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Intel Chipset Design Error!!!

IsLNdbOi said:
Anyone else here have any of the Gigabyte boards? All I see everyone mentioning are the Asus boards.
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I do (see sig) because I needed display port out. But that is a P67 board and it may not even be affected.
 
Man this sucks big time.
All those who just bought the new Sandy Bridge are screwed. That's alot of enthusiasts as well as regular Joe's. It's going to be at least a few months before Intel get their "fixed" chips out and even then their brand is damaged and we all may be a little more hesitant to buy more Sandy Bridge kit.
 
soberspine said:
If I use a HDD on sata II port can the HDD or the data on it be damaged?
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to my understanding it was decreased performance after heavy use or worse case is the port not longer works from what i read not that it did any data corruption or damaged the hdd
 
Semantics said:
to my understanding it was decreased performance after heavy use or worse case is the port not longer works from what i read not that it did any data corruption or damaged the hdd
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+1

The performance degrades as the BER climbs on that port which causes the SATA controller to eventually start resending data/commands because they never made it to the HDD. Over time the BER gets so bad that it can no longer talk to the HDD at all. I'm assuming, but they make it sound like you could just move it to another SATA II port and that would work for awhile.
 
Semantics said:
to my understanding it was decreased performance after heavy use or worse case is the port not longer works from what i read not that it did any data corruption or damaged the hdd
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I've seen a post from another board that says different. A p67 owner used his SSD on a SATA 3.0 port. The drive began exhibiting errors and data corruption which ultimately led to it being unreadable in any machine. Either way, I would move every SATA hardware over to a 6.0 port to be safe. I'm thinking I mite just pick up an extra 6.0 controller when I build out my system next week. Then just wait for an RMA unless newegg still has the ASRock boards in stock by next wk. In which case I plan on getting an Extreme 6. Nix that the Extreme 6 is now no longer available lol, Guess I'll have to see what MC has in their stores come next week, unless they pull them from store shelves.
 
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Stupid question but I plugged my Sata II hdd into the Sata III connection but when I boot it doesnt show up in the bios? I thought they were compatible?
 
forkedt said:
Stupid question but I plugged my Sata II hdd into the Sata III connection but when I boot it doesnt show up in the bios? I thought they were compatible?
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They should be, you may need to load a driver for the controller.
 
deejay2nv said:
They should be, you may need to load a driver for the controller.
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I should have explained better - I'm connecting it to the Sata III connection on the mobo... would I need to update the bios in that case? (Assuming there's even an update available yet)
 
Does not make me happy because i set aside a considerable amount of money to upgrade next week and knowing myself just havin the money around i'll blow it on somethin else lol. mayb ill just buy all the other components and get the mobo later on.
 
forkedt said:
I should have explained better - I'm connecting it to the Sata III connection on the mobo... would I need to update the bios in that case? (Assuming there's even an update available yet)
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chances are its a driver issue, it could be a bios issue, check ur manufacturers website for any bios updates, if not check the install DVD that came with your board for drivers
 
ahahah.

they say to never buy a first model year car.

i guess it now applies to computers too
 
A bit of additional bad news for band-aid people...
After benching (AS SSD) my Intel SSD on both the Marvell and the Intel SATA3 connectors on my P67 it is slower on BOTH than it was on the Intel SATA2 connection.
 
deejay2nv said:
chances are its a driver issue, it could be a bios issue, check ur manufacturers website for any bios updates, if not check the install DVD that came with your board for drivers
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A driver issue wouldn't affect what the BIOS "sees".
 
Wow I see so many people saying/hoping this does not affect them. Cougar Point is *all* 6 series chipsets. This problem affects every motherboard that has socket 1155 on it. It also covers *all* laptops that have Sandy Bridge CPU's. Cougar Point is the only chipset that is even available for Sandy Bridge motherboards and laptops. Either get a couple sata controller pcie cards or get the motherboard replaced. Those are your options.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924_3-20030070-64.html
 
niconx said:
Wow I see so many people saying/hoping this does not affect them. Cougar Point is *all* 6 series chipsets. This problem affects every motherboard that has socket 1155 on it. It also covers *all* laptops that have Sandy Bridge CPU's. Cougar Point is the only chipset that is even available for Sandy Bridge motherboards and laptops. Either get a couple sata controller pcie cards or get the motherboard replaced. Those are your options.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924_3-20030070-64.html
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Or don't use SATA ports 2 through 5.

Fortunately for me I only use 0 and 1, but now I have to have this in the back of my mind if I ever want to slap another HDD in there. Poo. :(
 
niconx said:
Wow I see so many people saying/hoping this does not affect them. Cougar Point is *all* 6 series chipsets. This problem affects every motherboard that has socket 1155 on it. It also covers *all* laptops that have Sandy Bridge CPU's. Cougar Point is the only chipset that is even available for Sandy Bridge motherboards and laptops. Either get a couple sata controller pcie cards or get the motherboard replaced. Those are your options.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924_3-20030070-64.html
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just so you know laptops typically only use the first 2 sata ports now, one for hdd and one for optical.....external sata port (if equipped) may or may not be affected depending upon chipset used.(intel intergrated or third party)
 
Some more info from Anandtech.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4143/the-source-of-intels-cougar-point-sata-bug

The problem in the chipset was traced back to a transistor in the 3Gbps PLL clocking tree. The aforementioned transistor has a very thin gate oxide, which allows you to turn it on with a very low voltage. Unfortunately in this case Intel biased the transistor with too high of a voltage, resulting in higher than expected leakage current. Depending on the physical characteristics of the transistor the leakage current here can increase over time which can ultimately result in this failure on the 3Gbps ports. The fact that the 3Gbps and 6Gbps circuits have their own independent clocking trees is what ensures that this problem is limited to only ports 2 - 5 off the controller.

You can coax the problem out earlier by testing the PCH at increased voltage and temperature levels. By increasing one or both of these values you can simulate load over time and that’s how the problem was initially discovered. Intel believes that any current issues users have with SATA performance/compatibility/reliability are likely unrelated to the hardware bug.
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I would think the motherboard makers will just send out cheap PCI/PCIe based SATA controllers. It's the cheapest and easiest solution for them.
 
Anand also says this:

"One fix for this type of a problem would be to scale down the voltage applied across the problematic transistor. In this case there’s a much simpler option. The source of the problem is actually not even a key part of the 6-series chipset design, it’s remnant of an earlier design that’s no longer needed. In our Sandy Bridge review I pointed out the fair amount of design reuse that was done in creating the 6-series chipset. The solution Intel has devised is to simply remove voltage to the transistor. The chip is functionally no different, but by permanently disabling the transistor the problem will never arise."

So, will a bios update disable this transistor and prevent the problem? Will the new chipset stepping have this transistor omitted altogether?

If I don't have to replace my board I'll be most satisfied.
 
I'm using all of the slots on my board so I wouldn't be able to use one of those PCIe controller cards. Hopefully, these motherboard makers make the exchange process easy.
 
This is just infecting the chipset and not the 2600K or 2500K CPU's right? I've read in here that even CPU's are infected? It's strictly just the chipset on the motherboards right?

Curious what happends with the Intel Branded boards I have. The mini ITX H67CF and the Micro ATX Intel branded board... This sucks.
 
This is pretty unfortunate -- luckily for me I only use SATA III ports 1/2 for HDDs and relegate the rarely used DVDRW to a SATA II port. (a lot cheaper to replace than a harddrive thankfully)

Still, maybe in time if MSI offers to cross-ship I'll take advantage of an RMA; however, right now I'm not very worried about it. Anyone else feel the same?
 
3DChipset said:
This is just infecting the chipset and not the 2600K or 2500K CPU's right? I've read in here that even CPU's are infected? It's strictly just the chipset on the motherboards right?

Curious what happends with the Intel Branded boards I have. The mini ITX H67CF and the Micro ATX Intel branded board... This sucks.
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The CPUs are fine, only the mobo's themselves are affected.
 
BM00 said:
Still, maybe in time if MSI offers to cross-ship I'll take advantage of an RMA; however, right now I'm not very worried about it. Anyone else feel the same?
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I think everybody with a SB board should RMA it no matter what, it would be stupid not to. Even if you don't use the faulty ports, you might give or resell your board or computer later to someone who will, or the faulty transistor might just burn at any time. If you haven't taken advantage of the RMA while Intel offers it to OEMs and board manufacturers, chances are you won't be allowed to return it then.
Just check with your reseller when this can happen, you may need to register now for a board exchange in April, or whenever the new fixed boards are available.

I don't know how many boards were made already, but it's unlikely that the chipset will be unsoldered and a new one soldered, the whole board will probably go to the junkyard and you'll get a brand new one. Not sure if Intel's $700M provision will cover it all.
 
IsLNdbOi said:
A driver issue wouldn't affect what the BIOS "sees".
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True, i completely missed where he said bios, my next step would to check the SATA cables and power, recheck on the SATA 3.0 port to see if it reads, and finally if you have access to a SATA 6.0 port on another PC try that.
 
I guess I'll be waiting to build a new system then...I was planning on an i7 2600k build, but not with this happening right now. I'll wait for the dust to clear and then buy the new hardware once the rush of replacement mobos are done.
 
We would like to thank all you SB purchasers for becoming a beta tester. Sincerely, Intel.
 
I am returning my bundle to MC. I am glad I did not sell my i5-760 I bought on ebay for $145. SB was a nice experience until now.
 
BM00 said:
This is pretty unfortunate -- luckily for me I only use SATA III ports 1/2 for HDDs and relegate the rarely used DVDRW to a SATA II port. (a lot cheaper to replace than a harddrive thankfully)

Still, maybe in time if MSI offers to cross-ship I'll take advantage of an RMA; however, right now I'm not very worried about it. Anyone else feel the same?
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im not worried about it. people are freaking out over nothing really only 5-15% will even have the issue.
 
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