Item arrived damaged or did it?

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falkenbd said:
His PM to me, said I would pay to ship it back to him and he would refund my money, less the shipping costs.... To me, implies $85- his $15 original shipping cost.
(why would he say "minus shipping costs" if he just meant he was going to refund me $85)

He can clear that up if he choses.
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The Gonz said:
If this isn't good enough than ship it back. I am not a business. I am sorry I can't send you a free return shipping label. But you asked me to refund you in full AND THEN if I want the item back to send you more money to ship it back to me.
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He already did. He sold you the item $85 shipped. Not $60 + Shipping. Full refund would be $85, but he is not going to give you money to ship the item back to him.
 
Skillz said:
Only the buyer is paying shipping one way. Seller agreed for a full refund, but isn't going to pay to have the item returned.
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The buyer should send the item back and receive $85 + return shipping costs.

What is so complicated?
 
The Lurker said:
Seller fucked up the packing and the buyer got a damaged item, buyer pays for shipping both ways. Plain and simple. This is a cheap lesson learned for the seller.

The only time a buyer pays shipping both ways is if the buyer asks to return the item because they no longer want it.
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Because you said the BUYER should pay for shipping BOTH ways when in fact the BUYER is only paying to have the item returned to the seller after a full refund.
 
Skillz said:
Because you said the BUYER should pay for shipping BOTH ways when in fact the BUYER is only paying to have the item returned to the seller after a full refund.
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MY MISTAKE!!!!!!!!

Sorry about that. Seller, SELLER pays for shipping both ways if the damage is caused due to negligent packaging.

I edited my post.
 
ummm....a box can usually survive more impacts than the contents inside (all depending on the contents of course). exterior packaging damage (or lack of) is no way indicative of the packaging inside

lesson to all readers to take packaging seriously - the box industry is always run by the bottom dollar. most box companies are owned by the same company as the cardboard manufacturer - just so they can sell off their own supply to each other. customers don't care enough to spend on quality packaging, so it's just a market of undercutting and bottom barrel prices/quality

<--- works for a packaging company specializing in hazardous materials, specifically testing packaging to ensure this doesn't happen
 
The Lurker said:
MY MISTAKE!!!!!!!!

Sorry about that. Seller, SELLER pays for shipping both ways if the damage is caused due to negligent packaging.

I edited my post.
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BUT, the packaging looks immaculate. That damage makes no sense.
 
Besides the fact that the heavy pump/heatsink was allowed to rest on top of the radiator coils, with nothing to absorb the shock or keep them separated. I doubt the post office kept it right side up without dropping it off a conveyer belt or anything. And it's pretty banged up, the coolermaster box is actually ripped on the corners a bit.

The indent is exactly under where the pumps rests in the box.

I think you missed the fact that this is not just a radiator, but an AIO cooler that comes pre-assembled, so it includes a heavy heatsink/pump combo in the box.


HeavensCloud said:
BUT, the packaging looks immaculate. That damage makes no sense.
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Personally , as someone who tries to sell things here, i would just ask that you send it back and ill refund all the money. for $100 its not worth all this hassle. if its damaged then you learned a lesson, if its fine you can re sell it and recoup your costs.

To me neither side seems unreasonable, but its more import to me to be as solid a seller as possible, and sometimes you loose on deals, also though as a buyer i wouldn't mind paying $10-15 to ship it back.

If it were me that received the item i would at least test it and consider the free $20. thats me personally though. hope you guys can work it out.
 
The buyer could be lying due to his negligence.

As a frequent buyer & seller here, standard practice is that the buyer foots the money to ship it back.
If it were a paypal dispute, the buyer would still have to return the goods. That's the buyer's expense!

in my opinion, the seller tried to offer solutions and is willing to refund the full purchase price. So just ship it back to him since you're not happy!

falken, do you drive to work? Do you know how much risk you take every day?
imo, the future formation of a small pinhole leak due to an ever so slightly bent fin is negligible.

this is really absurd. It's so obvious that you can either ship it back, or take the $20 and accept the heatsink. You are being unreasonable to expect the seller to pay return shipping.
 
This could be the dumbest thing I've read in a while.

J Macker said:
The buyer could be lying due to his negligence.

As a frequent buyer & seller here, standard practice is that the buyer foots the money to ship it back.
If it were a paypal dispute, the buyer would still have to return the goods. That's the buyer's expense!

in my opinion, the seller tried to offer solutions and is willing to refund the full purchase price. So just ship it back to him since you're not happy!

falken, do you drive to work? Do you know how much risk you take every day?
imo, the future formation of a small pinhole leak due to an ever so slightly bent fin is negligible.

this is really absurd. It's so obvious that you can either ship it back, or take the $20 and accept the heatsink. You are being unreasonable to expect the seller to pay return shipping.
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From a personal and professional standpoint, If I had improperly packed the item which facilitated damage during shipping, then I would definitely pay for the cost of shipping the item back to me plus the original purchase price, which would include shipping if that was what I had advertised.
 
AceGoober said:
From a personal and professional standpoint, If I had improperly packed the item which facilitated damage during shipping, then I would definitely pay for the cost of shipping the item back to me plus the original purchase price, which would include shipping if that was what I had advertised.
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This. Seller screwed up and should eat the loss of shipping both ways.
 
Gillbot said:
This. Seller screwed up and should eat the loss of shipping both ways.
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This all the way. Sell should give a full refund of the $85 and credit the buyer an extra $10 (or whatever) to have the item shipped back.
 
I hope this can get sorted out so both parties don't feel completely burnt. This is also why I double box and pad the shit out of stuff whenever possible.
 
I dont understand why the buyer is so reluctant to test out the system and get $20 if it works. A brand new system could develop a leak in the future so that makes no sense. In the end, you get a $200 system for $65..Somethings gotta give..
 
It seems we have a nearly divided audience.
Some say seller should pay return shipping some say buyer should pay shipping.( as per precedence set by services such as PayPal ).

In the end we can all agree that nobody wins here. I have been selling here for a while as reflected by my immaculate heat rating. I strive to offer amazing prices on goods that are like new. Just ask anyone who has purchased something from me.

The buyer (assuming they will not install the unit under ANY circumstances) is still in need of a water cooler.
The seller has a damaged/unsellable cooler.

No one wins.
 
I'll test it out tonight (first chance i'll get) so everyone knows if it works or not. I'll take more detailed pictures of how it was packaged as well.

The first message I got from the seller was that I was on the hook for shipping both ways. And his first reaction was to deny that it was his fault.

Ultimately I have no recourse, and he can do whatever he sees fit.
 
As pointed out by J Macker, if this were a paypal dispute, and paypal sided with the buyer, he would still be responsible for RETURN SHIPPING. It has always been that way, regardless of how the original ad was posted (i.e including shipping, or listing shipping separately).

I have been on ebay 14+ years, and I have NEVER offered free shipping (included shipping) and free return shipping.

I know some businesses do, but I am not a business.

I say if you are that unhappy, send it back at your expense. If not, I would gladly take the 20 refund, and use it.
 
With ebay disputes, the buyer will get sent a return label and they'll bill the seller for it.

With paypal disputes, you are correct, return shipping would not be covered automatically.

Also with paypal, once the item is returned, the original transaction amount, including original shipping cost is automatically refunded...

All i'm saying is, when I have shipped items that i've sold to people (My personal belongings) and they were damaged in shipping - I have not let it cost a dime out of the buyers pocket, I personally just think it's wrong to not make someone whole again if they didn't get what they paid for. Personal or business transaction. Period.

In fact,when I sold my 27" monoprice IPS monitor, it got damaged on the way to California. The box was not damaged on the outside, yet the bottom of the monitor had a crack in the bezel. The monitor still worked (and still works to this day, I gave it to a friend after I fully refunded the buyer after having UPS pick it back up and bring it back to me)

Feel free to verify that with the buyer. (Roflcopter_Down)
Here is the FS thread: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1808377&highlight=


The shipping was at least $30 each way in that case.
 
Based on those pictures, the packaging looks pristine and the radiator looks like someone took a hammer to it. Not entirely sure how it received that kind of damage through new-looking packaging.
 
This is Buyer words vs Seller words. Buyer says there were deflated bubbles in between, even if not boxed the radiator, if there were enough bubbles in between, there is no negligence on seller's side. And this is a forum, not a business. When you make a sell or buy, you take the risk. Also seller will be losing 2x shipping cost plus defected item, and I dont see any negligence on his end. Buyer may be lying or seller may be lying, but not enough proof either side to back up their story. I would say but suck up and cover the their side of the shipping and it would be fair. If you think that is too much, then you should not be doing business here anyways.
 
g1xx3r said:
I dont understand why the buyer is so reluctant to test out the system and get $20 if it works. A brand new system could develop a leak in the future so that makes no sense. In the end, you get a $200 system for $65..Somethings gotta give..
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I wouldn't test it either. If it's not what was described, I'd just return it.
 
Octonaut said:
User damaged his own, bought yours and sending his old one back.

Plain and simple
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While that's a possibility, I think it's inflammatory to accuse the buyer of doing that without any evidence presented thus far to suggest that it is true.
 
savoirfaire said:
While that's a possibility, I think it's inflammatory to accuse the buyer of doing that without any evidence presented thus far to suggest that it is true.
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Works both ways in blaming the seller who used the manufacturers original packaging to ship the item that his packaging methods are to blame.
 
The day I got the package, I opened it as soon as I got home and noticed the dings and sent pictures right away to the seller.

I just spent some more time taking a bunch of detailed pictures of the process I went thru yesterday during unwrapping, it is all exactly as it was when I went through it.

Illl upload in a minute.

But I'd like all those people who say since the box is "perfect/fine/immaculate" on the outside (which i disagree with anyway) to put a piece of glass in a single layer of bubble wrap, with a copper heatsink, and then ship it to themselves and see what they get..............

I've spent too much time replying to this thread and retaking pictures of it to actually give a shit anymore. I should have just spent the $120 on a bnib one from newegg.
 
Well here's the thing. If you sent payment with Paypal like you wanted then you would get your full refund ($85) and you'd have to pay out of pocket to send it back.

This is exactly what the seller has offered.
 
Skillz said:
Works both ways in blaming the seller who used the manufacturers original packaging to ship the item that his packaging methods are to blame.
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Well, that's not really the same thing. IF he felt that the item was improperly packed, he can justifiably argue that that was the reason for the damage. Without detailed photos of the item before shipping and after receipt, there is as much evidence that the buyer is pulling a switcheroo as there is that the postman was the one who replaced the original item with a damaged one. That's all I'm saying.

Also, it would be very easy to damage an item inside a box without causing external damage to the box. All it would take is a couple of shakes that cause the items in said box to bang against each other. I'm not taking sides here, just saying that people are making judgements based on questionable "evidence".
 
Skillz said:
Well here's the thing. If you sent payment with Paypal like you wanted then you would get your full refund ($85) and you'd have to pay out of pocket to send it back.

This is exactly what the seller has offered.
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We are still not on the same page with this.

He told me he would refund me $85-15 (his original shipping cost) for a $70 refund, that I would be spending $12-15 on shipping to get back. Maybe I missed the part where he clarified that and said I would get an $85 refund if I shipped it back.


How about this... Do YOU want the thing? Pay me $65 plus shipping and Gonz can pay me the $20 he offered...

I will package this thing so well that a fucking tank could run it over and you'll get it exactly as shown in the pictures. if you don't, the shipping insurance will take care of it.

It doesn't leak....
 
falkenbd said:
We are still not on the same page with this.

He told me he would refund me $85-15 (his original shipping cost) for a $70 refund, that I would be spending $12-15 on shipping to get back. Maybe I missed the part where he clarified that and said I would get an $85 refund if I shipped it back.
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The Gonz, want to clarify this?

falkenbd said:
How about this... Do YOU want the thing? Pay me $65 plus shipping and Gonz can pay me the $20 he offered...

I will package this thing so well that a fucking tank could run it over and you'll get it exactly as shown in the pictures. if you don't, the shipping insurance will take care of it.

It doesn't leak....
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If I didn't already have an AIO water cooler for my CPU I would probably take you up on that offer. As long as you have confirmed it doesn't leak.
 
Yeah, I confirmed it doesn't leak. Makes some bubble noises for a few seconds when it started up but I've read they do that when the pump is on full regardless.

I've done what I can I guess with taking pictures and such. I really have nothing to prove, and I really don't have the kind of time to try to pull some shit like people are implying above.
 
falkenbd said:
Yeah, I confirmed it doesn't leak. Makes some bubble noises for a few seconds when it started up but I've read they do that when the pump is on full regardless.

I've done what I can I guess with taking pictures and such. I really have nothing to prove, and I really don't have the kind of time to try to pull some shit like people are implying above.
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Taking into consideration the amount of time and effort you've put into proving your case, I am siding with you 100%.

Seller should refund you the full amount + your costs of shipping it back.

Sellers been doing business here for 12+ years...He/She should have no problem refunding . I think it was very immature and premature of him to make the assumption that you were/are planning to keep the money + item.

Also, don't take offense to the people siding with the Seller and trying to make up some elaborate story about how you're trying to burn the Seller.....Online forum trading is full of scum-bag buyers who use paypal's policy to take advantage of sellers...They ruin it for the good and honest buyers that are stuck in your current kind of situation.
 
There is too much conjecture in this thread from people not even involved .
You're in contact with each other so work it out amongst yourselves
 
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