Mass Effect: Andromeda

[M76]

No one said it shipped in an acceptable state. We said it shipped in a playable enough state to be completed. Nothing more.

Well I think the patches made it worse. I liked the undisturbed space flight animations, and they put a "press whatever to skip" text on top of it that doesn't even go away. Killed my immersion right there.

 

[Dan_D]

Well I think the patches made it worse. I liked the undisturbed space flight animations, and they put a "press whatever to skip" text on top of it that doesn't even go away. Killed my immersion right there.

Fuck that. Those animations were cool, but I hated being forced to sit through them time and time again. After visiting about 10 planets or a couple of star systems I grew tired of that crap. You are definitely in the minority as most people applauded the change, saying things like "this is how it should have been to start with." A sentiment I agree with. I wish they shortened the take off and landing animations. Again, it's fine the first few times but it gets tedious quickly. Fortunately, there is a mod that does just that.

 

[zamardii12]

Well I think the patches made it worse. I liked the undisturbed space flight animations, and they put a "press whatever to skip" text on top of it that doesn't even go away. Killed my immersion right there.

I agree. I beat the game before a single patch was released at launch and I got used to the flying animations quickly. I kept my mind in the head-space of being a adventurer... and plus I am a space junkie and love this stuff so I didn't mind it.

 

[MacLeod]

What he's talking about was an issue. It wasn't just a skin tone problem but the fact that all the presets were hideous for both males and females. The character creator was shit among other failings. To some extent these issues remain. The character creator still sucks although new presets have been added which are less bad and you can finally create a white person if you want to.

Agreed. I think the way the characters looked played a big role in us not really giving a shit about then.

Both male and female Shepard looked like bad asses that could take on the galaxy. The male Ryder looked like an accountant, typical pussy whipped millennial complete with patchy beard and the female looked like a mousey librarian. And both were outright laughable when they tried to act tough.

The supporting cast looking like random, boring people you see everyday at work really hurt the game too. I don't care about boring, average looking people because I see them every day! Hell I'm one of them! I want female characters like Miranda, Ashley and Tali (my favorite) that are smart, strong and gorgeous. I want male characters like Garus, Wrex and Thane who are bad asses that you would love to go to battle with then get drunk with.

That was always my biggest gripe about ME:A. Not the animation or the bugs, it was the laughable characters. To me that's what made ME:1-3 so great, the cast. What's widely accepted as the best DLC? The Citadel. There's very little fighting or story to it. It's just the cast of characters interacting. Could you imagine a "Citadel" DLC with ME:A's characters being interesting?

 

[Dan_D]

Agreed. I think the way the characters looked played a big role in us not really giving a shit about then.

Both male and female Shepard looked like bad asses that could take on the galaxy. The male Ryder looked like an accountant, typical pussy whipped millennial complete with patchy beard and the female looked like a mousey librarian. And both were outright laughable when they tried to act tough.

The supporting cast looking like random, boring people you see everyday at work really hurt the game too. I don't care about boring, average looking people because I see them every day! Hell I'm one of them! I want female characters like Miranda, Ashley and Tali (my favorite) that are smart, strong and gorgeous. I want male characters like Garus, Wrex and Thane who are bad asses that you would love to go to battle with then get drunk with.

That was always my biggest gripe about ME:A. Not the animation or the bugs, it was the laughable characters. To me that's what made ME:1-3 so great, the cast. What's widely accepted as the best DLC? The Citadel. There's very little fighting or story to it. It's just the cast of characters interacting. Could you imagine a "Citadel" DLC with ME:A's characters being interesting?

There are two real problems with Mass Effect Andromeda. The first is that neither Scott nor Sara are all that much fun to play comparatively. If you take the smart ass approach they can be amusing at times but really, they are poor substitutes for Shepard. Shepard was much more fun to play. Ryder attempts to be too diplomatic and too realistic in a way. Shepard was larger than life in everything he or she did.

For example, Shepard's interrupt actions from ME2 onward were always decisive and fun. You could fry a gunship mechanic, push a guy out a window, shoot a hostage, punch the hostage taker, threaten to rip some guys balls off, etc. Ryder's interrupts are generally hugs and kisses. (Seriously, most of Ryder's interrupt actions actually involve hugging and kissing.) At one point Ryder stumbles on a couple exiles going through the pockets of a murder victim in a back alley. You can tell them looting is wrong and the looters tell you to fuck off. Even SAM tells you not to antagonize them further. Further attempts to talk to them gets you told to fuck off without dialog choices. Shepard ran into the same exact situation in ME2 on Omega and you told them how it was going to be and they listened to you one way or another.

The second problem is another big one. ME1 suffered from a lot of failings that people rip on Andromeda for. In many ways it's true to ME1's formula. However, ME1 did one thing that ultimately made it a success. Mass Effect one presented a universe filled with detail and atmosphere that made it a place you would want to go if you could actually do it. It's interesting, unforgiving, full of wonder and life. You have minimal aliens compared to Star Wars, yet the universe had depth and a kind of realism in some aspects. It was also relatable and filled with mystery. Andromeda gives you a narrative in which planets are inhospitable and that makes sense in the narrative but it's not as exciting a place to be. The Nexus is huge and we could have seen much more of it and it could have had the scale and splendor it deserved while making it feel more like the original games and not change the narrative.

We also could have seen a sprawling Angaran city at the very least, similar to an Alien Illium but instead we got one small town and everything else amounted to prefabricated structures that looked pretty much like what the Initiative brought with them to Andromeda for settlers and colonists. Kadara port and Aya were missed opportunities, even though they are for the most part executed well enough. The Andromeda galaxy, or Heleus proper anyway doesn't have much to offer beyond three new species. One of which is a cut rate combination of Reapers and Collectors, and the other is a group that looks like a mixture of aliens we've seen previously that live like refugees. The Remnant are like the Protheans, and this is one point where I think Andromeda succeeds. Their structures and technology do provide a sense of wonder and awe at times. They offer genuine mystery, but the game tends to treat them as more of a side note in places with the Angaran and Kett being the focus. Neither of which are compelling.

 

[singe_101]

This isn't a disagreement post. I also haven't finished it, I am on Kadara. That looting mini-event was pretty dumb.

Gotta go custom Ryder, I watched a Youtube video to see why Vetra doesn't talk to a Turian ex-Spectre and it was still lame, no reaction.

The initiative is made up of civilians, mostly like Udina and Khalisah al-Jilani. Conrad Verner's sister made it in. They weren't even ready to let Ryder aboard the Tempest to help the damn Nexus without Vetra pulling strings.

The text in-game tells you the wimpy little Charger SMG is standard issue and Liam uses it. The Pathfinder weapons are DLC but free if you used Origin Access, they're weaker than the N7 military weapons.

Bain Massani and the black ops Angara are kind of interesting.

 

[Dan_D]

This isn't a disagreement post. I also haven't finished it, I am on Kadara. That looting mini-event was pretty dumb.

Gotta go custom Ryder, I watched a Youtube video to see why Vetra doesn't talk to a Turian ex-Spectre and it was still lame, no reaction.

The initiative is made up of civilians, mostly like Udina and Khalisah al-Jilani. Conrad Verner's sister made it in. They weren't even ready to let Ryder aboard the Tempest to help the damn Nexus without Vetra pulling strings.

The text in-game tells you the wimpy little Charger SMG is standard issue and Liam uses it. The Pathfinder weapons are DLC but free if you used Origin Access, they're weaker than the N7 military weapons.

Bain Massani and the black ops Angara are kind of interesting.

Well, since you haven't finished it I'll keep my mouth mostly shut. There are some solid positives for the game. Things revolving around the Remnant do get really good and the end mission of the game is nothing short of spectacular. If we cared more about the characters it would easily be on par with the final missions in ME1 and ME2. Visually, Meridian is stunning and quite interesting. The quest line, Ryder family secrets is excellent and it ties in well with the other games.

Unfortunately, there are some great plot lines that thread through the game nicely, but end abruptly. Ryder Family Secrets is one example of this.

Spoiler: Ryder Family Secrets

The quest; "Ryder Family Secrets" not only tells Ryder why the Initiative really exists, but establishes almost certain connections to Cerberus and reveals that Ryder's mother didn't die. She was put in stasis and brought to Andromeda. These are big plot threads that should have been leveraged. Instead, Ryder does nothing with the information.

This is due to the fact that the game was rushed and no DLC was developed for it. Andromeda has been setup for an outstanding sequel as the foundation established is certainly there. Unfortunately, I doubt we'll see a sequel to this story line at any point in the future.

 

[singe_101]

How'd the topic change from characters and the Tempest crew to missions and plot? Thanks for not spoiling it, though.

They could let us do fetch quests as a non-human character, even without allowing it on the main missions. Players could be Krogan in ME3 multiplayer, which blocks more of the screen but it worked.

It's already strange I can respec to a biotic god. I bet nobody comments on it, or using remnant weapons. The Angarans are pleased I have an old helmet but no comment on my sniper rifle with unlimited energy, it just has to cool down.

 

[Dan_D]

Doing fetch quests as a non-human character, and not the character you spend hours building up and doing story content with would be pointless.

 

[singe_101]

But you said they weren't that fun to play comparatively, and it was too late to change their main characters much but they could allow some changes of pace.

They already have the mode where you can't save the game on crucial missions so those would require Ryder.

It wouldn't have to be dumb quests, it could be to clear out the massive Kett base on Eos with the final boss (Cardinal?). That took some time and I got the Valkyrie and Hornet combo I like instead of random weapons.

Strike team missions are already in there, they could be single player but let us pick all three on the squad. Aya also has a simulator arena that Cora is always looking at, so use their tech and copy ME3's fun DLC arena.

 

[Dan_D]

But you said they weren't that fun to play comparatively, and it was too late to change their main characters much but they could allow some changes of pace.

They already have the mode where you can't save the game on crucial missions so those would require Ryder.

It wouldn't have to be dumb quests, it could be to clear out the massive Kett base on Eos with the final boss (Cardinal?). That took some time and I got the Valkyrie and Hornet combo I like instead of random weapons.

Strike team missions are already in there, they could be single player but let us pick all three on the squad. Aya also has a simulator arena that Cora is always looking at, so use their tech and copy ME3's fun DLC arena.

The Ryder siblings would still be more fun to play doing bullshit fetch quests than some random Turian or Krogan we don't know jack shit about with next to no dialog. This is why I say it's pointless. There are a lot of reasons why games like this have human protagonists and don't let you select other races. One of them, is research has shown that the average person doesn't find aliens relatable enough. It's an RPG title and for all the outliers that scream "I want to play an alien", there seems to be a larger number that say otherwise. I'm in the camp that says otherwise. If I fantasize about flying through space on a starship, I'm still me. A better version of me for sure, but I'm still wanting to be me or something close to me. I don't want to look like a fucking bird or a lizard.

In a sense, the multiplayer is what you are asking about. They are combat missions loosely tied to the main story using characters that have no direct tie to the main characters. It was this way for ME3 as well. Running fetch quests by breaking immersion to switch to a nobody character doesn't make any sense.

 

[M76]

Fuck that. Those animations were cool, but I hated being forced to sit through them time and time again. After visiting about 10 planets or a couple of star systems I grew tired of that crap. You are definitely in the minority as most people applauded the change, saying things like "this is how it should have been to start with." A sentiment I agree with. I wish they shortened the take off and landing animations. Again, it's fine the first few times but it gets tedious quickly. Fortunately, there is a mod that does just that.

No, fuck that text. I'm not saying it shouldn't be skippable, I'm saying the text on it ruined it completely for me. I never even wanted to skip it before they put in the option, then I had no choice but to skip it, because all I could focus on was that text. How it should've been, or how I would have made it is if the space flight sequence was viewed trough the ship's bridge monitor. The landing animations were annoying me too, but they never made those skippable.

 

[Dan_D]

No, fuck that text. I'm not saying it shouldn't be skippable, I'm saying the text on it ruined it completely for me. I never even wanted to skip it before they put in the option, then I had no choice but to skip it, because all I could focus on was that text. How it should've been, or how I would have made it is if the space flight sequence was viewed trough the ship's bridge monitor. The landing animations were annoying me too, but they never made those skippable.

Fair enough. Removal of the text or the ability to turn off said text would have made everyone happy.

 

[zamardii12]

Ryder attempts to be too diplomatic and too realistic in a way. Shepard was larger than life in everything he or she did.

Ryder being diplomatic and too realistic is what made his character good. He lived in the shadow of his father and never really wanted the responsibility of the Pathfinder. The whole idea of traveling to another galaxy where you might encounter people and races you don't know implies that although you still have a personality of your own you HAVE to be more diplomatic because in a sense you ARE a diplomat to the entire human race.

Shephard was larger than life because his/her very role was to defend the Milky Way from complete destruction and the wiping out of life in the entire galaxy. He was a single person as you say "larger than life," b/c his/her very existence was predicated on the idea that you were the last hope to defend the Milky Way and bring together all the races and groups against a coming Armageddon. Nowhere in Andromeda is there a threat of this magnitude, so the role of both Ryders would not have lived up to Shephard ever which is why when I recommend MA: Andromeda to people who held out on it until now that it's buy-able for $10, is to go into it with an open mind and not try to compare it to the Shephard trilogy. It's not fair.

 

[Dan_D]

Ryder being diplomatic and too realistic is what made his character good. He lived in the shadow of his father and never really wanted the responsibility of the Pathfinder. The whole idea of traveling to another galaxy where you might encounter people and races you don't know implies that although you still have a personality of your own you HAVE to be more diplomatic because in a sense you ARE a diplomat to the entire human race.

Shephard was larger than life because his/her very role was to defend the Milky Way from complete destruction and the wiping out of life in the entire galaxy. He was a single person as you say "larger than life," b/c his/her very existence was predicated on the idea that you were the last hope to defend the Milky Way and bring together all the races and groups against a coming Armageddon. Nowhere in Andromeda is there a threat of this magnitude, so the role of both Ryders would not have lived up to Shephard ever which is why when I recommend MA: Andromeda to people who held out on it until now that it's buy-able for $10, is to go into it with an open mind and not try to compare it to the Shephard trilogy. It's not fair.

That's not entirely true. Shepard became a Council SPECTRE and got nearly unlimited freedom before anyone knew that the fate of the Milky Way was really at stake. In fact, Shepard didn't even know just where things were headed yet as he was made a SPECTRE before he got a complete Prothean warning message or talked to Sovereign. I agree the character's roles are somewhat different, but in the example I used above, there was no reason why Ryder had to be a pussy in that situation. You are armored, heavily armed and the looters weren't. You also outnumbered them three to two. You also are 634 years beyond Council space in a lawless land of exiles and criminals in some cases. While being diplomatic makes sense on Aya, it doesn't make sense on Kadara. They could have kept to the same themes and still made Ryder more fun to play.

I agree the character is at it's core good enough. My problem is that it's not as much fun to play as Shepard was.

 

[singe_101]

Ryder being diplomatic and too realistic is what made his character good. He lived in the shadow of his father and never really wanted the responsibility of the Pathfinder. The whole idea of traveling to another galaxy where you might encounter people and races you don't know implies that although you still have a personality of your own you HAVE to be more diplomatic because in a sense you ARE a diplomat to the entire human race.
.

The dorks are in the original trilogy like the council, Udina, and C-Sec who had too many restrictions for Garrus. It makes sense the four council races wouldn't really agree to overhaul their style by the time of the Initiative launch, even when they're still annoying to the player. The N7 Ryder had to sneak in improved SAM and the symbiosis, and work with the Shadow Broker, etc.

And why not bring all badasses? If there's a problem, they mutiny and fight. And the Collective already breaks off from exile Milky Way beings and they fight.

 

[Litfod]

The second problem is another big one. ME1 suffered from a lot of failings that people rip on Andromeda for. In many ways it's true to ME1's formula. However, ME1 did one thing that ultimately made it a success. Mass Effect one presented a universe filled with detail and atmosphere that made it a place you would want to go if you could actually do it. It's interesting, unforgiving, full of wonder and life. You have minimal aliens compared to Star Wars, yet the universe had depth and a kind of realism in some aspects.

That last part was definitely the key for me. Pre-Andromeda Mass Effect had a small number of memorable key alien species, with strong back stories relating them to each other (esp Krogan/Salarians). It was a really solid foundation for the (increasingly flaky) storytelling they built on top. And then Andromeda ditched that whole foundation, and replaced it with utterly forgettable and derivative new aliens. I can't even remember what they look like now (when I try and think of the Kett I just end up with a mental image of Batarians). And then they ditched the memorable and fun, ass-kicking Shepard (playing primarily renegade led to a lot of fun interactions) and replaced him/her with the forgettable, derivative and utterly bland Ryder, a "hero" who is dumped in the lead role at the expense of Cora, who was more qualified and who would have been more interesting to play. Although I was perfectly content with how my custom (female) Ryder looked, even if she did resemble a middle class art school student rather than a "pathfinder".

I didn't share a lot of the complaints that came up at the time, largely because I remember how shit the ME1/2 character editors were, and because the series was never exactly on Uncharted levels of technical excellence. I enjoyed Andromeda for the most part, but they really threw the baby out with the bathwater when they ditched the milky way. After ME3 it was clear they no longer had the story telling backbone required to reproduce the elements which made the original trilogy as successful as it was.

 

[DF-1]

so what mods specifically did you guys use? i'm thinking about trying this out finally.

 

[Dan_D]

so what mods specifically did you guys use? i'm thinking about trying this out finally.

I use a shit ton of them. However, these are the ones I think improve the overall quality of life in the game.

Faster Kadara doors.
Iron Man Mod (Be careful, it can get you into trouble)
Shorter take off and landing sequences.
Better Nomad 4WD.
All weapon ranges increased.
Nomad top speed / boost increased.
Minimal reticles.
Tempest store - Extended
Ultimate camera FOV mode. (A must in my opinion.)

I also like PeeBee unmasked, X5 Ghost lights fixed, Suvi remake, road rage, Cora - Asari Underarmor / new armor, New armor for Liam, New armor for PeeBee, Pathfinder scarf removal, colorless weapon mods, Beta - initiative clear visors, Tempest wood replacer, blue omni-tool, and a few others.

 

[TaintedSquirrel]

If I ever replay this game, I am for sure using that Iron Man mod.

The 1st Person Mod looks good too

https://www.nexusmods.com/masseffectandromeda/mods/563/

 

[Flogger23m]

That first person mod does look interesting. I also find it amazing that it even has such mods. Looks like ME:A is more moddable than previous ME games, and even BF. I would've thought they'd lock down the engine like they did in BF.

 

[Blade-Runner]

Any recommendations for gameplay mods?

 

[Dan_D]

If I ever replay this game, I am for sure using that Iron Man mod.

The 1st Person Mod looks good too

https://www.nexusmods.com/masseffectandromeda/mods/563/

The Iron Man mod kicks ass. It's better than traveling by Nomad where the environment won't kill you and it makes short work of fetch quests. The 1st person mod doesn't work very well. You end up with no head in conversations.

That first person mod does look interesting. I also find it amazing that it even has such mods. Looks like ME:A is more moddable than previous ME games, and even BF. I would've thought they'd lock down the engine like they did in BF.

I already covered a list of game play mods. There are more that can make you overpowered etc. but I don't use them. The game is easy enough, even on Insanity.

 

[Armenius]

Drew Karpyshyn quit Bioware again. Hopes for a Mass Effect comeback, however slim they were, are now dead.

https://archive.is/D4XJP

Article says he was working on additional projects before he left, in addition to Anthem.

 

[Q-BZ]

Drew Karpyshyn quit Bioware again. Hopes for a Mass Effect comeback, however slim they were, are now dead.

https://archive.is/D4XJP

Article says he was working on additional projects before he left, in addition to Anthem.

From that IGN article you cited:

Karpyshyn won't be leaving the industry altogether. He will now be writing in a freelance capacity, first for FoxNext Games' new studio, Fogbank Entertainment, where he will be working alongside former BioWare writers Alex Freed and Daniel Erickson.


The studio's current project is described only as an "episodic narrative game, which will draw from story, character, and location elements based on acclaimed Fox intellectual property as well as original content."

I see this is as potentially good news. These guys are free of EA and all that goes with it and they are working together. That's nothing but good. It's a start.


I think the only way we would ever see any games more along the lines of what we would hope to see from Bioware ever again would have be if enough of them left EA and joined up somewhere else. Shy of that I have little to no hope on the subject.

 

[Sprayingmango]

Has this game ever been fixed? Or is it still a janky, disgusting mess?

 

[Dan_D]

Has this game ever been fixed? Or is it still a janky, disgusting mess?

A lot of the animation and technical issues have been fixed. On a purely technical level, it's the most polished of them now save for Mass Effect 2, which is easily the best quality of all the series. Animation isn't perfect, but there are now fewer animation glitches, clipping, and other issues than you'll find in the rest of the series. All the quests are fixed too. The menus are still a mess, but they aren't any worse than ME1's menus which were a total clusterfuck.

 

[singe_101]

They're better at making Turians than Ryder. Or Krogan, I went through Krogan cutscenes and it was fine.

Also it is weird to see the Krogan using the Avenger. They won't all have the Ruzad but Hesh, Dhan, Pirahna, Zalkin, or Thokin would be better and even the Katana.

 

[Dan_D]

They're better at making Turians than Ryder. Or Krogan, I went through Krogan cutscenes and it was fine.

Also it is weird to see the Krogan using the Avenger. They won't all have the Ruzad but Hesh, Dhan, Pirahna, Zalkin, or Thokin would be better and even the Katana.

Not really. Krogan have used plenty of assault rifles in previous games. Grunt's even been seen with the Avenger in earlier games. Hell, you can choose to give him one if you want to. Within the game's narrative, they would probably have whatever the Initiative stocked up on which would be the M8 Avenger primarily. They don't necessarily have access to all the fabrication patterns found on the Nexus or in the Tempest. Secondly, for you non-gun people, you have to understand that your comfort and familiarity with a weapon is pretty important. You wouldn't necessarily change it just because you saw one laying on the ground that looked cool. You tend to stick with what's most comfortable and what you trust. This is why you see guys carrying Glocks which aren't particularly nice, when they may have nicer weapons in their safes at home. I carry a 1911 despite the platform's limitations because of my comfort and confidence in my ability to shoot it well should the need arise.

Now, the game does screw up occasionally and you'll see Angara running around with Avengers. That makes very little sense. They should be using their own weapons, Remnant weapons, or weapons stolen from the Kett.

 

[singe_101]

Then why does Bioware set the Avenger to do so little damage if the Krogan are such fearsome warriors? I get the Avenger VI for free from APEX and never use them. It would be trash against the three fiends in the Krogan pit.

It is an outlier because the Viper, Katana, and Predator (almost 0 weight) nostalgia weapons are nothing special but they do normal damage.

Angara use the sandstorm in a cutscene on Kadara. They must have taken them from the exiles.

 

[Dan_D]

Then why does Bioware set the Avenger to do so little damage if the Krogan are such fearsome warriors? I get the Avenger VI for free from APEX and never use them. It would be trash against the three fiends in the Krogan pit.

Don't confuse game balance behavior with anything story related. The Krogan are given that weapon because it's a standard weapon that's basically the most common rifle in the Mass Effect universe. It's effectively the AR-15 of it's day. Similarly, if you want to talk about power. Today's AR-15 is far from fearsome compared to other options.

It is an outlier because the Viper, Katana, and Predator (almost 0 weight) nostalgia weapons are nothing special but they do normal damage.

The Avenger is far from the worst gun in any Mass Effect game, but weapon balance in the game is an issue. You've got some guns like the N7 Valkryie and M-25 Hornet, which when crafted with the automatic fire mod are so powerful that it makes little sense to use most of the weapons in the assault rifle and pistol classes.

Angara use the sandstorm in a cutscene on Kadara. They must have taken them from the exiles.

The Angaran strike team that goes with you to free the Moshae. This makes no sense.

 

[Armenius]

The Avenger is awesome in ME3 and MEA multiplayer due to its laser accuracy and light weight. At least a good holdover until you can level up your OP weapons. It's also always a good choice regardless when you want to keep the weight down on your casters.

 

[singe_101]

Drack asks Peebee about carrying a bigger gun instead of a pistol, and pistols do the same damage as the Avenger. He says with biotics even he could be lightweight.

They wouldn't need to be comfortable with the Thokin, the plasma projectiles track to the target.

And human exiles cobble together the Vanquisher, ugly but it works like the N7 Valiant.

 

[Dan_D]

The Avenger is awesome in ME3 and MEA multiplayer due to its laser accuracy and light weight. At least a good holdover until you can level up your OP weapons. It's also always a good choice regardless when you want to keep the weight down on your casters.

In Mass Effect 2, I think the Avenger is shit. Yes, it's technically a viable weapon. However, everything feels like a bullet sponge when using it. In ME2, the accuracy is somewhat lacking. As far as accuracy goes, It's better than the M76 Revenant the damage, fire rate and capacity more than make up for it's weaknesses. The M96 Mattock is a better weapon due to it's power, although it suffers when you get swarmed by husks. Even the M15 Vindicator beats the Avenger due to it's raw power. Although, I'm not a fan of that gun either.

In ME3, I'd agree with you. It's light, accurate and does enough damage to be a viable weapon for any situation. There are many guns I like better and take the weight penalty to use, but the M8 Avenger still has its uses. It's a weapon with no real strengths but no weaknesses either.

In ME:A, at least single player I disagree with you. Everything feels like a bullet sponge when your using the Avenger. That said, it stacks up well against some alternatives due to the light weight. This is assuming you use powers a lot. I don't, so it's less important to me. I tend to play the solder classes and builds more than anything in all four games. As a pure weapon, when compared to the accuracy and damage per round of some other choices the Avenger stacks up very well. In ME:A, it does well against the Revenant and even the Cyclone. The thermal clip capacity is good while the amount you can carry in total is fantastic.

Unfortunately, if you compare this to say the N7 Valkyrie or M-25 Hornet crafted with automatic fire mods in single player, it's absolute shit for anything other than total ammunition capacity. On lower difficulties, it makes little difference. On insanity, it feels like it takes a week to kill anything. The Valkyrie, if you are doing shit right is accurate enough and it's significantly higher rate of fire and damage per round mitigate the poor total ammunition capacity. That and the game's ammunition pickup locations are numerous enough to offset that disadvantage. The M8 Avenger S is better, but it didn't get enough of a damage boost to offset it's overall weakness. It does slightly more damage than the X5 Ghost, but lacks the fire rate and capacity of the Ghost making it a worse weapon. The M8 Avenger S is also not craftable in single player, meaning you can't improve it enough to make it a more viable option.

Drack asks Peebee about carrying a bigger gun instead of a pistol, and pistols do the same damage as the Avenger. He says with biotics even he could be lightweight.

They wouldn't need to be comfortable with the Thokin, the plasma projectiles track to the target.

And human exiles cobble together the Vanquisher, ugly but it works like the N7 Valiant.

Many of the pistols do significantly more damage than the Avenger. This is especially true since SMG's are lumped into the pistol category for some reason.

 

[TaintedSquirrel]

 

[Q-BZ]

The day ME died was the day the original ending on ME3 ever got cleared past a discussion in a conference room somewhere. It was all gravy after that. I think 20-20 hindsight proves it at this point. At least for me.

 

[Sycraft]

The day ME died was the day the original ending on ME3 ever got cleared past a discussion in a conference room somewhere. It was all gravy after that. I think 20-20 hindsight proves it at this point. At least for me.

Yep. ME3 killed ME for me. My plan was when it came out to play through it using my save that had come up through ME1 and 2, and then once beating it go back and redo all 3, making very different choices to see how that changed things. I'm a big fan of replaying old games I enjoy, I replay BG2 every couple years it seems. After playing ME3... I've had no desire to pick up the series. Never went back and replayed 1 and 2 again, never touched it. It just ruined it for me. It was not only extremely stupid and a complete deus ex machinia writing moment, but it completely erased all player agency, which was the fun of it for me. It just made it a story I didn't care about to like, and that was the end of it.

 

[TaintedSquirrel]

Ehh the stupid ending doesn't degrade the rest of the series.

 

[Q-BZ]

Ehh the stupid ending doesn't degrade the rest of the series.

No it doesn't but unfortunately that was the beginning of the end in terms of effects, fallout, decisions, etc. (I love these games)

 

[Sycraft]

Ehh the stupid ending doesn't degrade the rest of the series.

It actually did for me . It just made everything else in them seem so pointless. I really get in to RPGs for their stories, and the fact that in good ones you feel like you can control over those stories, agency in your decisions. I know more than enough about game development to know that most of that is a false sense of agency and is very shallow, how most conversation trees branch to the same points, but when it is done well, as it was in the first 2 ME games, it really draws me in and I can feel like the choices DO matter. So when they completely destroy that, well it destroys the story for me.

Not trying to claim that this is some kind of morally superior position or something silly, just saying it is how I am. I replayed both ME1 and ME2 at least twice before 3 came out, I played 3 once and have never wanted to pick up any of them again.