Microsoft Admits Windows 10 Automatic Spying Cannot Be Stopped

[DPI]

I would even argue that he has more right since he paid money to be able to turn off telemetry 100%.

I would be 100% ok with things if Microsoft said "if you got the free upgrade, telemetry is on -- no choices. If you paid for it, here's a way to disable it completely."

In my estimation, that solves the situation cleanly for everyone.

Agreed. I would've gladly paid a $99 upgrade if it gave me full control over the OS, including the option to disable user-tracking completely, and skipping Windows Update downloading new marketing/cloud junkware I have no use for.

Windows 10 Pro Full/Retail is $199 on Newegg right now. It is simply unfathomable to me how MS has the nerve to charge that much but yet disregard these customers not to give them the choice of a data collection off switch. They obviously only respect Enterprise since they're getting the option.

Insiders and fanboys want Microsoft up their ass keylogging everything in exchange for a perpetual free copy? Lube up, enjoy. You get it free, you're the product. But paying customers should have the option. I understand Microsot really wants to monetize the data they collect, but that's a Microsoft problem, not an end user problem, and does not compel in me a sense of obligation.

 

[flu!d]

Well technically they're still taking my information even though I legitimately paid for a full retail version of the OS, information that they could resell to advertisers for all I know. So technically they could still be making money out of me...

 

[svet-am]

Well technically they're still taking my information even though I legitimately paid for a full retail version of the OS, information that they could resell to advertisers for all I know. So technically they could still be making money out of me...

From a business perspective I see how they sold this to the board and to investors. Instead of having a revenue spike every few years due to operating systems or MS Office sales they can now have continuous revenue streams in the ad-based line of business.

Still doesn't make it right, though.

 

[ManofGod]

From a business perspective I see how they sold this to the board and to investors. Instead of having a revenue spike every few years due to operating systems or MS Office sales they can now have continuous revenue streams in the ad-based line of business.

Still doesn't make it right, though.

So, they are going to get into the ads business by selling off their ads business, ok: Yeah, right.

 

[svet-am]

So, they are going to get into the ads business by selling off their ads business, ok: Yeah, right.

I actually get a kick out of how take statements out of context and then use them to mean something than what was actually said. I didn't say anything at all about internal staff. Take a look at all of the URLs that Windows 10 connects to under the hood. You can do this easily with wire shark. I have personally done it. Well over half of them are advertising firms. Do you think Microsoft is giving that data to them for free?

 

[Tawnos]

I actually get a kick out of how take statements out of context and then use them to mean something than what was actually said. I didn't say anything at all about internal staff. Take a look at all of the URLs that Windows 10 connects to under the hood. You can do this easily with wire shark. I have personally done it. Well over half of them are advertising firms. Do you think Microsoft is giving that data to them for free?

Well over half are advertising firms, from win10? Care to share which those are? I'd be interested to investigate.

 

[svet-am]

Well over half are advertising firms, from win10? Care to share which those are? I'd be interested to investigate.

Sure! I a traveling today but can do this either tonight from my hotel room or Friday when I get back home. Don't wait on me though. Fire up wire shark and start checking out the URLs on your own.

 

[x509]

I would be 100% ok with things if Microsoft said "if you got the free upgrade, telemetry is on -- no choices. If you paid for it, here's a way to disable it completely."

In my estimation, that solves the situation cleanly for everyone.

Me too, but that's not the current situation.

 

[x509]

From a business perspective I see how they sold this to the board and to investors. Instead of having a revenue spike every few years due to operating systems or MS Office sales they can now have continuous revenue streams in the ad-based line of business.

Still doesn't make it right, though.

Agree that this is not right. But, but, but. Microsoft is a publicly traded company, and senior execs sometimes have performance bonuses tied to the stock price, plus of course all those options they have. Turns out that Wall Street values "subscriptions" and other forms of continuous income more than they value the expected value of future one-time sales. In Wall Street parlance, they put a higher multiple on subscription earnings than one-time sales earnings. The "multiple" is how they calculate the target stock price based on current and forecasted future earnings.

 

[heatlesssun]

Me too, but that's not the current situation.

But paying for it doesn't mean that you wouldn't benefit from the telemetry, even indirectly, because others had it on that revealed a problem.

 

[Ocellaris]

I actually get a kick out of how take statements out of context and then use them to mean something than what was actually said. I didn't say anything at all about internal staff. Take a look at all of the URLs that Windows 10 connects to under the hood. You can do this easily with wire shark. I have personally done it. Well over half of them are advertising firms. Do you think Microsoft is giving that data to them for free?

I want to see a list of what URLs are utilized by which settings, unfortunately empirical data is a weak spot among the people who think MS is spying on everyone here. There is a lot of stuff that can be disabled during the initial setup of Windows 10, a lot of the complaining appears to be from people who went with "Express Settings" and left everything enabled. So yes, if you choose to have your information used for advertising, MS sends it to advertising companies. Do they still send your data to advertising companies when you opt out?

I am much more interested to see what connections are still being made once everything is disabled.

 

[zero2dash]

I have not played around with 10586 enough to have noticed this, but someone else did (and I'm surprised nine kinds of hell haven't been raised yet, although I guess that's probably because enterprise adoption rate is still ridiculously low).

Apparently they changed the options for telemetry in gpedit in TH2/10586 - you cannot shut the telemetry off now, even in Enterprise:

Despite all the announcements about MS giving enterprise users the option to switch off telemetry completely on new 10586 build (although it doesn't recommend it...), a tiny thing has changed, and not for the better.
The core setting is well known: Computer Configuration > Administrative Templates > Windows Components > Data Collection and Preview Builds > Allow Telemetry.

On 10240:

0. Off [Enterprise Only]
1- Basic
2. Enhanced
3. Full


A value of 0 indicates that no telemetry data from OS components is sent to Microsoft. Setting a value of 0 is applicable to enterprise and server devices only. Setting a value of 0 for other devices is equivalent to choosing a value of 1.

On 10586:

0. Security
1. Basic
2. Enhanced
3. Full


A value of 0 will send minimal data to Microsoft. This data includes Malicious Software Removal Tool (MSRT) & Windows Defender data, if enabled, and telemetry client settings.
This level is available only on Windows 10 Enterprise and Windows 10 Education, and IoT Core.

From zero data to minimal data: well, not quite a step ahead in privacy policy.

 

[chenw]

And here I was excited about finding out how to disable telemetry completely, only to find that they pin pricked a hole again.

Ah well, at least I still have Spybot's Anti-Beacon, assuming that the application works (no reason to believe it doesn't, though).

 

[evilsofa]

Ah well, at least I still have Spybot's Anti-Beacon, assuming that the application works (no reason to believe it doesn't, though).

I would take the opposite approach - assume any anti-telemetry application to be ineffective (if not malicious) until proven otherwise. It doesn't matter how much you love Spybot, there should still be other eyes checking that their anti-telemetry software actually works.

If you're going to be that suspicious of Microsoft, then you should be equally suspicious of any other company or individual that's fiddling with the way your OS is collecting telemetry.