Next Gen Consoles

Marees

Gawd
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Storage Matters: Why Xbox and Playstation SSDs Usher In A New Era of Gaming

Ryan Smith (@RyanSmithAT) Tweeted:
Given the massive leap in perf that SSDs will give the next-gen consoles, @Billy_Tallis has put together a fantastic article on the subject, outlining the technology and why MS & Sony made the decisions they did. It's everything you didn't know you wanted to know #weekendreading
https://twitter.com/RyanSmithAT/status/1271439948827160577?s=20


AnandTech (@anandtech) Tweeted:
The switch to SSDs may be the most exciting feature of the upcoming Microsoft Xbox Series X and Sony Playstation 5. Here's our take on what to expect from the new console SSDs and what it means for the gaming industry as a whole.

https://www.anandtech.com/show/15848/storage-matters-xbox-ps5-new-era-of-gaming

https://twitter.com/anandtech/status/1271437394181451778?s=20
 

schlitzbull

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If these consoles retail for <600 USD i might make the jump -- that's a lot of hardware for such a tiny price that the equivalent gaming PC likely won't match

My thoughts exactly. Im mid htpc build for my office and will probably sell those parts and my Nvidia Shield for this. Im hoping the discless ps5 goes for $450.
 

Armenius

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Ori dev says what we're all thinking. And with UE5 allowing artists to be lazy with their assets it's going to get even worse.

1592419742128.png
 

Marees

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Ori dev says what we're all thinking. And with UE5 allowing artists to be lazy with their assets it's going to get even worse.

View attachment 254411

Fortunately (for Microsoft) their architecture allows the external cartridge to be as fast as internal NVMe card. I don't think there is any size limit either (even though they have mentioned only 1TB to start with)

Microsoft have the perfect Razor & Blade model with series X !!!
 

Nolan7689

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Fortunately (for Microsoft) their architecture allows the external cartridge to be as fast as internal NVMe card. I don't think there is any size limit either (even though they have mentioned only 1TB to start with)

Microsoft have the perfect Razor & Blade model with series X !!!
Sony is allowing effectively the same, the PS5 has an internal M.2 slot and Sony is testing drives for compatibility in terms of performance/size.

It’s definitely not near as simple though as swapping out an external card though.
 

vegeta535

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Fortunately (for Microsoft) their architecture allows the external cartridge to be as fast as internal NVMe card. I don't think there is any size limit either (even though they have mentioned only 1TB to start with)

Microsoft have the perfect Razor & Blade model with series X !!!
Sony is allowing effectively the same, the PS5 has an internal M.2 slot and Sony is testing drives for compatibility in terms of performance/size.

It’s definitely not near as simple though as swapping out an external card though.
Both are going to be e expensive.
 

Stitch1

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So the latest rumors on the Xbox Series S is that it will share the same CPU as the X but with a cut down GPU. The long time rumor was a 4TFs GPU but now people are saying all kinds of different numbers. The idea is this is a 1080/1440 machine with a cut down GPU with less compute units and less ram. However, it is said to still have ray tracing. Not bad if the price point rumors are true. Some are saying as low as $199.
 

jarablue

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Can't install more then 10 to 15 games? How about install 1 game and immerse yourself in it. And play it to start to finish. We've gotten so fat and greedy with no attention span now
 

vegeta535

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Can't install more then 10 to 15 games? How about install 1 game and immerse yourself in it. And play it to start to finish. We've gotten so fat and greedy with no attention span now
Yea for most people it won't matter to then. They buy the next Madden and CoD game and never play the old ones again. I generally don't go back to play old games and only games I like to keep installed bars fighting for when friends come over for drunken street fighter and the likes.
 

Marees

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So the latest rumors on the Xbox Series S is that it will share the same CPU as the X but with a cut down GPU. The long time rumor was a 4TFs GPU but now people are saying all kinds of different numbers. The idea is this is a 1080/1440 machine with a cut down GPU with less compute units and less ram. However, it is said to still have ray tracing. Not bad if the price point rumors are true. Some are saying as low as $199.

Xbox Series X was reportedly slated to launch in August with Series S launching in October

https://mspoweruser.com/xbox-series-x-launch-august-series-s-after-october/

Reported by The Thurrot, Microsoft’s original plans for the Xbox Series family of next-gen consoles originally saw the more powerful Xbox Series X release as early as late August.

While the Xbox Series X release date is currently unknown, rumours have been suggesting that the console is set to launch alongside the lower-powered Xbox Series S that was originally set to launch in October.

the Xbox Series S announcement was pushed to a later date which many outlets believe is scheduled for August.

However, Thurrot does not fully believe that Lockhart is set to be announced in August. The outlet’s consistent sources have yet to confirm to the website whether or not the console will be announced then as part of Xbox’s 20/20 marketing push.
 

Armenius

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Xbox Series X was reportedly slated to launch in August with Series S launching in October

https://mspoweruser.com/xbox-series-x-launch-august-series-s-after-october/

Reported by The Thurrot, Microsoft’s original plans for the Xbox Series family of next-gen consoles originally saw the more powerful Xbox Series X release as early as late August.

While the Xbox Series X release date is currently unknown, rumours have been suggesting that the console is set to launch alongside the lower-powered Xbox Series S that was originally set to launch in October.

the Xbox Series S announcement was pushed to a later date which many outlets believe is scheduled for August.

However, Thurrot does not fully believe that Lockhart is set to be announced in August. The outlet’s consistent sources have yet to confirm to the website whether or not the console will be announced then as part of Xbox’s 20/20 marketing push.
Thurrott is usually pretty good with information, but I don't believe this one. The release window has been "Holiday 2020" every since it was revealed to the public. It also does not make sense that the marketing strategy of releasing a new console during the Christmas shopping season would change with this one, unless Microsoft is really worried about competing with Sony this generation and wanted to be first.
1593704248191.png


MS Power User also editorialized what Thurrott actually said. Thurrott attributed nothing about the supposed release window change to China Virus. Here is the original article, which is linked in the quote but I'm separating it here:
https://www.thurrott.com/games/xbox/237240/the-latest-on-lockhart
 

Marees

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The Verge has obtained photos of Microsoft’s new next-gen Xbox controller in white, complete with packaging that mentions the Xbox Series S. Twitter user Zak S was able to purchase the controller today, and we’ve confirmed it’s genuine.

The new controller was sold on a resale site today, and the side of the packaging notes that the controller works with both Xbox Series X and Xbox Series S consoles. Microsoft has not officially unveiled an Xbox Series S yet, nor has the company even confirmed a white Xbox Series X controller.

A mysterious white Xbox Series X controller also appeared online last month, complete with the new D-pad, textured triggers, and new share button. This new leak matches the previous controller leak, and retail packaging suggests that these could be appearing in stores soon.

https://www.theverge.com/platform/a...ontroller-packaging?__twitter_impression=true

via FPSReview
https://www.thefpsreview.com/2020/08/09/xbox-series-s-confirmed-by-leaked-controller-manual/

Someone managed to get his hands on the company’s next-gen controller early, and according to the manual, it’s compatible with both the Xbox Series X and Xbox Series S, which confirms that all of those previous rumors about a weaker console are true.

EfB-c8OWkAEHrUp.jpeg
 

Comixbooks

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I'm pretty sure I'm not going to cave in and buy one. PC gaming is where it's at unless there is one game I have to have. You gotta figure all the games still use controllers so there isnt going to be any grand scale MMOs or RPGs.
 

Domingo

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Looks like the Xbox Wireless Adapter should work with the new controllers...at least assuming they aren't referring to a newer model.
 

zamardii12

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Ori dev says what we're all thinking. And with UE5 allowing artists to be lazy with their assets it's going to get even worse.

View attachment 254411

Without a doubt. Although the way i've heard the best way to mitigate this issue is to have the games on the internal SSD (and in the case of the XBX the expansions SSD) that you are regularly playing in your rotation. Like I have a 4TB external setup on my Xbox One X and all my games are installed, but i'll just transfer the games I want to utilize with the SSD onto internal whenever I want to play them. Without a doubt i'll be buying one of those 1TB expansions cards as soon as they're available... although I would appreciate a 2TB model.

I am kind of cringing thinking about how much those expansion cards are going to be. I think $100 - $150 for the 1TB and $200 for the 2TB (if there ever is one).
 

T4rd

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I think 8 TB cartridges should be possible.

For now maybe 4 TB cartridges that cost > $500 !?

For now, I'll be good with sticking a slow 2+ TB external HDD up to the console and swap out games as needed to the internal SSD to play. I'm pretty sure at least the PS5 will continue to support that on PS5, but it would be nice if they streamlined it a bit to let you launch almost directly off of the external drive and let the game continue to install/transfer while you're playing it like they already allow you to do with partial game downloads before the game finishes downloading.
 

Marees

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XSX leaked pricing puts it at $599.

That's gonna hurt a bit, esp. if the PS5 launches at $399/$499 for the digital/disk versions.

Another source says that $600 is inclusive of bundled Halo game

Without the bundle it should cost $550 (same as PS5 regular !? )

MSPoweruser (@mspoweruser) Tweeted:
Xbox Series X price valued around $539 according to Monster Energy - https://t.co/JR1sGZ9Xty https://t.co/kS91r7DxAr
https://twitter.com/mspoweruser/status/1295340319941304321?s=20
 

T4rd

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This is more than reasonable. $600 in 2006 money is only $466, which is when the PS3 launched.

I agree and would still buy the PS5 at $599. But obviously these two consoles directly compete with each other and if the price difference is that significant (esp. compared to the digital PS5 if it's indeed at $399), it doesn't bode well for Xbox unless they think the Series S can make up for it despite not really competing directly with PS5.
 

Marees

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$550 consoles !?

don’t be surprised if the Xbox Series X ends up costing more than $500. There are already rumors suggesting the system will cost $600 when it launches in November. Of course, Microsoft could decide to price the system lower to compete against Sony's PlayStation 5, which also arrives this holiday season.

“Basically we have the same die area across three different technologies, and it’s significantly more expensive for the die in the newest one”
~Xbox architect Jeff Andrews pointed out during the Hot Chips presentation

https://uk.pcmag.com/video-game-con...-workout-due-to-high-chip-manufacturing-costs
 

T4rd

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Is there any good information about next-gen VR for PS5?

Nothing yet, which is odd too. I'm guessing Sony is planning for a (much needed) update to the PSVR to bring it more in line with current PC VR solutions, so they're not pushing it too much until that happens maybe a year or so after the PS5 launch. I know the current PSVR is compatible with the PS5, but I don't think any new PSVR games have been announced for it.
 

Reaperkk

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This is more than reasonable. $600 in 2006 money is only $466, which is when the PS3 launched.

Friends I've talked to about the consoles always seem to forget the PS3 was $600 at launch, I'm reminded every time I boot mine up to watch netflix. I don't think it's unreasonable considering the tech going into it.
 

T4rd

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Friends I've talked to about the consoles always seem to forget the PS3 was $600 at launch, I'm reminded every time I boot mine up to watch netflix. I don't think it's unreasonable considering the tech going into it.

Indeed, and also lets not forget there was the cheaper $500 20GB model too, which kind of sucked mainly because it didn't have WiFi built in. A decent portion of that cost as well was the additional hardware required for PS2 emulation which we all know Sony eventually dropped in order to get the cost down and that's not a factor anymore since the current and next gen use the same x86 architecture.

Unfortunately my original PS3 died and my multiple attempts to reflow it in the oven failed. So I replaced it with a PS3 slim (not the crappy newest version with the manual disc tray) and it has been good for the past 12 years or so. My daughter still uses it daily to play Little Big Planet with her friends.
 

Stitch1

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I am frustrated with Sony over this new console release. Remember back when a lot of people were arguing that the GDC event was only for developers and not really meant for us consumers? Yeah, about that.... Had that not happened then what would we consumers really know about the details of the PS5? We got the first look at the back side of the console hours before being able to pre-order it. Heck, we hardly even knew the price as the pre-orders opened.

Regarding backwards compatibility, there is still so little known. What little we do know came from that GDC event. Sony still has not clarified anything regarding "boost mode".

Almost all new info has come from outside sources like Geoff Keighley on Twitter.

It seems if you want PS5 enhancements for PS4 games you'll be paying for them again. For example, Spider-man. You can put your PS4 disc into a PS5 and play it as if you would on PS4 but if you want the next gen enhancements, then only way you can get it is by buying the ultimate edition of Miles Morales. That Ultimate Edition is $20 more than the standard $50 edition. That's fine and all but that's info I would have liked to have known sooner. I would also like to know what this means for newer games like The Last of Us 2 and Ghost of Tsushima.

I don't want to beat a dead horse but them saying they would give notice for pre-orders and then not. As well as them letting everyone think both Miles and Horizon were PS5 exclusives just to later release a blog post stating they would both be on PS4 as well. Kind of a BS move when Xbox was getting beat up for supporting cross gen for up to two years. But now Sony quietly announces they will support the PS4 for 3 to 4 years. Just looks bad in my eyes. I get it though. Why not let you competitor take all the wrath. Although, if the new God of War is really coming out next year I bet it too is cross gen. Either that or it will be delayed into 2022. Sony has a horrible track record of announcing games early just to push them back over and over.

I don't know why I assumed the SSD was soldered to the motherboard but apparently it isn't. For whatever reason I thought there was an open M.2 slot so you could add to the storage. That's not the case. So when it comes time to upgrade you will have to replace that low 825GBs with something new. Something not currently on the market. Again, I am getting this news second hand as Sony has yet to tell us anything about whats going on inside this box.

Just a lot of bad moves on their part. As a huge fan, I am just kind of frustrated with the lack of leadership this time around. They knocked it out of the park this time last gen. Why change what worked?
******************************************************************
Rant over!

On the positive side of things. Demon Souls looks GREAT! Ratchet and Clank (coming later) looks GREAT! There's another God of War in the works and you can jump into a PS5 as low as $400. Those are all good things moving forward.


Originally, I was going to go with the disc version for $500 but with how they are handling backward compatibility, I am going all digital. I really only plan to buy the first party games this time around as I will be using the Xbox Series X as my main. A complete 1080 for me compared to last gen.
 
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Nolan7689

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I’ll probably go disc because I’m stupid and small brain says “more functionality>less functionality” even though physical media is now the minority for me.

I still just really like getting physical editions for certain things though. For example I have physical versions of Persona 5 and Dark Souls 3. I’ll continue that trend even though it’ll just cost me more money really. Like I said at the start, I’m dumb.


Now it’d just be cool if Sony could do two things; sort out this preorder bullshit, and actually give a true timeline on updating firmware for their HDMI 2.1 TVs to have proper functionality. (Specifically they have a set that is supposed to get VRR and ALLM but absolutely no roadmap on when.)
 

Domingo

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I went with the disk one just because I no longer have a UHD Blu-Ray player. The only disks I have from even the previous generation of games were either bundled with something or just given to me. There's always a tiny chance they might allow you to play old disks, too. It might not be backwards compatible with the PS1-3 right now, but it could happen down the line, kinda like with the Xbox One. It's one of those situations where I'd rather have something and not need it than wish I had it later.
 

Stitch1

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So now that the "next gen" consoles are current gen what is everyone's thoughts on them? Have you all gotten ahold of either or both? How are you liking them?

I was lucky enough to pre-order the Series X for launch day and was super lucky and was able to score a PS5 from BestBuy last week. After spending some time with both they both have their strengths and weaknesses. But overall they are very nice upgrades from what many would consider a lackluster offering at the start of last gen. Without going into too much depth the SSDs really steal the show. The lack of loading in general is just a huge quality of life feature that should have happened a lot sooner (imo).

Gamepass has been and continues to be a fantastic deal. The PS+ Collection is a very nice addition as well.

The DualSense controller is very cool with the haptics and adaptive triggers. I still prefer the feel of the DS4 a little better and have always preferred the asymmetrical sticks of the Xbox over the Play Stations. If I could get the haptics and adaptive triggers inside a Series X or even better an Elite controller it would be the best controller ever. I also just like how clicky the DPad and buttons are and overall shape/feel of the Xbox over the DS. But man after playing through Astro's Playroom, I can't wait to see what they do with those adaptive triggers. They are VERY cool.

Lunch games. Sony has them Xbox really doesn't. I don't normally buy games at full price so not a deal breaker for me. But Sony has Spiderman and Demon's Souls and both look fantastic. I didn't buy either yet. Instead I have been playing Astro's Playroom (free) and some back catalog of PS4 games. Something odd to note. If you have a physical edition of the games from the PS+ collection you still have to use the disc to play them if you used it to install them. For example I already own God of War. I used that disc to install the game because I have a data cap. Well even though it's part of the PS+ collection and I have redeemed the game as part of the collection I still have to put the disc in to play it. Not a big deal but kind of lame. Just to make sure it wasn't a fluke I tried The Last of Us Remastered. Same issue.

On Xbox I have also been playing older games. However, I went back another generation. I had Dead Space on PS3 but for whatever reason I never got around to finishing it. However, now that EA Play is part of GamePass I have access to that game again. So I have been making my way through it and having a blast. It does look dated but overall holds up pretty well. The HDR added by the Series X is a nice addition. Prior to that I completed Day of the Tentacle and Full Throttle. These are 90's games were remastered a few years back for PS4. They just recently came to Game Pass on Xbox. I still need to play Grim Fandango. After those I wanted something a little more modern so I gave TitanFall 2 a try. The story is decent probably in the C to low B range. However, the gameplay is top notch. It's not super long but worth a playthrough, that's for sure. Really solid B from me. The other game that I have been playing FAR too much of.... Tetris Effect. It was the first game I downloaded onto the Xbox to try out while other games were downloading. Good lord is that game addictive! I played through the Journey mode to see how it was. I couldn't stop. I had to finish it. I recently bought OLED TV for these new systems and this game just looks amazing on it. Then my wife tried it. She too couldn't stop. So now we battle each other at least a few matches before bed. In fact Tetris is the reason I ended up getting the PS5. I stayed up one night WAY too late playing it and before I went to bed I decided to check a few stores to see if any stock had come in. Frist it was Costco.. Nope... Tried Target... Nope... Tried Best Buy! YEP! They were doing something a little different. You couldn't add it to your cart right away. But after a few mins you could. Then they sent you a verification code. Boom, no problems there. Next thing I knew it was being processed.

On the user experience side of things it's currently, in my opinion, a mixed bag. On the Sony side way more has changed. The UI looks very nice in 4k and is pretty easy to use. Setting everything up seems to take a little longer and you have a little less control over the settings. But it's a very clean layout and not super different from the PS4. Although, it does move some stuff around. The party chat is crap. They have already issued a statement that they are going to fix it so..... Anyways. I think everything else is fine. Well other than the lack of folders. Why the step back? Who knows. But come on Sony. I don't hate the direction they are going with the UI but I hate how everything gets stripped down then built back up at the start of each gen. On the Xbox they have made a ton of changes throughout the last generation. What the Xbox One consoles have now is what you get with the Series X&S. I don't exactly love it's UI either. But I like how customizable it is. Don't like the layout? Change it. Don't want to see something on your dashboard? Remove it. It's that simple.

I have seen the reports of PS5's having issues. Even some close friends have had some issues with theirs. For now, I do not use an external hard drive nor do I put it in rest mode. Also, although I really want to play it, I have been waiting for some patches before playing the Spiderman remaster. Real life friend didn't have any issues until he installed Spiderman then had all kinds of issues. On the Xbox I haven't worried nearly as much about it. It's always in rest mode and WOW does it wake up FAST! My TV takes longer to wake up.

Overall, I am really enjoying both systems. I have had more time with the Xbox and have played more on it at this point. However, that's not a diss at the PS5. I just haven't owned it as long. I was finally getting around to playing Limbo this weekend on it. I got that as a PS+ title forever ago. I've played Inside but never Limbo. Man, what I neat indie game. I plan to finish it tonight then go back to playing Dead Space on the Xbox. My main take away at this point at the start of the new generation is that both consoles are great. At the start of last gen both were kind of lackluster. I wouldn't even buy a Xbox One at lunch. Although, they had a pretty good launch line up of games. Sony had the much better hardware last gen and the games did come. But at the start Resogun was my jam at for a good bit last gen. This gen is already at a much better place than this time last gen. Both companies seem to have a lot of good stuff in the works and as I said at the start SSDs do make all the difference this time around. Being able to quickly get into the action or back into the action after a death or quick travel is just amazing. I forgot to talk about how fast everything really is. Like Witcher 3's fast travel or Fallen Order's respawning. But taking huge chucks of wait times out of these games truly feels next gen to me.
 

Domingo

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I'm really enjoying the PS5. The graphics and performance truly do feel "next-gen" to me. I always felt that the PS4 and Xbox One were the smallest console upgrades of my life. The PS5 feels like a true generational leap even vs. the PS4 Pro. Even beyond the better graphics and focus on high FPS, the load times are borderline instant and the new controller feedback add to the experience. I also really appreciate getting the huge PS+ bundle that included many of last-gen's best. I'm super happy with it.

On the down side, I think the UI is clunky and very inconsistent. Functions that work in one menu (or on the PS4) work differently for no real reason. There doesn't seem to be any way to sort your games and only a few are visible at a time via the main menu. Audio options are bare bones and Sony's "better than Dolby Atmos" positional audio is only for headphones. They claim that it's coming for "TV speakers" but that sounds like the same tech that mimics things via 2 speakers. The system is huge and mounting it sideways was clearly a clunky afterthought. I wish there was a way to turn off those annoying LED lights on it, too. Love those controllers, but they suck up batteries like no controller has before. I'm having to charge mine up way more than I'd like. All those new features come at a cost - and that cost is about 1/2 the longevity of the Xbox Series X Controller.

Long story short - as a game system it's straight-up amazing. On the other hand, the UI and physical system itself leave a lot to be desired.
 

Archaea

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My biggest gripe with the Xbox series X is that the controllers have a spotlight on them that shines directly into my eyes in my pitch black projector based HT room. Stupid design choice. As was removing the player number light indicator. (That the Xbox 360 had)
 

Colonel Sanders

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My biggest gripe with the Xbox series X is that the controllers have a spotlight on them that shines directly into my eyes in my pitch black projector based HT room. Stupid design choice. As was removing the player number light indicator. (That the Xbox 360 had)
Well that's dumb. Are you 100% sure there isn't a brightness setting you can tweak buried in the Series X settings menus somewhere? You can do that for the PS4 or PS5 controllers for example. Worth checking at least (if you haven't already.)
 

Stitch1

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I don't think you can dim the standard Xbox controller's light. You can on the elite controller though.
 

bizzmeister

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My biggest gripe with the Xbox series X is that the controllers have a spotlight on them that shines directly into my eyes in my pitch black projector based HT room. Stupid design choice. As was removing the player number light indicator. (That the Xbox 360 had)
Just put a small piece of black electric tape on it, waaaalah
 
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