i swapped my second 470 to the 3rd slot(8x) on my asus rampage 2 extreme MB cause i wanted some space for the 1st 470 to breath (it used to run 3 degrees higher at idle and 10 degrees higher at load)
now both cards run at same temperatures and hardly any loss in performance(vantage score 100 points less with the second card in 8x slot compared to 16x-16x) "

take from: http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?high=&m=376355&mpage=2

so when my hi-flo plates come in I will be moving my bottom card to pci-e slot_3
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You know what, I may just end up doing that. But then my frickin 1200watt psu is soo big it may just end up sticking to that lol.
 
OH crapzilla... damn it. my case (TJ09) doesn't have room for a 2 slot card to go into that last pci-e slot... grrr... my options are, go water, or new case... or live with fans at 80+..

edit: I think I am going to go water and get an exos 2 external..
 
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duhokay said:
Anyone having an issue with the mouse cursor disappearing in the middle monitor?
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Nope, the only issue Ive ever had is playing Bad Company 2. It randomly just says reload and it says on my screen even though my clip is full..


I hit esc, and then go back to the game and its gone. Kinda annoying lol.
 
bizzmeister said:
Nope, the only issue Ive ever had is playing Bad Company 2. It randomly just says reload and it says on my screen even though my clip is full..


I hit esc, and then go back to the game and its gone. Kinda annoying lol.
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That happens on a single display as well as of the latest patch, FYI.
 
I'm getting lots of random ass crashes with these drivers.

BFBC2 will just quit without reason right to the desktop mid-game with no error messages.

I've crashed twice in JC2 loading cinematics right to desktop, no errors.

I BSOD with nvdkmlm.sys (sp?) whenever I try to install itunes, ya that's right, itunes.

I hope the WHQL fix these rather strange errors.

On the other hand, 30 fps enthusiast crysis warhead @5760x1080? Hell ya!
 
weird on the itunes thing.. maybe back your overclocks off a bit to test for better game stability tho? or maybe do a driver sweeper wipe and start fresh... sounds like maybe a botched driver install.. maybe...
 
revenant said:
weird on the itunes thing.. maybe back your overclocks off a bit to test for better game stability tho? or maybe do a driver sweeper wipe and start fresh... sounds like maybe a botched driver install.. maybe...
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This is after I full formatted by torqx due to Games for Windows Live errors. I also had problems with securom and BFBC2, I think drm hates me. But ya, clean install.
 
Oh man.. sorry. yeah, I cringed when I saw that shit getting installed with GTA4 this weekend.. ugh. DRM doesn't just hate you.. it just plain sucks. :(
 
Hooked up another 480 yesterday for triple SLI (my second attempt at tri-480) . My experience so far has been, unfortunately, similar to my experience with other triple GPU setups (2x 4870 X2, 3x 5870, 3x 9800 GTX): performance and compatability is, quite simply, all over the board, especially in Surround.

In Heaven, I get an extra 27% (2540pts) over dual cards in single screen (1920x1200, 4xaa, 16xas, highest settings). Haven't tried Heaven yet in Surround...

GTA IV is unusable in 2D Surround with tri-sli (tried a variety of resolutions and settings): the cursor locks up upon loading the menu. Although I can key around to start a game, the load screen locks up.

Metro 2033 - Similar to GTA, screen locks up at menu in 2D surround.

FarCry2 - Tried to run a benchmark, but froze at load screen.

BF2 - Can run in game at 3600x1920 4aa, highest settings no problem. Haven't tracked FPS, but it's extremely smooth.

I've tested all my cards seperately and they are good, so that's not the problem (can all be OC'ed past 825/2000 and run cool). My DFI x58 is 16x/16x/8x so bandwidth shouldn't be an issue.

So far, only one out of four games I've tried actually work... Anyone else have experience yet with tri-sli and 2d Surround?
 
no personal experience with 3 card, by my 2 card setup runs great with everything I have thrown at it.. I think heatlesssun is one of the only others here with a tri-sli surround setup... what psu are you running?
 
harmattan said:
So far, only one out of four games I've tried actually work... Anyone else have experience yet with tri-sli and 2d Surround?
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Sorry to hear about your issues but I've tried Metro 2033, Batman AA, Just Cause 2, Dirt 2, the new Serious Sam games, HL2 and the episodes, Portal, BC2 and they all worked in 2D Surround just fine. I've even tried 3D in Metro 2033, JC2, BC2, Batman AA and it works well in the games but its murder on performance. Batman and JC2 look incredible with 3D Surround, particularly JC2, looks like a damn Pixar movie, is just fucking fantastic. Don't know why Kyle doesn't like 3D, in games designed for it is a HUGE leap in visuals.
 
Unknown-One said:
@Kyle

I temporarily swapped my HD5850 for two GTX260's so I could test this out, and I ran straight into the same issue you had with Doom 3. I spent some time bug hunting, and came across something troubling.

There appears to be a hard resolution limit for games using the Doom 3 engine (and many other OpenGL applications) when they're running on Nvidia cards. I ran the game in a window so I could quickly switch the game's resolution, and discovered that setting the resolution any wider than 4096 pixels instantly resulted in the render window turning gray.

This happens with or without SLI enabled, and with or without Surround enabled. It doesn't appear to be limited to the GeForce 200 or 400 series either, because I was able to make the issue appear on a single 9800GT as well. This appears to be an issue effecting every Nvidia card, with every version of their video driver that I've tried.

[...]

Wider than 4096 pixels = gray screen.

There's something wrong with Nvidia's drivers or hardware, and it's a long standing issue spanning multiple generations. Think you can give Nvidia a poke so they'll fix it?
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Hello Unknown-One,

Let me introduce myself. I manage the Core OpenGL driver team for NVIDIA. I recently was made aware of your testing (thanks for that!) you describe in this thread. Based on the information you provided here, we tried to reproduce this issue. But we have been unable to do so with either Doom3 or Quake4. Can you help us get a repro case? What driver version(s) have you tried? Have you tried driver 257.21 that we recently released? Have you tried completely uninstalling the driver before installing another driver? Also, what version of Doom3 did you use?

> Wider than 4096 pixels = gray screen.

G7x based chips can render to a max of 4096 pixels wide. G80 through GT200 can render 8K pixels. Fermi can render 16K pixels. Thus you should not see this gray screen, but you obviously do.

With your help we'll get to the bottom of this.

Regards,
Barthold
 
revenant said:
no personal experience with 3 card, by my 2 card setup runs great with everything I have thrown at it.. I think heatlesssun is one of the only others here with a tri-sli surround setup... what psu are you running?
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PSU is a ToPower Powertrain 1500w, so power shouldn't be a problem. Also, I can run single screen tri-sli all day with no problems. Maybe heat? I have a stock fan card sandwiched between two watercooled cards. The fan-cooled card never gets above 91c and has 120mm fans directly above and behind it. However, my water-cooled cards never go over 65c, so maybe the variation in temps (65c-91c) is causing an issue? I have noticed running in Surround does bump up my card temps a couple degrees...

Also, not sure if related, but I've noted I'm experiencing USB issues since I moved to tri-sli. The same issues others are reporting here:

http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=172976
 
The USB issue is interesting. Maybe the chipset is bandwidth starved with all graphics PCI-E lanes in use on Surround? Just speculating.

As for your other problem, you say TriSLI runs fine on one monitor. What about dual SLI in Surround? Is it just specifically TriSLI combined with Surround that gives you issues, or Surround in general?
 
I know my top card runs about 20c hotter at load than my bottom and my surround works perfect. so I doubt the temp thing is it.. but I think you might be onto something with the USB issues... maybe beta driver related? hmmm or the mobo internal bw is getting tapped out..

edit: maybe an interrupt issue? hmm.. sounds like the 3rd card and the USB root hub might be trying to share an interrupt.. just a wild ass guess.
 
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barthold said:
Hello Unknown-One,

Let me introduce myself. I manage the Core OpenGL driver team for NVIDIA. I recently was made aware of your testing (thanks for that!) you describe in this thread. Based on the information you provided here, we tried to reproduce this issue. But we have been unable to do so with either Doom3 or Quake4. Can you help us get a repro case? What driver version(s) have you tried? Have you tried driver 257.21 that we recently released? Have you tried completely uninstalling the driver before installing another driver? Also, what version of Doom3 did you use?

> Wider than 4096 pixels = gray screen.

G7x based chips can render to a max of 4096 pixels wide. G80 through GT200 can render 8K pixels. Fermi can render 16K pixels. Thus you should not see this gray screen, but you obviously do.

With your help we'll get to the bottom of this.

Regards,
Barthold
Click to expand...

You probably want to PM the guy if you're looking for him specifically.
 
Matrices said:
The USB issue is interesting. Maybe the chipset is bandwidth starved with all graphics PCI-E lanes in use on Surround? Just speculating.

As for your other problem, you say TriSLI runs fine on one monitor. What about dual SLI in Surround? Is it just specifically TriSLI combined with Surround that gives you issues, or Surround in general?
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Theory on the pci bus being overloaded sounds reasonable.

Surround with dual card sli worked perfectly in the games I listed, as they do in single monitor tri-sli, but are borked in tri-sli surround.
 
So the only variable there that you could possibly control is the cable that goes from the third card to the third monitor. Have you tried using different inputs and outputs on either end?

The only other plausible theory aside from bandwidth, in my opinion, is a voltage regulation issue on the motherboard caused by drawing power for all your USB devices on top of all your video cards. Even if you could isolate in the BIOS some setting that would overvolt the PCI-E slots, I wouldn't recommend it. Might just end up frying the card.

Maybe try unplugging "unnecessary" USB devices to see if anything changes?
 
Unknown-One said:
That's not the issue with Doom 3 that we're experiencing. It won't even work in 2D surround...heck, it doesn't work on a single monitor if the horizontal resolution is larger than 4096 pixels.
Click to expand...

i got it working in 2d surround tonight... followed the same steps as i did for getting it working with eyefinity.. weird!

drop the three patched files into base

game00.pk4
game03.pk4
gamex86.dll

then mod the lines in the doomcfg file

seta r_aspectRatio "1" (1 = 16:9, 2=16:10)
seta r_customHeight "1080"
seta r_customWidth "5760"
seta r_fullscreen "1"
seta r_mode "-1"
 
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