My NEC LCD2690WUXi review

Sycraft

Supreme [H]ardness
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Played with it for a couple days, so here's my thoughts:

All in all, this is an absolutely superior monitor. Best I've ever seen, much less owned. So, to the specifics. This is from a gamer's perspective, since I use it for that, and then for general use (web surfing, apps, etc). I don't do pro photo/prepress work so colour matching isn't a concern. I want it to look good, not accurate.


Input Lag
Seems to be a big issue for a lot of people. Well whatever lag it has, I don't notice. I'm not saying that would be true for everyone, but I certainly don't have any problem playing games on it. It doesn't feel laggy, that's for sure.


Response
This is a fast panel. I don't notice any ghosting with it. One of the great things, coming from a VA that was technically as fast or faster, is the dark-dark transitions. Everything just looks clearer as there's no more ghosting. I'd gotten used to it and now I notice its absence.

I can't imagine anyone but someone who is extremely sensitive noticing any problems. Images are smooth and fluid.

Overdrive seems well under control (I turned it on). I can't get it to exhibit any problems. For example on my BenQ I could see some sparkles and incorrect colours if I played with certain red-green transitions. The same thing here doesn't cause any artifacts I can see.


Colour
Hands down, best colour I've seen on a display. Better than CRTs, better than my old LCD (A BenQ FP241W). I'm sold on IPS as the technology for desktop monitors. The colour looks good no matter what. I move around, there isn't any noticeable shifting. Also, it looks the same at all distances.

Something I noticed with the VA panel was how much better it looked when I was like 10 feet away. That's not to say it looked bad at normal operating distance, just that when I laid back in bed to watch a movie or something it got noticeably better. So I think VA would be good for an HDTV.

However this IPS panel looks just as good close up as it does far away. Since close up is where it is getting used, that's what I'm after.


Wide Gamut
For gaming, wide gamut is the way to go. I find it makes games look just stunning. I can't get over how good the forests look in WoW. The green crystals in Terokkar look emerald now. Yes, maybe the colour isn't "correct" but it doesn't matter. What matters is in all the games I've tried, it looks better. To my it looks more vibrant and closer to reality. Things aren't as washed out.

I don't really notice a problem with it browsing the web either. However, Firefox 3 will be along soon and can handle colour correction if you like.

So while photo or video people might have a problem with the higher gamut, for gamers I think it is a huge boon.


Contrast ratio/Black level
The monitor walks the walk here with it's CR claims. With a native white point and gamma, you get real close to the 800:1 quoted. Even with heavy modifications, such as a 6500k whitepoint and L* gamma curve, it measures almost 600:1 on my display (for reference film in a good theatre is like 500:1).

Black level is quite good. By the numbers it is higher than my FP241W, but not a whole lot. On everything but a totally black screen, it's very dark and even then it is good.

Unlike the BenQ, you seem to be able to set brightness to any level without killing contrast or crushing blacks. On the BenQ I had to set it pretty high to get a full range. Here if you lower brightness both the white and black levels go down.

So if you are worried about blacks sucking, well, don't. In regular use, it looks as good as my VA panel did.


Uniformity
I don't know how good it is without colourcomp but with it, it is stunning. I can't see any variation over the panel. There's no reason not to use colourcomp as far as I can tell. All it does it reduce the maximum brightness, which is still really bright. With colourcomp on, and the white point set to 6500k (which further reduces brightness), the calibration software still had to reduce brightness below 50% to get down to the 200nits I requested.

Unless you like your panel scorchingly bright, colourcomp shouldn't be a problem and man, either because of it or the panel itself this thing has an extremely consistent image.


Calibration
I bought the Spectraview version which has the calibrator included. I'd highly recommend it. Prior to calibration the monitor is great, after calibration, it is stunning. Extremely natural and neutral colour, best greys I've ever seen.

One of the things I think really makes it worth it is the L* gamma curve you can use. I'd never heard of it before. Basically instead of a straight power gamma curve, it is modified and is supposed to be more perceptually uniform. After seeing it, I believe the claim. Gradients look extremely uniform in the change in brightness. In games, it seems to help the low end a lot. Darker colours are visible and differentiated.

It may not be what most things are expecting, but it seem to look great. Thus I'd recommend anyone who has the Spectraview version give the L* curve a whirl.

I'm also really sold on hardware calibration. I did software calibration with my last monitor, and the hardware calibration has cleared up two things that I noticed:

1) Slight imperfections in a grayscale gradient. This is probably due to the fact that you lose some colours when you correct the videocard LUT. Not a problem here, at least that I can see, grayscale is perfect.

2) Games override it. A lot of games like to load their gamma via the video card, and thus override any calibration. Again, no problem with a hardware calibration, your corrections are applied after the game. So while the game might change the power, it doesn't change the corrections.


Features
Great monitor when it comes to the features. Rather a nice step up from the BenQ, which was a little spartan. The OSD is excellent. Easy to use, very responsive, and tons of controls. The normal OSD has just about everything you want to adjust, but just in case you need more than advanced OSD has more than you ever though possible.

The scaler is just amazing. Quality is great, I stopped using the nVidia scaling and switched over to the monitor. The ability to customize it is incredible. For every resolution you can set how it scales (like full, aspect, etc), sharpness, and so on and it'll remember it.

I also like the LED controls. I happen to get annoyed by all the bright blue LEDs that are so common these days. No problem, just tell the monitor you want it green and/or turn the brightness down. Not major, but they went the extra mile with pretty much everything like that. You can customize as much as you like.


Overall
Superior screen, if you've got the money. Sure as hell pricey and I'm sure you can do near as good for a good deal less, however I can't fault the price as it really is top notch.

If you do decide to get one, I'd really recommend the Spectraview version. It is a good deal cheaper to buy that with the monitor, and it is worth the price in my mind. If you can swing $1100 for a monitor, you should spend the extra $200 to get 100% out of it. Provantage has a pretty good deal on the SV version, just a little over $1300 shipped.

So if you have the money, and you want a truly superb monitor for gaming, I'd say this is one to seriously look at.
 
Nice one, thanks for posting your findings. Can I ask do you play any fast or fps games online? if so how does the lag feel to you personally? Have you any backlight bleed? if so is it noticeable when in normal use?

thx.

If the LG W2600hp reviews are pretty limp, I might get the NEC.
 
I don't play FPSes online. I do play offline, Call of Duty 4 for example, and the lag doesn't seem to be noticeable. As I've said, I don't claim this will apply to others, this is just how I see it. It is also possible I am just adjusting to the lag. Back in the day I used to play Quake Team Fortress on line a ton and of course that necessitated getting good at adjusting to latency. However, I certainly don't find this display problematic.

There is a small amount of bleed in an area near the bottom centre of the panel. Only visible on a dark screen, and even then it isn't much. Can't see it at all in normal operation.
 
Hi Sycraft and the group-

I purchased one of these monitors last week from newegg, $1408 which included overnight shipping from CA.. Overnight shipping was only $20 more, plus I live on the East Coast, therefore, it was worth the extra $$ to get it on over to me.

I must also praise the quality of the image and the amazing color saturation. It is a BRIGHT monitor! :) I had to turn the brightness setting way down. I too bought the unit with the SpectraView II calibration kit (almost crazy NOT to buy it with this included) and found somewhat of an improvement after calibration, but nothing that would knock my socks off. If anything, I would say the calibration seemed to clear up fuzzy edges, sort of a video "alignment" more so than the colors bursting off the screen as it already was..

As for lag.... I am not a gamer, I bought this monitor for photo editing as well as general purpose computing. I am a Mac user with an EyeTV HDTV tuner attached to the computer. With live HD images, moving video definitely has a pronounced lagging effect which is hard on the eyes. Not good, coming from a Samsung 245 monitor that did not have this issue. I can live with it though, as I don't watch a tremendous amount of TV with it, but regardless, it's still a shame to have to suffer with such severe lagging TV video.

Other than this issue, I have no complaints. I have since discovered the "Advanced" menu which allows me to set the Auto Brightness to 1, and that turns on the "Electric Eye" on the lower right hand corner of the unit. That way, during the day the brightness is brighter, and at night it is lowered automatically. Much easier on the eyes! I did try the OverDrive function with my HDTV lagging issue.. It didn't help, so I set it back to Off.

Photo editing is incredible! The Sammy 245 is not even in the same league here. Images are crisp and it's very easy to edit fine details in Lightroom and Photoshop now. The color saturation is awesome. The NEC does my photos more justice than on paper!

Overall, I'm pleased. I'm glad I spent the (bigger) bucks for this monitor. I had spent hours reading through what seemed like endless threads about this unit, many positive remarks, MANY negative remarks. For me, it's a 9 out of 10. I'd buy it again. The 26 inch size is plenty large enough, too. I had considered the upcoming 30 inch model, but it seems that size is way too large for anything practical. Perhaps if that model is mounted on your wall, and you're sitting way back from it, then it might work.. But having it resting on a desktop, a 30 inch size would dwarf everything else. Simply not practical.

Oh, and I have a revision 4F monitor manufactured Feb 2008. A lot of the threads make comment of revision 4B and earlier having issues. Back light bleed is minimal, I hardly see any at all with no dead pixels that I can find (yet).
 
What do you mean by lagging TV video? Just curious since I don't see anything that could be described as that in games or watching computer based video. I don't notice any audio/video lag, there's no ghosting or anything.

So what is the effect you are experiencing that you call "lag"? I'm curious to see if I can notice it.
 
The HD video is jerky.. Example, The Masters were on CBS yesterday. When the players would walk across the green and the camera was tracking them while walking, the entire video jerks and lags while they walk. On the Sammy, it was smooth (I hooked it back up just to verify). When the player would swing, that was fine (not a lot of overall movement going on in the picture as a whole). When the ball was in the air with a blue background, the jerkiness picked up a bit, and when the camera focused up close on the ball while rolling on the green towards the hole, the video went jerky again.

It is interesting to note that a standard definition channel does not appear to have lag. Nor does a DVD. But with a *moving* high definition image, it really struggles to keep up.
 
I have 1B rev. monitor manufactured Feb 2008, it is very strange to have low rev. which manufactured recently... unfortunately it has all the issues others talked about...
 
Hmmm, I don't know what it going on with that, but I'd wonder if it isn't something to do with the HDTV unit. I just grabbed two 1080p videos from Microsoft's WMV HD site and they both look, well, stunning. No lag or stuttering that I could see, just flawless, beautiful, video (makes my DLP set look kinda crummy). Only potential downside is it is so good, you can see if a transfer is crappy. Any dust and such that was on the film is quite evident.

So I think you've got something else going on. What I can't say, but I don't think it is a monitor fault. Two possibilities spring to mind:

1) Maybe the refresh rate is screwed up. Maybe the monitor is reporting other rates than 60Hz and you computer is choosing one of those by default. Check your refresh, make sure it is 60Hz.

2) Maybe your HDTV card has problems, and your old monitor wasn't responsive enough to reveal them.

Either way, I'd look around and see, because I don't think it is an issue with the screen. As a practical matter, if it had problems with doing fast video, it'd be most evident in games since games are higher frame rate than TV. full 1920x1200 resolution, and feature lots of movement.
 
There is NO problem with any lag visually. It may be detected by direct comparison with CRT using stopwatch and fast camera ONLY (2490).
Visual side by side comparison with CRT shows from zero to nothing.
Absolutely NO problem with HD video. I use it for Blu-ray movies (2490). It's very strange to hear 2690 demonstrates different performance (other than color gamut).
BTW these monitors (2490/2690) are bought by video studios as they are probably the only to provide 100% HD support.
Check the equipment.
 
BTW
What is the latest revision of this screen ? any one knows ?
 
Guys--

Don't argue with me. I know what I'm seeing, and the HD video on the 2690 is jerky and poor. I have eyes, I see what's happening! I put my former Samsung 245BW back in service and the jerkiness goes away. The issue is in the 2690. Period.
 
Nobody is doubting what you're seeing, but you're blaming it on the monitor when the monitor isn't the issue here. You're saying the monitor struggles to keep up with HD video, which doesn't even make sense. The monitor doesn't process the video. The monitor just displays what the video card sends, and this monitor has no trouble displaying 60 frames per second smoothly at 60 Hz. That's one of the things I test. The problem has to be elsewhere.

Are you using EyeTV 2.5 or EyeTV 3? EyeTV 3 has a problem where 1080i is jerky with progressive scan deinterlacing, like the frames aren't synchronizing properly, and the amount of jerkiness you see will depend on the monitor's timings. I already reported this to Elgato, but I don't know when it will be fixed. As a workaround, you can set the deinterlacing to motion adaptive or always. If it's already set to one of those or if you're using EyeTV 2.5, then you shouldn't be having this problem.
 
Sycraft - Thanks very much for your review, congrats on the monitor! I use a 2490WUXi and could not be any happier. Maybe if I get a second monitor I'll get a 2690 to go with it. :D
 
So did NEC sort out all the QC issue with this monitor like bad backlighting, buzzing power supply etc?
 
Very nice review, much better than I could have written!

I have had my 2690 for about 2 weeks, and I absolutely LOVE it. I too got the Spectravision calibration, and it did make the monitor colors better.

One question I have - I turned off the reminders about calibration, do you really need to calibrate periodically? How often does a hardware re-calibration need to be done?
 
How often does a hardware re-calibration need to be done?

It depends.
Just to keep your friend in a good shape - 1-2 times a months, not more.
You might want to re-calibrate it when settings are changed.
Re-calibration may be useful when you want to spend time with photos.You may choose maximum contrast or better gray tones - another calibration. SpectraView gives endless variations to get the best of your 2690.
 
I have a quick question that I don't think needs a new thread, so I'll post it here. Also, my question has been asked before, but so far I haven't found a satisfying answer, there may not be one. I have read about the wide gamut issue here and on dpreview, but obviously I don't have the ability to see these two fine LCDs side-by-side to see how much it will really bother me. On the days when I prefer the 2490, I imagine how much better it will treat middle range colors in movies and in photos. And on days when I prefer the 2690, I imagine how people have said the additional color saturation actually looks good in games (I don't game much) and movies, even though these are not color managed. I do plan to do some photo work using color aware software. And finally, I plan to own this display for several years, so software should be catching up, no?

I guess what it comes down to is how well does the default sRGB mode on the 2690 do it's job? Am I really going to care that much that reds and greens are a little more saturated when browsing the web? Again, sorry. I'm 2 days out from making the purchase with no chance of seeing either screen in person.
 
Well, I can only sort of answer you. I don't know how accurate it is, but yes sRGB mode does clamp down the colour gamut. I've used it when watching some poorly compressed movies. The over saturation leads to the compression artifacts being much more visible and sRGB mode fixes this. For most thing it is fine, even desirable. The wide gamut looks quite good in the T2 HD trailer, for example.

So basically I'd say if the concern is can you go to an sRGB approximation when you find the wide gamut annoying, the answer is yes. However if you want to do colour critical work in sRGB, you are probably better off getting a 2490.

Now if you are using colour aware software, I don't imagine you should have any problems, in fact the additional gamut should be a good thing.
 
I have a quick question that I don't think needs a new thread, so I'll post it here. Also, my question has been asked before, but so far I haven't found a satisfying answer, there may not be one. I have read about the wide gamut issue here and on dpreview, but obviously I don't have the ability to see these two fine LCDs side-by-side to see how much it will really bother me. On the days when I prefer the 2490, I imagine how much better it will treat middle range colors in movies and in photos. And on days when I prefer the 2690, I imagine how people have said the additional color saturation actually looks good in games (I don't game much) and movies, even though these are not color managed. I do plan to do some photo work using color aware software. And finally, I plan to own this display for several years, so software should be catching up, no?

I guess what it comes down to is how well does the default sRGB mode on the 2690 do it's job? Am I really going to care that much that reds and greens are a little more saturated when browsing the web? Again, sorry. I'm 2 days out from making the purchase with no chance of seeing either screen in person.

Sorry for being unable to provide you with direct answer - so close they are and so much about the taste.
Some thoughts, though.

I had this very choice last year. I was weighing pixel pitch and screen size. Color gamut was neglected. Larger pixels for better text, smaller pixels for smoother photos. My decision was 2490 - smoother photos and text with increased dpi.

And on days when I prefer the 2690, I imagine how people have said the additional color saturation actually looks good in games (I don't game much) and movies, even though these are not color managed.
I have tested several wider gamut monitors (PVA, though) side-by-side with 2490.
1. Difference is notisable on some pure color samples - not on all of them.
2. Difference is miserable in real applications.
3. Difference does not necessarily mean that wider looks better.

There may be a trick about what people say: "wow!" - always ask them what did they have before.
CRT? TN/*VA? - opinion disregarded as they have not seen real monitors, anything other than TN/*VA may be "wow" for them.

You have two days to ask for two more (again subjective, sorry!) opinions:
1. ToastyX from this forum (used 2490 and 26" IPS monitor (well inferior to the NEC but wide gamut).
2. xtknight from anandtech.com (has 2690 and 20" IPS). His review of 2690.
 
Are you speaking of the LCD2490WUXI-BKSV with the included SpectraView II package?

Which wide gamut monitors have you also looked at?

Concerning the LCD2490/2690WUXI, how does it handle 720p/1080p over DVI? Does it correctly recognize video signals and display them without overscan? I would assume since it's DVI, it does not overscan and cut off parts of the image.

I am currently evaluating monitors, and am willing (and able) to pay the price for the LCD2490WUXI-BKSV, which I can find for just over $1200.00 Canadian, and my desire is to have a well calibrated screen that can handle my PC, Xbox 360 (over VGA) and PS3 over the second DVI connection. Wide gamut is not important to me as photo editing is a minor hobby of mine.

I do love IPS screens and am still compelled to have one.

My apologies if I've hijacked this thread.

Regards,

10e

Sorry for being unable to provide you with direct answer - so close they are and so much about the taste.
Some thoughts, though.

I had this very choice last year. I was weighing pixel pitch and screen size. Color gamut was neglected. Larger pixels for better text, smaller pixels for smoother photos. My decision was 2490 - smoother photos and text with increased dpi.


I have tested several wider gamut monitors (PVA, though) side-by-side with 2490.
1. Difference is notisable on some pure color samples - not on all of them.
2. Difference is miserable in real applications.
3. Difference does not necessarily mean that wider looks better.

There may be a trick about what people say: "wow!" - always ask them what did they have before.
CRT? TN/*VA? - opinion disregarded as they have not seen real monitors, anything other than TN/*VA may be "wow" for them.

You have two days to ask for two more (again subjective, sorry!) opinions:
1. ToastyX from this forum (used 2490 and 26" IPS monitor (well inferior to the NEC but wide gamut).
2. xtknight from anandtech.com (has 2690 and 20" IPS). His review of 2690.
 
Generally, the answer would be not more than two or three times a year. While some manuals and calibration packages will tell you to calibrate monthly, I don't see that it's required much past the first month or so that the monitor is "broken in" and colors have "settled".

I would recommend re-calibrating the second you upgrade/replace your video card, as I have seen some differences in color calibration with ATI and nVidia cards (being the most common that I've tried).

Regards,

10e

Very nice review, much better than I could have written!

I have had my 2690 for about 2 weeks, and I absolutely LOVE it. I too got the Spectravision calibration, and it did make the monitor colors better.

One question I have - I turned off the reminders about calibration, do you really need to calibrate periodically? How often does a hardware re-calibration need to be done?
 
Are you speaking of the LCD2490WUXI-BKSV with the included SpectraView II package?

Which wide gamut monitors have you also looked at?

Concerning the LCD2490/2690WUXI, how does it handle 720p/1080p over DVI? Does it correctly recognize video signals and display them without overscan? I would assume since it's DVI, it does not overscan and cut off parts of the image.

I am currently evaluating monitors, and am willing (and able) to pay the price for the LCD2490WUXI-BKSV, which I can find for just over $1200.00 Canadian, and my desire is to have a well calibrated screen that can handle my PC, Xbox 360 (over VGA) and PS3 over the second DVI connection. Wide gamut is not important to me as photo editing is a minor hobby of mine.

I do love IPS screens and am still compelled to have one.

My apologies if I've hijacked this thread.

Regards,

10e


Are you speaking of the LCD2490WUXI-BKSV with the included SpectraView II package?
Yes.

Which wide gamut monitors have you also looked at?
Dell 2407-HC, Dell 2408, Dell 2707.

Concerning the LCD2490/2690WUXI, how does it handle 720p/1080p over DVI? Does it correctly recognize video signals and display them without overscan?
720p/1080p 100% correct, no ovescan, no cropping (Sony Blu-ray player).
PS3, Xbox 360 not tested.
 

One thing I didn't get there was the supposed improvement provided by ColorComp. It seems like there was a 15% brightness variation across his screen regardless of whether ColorComp was enabled or not.

It would be interesting to see the color temperature variation across the screen as well.

Brightness and color non-uniformity bother me, especially when the non-uniformity is horizontal. Vertical is not quite as bad. With horizontal non-uniformity, you see the brightness or color changing as your eyes follow the text that you're reading, so it's quite annoying.

The inconsistent quality of LCD panels is a nasty problem. It's a crapshoot every time you buy or exchange a monitor...
 
Thanks for the help. So I decided to drop a load on the LCD2490. Money wasn't the reason I chose this rather than the 2690. It's just without the chance to see both in person I'll never know what I might be missing. Besides, even though the 2690 is capable of more vibrant colors, I'm not convinced there is enough content out there in the right format to make it worth it. I mostly watch movies and browse the web, so the narrow-gamut will probably serve me better. Also per ToastyX's posts, I got the sense that the 2490 is slightly more likely to have less QC issues. Give me a year or two and I'll revisit this whole mess. In the meantime, please don't tell me what a mistake I just made. This was almost purely an emotional buy (I tried to make it otherwise), which I'm sure NEC will love to hear.
 
That would a good monitor. But the price is prohibitive for me. Never the less thanks for the review.
 
I would likely say you made a mistake not getting it sooner :)

Thanks for the help. So I decided to drop a load on the LCD2490. Money wasn't the reason I chose this rather than the 2690. It's just without the chance to see both in person I'll never know what I might be missing. Besides, even though the 2690 is capable of more vibrant colors, I'm not convinced there is enough content out there in the right format to make it worth it. I mostly watch movies and browse the web, so the narrow-gamut will probably serve me better. Also per ToastyX's posts, I got the sense that the 2490 is slightly more likely to have less QC issues. Give me a year or two and I'll revisit this whole mess. In the meantime, please don't tell me what a mistake I just made. This was almost purely an emotional buy (I tried to make it otherwise), which I'm sure NEC will love to hear.
 
There may be a trick about what people say: "wow!" - always ask them what did they have before.
CRT? TN/*VA? - opinion disregarded as they have not seen real monitors, anything other than TN/*VA may be "wow" for them.

Oh so now CRTs and TN/MVA/PVA panels aren't real monitors? You IPS snobs are really something else, anyone that knew anything about "real" monitors would tell you a decent CRT would beat the crap out of any "pro" IPS LCD and any decent plasma will make the blueish ugly blacks on a IPS LCD look downright terrible. IPS is a display technology that is going no where in consumer displays due to terrible on off contrast ratios. If all you do is use photoshop all day by all means they are the best display, for anything else there are better options
 
Oh so now CRTs and TN/MVA/PVA panels aren't real monitors? You IPS snobs are really something else, anyone that knew anything about "real" monitors would tell you a decent CRT would beat the crap out of any "pro" IPS LCD and any decent plasma will make the blueish ugly blacks on a IPS LCD look downright terrible. IPS is a display technology that is going no where in consumer displays due to terrible on off contrast ratios. If all you do is use photoshop all day by all means they are the best display, for anything else there are better options

any decent plasma
You are in the wrong thread. For plasma TV check your nearest BestBuy.

blueish ugly blacks on a IPS LCD look downright terrible.
Update your information. Your knowledge really sucks.

IPS is a display technology that is going no where in consumer displays due to terrible on off contrast ratios.
Some more treatment for ignorance.
And some water to swallow the pill.

for anything else there are better options
Really? Study basics and see what the optons are.

MULTIMEDIA (good for all-around multimedia use, movies/regular gaming)

Low response time
Accurate color/gamma curve
High contrast
Wide viewing angle

#1 25.5": NEC MultiSync LCD2690WUXi, 1920x1200 (16:10)
Panel: WG H-IPS w/ A-TW-Pol (LG.Philips LM260WU1); true 8-bit, 16.7M colors

#2 24.1": NEC MultiSync LCD2490WUXi, 1920x1200 (16:10)
Panel: H-IPS w/ A-TW-Pol (LG.Philips LM240WU1); true 8-bit, 16.7M colors

#3 30": Dell UltraSharp 3007WFP-HC, 2560x1600 (16:10)
Panel: WG S-IPS (LG.Philips LM300WQ1); true 8-bit, 16.7M colors

#4 25.5": DoubleSight DS-263N, 1920x1200 (16:10)
Panel: WG H-IPS (LG.Philips LM260WU1); true 8-bit, 16.7M colors

#5 25.5": Planar PX2611W, 1920x1200 (16:10)
Panel: WG H-IPS (LG.Philips LM260WU1); true 8-bit, 16.7M colors



You IPS snobs are really something else, anyone that knew anything about "real" monitors would tell you a decent CRT would beat the crap out of any "pro" IPS LCD

IPS vs CRT

Find "decent" 25"- 30" widescreen CRT monitor first.
Until that - :)shut your mouth!:)
 
Thanks for graphs from who knows where showing a monitor that costs 2x the price of a 2408wfp losing to it, anything under 1000:1 on off is a joke. Sony 24" FW900, close enough to 25" and will beat your monitor any day. Don't forget you said they weren't "real" monitors so don't start taking sizes. Until you can come up with reputable information from a well known site it is you my friend that should just shut up. You should know that a lot of pros wouldn't even take an LCD if it were given to them, NEC or not.. still if you think you have the "bestest monitor in the worlds and you pwnz all" then good for you, I hope it helps you feel good about yourself. Your post just really reinforced the snob part in my reply, thanks! Since your new here and obviously don't know much about displays you should probably do a search on "CRT" of thread titles in this forum, you might be surprised how many agree with me.

PS, what was that last CRT vs LCD supposed to show exactly? I'm curious if you could enlighten me on what exactly you're supposed to tell from a bad digi cam shot? Just because the viewing angles are comparable doesn't mean it can properly display colors and the entire grayscale like a CRT can..
 
Thanks for graphs from who knows where showing a monitor that costs 2x the price of a 2408wfp losing to it, anything under 1000:1 on off is a joke.


Bahahaha! :D

Albovin actually rates the 2408 as half decent in his review, but it is an utter piece of garbage compared the the NEC 2490 IMO.

I get a great laugh out of people who merely quote specs. Yeah, the Dell has high contrast in that central spot where the sensor reads it. No matter I guess that contrast has probably dropped to 50:1 on the sides of the panel from the crazy PVA angular gamma shift. While the NEC is completely stable. Pictures demonstrate the viewing angle matches a CRT perfectly BTW.

So
NEC" 800:1 center, 800:1 sides.
Dell: 1000:1 center, 50:1 sides. (clue: this is not better)

On top of that, the 2408 has the worse lag of any panel going, along with black crush that you need a calibrator to get rid of. Since it doesn't have an internal LUT, you lose even more colors when you calibrate, not to mention the bigger more inaccurate color steps.

The NEC with it's 12bit LUT and internal hardware calibration will display a more accurate grayscale than just about any CRT you have seen and it won't lose any colors to calibration.

Let's not forget about the crazy levels of overdrive needed to make a PVA panel respond that leads to wacky multi-color overdrive ghosting.

You are comparing a Porsche to a Lada (Dell), and claiming the Lada is better better because it is cheaper and gets better EPA gas mileage rating.

The NEC is a vastly superior panel. I wouln't buy the dell if it were a quarter the price of the NEC. If I cheap out, I will get a TN panel before the Dell PVA mess.
 
I agree it is a better display but there are still viable reason why others don't want need it. This is besides the fact that he said a CRT isn't a real monitor which is what I really disagree with. Yes IPS monitors are the monitors with the least amount of negatives but saying they're perfect for everybody and that they beat out CRTs is just plain ignorant. No one will dispute this is probably one of the best "computer" displays out there for color critical work. However certain people find them to have disadvantages that make the extra money just not worth it. Snowdog I think you already know I know the disadvantages of IPS and PVA monitors so don't try to rehash the same discussion we had 2 years ago. Oh and btw that 50:1 number was ridiculous, do you even know what that would look like? ;)
 
The NEC with it's 12bit LUT and internal hardware calibration will display a more accurate grayscale than just about any CRT you have seen and it won't lose any colors to calibration.

If you say so.. bahaha my turn to laugh now with the black level of an LCD your obviously missing shades of grey.. duh
 
Oh and btw that 50:1 number was ridiculous, do you even know what that would look like? ;)

Probably a lot like this: :D
http://bp0.blogger.com/_0-tLLf6eqJY/R9Mcby1sY1I/AAAAAAAAAHU/hxsFWoJYMJk/s1600-h/desperado12xn1.jpg

If you say so.. bahaha my turn to laugh now with the black level of an LCD your obviously missing shades of grey.. duh

That is black level you are talking about. Black/Bright levels are relative issues (to ambient lighting) and not absolutes. Grey scale accuracy is an absolute. For displaying a consistent accurate gray scale range (your original rant), good luck finding a CRT that does that anywhere close the NEC.

I have a Trinitron next to an LCD on my desk. In a normally lit room, the LCD black looks just as good as the CRTs sometimes better, because the CRT tends to absorb room light. So an NEC would blow away my CRT for greyscale in normal lighting, including black. When the room darkens the tables turn in favor of the CRT as the LCD black becomes exposed as not black as room lighting drops.

I am a fan of CRTs and the reason I like IPS screens is that they best match CRTs for viewing angles which are problematic (a mess) on both VA and TN screens.

The NEC has CRT like viewing angles along with superb color accuracy/linearity. It is the king of 24" monitors. The only reason to not buy this 24" is the pricetag.

There are not many products out there where the clear leader stands so far above the crowd. I don't own a 2490, but I might get one yet. A no brainer if you want a quality product.

When deciding between the mediocre, I would save even more money and get a TN screen and also save myself from input lag, overdrive artifacts, and *VA horizontal gamma shift (but suffer vertical shift in the bargain).
 
Hey guys,

Let's get back on target here.

Ok, so Albovin is a little more passionate than most and can sound insulting, but I only glean that he is often just trying to make a very strong point. We're adults. Let's move on.

For me the excessive contrast of MVA/PVA hurts my eyes. Reading the HardForum on my beloved BenQ FP241VW is a labour of love that occasionally leaves my 37 year young eyes bleary and teary. I've been staring at computer screens for over a quarter of a century, and up until THIS point, I've never felt eyestrain after hours of reading/surfing/working, so MVA must have something to do with this (as this is my first, and possibly last MVA screen).

Not so on S-IPS or TN on my BenQ G2400W or Dell 2005FPW OR LG TV.



My plan is this. I will spend some time reading the LCD2690 thread. I have found a supplier in Mississauga, Canada where I can get the SV version. If I am suitably happy with what I read on the other thread, I will partake and make the same transition as SyCraft: BenQ FP241W/VW to LCD2690.

The BenQ will become a console monitor for PS3 and 360, and for my VMWare ESX server box console display.

Input lag is in check and I mostly console game, so anything under 50ms is fine for me. I personally could care less.

I love S-IPS. I revere S-IPS and I want over saturated colors of a wide gamut panel, which incidentally is only $90.00 more than the LCD2490WUXI-BK/SV version here. Accuracy is important but in games brighter and stronger is better :)

Thanks again, Sycraft for the review, and Albovin for your information as well.

I'm looking forward to having a screen I can keep for at least 4 years (based on warranty).

Regards,

10e
 
Ok, so Albovin is a little more passionate than most and can sound insulting, but I only glean that he is often just trying to make a very strong point. We're adults. Let's move on.

Also he is not typing in his native language. Attempting to make a point while translating your words is not likely an easy task.

For me the excessive contrast of MVA/PVA hurts my eyes. Reading the HardForum on my beloved BenQ FP241VW is a labour of love that occasionally leaves my 37 year young eyes bleary and teary. I've been staring at computer screens for over a quarter of a century, and up until THIS point, I've never felt eyestrain after hours of reading/surfing/working, so MVA must have something to do with this (as this is my first, and possibly last MVA screen).

Close to my story. I also have about 25 years of computer use as will. With over 15 of those years at long hours either in University or as a working software developer. Never had any eye strain issues till I encountered my first PVA panel. Which I got rid because of the double whammy of excess brightness and weird PVA angular artifacts. The gamma shift can cause weird 3d anomalies that tire the eyes and weird edge glare. Too subtle for most to notice, but like the Eskimos noting more variations in snow do to much greater familiarity, I note many different aberrations in displays that I use so much. I ditched my PVAs for TN and another CRT. My eyes have thanked me.

Though a word of warning on the 2690, it is a 500cd/m2 display and LCDs usually don't throttle down that effectively. This is likely to cause strain from it's sheer brightness.


I love S-IPS. I revere S-IPS and I want over saturated colors of a wide gamut panel, which incidentally is only $90.00 more than the LCD2490WUXI-BK/SV version here. Accuracy is important but in games brighter and stronger is better :)

The problem I have with this, is if you want more saturated colors, visit the "Digital Vibrance Control" in you NVidia drivers. No need to saddle everyone with inaccurate monitors just to give some an over saturated look they desire that could be achieved by adjusting a control.
 
How do you figure that the monitor is inaccurate? It isn't, it is just capable of displaying a large part of the colour space than older monitors. To call that inaccurate would be the same as calling a higher resolution monitor inaccurate, or a higher frequency sound card inaccurate. The new monitors are just capable of covering a larger part of the range of human perception, though if you look at a graph you'll be amazed at how far they still have to go.

What is needed, is better colour management. Operating systems and applications need to be able to look at the gamut of the display device and then decide how to do output accordingly. Same thing as a game needing to be able to scale it's UI and polygons to accommodate different resolutions.

I imagine that this is coming, the wide gamut monitors are becoming much more common. As a simple example, Firefox 3 supports colour management properly, so if images are tagged right, it'll deal with mapping them to your monitor's colour space.

Also, the software controls cannot offer a wider gamut. There is no way you can reproduce colours outside of the range of what the display is capable of. Software can change the response curves, that is to say when a given app requests a certain level, they can instruct the display to do a different level, but it cannot change the display's physical capabilities.
 
I've heard that unlike the Planar and Doublesight, that the WuXI is better at throttling the brightness with the OSD controls. Correct me here if I'm wrong. In fact, both XTKnight and Sycraft have mentioned that the brightness can be dialed down without losing contrast and color on the 2690.

In this light, and after having spent an hour perusing the 2690 thread, I am more resolved to order it.

The reason I don't use the DV controls on the nvidia control panel is because I can't get that same level of saturation with other devices like my PS3 or Xbox 360. I will at least connect them to this screen, as well as the BenQ FP241VW.

Funny you should mention Eskimos, because if I remember correctly, we are both Canadians Snowdog.

And I do realize translation of certain sayings from one language to another can cause "lost in translation" issues. I also speak Greek, and am learning Arabic to appease my wonderful wife and her family, as well as myself :)

I'm also still trying to get my head around this English thing :)

Regards,

10e
 
10e:
I look forward to hearing how the brightness control works for you. Yeah, I am Canadian, in Ottawa. I never could tell from your posts that English wasn't your first language, that was more aimed at others who often attack Albovin for his grammar. I was agreeing with what you said and expanding.

Sycraft:
I understand the issue. It is not necessarily the monitor that is inaccurate, but the poor color management in applications/OS. Though in the end the result is the same. It just seems too soon to go non-sRGB. You can get something like the 2490 and calibrate it internally, not even need a profile and get dead accurate color in everything, movies/games/image/web etc...

In a few years with proper OS support (windows 7??) and 10bit color depth interfaces to displays, I will move to wide Gamut. Right now, it is a mess IMO, I hate that there are fewer and fewer sRGB monitors. Sick of listening to idiot reviewers (not you) rave about the extra saturation while they look at sRGB content artificially Disneyfied in wider gamut.

Disneyfied color is not an asset, it is a problem, if you want Disney color a visit to the card control panel will get you that from a correct gamut monitor. Trying to get normal correct color from an out of gamut monitor across all your applications OTOH is currently impossible.
 
Thanks for graphs from who knows where showing a monitor that costs 2x the price of a 2408wfp losing to it, anything under 1000:1 on off is a joke. Sony 24" FW900, close enough to 25" and will beat your monitor any day. Don't forget you said they weren't "real" monitors so don't start taking sizes. Until you can come up with reputable information from a well known site it is you my friend that should just shut up. You should know that a lot of pros wouldn't even take an LCD if it were given to them, NEC or not.. still if you think you have the "bestest monitor in the worlds and you pwnz all" then good for you, I hope it helps you feel good about yourself. Your post just really reinforced the snob part in my reply, thanks! Since your new here and obviously don't know much about displays you should probably do a search on "CRT" of thread titles in this forum, you might be surprised how many agree with me.

PS, what was that last CRT vs LCD supposed to show exactly? I'm curious if you could enlighten me on what exactly you're supposed to tell from a bad digi cam shot? Just because the viewing angles are comparable doesn't mean it can properly display colors and the entire grayscale like a CRT can..

My friend, who is asking you about pros?
You interfere with a conversation, you understand the language but not the idea. I said meaning "don't believe WOWs until you know what someone had before" because average WOWers come from old shady-fady 17"(16" real)-19"(18)" CRTs. Don't you know that?
This is what most people have, what most people use alongwith TN/*VA.
They don't need much to be astonished (24" wide gamut TN could be enough for not prepared user (after 19" crappy CRT) to scream WOW) - they have not seen real monitors.
Now clear?
You really shouldn't troll this thread with FW900.
Who uses this monitor? One of 25.000? One of 50.000? Who in the right mind (except certain pros and CRT addicts) will buy this 100 Lbs (actually 22.5") CRT monster nowadays?
This exceptional CRT simply does not exist for general public. Don't you know that?
Why do you think I exclude this monitor from real ones?
BTW how would you connect Blu-ray player to watch your favorite Full HD movies, play PS3 games to CRT?
A-a-a... You prefer plasma? So go and watch your plasma, don't teach people how to get the best of their monitors.

Since your new here and obviously don't know much about displays you should probably do a search on "CRT" of thread titles in this forum, you might be surprised how many agree with me.
I never discuss "LCD vs CRT what is better" - useless.
I compare them sometimes to explain things. Some people like CRT. Why not? No problem.
I was happy to get rid of my Trinitron in favor of my first LCD 20".
I've never regretted it. No problem.

Yes, I don't know much about displays. I should probably study last century myths you are retelling in your post.

Don't forget you said they weren't "real" monitors so don't start taking sizes.
Your permission to talk sizes is not required.
Even the bottomline 22" LCD is considerably larger than typical 19"(18) or more advanced 20"(19) CRT, especially for most impressing for average public things like movies or gaming.

still if you think you have the "bestest monitor in the worlds and you pwnz all" then good for you, I hope it helps you feel good about yourself. Your post just really reinforced the snob part in my reply, thanks!
Your judgement is based on childish terms.
Try to widen your "gamut" to realize that it's not necessary to own Mona Lisa to understand what it is and to feel good about yourself.

Until you can come up with reputable information from a well known site it is you my friend that should just shut up.
What is it for and how can it help you?


Again, back on target here.
The Russian leading expert in ... hm... let's say "colorimetric management of display systems", the scientist and professional photographer Aleksey Shadrin have published an article devoted to the NEC 2690. Unfortunately I cannot properly translate this article in the whole as it's full of specific terminology, far beyond advanced monitor user practices.
In short.
He says that he has been well known strict LCD monitor negativist for years. Now he has to confess that he has changed his mind.
Reason. Expert visual assessment and spectrometric testing of the NEC 2690 were done in a professional laboratory (based on color-printing facility). The verdict: the monitor is equal to high class professional LCD monitors (including grayscale - for StaticSurge) and surpasses them in some areas. 2690 can be fully integrated in color-critical/printing process (ISO 3664:2000).
Again, unfortunately I cannot find his works (except this small part of his website) in English. That would be a good source for photo/monitor enthusiasts.

Let me add my guess that the unit did not have out-of-the-box issues.
 
Wish me luck :)

I didn't have an ounce of buyer's remorse.

I went through the thread for the 2690 and didn't find any real concerns.

I am very excited and should have it early next week.

I may disappear for a few days tweaking and reading, and then I'll come back and add my $.02.

I ended up having to purchase the separate 2690 and SVII-KIT as the retailer was out of stock on the SV version. I guess someone jumped me in queue and picked it up late yesterday, but it didn't cost much more than the full SV version, and I really want the spectraview calibration package.

I'll let y'all know what I find. I plan to test it with every HD gadget I have and play with Photoshop as much as possible on it :)

Thank you all for your information and especially Sycraft for reviewing and putting me over the edge!

Regards,

10e
 
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