Mechanical Keyboard Guide

SolidSnakeUS said:
I did the full customize thing and I could not find anything on how to make it look like that. I might have to type it out like that in the text box?
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Either that or upload it as a picture. You could email them and ask, they are really quick to answer emails.
 
I think I'm down to wanting the Rosewill MX Brown Keyboard (RK-9000BR). Seems to basically be Filco quality, less price and like that I can just get it from Newegg, which is a place I do trust. Curious, if anyone can find one, can someone show me some pictures of basically what it would look like with red/blue keys (WASD ones or something like that) over the red steel backplate?
 
Forceman said:
I'm not a retail store, so that is completely irrelevant. Amazon's return policy is one of their competitive advantages, and one of the reasons they have done so well in the online market. No matter how much research you do, you still can't reproduce the feel of actually using a product - and without the opportunity to test drive the product somehow, what else are you going to do? I'm supposed to just accept that trying a product is going to cost me $20? If and when Amazon charges a restocking fee, then I'll pay it, but it's hardly taking advantage of their policy to buy from them and then return it if I don't like it. That's kind of the whole basis for the "no questions asked" return policy.

I don't buy three different versions of the same thing and then return the two I don't like; but if I've done the research and it still turns out I don't like the one I thought would be right, I have no compunctions about returning it, and no one else should either.
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I'm siding with you on this one.

A keyboard is different than, say, RAM or a hard drive because those two things just have to work. With a keyboard, it'll 99.99% of the time work when you open it up and plug it in, but there's a lot of things about a keyboard that boil down to personal preference. I find myself in the same situation as a lot of people here: I've never owned a mechanical before, and while I've tried a few switches before (blues on the BWU and reds on the K90 at my local Fry's), I have no way of trying out other types of switches other than just buying the keyboard and seeing if I like it. I can read all the descriptions I want about whether its linear or tactile or how much the actuation force is, but it's incredibly difficult to "imagine" what a switch will feel like just from descriptive text alone.

I'm not advocating buying a keyboard, using the shit out of it, and then returning it before the return policy runs out. I hate people who do that, or the people who buy motherboards from Fry's and then return it without SATA cables or I/O panels or with a missing capacitor or something. However, I don't see the harm in buying a keyboard, trying it out for a day or two to see if you like the switches or not, and then returning it, as long as your sole intention is to just try it out and you don't abuse it. Return policies are there for a reason.
 
Why not just order ever keyswitch available on Amazon and return all but one like a scumbag. I'm sure that'll result in Amazon making a killing off of you.


The return policy is there for legitimate complaints, not to be used as a rental service.
 
BababooeyHTJ said:
Why not just order ever keyswitch available on Amazon and return all but one like a scumbag. I'm sure that'll result in Amazon making a killing off of you.


The return policy is there for legitimate complaints, not to be used as a rental service.
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Unfortunately it gets abused far too often and I'm waiting for the inevitable to happen and Amazon starts cracking it down.

Wanna see something worse, though? Go to a Costco or a Wal Mart.
 
Q-BZ said:
Unfortunately it gets abused far too often and I'm waiting for the inevitable to happen and Amazon starts cracking it down.

Wanna see something worse, though? Go to a Costco or a Wal Mart.
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Yeah, I love the "oh, I wouldn't like it if someone did that to me on the forums" but its different when I do the same damn thing on Amazon.
 
BababooeyHTJ said:
Why not just order ever keyswitch available on Amazon and return all but one like a scumbag. I'm sure that'll result in Amazon making a killing off of you.


The return policy is there for legitimate complaints, not to be used as a rental service.
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Jesus, grow up and climb down off your high horse. No one said anything about ordering every possible combination just to rent them for a while to play with. We said if you are going to buy something that is highly subjective, like a keyboard, buy it from somewhere that has a liberal return policy so you can return it if you genuinely don't like it. How is that being a dick? That's why they have return policies. If you don't think Amazon has that policy because they know that as an internet store they have to accommodate people who are reluctant to buy things online because they can't try them out before hand, you're kidding yourself. That's why people shop there.

I'm curious, have you never bought something and then not liked it and returned it? Are you so altruistic that you take a loss on everything you don't like by re-selling it instead of returning it?
 
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...it's not mechanical, it's $24 shipped, and for $65 shipped you could pick up a CM Storm Quickfire a few days ago. Doesn't belong in this thread.
 
Hence why I said that it was for those who are interested in a mechanical KB an can't afford one. Like me, I could barely afford the $23 I spent on the board, I am a broke college student getting married in May and have to save up every penny I can for that.
 
ranviper said:
Hence why I said that it was for those who are interested in a mechanical KB an can't afford one. Like me, I could barely afford the $23 I spent on the board, I am a broke college student getting married in May and have to save up every penny I can for that.
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Too soon?

No rush man. Take your time.
 
WorldExclusive said:
Too soon?

No rush man. Take your time.
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The reason I am "broke" is because the money I do have is going to my wedding - I already have a job after school, I graduate before the wedding. I am in a fine financial state, just the money is going to better things.
 
ranviper said:
The reason I am "broke" is because the money I do have is going to my wedding - I already have a job after school, I graduate before the wedding. I am in a fine financial state, just the money is going to better things.
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Ok, cool. Thought you were out of money in general.

Enjoy the wedding. :)
 
I've received my WASD Cherry key samples (red, blue and brown only -> key caps with the cherry assemblies only) and here are my impressions and also some questions (questions are last in my post, so skip to them if you just want to help me :)). Bare in mind that this is the first time that i play with Cherry mech keys, i've only used cheap membrane mechs and some good quality scissor keyboards (Logitech UltraX and some IBM laptop ones).

First of all, i'm really, really impressed by the feel of them, it's nothing like the cheap membrane keys i've used. The quality and feel of the cherry keys cannot compare to anything else with a cheap membrane. I really think now it's worth paying the high price for such a keyboard and i'll definitely buy one. Membrane keyboards shouldn't exist, they are an abomination. :p

Ok, so here are my impressions:

Blue:
-I like the sound of it, that click, but is kinda loud, i' think it could be a problem on the long run. But damn, it's such a satisfying sound. :D
-The tactile bump is more defined than Browns, it feels like an actual bump, not like a rough bump (don't know how to better describe the Brown bump).
-Just as hard to press like the Brown. It's OK for me, but i would prefer something like the Red's pressing force (i think it's 45 grams, iirc)

Brown:
-I don't like the bump. :( It's more rough, less defined and thus it feels to me like a lesser quality key mechanism. I can't pinpoint the bump as clearly as the Blue, hard to describe, it's like it's not as consistent every time i press it.

Red:
I think these will be my favorites.
-Lighter to press, i think it's good for RSI sufferers (my right hand started to show signs)
-Since it's much easier to press, it's also easier to bottom out and i like the clack it makes. :D
-I think these are better for gaming. Not sure, though (read my second question below)****.

Questions:

-For linear keyswitches like Reds, the keystroke is still generated after 2mm, just like with the tactile keyswitches, right? It's just you don't feel it, correct? I think i prefer this because i have a choice for the feedback and noise (as i can still touch type, without making any sound, or i can bottom out, for the clank, in both cases i still have that smooth and light key travel of Reds)

-****This is kinda important, as i also play games: With tactile key switches like Brown and Blue, if i bottom out the key, can i still get another key press registered if i don't let the switch spring fully? Imagine my finger bottoming out the key and then slightly lifting it, but only until i reach the bottom of the bump and not lifting it any further. At that point, is a new keystroke generated? Or do i have to lift the finger completely and then press it again?
I'm thinking this could be a problem with FPS games and the way direction keys (WASD) are pressed by me.
 
Blues won't register a key press without the click. That actuation point is where the switch actually registers input. Cherry MX Blacks and Reds both actuate at the same point, but they do not have a tactile bump. It is technically possible to type without making a sound in theory, but it would take a lot of training to do it with any kind of consistency.
 
You can't make too much of a conclusion from a loose key switch. Typing on a keyboard full of them is an entirely different experience.

As for your question, browns and reds actuate at the exact same point.
 
BababooeyHTJ said:
You can't make too much of a conclusion from a loose key switch. Typing on a keyboard full of them is an entirely different experience.

As for your question, browns and reds actuate at the exact same point.
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Right. It's just that browns have a tactile response in the form of a bump, while Cherry MX Reds do not.
 
BababooeyHTJ said:
You can't make too much of a conclusion from a loose key switch. Typing on a keyboard full of them is an entirely different experience.
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I know, i've expected that. For example, i've noticed that the sound changes dramatically depending on the surface the key switch is placed on (wood, metal, heavy rubber, etc); maybe that's why heavy, solid keyboards have such a good sound: less reverberation.
Anyway, i just wanted to see how much i have to press a particular cherry key switch, to feel the tactile bump in brown and blue keys and to hear the click of the blue switch; i think the key samples helped me in this regard.

Btw, are there any other switches like the blues, with the same click sound (or slightly similar), but with a lighter key press? Or an even lighter switch than Reds, linear switch?
 
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DG25 said:
I know, i've expected that. For example, i've noticed that the sound changes dramatically depending on the surface the key switch is placed on (wood, metal, heavy rubber, etc); maybe that's why heavy, solid keyboards have such a good sound: less reverberation.
Anyway, i just wanted to see how much i have to press a particular cherry key switch, to feel the tactile bump in brown and blue keys and to hear the click of the blue switch; i think the key samples helped me in this regard.

Btw, are there any other switches like the blues, with the same click sound (or slightly similar), but with a lighter key press? Or an even lighter switch than Reds, linear switch?
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Browns, blues, and reds all use the same spring. The only difference is the stem. They'll feel different when you're stretching with you pinky finger for a key mounted into a keyboard or double tapping. I wouldn't draw too much of a conclusion just yet.
 
I've mounted them like this, so i can try double tapping and pinky pressing. :D


All of them feel great and i've started to like the Brown switch. Argh, can't decide, maybe i should get three keyboards, each with a different switch. :)
 
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That's what I'm doing. Currently I have several boards, and more on the way:

IBM Model M (buckling spring, heavy force required, very loud click)
Leopold FC200R (Cherry MX Brown, light force required, slightly tactile bump, no click)
CM Storm Quickfire Rapid (Cherry MX Blue, light force required, slight tactile bump, moderate click)
Data911 (Cherry MX Black w/ rubber backing sheet, heavy force required, heavy tactile bump from rubber sheet / domes, no click. Very odd board, can't decide if I like it or not. I will probably remove the rubber backing sheet as this will make it behave like normal MX Black switches)
Cherry Point of Sale compact (Cherry ML switches -- like a low profile MX Black. Sometimes I like these, other times not so much. Only has 2KRO and does not seem to cooperate with all BIOS -- some will not register CTRL-I to get in Intel RAID setup, or F1, for example)

I have a pair of SIIG MiniTouch boards in the mail to me soon, one with Cherry MX Clear switches (really looking forward to these, I think they will fit my typing style well) and one with Monterey switches.
 
I am really in doubt between reds and browns. I see some people that say they don't feel much difference between them? But it is hard to try a mech around here. I tried a razer BW with blues in a local shop. I thought they made to much noise, and found them just a little to stiff. But I would like the tactile feedback. I'm currently using a logitech illuminated and like it that I know when I have hit the button hard enough.
I think I'm more into the browns? And then I would purchase a ducky shine. If I would take reds than I would buy the Corsair K90 (that one is cheaper to get it here in the Netherlands, and easier). I'm also afraid I'm gonna hit buttons I don't want to when I would take reds because I sometimes lightly rest my vingers on the buttons. And what I like about the corsair is the wrist rest.
I use my keyboard 40% for gaming and 60% for normal stuff.

What would you guys recommend?
 
The reds are too light for me. But they aren't so light that simply resting your fingers on them should cause keys to register. And remember there is no tactile feedback with the reds. So if you want that, browns are really the only way you are going to get that without making a ton of noises.
 
Did you find browns to be a bit too light for you as well? I've never tried reds so I really have no clue how much lighter they actually feel. I like a tactile switch so I'm in no rush to go out and try a board with reds.
 
BababooeyHTJ said:
Did you find browns to be a bit too light for you as well? I've never tried reds so I really have no clue how much lighter they actually feel. I like a tactile switch so I'm in no rush to go out and try a board with reds.
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Red are pretty damned light. Easier to press than blues or browns for sure.
 
Dan_D said:
Red are pretty damned light. Easier to press than blues or browns for sure.
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If the reds are lighter than the browns, they must be pretty darn light, because the browns hardly seem to take any force to press (but not in a bad way). The browns also don't really seem to have any kind of noticeable tactile bump - I know they are supposed to, but it is very subdued compared to the blues. I don't know if some people actually type by feeling for the bump and then stop putting pressure on the key (I just mash them all the way down) but if you do the browns might not be noticeable enough for that kind of typing (the blues would be).

The browns feel really good though.
 
Forceman said:
If the reds are lighter than the browns, they must be pretty darn light, because the browns hardly seem to take any force to press (but not in a bad way). The browns also don't really seem to have any kind of noticeable tactile bump - I know they are supposed to, but it is very subdued compared to the blues. I don't know if some people actually type by feeling for the bump and then stop putting pressure on the key (I just mash them all the way down) but if you do the browns might not be noticeable enough for that kind of typing (the blues would be).

The browns feel really good though.
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I feel the bump in the browns and to me they feel stiffer than the blues do. Blacks actually have more actuation force required than the tactile keys do, but they feel lighter to me because they lack that tactile bump or click. Reds are just super light to me.
 
I got my free samples of the keys today. Definite difference between them, but the problem is, it would be better if I had a full keyboard though. Do like the Blue, Brown and Clear.
 
el-jorge said:
I am really in doubt between reds and browns. I see some people that say they don't feel much difference between them? But it is hard to try a mech around here. I tried a razer BW with blues in a local shop. I thought they made to much noise, and found them just a little to stiff. But I would like the tactile feedback. I'm currently using a logitech illuminated and like it that I know when I have hit the button hard enough.
I think I'm more into the browns? And then I would purchase a ducky shine. If I would take reds than I would buy the Corsair K90 (that one is cheaper to get it here in the Netherlands, and easier). I'm also afraid I'm gonna hit buttons I don't want to when I would take reds because I sometimes lightly rest my vingers on the buttons. And what I like about the corsair is the wrist rest.
I use my keyboard 40% for gaming and 60% for normal stuff.

What would you guys recommend?
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I'd go with the Corsair K90. If you've tried the Razer BW then I can tell you that the Corsair is a noticably easier key press. The keys on the K90 don't "click" like they do on the BW. I actually have the K90 and have been considering the BW lately because I kind of like the click and additional actuation force. Just to styme the potential insecurity: I've never accidently pressed a key on the K90 because it was too easy to actuate, for the record...
 
I even just did the nickel thing for weighing my current keys and they come out to anywhere between 70 and 80g of actuation. So honestly, a Brown sounds very good right about now.
 
Dan_D said:
I feel the bump in the browns and to me they feel stiffer than the blues do. Blacks actually have more actuation force required than the tactile keys do, but they feel lighter to me because they lack that tactile bump or click. Reds are just super light to me.
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Hmm. I can feel the bump in the browns if I am looking for it, but in normal use I don't notice it (like you do with the blues). The blues have that definitive actuation feel like the old buckling springs did so maybe I'm just comparing/used to that kind of feel. I think for me the difference was that the force for the blues was kind of all right at that acutation point, with very little resistance elsewhere, but the browns have a more spread out actuation feel. Kind of hard to describe.

It's all so subjective though, so it's hard for anyone to explain/tell anyone what to get - you kind of have to make a leap of faith and see how you like it.
 
Forceman said:
If the reds are lighter than the browns, they must be pretty darn light, because the browns hardly seem to take any force to press (but not in a bad way). The browns also don't really seem to have any kind of noticeable tactile bump - I know they are supposed to, but it is very subdued compared to the blues. I don't know if some people actually type by feeling for the bump and then stop putting pressure on the key (I just mash them all the way down) but if you do the browns might not be noticeable enough for that kind of typing (the blues would be).

The browns feel really good though.
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I agree with you. I've been using mx browns for a good year or so now and gotten pretty used to them. One day I just noticed that I don't bottom out all of the time. I think that the tactile bump does help. Do I go out of my way to feel for it and stop? No but you just get really accustomed to using a certain switch over a period of time I guess. I agree that browns are super light. It's hard to picture a lighter key. I love them. I've tried a fair amount of different switches and always go back to browns.

I really think that the tactile point on plate mounted mx blues is overly stiff. It feels like black alps to me. Every once in a while you'll hit a key in such a way that it'll feel like an alps key binding up. I can't stand it. This isn't a problem on pcb mounted mx blues for me. They do seem to feel much smoother to me, like a buckling spring honestly. The only part that sucks is that I don't know of a board with pcb mounted mx blues and costar stabilizers.
 
Hmmm hard decision. I Think I'm going to try the corsair. It is cheaper and easier to purchase here. If I don't like I can always try to purchase a Ducky with browns and backlight. The hard thing is I like the corsair also for it's wrist rest and media keys. I like the ducky because of its brown keys with backlit.
 
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Picked up the corsair today. It is going back tomorrow. The backlight on one of the keys was not working. And it makes a lot more noise than I expected from what I heard of the videos on youtube. I dont like that. Probably going to look for some rubberdome keyboard.
 
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