Intel's Obfuscation Analyzed

FrgMstr

FrgMstr

Just Plain Mean
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Why do I feel like going to the pub after listening to this guy? In all seriousness, we all know this is all AMD's fault for allowing Intel to stagnate, right? No matter what you think about Intel's shaky movements towards 10nm, or it having its thumb planted firmly up its butt for years now, Intel feeling the heat from AMD's Threadripper 32-Core part did not lead to a very well planned marketing execution strategy. Are you drunk Intel?

Check out the video.
 
To be honest, I've not read a whole lot on why this is a big deal. Anyone care to inform me?
 
Competition is good.

It brings lower prices to the consumer, and keeps companies from stagnating.

When companies get to lazy, opportunities open up for the competition.
 
I liked the video you linked, but it's not just Intel that does deceptive marketing. The scottsman kept saying distrust everything Intel Marketing team says. AMD with Vega marketing was right up there with the worst of it - IMO.

But good on AMD for continuing to move the ball forward - and there is no doubt that Intel's promotion of this 28 core chip was deceptive.
 
Archaea said:
I liked the video you linked, but it's not just Intel that does deceptive marketing. The scottsman kept saying distrust everything Intel Marketing team says. AMD with Vega marketing was right up there with the worst of it - IMO.

But good on AMD for continuing to move the ball forward - and there is no doubt that Intel's promotion of this 28 core chip was deceptive.
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Marketing is by its very nature, just a game to say as much bullshit as you can get away with. Intel seems to have crossed that line. Their products are boring right now so the best they can do is try to throw shade on amd. However, this is some next level "wizard of oz" shit they tried to pull at computex.
 
i disagree with him.
nothing in what Intel did was smart, they just handed AMD a barbed spike to beat them with in exchange for a temporary thunder theft.
i see very well AMD doubling down on Intel's Demo during AMD's own LN2 TR2 overclock session, like " hey we too can do extrem cooling, and look at the result ...BooM " seriously a 4.5Ghz threadripper would beat the shit out of that 5Ghz 28 Intel Core.
so imagine what a 6Ghz LN2 OC could score.
i just hope AMD do this Demo while intel's deceit subject is still hot, that is really a terrific gift from Intel.
 
I think the parody Spanish video yesterday accurately summed up the situation.

Someone up top wanted good news, as it's been bad news for a while now, so they needed a feel good story. They passed it down to the engineers and gave them an unrealistic deadline.

I've been rewatching Silicon Valley (spoilers ahead) and I'd say the situation parodies the season 2 storyline. Gavin so badly wants good news for a change, he promises the board an unrealistic timeline, and then tells the engineers that they have to do Y in X before CES.
 
Intel's enormous success -- I was there at the time -- destroyed the Intel culture of constructive confrontation and turned it into a bloated politics-laden bureaucracy, nowhere more entrenched than in the main product line. It's going to take some kind of Cat-5/ 9.0-on-the-Richtor-scale disaster to change that: just AMD being competitive won't be enough.
Maybe 10nm is that disaster, maybe not.
 
If they weren't drunk then, they're getting drunk now. And not the celebratory kind.
 
It is kind of sad when your a tech journalist and you cant figure out that a 5 GHz chip with 28 cores is in the realm of fantasy for everyday use. Has it been so long that the insulation on the lines was not a massive tip off they were using sub ambient cooling? I like the fact that he called out several sites that bit the marketing line from Intel and showed the others that had used their heads a bit. I look forward to seeing how this all shakes out, core and clock wars... sign me up.
 
alamox said:
i disagree with him.
nothing in what Intel did was smart, they just handed AMD a barbed spike to beat them with in exchange for a temporary thunder theft.
i see very well AMD doubling down on Intel's Demo during AMD's own LN2 TR2 overclock session, like " hey we too can do extrem cooling, and look at the result ...BooM " seriously a 4.5Ghz threadripper would beat the shit out of that 5Ghz 28 Intel Core.
so imagine what a 6Ghz LN2 OC could score.
i just hope AMD do this Demo while intel's deceit subject is still hot, that is really a terrific gift from Intel.
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Speculation at best. How do you know or predict any of this? Cause someone on youtube hit 5.37 on LN2 with 16 cores so they are going to hit 6 on 32? I guess that makes sense.

The fanboism is out of control and the group thought stokes the fire. Why can't we wait and see before digging the grave for Intel! Multiple times I've said I'm extremely impressed with AMD's offering which looks to be a legit winner of an architecture and admittedly in the past have had an Intel bias due to performance - but this is the rhetoric that was all over these same forums before Bulldozer (albeit a MUCH different story) - we haven't seen any 3rd party data, just trade show bullshit and a BSOD trade show presentation by Intel. The 28 core did pretty decent at stock clocks too...
 
didn't intel do this years ago too? like around the time Athlon finally took lead intel displayed screenshots at 10ghz? I could be wrong about the time frames... but..... damn history does repeat it self...
 
Pretty sure I heard that Trump has officially requested to let Intel come back into our group.
 
GamersNexus had a video on this the day Intel showed this thing I think. Not like everyone fell for the Jedi Mind trick Intel tried to pull.
 
An interesting vid, but I disagree that AMD should have gone first. Going the next day allowed them to dunk on Intel in spectacular fashion.
 
I called it the day intel did the presentation. Kyle confirmed it with a pic of the mobo from AnandTech. The scottsman is late 2-3 days and a pound short :) Did anyone really think intel had something new running at computex >? They did clock It [H]ard though :D and the # of cores gave it away the second I saw it .
 
haste. said:
Speculation at best. How do you know or predict any of this? Cause someone on youtube hit 5.37 on LN2 with 16 cores so they are going to hit 6 on 32? I guess that makes sense.

The fanboism is out of control and the group thought stokes the fire. Why can't we wait and see before digging the grave for Intel! Multiple times I've said I'm extremely impressed with AMD's offering which looks to be a legit winner of an architecture and admittedly in the past have had an Intel bias due to performance - but this is the rhetoric that was all over these same forums before Bulldozer (albeit a MUCH different story) - we haven't seen any 3rd party data, just trade show bullshit and a BSOD trade show presentation by Intel. The 28 core did pretty decent at stock clocks too...
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oh come on with the fanboism already, what i said is just conclusions from previous products, Ryzen1, ryzen 2 and threadripper 1st gen.
threadripper 1st gen OC on water at the same frequency of of 1st gen ryzen, you add to that ryzen 2 getting 300mhz extra while using much lower voltage, would suggest that threadripper 2 will also OC to 4.3Ghz using a beafy water cooled solution, remember that having multi chip die allow AMD to spread the heat better than a monolitic die, so they are limited by the process node and voltage, heat being less so, since it can be managed more easily, threadripper is also the top binned ryzen chips, also Ryzen 2700 was OC to 6 Ghz on LN2, if we stay conservative and put Thread ripper at 5Ghz or 5.5Ghz that would still beat Intel by a fair margin since AMD multi-threaded perf scale alot better than intel, even if they only manage 5Ghz on LN2 that would beat intel's score.
so yes i have no official info, but the previous available information just makes it straight forward, i might be wrong but not by a big margin, as you said we will wait and see, but in reality you don't really need to, it's not a new product the chip is already out no matter how the setup is, 2CCX or 4 CCX, ppl manage stable 4Ghz with 1.25volt on ryzen 2 against 1.45v of ryzen 1, my guess TR2 stock would be around 3.8Ghz or even 4Ghz for the targeted 250watt draw, depand on how good the top binning are.
 
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I don't see those intel #s happening in the next six months either so whatever his analysis is trying to accomplish is moot. Simply because even if intel gets its 10 nm together this 28 core Xeon refresh with 10 nm tech will simply not scale on air cooling to 5 ghz on all cores. it would still be around 400 watts so the numbers are not adding up. Good luck intel. This is what happens when you try to milk us and AMD woops your greedy ass . :D
 
one thing is sure Intel will never be able to beat AMD's HEDT, so i am really anticipating the spin Intel's PR will put forward when they will finaly realize they need to use a Glue also to be competitive.
seriously Intel's marketing makes things even harder for them down the road, they need to do a 180 degree on many many statements they used to show AMD's inferiority, but then copy from them, that will be funny to watch, can't wait :D
 
I wonder if Intel will actually release this thing or go the gpp route and not talk about it again.

Seems like the longer they drag it out the more they'll get ragged on about it.
 
SeymourGore said:
I wonder if Intel will actually release this thing or go the gpp route and not talk about it again.

Seems like the longer they drag it out the more they'll get ragged on about it.
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if AMD's epyc 2nd gen 7nm is really 64cores, then it might canibalize a decent amount of server market share, leaving enough xeon chips to be thrown into HEDT, since intel's 10 nm is nowhere near release, this 28 core might make it into HEDT but at far lower frequency than the 5Ghz they claim, maybe 3.5Ghz, and a significant drop margins going from 10.000$ to 2.000$
 
Intel could die shrink to 2nm and be 100% air cooled with a heat spreader made out of moon rock, it doesn't matter, why does everyone not see the elephant shitting in the room? They still have to fix Spectre and Meltdown.

I don't care what they're making, I'm not eating ice cream after somebody sneezed on the spoon.
 
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Archaea said:
I liked the video you linked, but it's not just Intel that does deceptive marketing. The scottsman kept saying distrust everything Intel Marketing team says. AMD with Vega marketing was right up there with the worst of it
But good on AMD for continuing to move the ball forward - and there is no doubt that Intel's promotion of this 28 core chip was deceptive.
Click to expand...
Watch all of Jim's videos he criticizes and scrutinized everyone without bias.
 
Imhotep said:
I called it the day intel did the presentation. Kyle confirmed it with a pic of the mobo from AnandTech. The scottsman is late 2-3 days and a pound short :) Did anyone really think intel had something new running at computex >? They did clock It [H]ard though :D and the # of cores gave it away the second I saw it .
Click to expand...
I wouldn't say he'
Late at all be puts a ton of research into his videos.
 
Oh how the tables have turned.
I remember this meme in reverse back in 2011 when Bulldozer was new, but now with Ryzen...

EZ6LyI1.png
 
AMDs marketing department have needed firing for at least the last 10 years. They have always been less than amature. One of the biggest reasons they flounder in the Enterprise space.
 
Stimpy88 said:
AMDs marketing department have needed firing for at least the last 10 years. They have always been less than amature. One of the biggest reasons they flounder in the Enterprise space.
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Luckily the product makes up for that these days :) .

Imhotep said:
I called it the day intel did the presentation. Kyle confirmed it with a pic of the mobo from AnandTech. The scottsman is late 2-3 days and a pound short :) Did anyone really think intel had something new running at computex >? They did clock It [H]ard though :D and the # of cores gave it away the second I saw it .
Click to expand...

Well if you analyse other peoples stories in the press you need to wait until they get published :)
The tech press is conditioned by Intel for the past years so when other press sees this and knows the trend is Intel rules from the tech press then stuff like 5ghz miracles are believed by anyone in the press.
 
Stimpy88 said:
AMDs marketing department have needed firing for at least the last 10 years. They have always been less than amature. One of the biggest reasons they flounder in the Enterprise space.
Click to expand...

Don't encourage them to waste money on marketing. We don't need more marketing; we need more engineering. Actual products > hype + BS.

AMD didn't "lose". Intel does not have anything real right now. I bet AMD takes a while to actually start to sell 32 core chips. So, nobody actually "won the race" yet.

I personally would never buy a +250W CPU anyways. I prefer to keep it under 100W and I might get a Ryzen chip next.
 
alamox said:
oh come on with the fanboism already, what i said is just conclusions from previous products, Ryzen1, ryzen 2 and threadripper 1st gen.
threadripper 1st gen OC on water at the same frequency of of 1st gen ryzen, you add to that ryzen 2 getting 300mhz extra while using much lower voltage, would suggest that threadripper 2 will also OC to 4.3Ghz using a beafy water cooled solution, remember that having multi chip die allow AMD to spread the heat better than a monolitic die, so they are limited by the process node and voltage, heat being less so, since it can be managed more easily, threadripper is also the top binned ryzen chips, also Ryzen 2700 was OC to 6 Ghz on LN2, if we stay conservative and put Thread ripper at 5Ghz or 5.5Ghz that would still beat Intel by a fair margin since AMD multi-threaded perf scale alot better than intel, even if they only manage 5Ghz on LN2 that would beat intel's score.
so yes i have no official info, but the previous available information just makes it straight forward, i might be wrong but not by a big margin, as you said we will wait and see, but in reality you don't really need to, it's not a new product the chip is already out no matter how the setup is, 2CCX or 4 CCX, ppl manage stable 4Ghz with 1.25volt on ryzen 2 against 1.45v of ryzen 1, my guess TR2 stock would be around 3.8Ghz or even 4Ghz for the targeted 250watt draw, depand on how good the top binning are.
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lol. Reread your post (although nearly impossible to read). Reread what I posted. It's all speculative and fanbois hate being called out. Why don't we have a Cinebench for TR2 if it is as perfect as you are claiming? It's a legitimate question when at least Frankenstein was benched in public.

And your point of reference is that an 8 core can touch 6 on LN2... have you had much experience with OC and core scaling?

Edit: and sorry I didn't read all your posts, but man you are a fanboy beyond belief - in one post you say that Intel will never be able to beat AMD's HEDT and "lol'ed" about it. Just like they couldn't beat Athlon 64 but guessing that's all before your time.
 
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Poseur said:
Don't encourage them to waste money on marketing. We don't need more marketing; we need more engineering. Actual products > hype + BS.

AMD didn't "lose". Intel does not have anything real right now. I bet AMD takes a while to actually start to sell 32 core chips. So, nobody actually "won the race" yet.

I personally would never buy a +250W CPU anyways. I prefer to keep it under 100W and I might get a Ryzen chip next.
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Whoa hold on a second - remember the beginning of the downfall for AMD was when they literally were looking for areas within the org to save money and basically completely cut the marketing budget... This was well before Lisa Su's time, but you can't skimp on marketing you just have to do it correct. This isn't Bulldozer, they have an architecture. But don't cherry pick benchies in a presser that squeak out a win against Intel just to get shit on ever again!
 
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