ok guys please re-read what I typed. I said they never backed off on the statement that is was last gen. I never said they didn't say it. remember READING IS FUNDAMENTAL.
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How will the PS3 fare against the Xbox 360's Halo 3 release?
- Thread starter cerebrex
- Start date
ok guys please re-read what I typed. I said they never backed off on the statement that is was last gen. I never said they didn't say it. remember READING IS FUNDAMENTAL.
DragonMasterAlex
2[H]4U
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HAHAHAHA, look at the fanboy drivel, it's SO cute! PSP is killing DS? Yeah, except for that whole "PSP is outsold worldwide 2:1 by DS" fact, right? PSP is enjoying a spike right now because of the new model--no more, no less, and mark my words--by the middle of November, possibly even by the end of October, it'll be back to DS on top weekly. You can't call 2 weeks of robust sales "killing the DS" when in every other week all freaking year long and THEN some it's been being manhandled by the DS.
It's really sad how you fanboys cling to the dream that PS3 will magically pull a miracle out of its ass and suddenly become #1 when all it's done so far is get further and further behind.
Just *funny*
Stereophile
Supreme [H]ardness
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You're the ringleader of the Wii fanboy circle jerk. Still having so much fun with excite truck and elebits ?
Nobody is saying PS3 will be #1. We're saying: it's way too early to write the system off as a failure less than a year after it's been out, before it's gotten substantial price reductions, or released its AAA "must buy" exclusive titles.
X360's lead peaks this year. Any rational person realizes the sales gap between X360/PS3 is bound to close in 2008.
Still having so much fun with excite truck and elebits ? Nobody is saying PS3 will be #1. We're saying: it's way too early to write the system off as a failure less than a year after it's been out, before it's gotten substantial price reductions, or released its AAA "must buy" exclusive titles.
X360's lead peaks this year. Any rational person realizes the sales gap between X360/PS3 is bound to close in 2008.
Psychotext
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Still astounds me to see that. Who would have thought that the 360 would not only be keeping pace with the PS3 when it was released but that the PS3 would be struggling to match its sales.
deception``
Limp Gawd
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Yea, if you read it, he used a double negative. Easy to misread.
You're the ringleader of the Wii fanboy circle jerk.
No, those Wii titles are old news. I've been playing Metroid Prime 3, you know one of the best games of any console out this year. Hey how's Resistance treating you these days? Oh I made a funny....
Like Lair? Oh another funny!
Why? The hits on the 360 just keep on coming.
DragonMasterAlex
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You're the ringleader of the Wii fanboy circle jerk.
Nobody is saying PS3 will be #1. We're saying: it's way too early to write the system off as a failure less than a year after it's been out, before it's gotten substantial price reductions, or released its AAA "must buy" exclusive titles.
X360's lead peaks this year. Any rational person realizes the sales gap between X360/PS3 is bound to close in 2008.
LOL, I'm not a fanboy of anything you twit
. However, Excite Truck yes, is still a blast. Finished Elebits ages ago though. MP3 right now, and as soon as I snag a 360 pretty soon here, I'll be on Eternal Sonata (already bought) and GoW, maybe with Halo 3 later in the year if I can get past the other great titles.In any case, not many have written off PS3 as a failure, *I* certainly haven't. What I've said is that it's in a distant third right now and it's getting *further* behind, which is a fact. Further, Xbox 360's lead is gone--Wii is actually #1 in installed base now. 360 will remain #2 throughout 2008, and PS3 will remain in #3. PS3 CAN'T catch up until it starts to outsell 360 somewhere besides *Japan*, and that doesn't appear to be very likely at this stage. NO rational person would say that the gap between PS3 and 360 will close in 2008, for the very simple reason that PS3 continues to be *outsold* by 360 everywhere but Japan--a shrinking market both in pure numbers AND in importance.
Please read it again.I Mean the line You quoted from me. Hopefully you will understand it this time.
Probably should have put a colon after " They never said: " I don't want to edit it though so he can see that he has some reading comprehension issues since he has now quoted it 2 times without understanding.
As a game developer for a 360 title, I can tell you that a possible reason for the drought of PS3 games is the difficulty to convert PC/Xbox game files over - it's proven to be quite difficult - I know of a few developers that I keep in contact with occasionally that looked into the prospect of crossing platforms, but they just couldn't convince their publishers to invest the time - and some just don't like dealing with the Sony licenses and media channels. Unfortunately it's gotten to the point where the difficulty to convert titles over has intersected with the lower sales of the console - and its a lose lose situation. A lot of the guys are praising the titles that are exclusive to the PS3 only - but thats also telling of this same issue. I personally would love to run 1080P - it would give me a lot more workspace with the GUI and show off the detail much further, but it just isn't an option for us like many other developers. Also, Xbox live is very easy to integrate as well. Also, I have an artist friend that is working on an unannounced PS3 title... they are using a proprietary engine - and he always makes mention that most of the developers tend to run less high pass shaders and opt not to run anti aliasing due to the increase resolution. I honestly believe the reason behind this is that the PS3 doesn't have enough bandwidth to utilize 1080P with FSAA - I can't say for sure, I've never touched the developer end, but that does seem to be the road the developers are taking. So, it really boils down to which do you think would look best, 720P with high pass shaders and AA, or 1080P will few shaders and no AA. Naturally this is highly dependent on the engine being chosen... and this could be proven wrong in the future.
I never said the PSP was going to continue to out sell the DS what I said was that little things like price drops or AAA titles can change the flow of sales. 500,000 PSP sales in 2 week in just Japan is a HUGE accomplishment the DS has never sold 500,000 in just 2 weeks in Japan. The huge boost in sales was due to the new psp and the release of a HUGE AAA title.
Crisis core upped the sales of PSP.
Halo 3 upped the sales of Xbox360.
When the New Mario and SSMB come out it would up wii sales if they had enough supply.
Use the same flow of "logic" yeah I know it's hard for you to understand this thing called L...O...G...I...C but give it a shot just for this one time. Logically the Ps3s sales will increases with the release of games that people want such as FF, MGS, GT, and for me Little Big Planet, also if they happen to drop the price the sales will increase even more. I know you probably dont understand, 1+1 doesnt equal 2 to everyone and thats ok your special and dont let anyone tell you anything different. Be proud of that short bus.
Crisis core upped the sales of PSP.
Halo 3 upped the sales of Xbox360.
When the New Mario and SSMB come out it would up wii sales if they had enough supply.
Use the same flow of "logic" yeah I know it's hard for you to understand this thing called L...O...G...I...C but give it a shot just for this one time. Logically the Ps3s sales will increases with the release of games that people want such as FF, MGS, GT, and for me Little Big Planet, also if they happen to drop the price the sales will increase even more. I know you probably dont understand, 1+1 doesnt equal 2 to everyone and thats ok your special and dont let anyone tell you anything different. Be proud of that short bus.
DragonMasterAlex
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I'd say that was a clever rant, if in fact it *had* been. Unfortunately it was just stupid. I acknowledge quite clearly that PSP's sales were boosted by the introduction of the new model. Didn't mention Crisis Core (didn't care, FFVII is the most overrated game of all time, IMHO), but that's a good point, as the combo of a big title and a hardware revision are clearly potent in the marketplace.
The point remains, however, that it takes more than one or two titles to make up a huge deficiency. Do you seriously believe that a redesign and Crisis Core will bring the PSP's 6 million sold in Japan up to par with the DS's 19 million sold in Japan? I'm betting not a chance in hell. The same is true for MGS4 (which I eagerly await and *might* be tempted to get a PS3 for even before the slim comes out, but only time will tell) and even FFXIII; will they sell like mad? Of course they will. Are they alone--or even coupled with a price drop--enough to overcome ALL the titles and sales accumulated so far on 360 and Wii? Probably not.
This should be a familiar position, though: Xbox fanboys who just KNEW Xbox's more powerful hardware would pull it ahead of PS2 if they just got in those few great titles ended up disappointed when the momentum of the system with an already beefy--and improving rapidly--library was just too much to overcome. PS3 is in the same boat right now, and it's going to take more than a couple titles and a price drop to make up that distance. Frankly, it probably won't happen at all, but hey, I'm open--anything's possible
Wondernerd
Supreme [H]ardness
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And Sony(or retailers. I don't know who put the signs up) know the PS3 isn't selling. The PS2 is. Again, all of this is just what I see. I'm platform agnostic. I go where the games I want to play are. Right now, that isn't the PS3.
Backwards compatibility is going away(not a problem because there are like 6 PS2 per person). Does anybody really track the lies? The PS3 doesn't really have any games. The Good games are mediocre or Available on the 360. So what is the motivation to buy a PS3? Graphically, they are going to be the same.
Except they are unable to actually put Rumble in the controller that comes with the PS3. And downplayed Rumble and said it isn't important, nobody likes it and what people want is a poorly done Wiimote clone.
Except now, you can't buy the 500$US PS3. It wasn't a price cut. It was a liquidation sale. They had a 600 dollar PS3 and a 500 dollar PS3. After the price cut and the Liquidation inventory left, they have a 600 dollar and a 500 dollar PS3. A quick search on Gamedealer shows a 500 dollar and a 450 dollar PS3. I can search for X-Box 360 and get a 450, 400, 350 dollar unit. So for 350 dollars you get a device that can play the same games as a PS3.
Yes, but has Microsoft been reducing features and liquidating slow moving hardware? Since the release of the 360, Microsoft has been adding features, not reducing them.
I do think that have 10 different SKU's for the same fucking toy is silly. Nintendo has it mostly right. One Wii. 60 fucking gameboys, but one Wii.
I agree. Unfortunately, it leads to no real winner in this console war. Except for the gamers. Actually we lose too because now we get three shitty versions of the same shitty game.
Stereophile
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Stereophile
Supreme [H]ardness
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So the PS3 doesn't have the bandwidth to utilize 1080P with FSAA ? Too bad cause we all know FSAA is so important at 1920x1080 resolution.
With many games, the X360 doesn't utilize FSAA at 720P.
No wait,
ƒ1n1$h 73h ƒ19h7.......in 640P.
Psychotext
Supreme [H]ardness
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680p technically. Though it's about as important as Lair being a frame dropping mess at 1080p. I'll take gorgeous looking games at SD if needs be... Mario Galaxy being a good example.
Frame rate is king.
In Response to Wondernerd.
I once again have to disagree with you.With your first statement you dismissed the point I was getting at by going off on an unrelated statement of your opinion of what games you like. What did that have to do with the advertising campaign in Amsterdam? That was what you had started talking about when you seemed to imply that Sony had given up hope selling the PS3 in Amsterdam.
Your Second rebuttal once again brought up something that was not being discussed. I don't consider BC of PS2 games being games for the PS3. When I said there are games out there for the PS3 I meant just that. For some reason people don't want to admit that multi-platform games are PS3 games as well as 360 games. You then made some assertion that multi-platform games play better on the 360. ( I noted this as one of my major disappointments in the PS3 ) ,and that is not a motivation to buy a PS3. I already own a PS3. I have stated the reasons why I own it on this forum a few different times. I do not own a 360 so those games that you can play on you 360 I cannot unless it is a multi-platform game. They do exist that was the point. The games are there. I am not tempted to go buy a 360 just to play those games on that system but if I own a system those games are there. Also there are still some PS3 exclusives. You may not like them but some people do. They do exist. when people say that there are " NO" games for the PS3 it is kind of insulting to the people who own games for the PS3 like myself because they are either exaggerating or actually saying that there are no good games and these are both wrong.
Your third statement was almost the same as what I said but spun in a negative manner. I still believe that Rumble was added to appease the people who have demanded it. They didn't think it was cost effective or a necessity for the launch system. they made press releases to spin that decision in a positive manner. ( By this I mean make the choice to leave it out seem like a good idea.) The addition to bring it back was not what they had intended to do. It was something that was done in response to their customers. I still see this as a good thing.
As for the price cut it is so simple I don't know why some people want to think of it as some type of ruse that Sony is trying to pull on everyone. I like how you used the Price Point argument once again. This is simple if you buy a 10 oz. can of tuna for $.50 and the next day it is $.35 the price on the 10oz can is still less money there for the price was cut. As for your Inventory Liquidation argument. I have to commend you that I have not seen it but it once again smoke and mirrors. Inventory liquidation is just a reason for a price cut not a term for lowering the price that some how magically doesn't qualify as a price cut.
I don't really understand what you mean in your next statement because it can be taken in 2 different ways. When you were talking about a lowered featured version for a lowered price I thought you were talking about the rumored $400 PS3 that is supposed to come out soon. They took away BC and brought it in $100 cheaper. I own a PS3 so I see this as a good thing because I don't ever even use the BC abilities of my PS3. I also feel that if you want BC you can go and spend the extra $100 for it.
As for your point about us all loosing because they don't spend all of the money for development on any one system I also think you are wrong. If say Micro-Soft won the "console-war" today how many more features do you think they would introduce with no competition to drive them. When would the next price reduction come? How long before they introduce the X-Box 720 since no one else is going to put out anything better? Competition is good thing for the consumer. Having multiple systems out there drives the market. it advances the games. It also drive the companies to work for the Best games to be developed for their system since without great games to sell systems why would people spend money on their company. I bought a PS3 while you may own something else. I don't think my choice was wrong for me and yours was prob correct for you. Why it is so nessesary to defame or badmouth the other systems is beyond me. But then again here I am once again defending my purchase with no real hope of anyone new understanding my point of view so to each his own I guess.
I once again have to disagree with you.With your first statement you dismissed the point I was getting at by going off on an unrelated statement of your opinion of what games you like. What did that have to do with the advertising campaign in Amsterdam? That was what you had started talking about when you seemed to imply that Sony had given up hope selling the PS3 in Amsterdam.
Your Second rebuttal once again brought up something that was not being discussed. I don't consider BC of PS2 games being games for the PS3. When I said there are games out there for the PS3 I meant just that. For some reason people don't want to admit that multi-platform games are PS3 games as well as 360 games. You then made some assertion that multi-platform games play better on the 360. ( I noted this as one of my major disappointments in the PS3 ) ,and that is not a motivation to buy a PS3. I already own a PS3. I have stated the reasons why I own it on this forum a few different times. I do not own a 360 so those games that you can play on you 360 I cannot unless it is a multi-platform game. They do exist that was the point. The games are there. I am not tempted to go buy a 360 just to play those games on that system but if I own a system those games are there. Also there are still some PS3 exclusives. You may not like them but some people do. They do exist. when people say that there are " NO" games for the PS3 it is kind of insulting to the people who own games for the PS3 like myself because they are either exaggerating or actually saying that there are no good games and these are both wrong.
Your third statement was almost the same as what I said but spun in a negative manner. I still believe that Rumble was added to appease the people who have demanded it. They didn't think it was cost effective or a necessity for the launch system. they made press releases to spin that decision in a positive manner. ( By this I mean make the choice to leave it out seem like a good idea.) The addition to bring it back was not what they had intended to do. It was something that was done in response to their customers. I still see this as a good thing.
As for the price cut it is so simple I don't know why some people want to think of it as some type of ruse that Sony is trying to pull on everyone. I like how you used the Price Point argument once again. This is simple if you buy a 10 oz. can of tuna for $.50 and the next day it is $.35 the price on the 10oz can is still less money there for the price was cut. As for your Inventory Liquidation argument. I have to commend you that I have not seen it but it once again smoke and mirrors. Inventory liquidation is just a reason for a price cut not a term for lowering the price that some how magically doesn't qualify as a price cut.
I don't really understand what you mean in your next statement because it can be taken in 2 different ways. When you were talking about a lowered featured version for a lowered price I thought you were talking about the rumored $400 PS3 that is supposed to come out soon. They took away BC and brought it in $100 cheaper. I own a PS3 so I see this as a good thing because I don't ever even use the BC abilities of my PS3. I also feel that if you want BC you can go and spend the extra $100 for it.
As for your point about us all loosing because they don't spend all of the money for development on any one system I also think you are wrong. If say Micro-Soft won the "console-war" today how many more features do you think they would introduce with no competition to drive them. When would the next price reduction come? How long before they introduce the X-Box 720 since no one else is going to put out anything better? Competition is good thing for the consumer. Having multiple systems out there drives the market. it advances the games. It also drive the companies to work for the Best games to be developed for their system since without great games to sell systems why would people spend money on their company. I bought a PS3 while you may own something else. I don't think my choice was wrong for me and yours was prob correct for you. Why it is so nessesary to defame or badmouth the other systems is beyond me. But then again here I am once again defending my purchase with no real hope of anyone new understanding my point of view so to each his own I guess.
DragonMasterAlex
2[H]4U
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360 and PS3 *neither* have adequate bandwidth to process the kinds of graphics we're hoping for easily at 1080p, and both have a similar amount of bandwidth. 360 has a *little* room because of the eDram on die on the GPU, but even still, 720p really is the sweet spot. Either system could certainly do 1080p graphics, but the expense in memory bandwidth, CPU time, etc would require sacrifices to be made in other areas (physics, AI, # of objects onscreen at once, etc). Techniques like Normal Mapping, LOD, texture compression, etc. can all help--and indeed, we wouldn't have seen what we have so far without those technologies--but the bottom line is that there are a finite amount of resources available on either system--on ANY system--and the job of the coders and artists is to make the very best use of those resources that they can, and brute force shoveling polygons and uncompressed textures through the pipe simply isn't the way that happens.
Great game design is done with a great deal of *finesse*, muscle alone isn't the answer.
I'd say that was a clever rant, if in fact it *had* been. Unfortunately it was just stupid. I acknowledge quite clearly that PSP's sales were boosted by the introduction of the new model. Didn't mention Crisis Core (didn't care, FFVII is the most overrated game of all time, IMHO), but that's a good point, as the combo of a big title and a hardware revision are clearly potent in the marketplace.
The point remains, however, that it takes more than one or two titles to make up a huge deficiency. Do you seriously believe that a redesign and Crisis Core will bring the PSP's 6 million sold in Japan up to par with the DS's 19 million sold in Japan? I'm betting not a chance in hell. The same is true for MGS4 (which I eagerly await and *might* be tempted to get a PS3 for even before the slim comes out, but only time will tell) and even FFXIII; will they sell like mad? Of course they will. Are they alone--or even coupled with a price drop--enough to overcome ALL the titles and sales accumulated so far on 360 and Wii? Probably not.
This should be a familiar position, though: Xbox fanboys who just KNEW Xbox's more powerful hardware would pull it ahead of PS2 if they just got in those few great titles ended up disappointed when the momentum of the system with an already beefy--and improving rapidly--library was just too much to overcome. PS3 is in the same boat right now, and it's going to take more than a couple titles and a price drop to make up that distance. Frankly, it probably won't happen at all, but hey, I'm open--anything's possible
I'm not going to respond to your first two rants because you are arguing a point I never tried to make pulling a little straw man fallacy to disprove what I said. But as for your last rant the PS3 is no ware near in the same ship as the first xbox because sony has a huge line up of developers working for them and the xbox has almost nobody no ware near the same boat.
DragonMasterAlex
2[H]4U
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Actually, there are far MORE developers working on Xbox 360 titles than on PS3 titles (and more yet developing for Wii). Your claim that MS has "almost nobody" working on games for the 360 just proves that in addition to being ignorant, uneducated and a corporate whore, you just plain don't pay attention.
I'll have to quote myself and maybe bold it for you to actually read what I type.
Quote from stevedave just a post above:
"But as for your last rant the PS3 is no ware near in the same ship as the first xbox because sony has a huge line up of developers working for them and the xbox has almost nobody no ware near the same boat."
I said that the first xbox has no develoers not the Xbox360. Hell you can't even stop yourself from straw manning every argument you get into. Learn to read first then try an argument.
DragonMasterAlex
2[H]4U
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Ah, you're correct, I didn't read that carefully enough
. however, not reading something carefully enough isn't the same thing as setting up a Straw Man, you might want to read up on your debate terminology.The point remains, however: Sony has a *slim* list of developers working on PS3 compared to what MS and Nintendo have working on their respective systems this generation. That's not a recipe for "catching up", my friend
Ah, you're correct, I didn't read that carefully enough
The point remains, however: Sony has a *slim* list of developers working on PS3 compared to what MS and Nintendo have working on their respective systems this generation. That's not a recipe for "catching up", my friend
No the point remains you compared ps3's state to the original xbox's state when they are completely different Sony's first party development is more than all of the original Xboxs development. Even if the PS3 doesnt have as many developers as Xbox360 or Wii they have enough to keep them doing far better than the original Xbox.
Sorry for the list everyone:
Naughty Dog
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: Uncharted: Drake's Fortune
Next Project: ?
Rumoured Projects: Jak & Daxter: The Lost Frontier
Guerrilla Games
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: Killzone 2
Next Project: ?
Evolution Studios
Completed Projects: Motorstorm
Current Project: Motorstorm 2
Next Project: ?
Slant Six Games
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: SOCOM: Confrontation
Next Project: ?
SCE London
Completed Projects: None
Current Projects: The Getaway, SingStar, Eight Days
Next Project: ?
Studio Liverpool
Completed Projects: F1 Championship Edition
Current Project: WipeOut HD
Next Project: WipeOut PS3 (2008)
Sony San Diego Studios
Completed Projects: NBA '07, MLB '07 The Show, NBA '08
Current Project: MLB 08: The Show
Next Project: ?
Incognito
Completed Projects: Warhawk
Current Project: None
Next Project: Studio Dead, RIP.
Sony Online Entertainment
Completed Projects: Untold Legends: Dark Kingdom
Current Project: The Agency
Next Project: ?
Clap Hanz
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: Hot Shots Golf 5
Next Project: ?
Polyphony Digital
Completed Projects: Gran Turismo HD
Current Project: Gran Turismo 5
Next Project: ?
Home Platform Group
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: Home
Studio Japan
Completed Projects: None
Current Projects:The Eye of Judgment
Next Project: ?
Rumoured Projects: Ape Escape
Team Ico
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: ?
Next Project: ?
Sony Santa Monica
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: ?
Next Project: ?
Rumoured Projects: God of War III
Zipper Interactive
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: ?
Next Project: ?
Rumoured Projects: SOCOM: U.S. Navy Seals IV
Sony Bend
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: ?
Next Project: ?
Rumoured Projects: Syphon Filter PS3
Studio Cambridge
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: ?
Next Project: ?
SCE Foster City
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: ?
Next Project: ?
Team Siren
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: ?
Next Project: ?
Rumoured Project: Siren PS3
-------- Sony Published Games (Developers are not owned by Sony) ----------
Insomniac Games
Completed Projects: Resistance: Fall Of Man
Current Project: Ratchet & Clank Future: Tools Of Destruction
Next Project: ?
Rumoured Projects: Resistance 2
Factor 5
Completed Projects: Lair
Current Project: ?
Next Project: ?
Level 5
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: White Knight Story
Next Project: ?
Rumoured Future Projects: Dark Cloud 3
Sucker Punch
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: inFamous
Next Project: ?
Media Molecule
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: LittleBigPlanet
Next Project: ?
Ninja Theory
Completed Projects: Heavenly Sword
Current Project: ?
Next Project: ?
Rumoured Projects: Heavenly Sword 2
Game Republic (*Published by Studio Japan)
Completed Projects: Genji: Days of the Blade*, Folklore*
Current Project: ?
Next Project: ?
Relentless Software
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: BUZZ! Quiz TV
Rhino Studios
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: Afrika
Next Project: ?
Quantic Dream
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: Heavy Rain
Next Project: ?
Eat, Sleep, Play
Completed Projects: None
Current Project: ?
Next Project: ?
Rumoured Project: Twisted Metal PS3
Now we're just arguing for the sake of arguing - clearly the original Xbox has nothing at all to do with this thread.
DragonMasterAlex
2[H]4U
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Now you're just arguing to argue, which is pointless.
Here is the BOTTOM line: PS3 has the fewest developers working on the fewest games of ANY of the current generation platforms, *period*. Barring some extraordinary event in which the PS3 begins to outsell 360 and Wii, or at least 360, everywhere on earth, that's not going to change. Indeed, what history showed with Gamecube and Xbox was that the further the competition got behind (as PS3 is now doing), the less developers made games for the systems.
I like the way you stick to your fantasy though, it's very cute and funny
Now you're just arguing to argue, which is pointless.
Here is the BOTTOM line: PS3 has the fewest developers working on the fewest games of ANY of the current generation platforms, *period*. Barring some extraordinary event in which the PS3 begins to outsell 360 and Wii, or at least 360, everywhere on earth, that's not going to change. Indeed, what history showed with Gamecube and Xbox was that the further the competition got behind (as PS3 is now doing), the less developers made games for the systems.
I like the way you stick to your fantasy though, it's very cute and funny
Again why are you comparing the ps3 with the xbox and gcube after I just got done pointing out that they are no ware near being in the same position. Developers aren't going to stop developing for the Ps3 unless people stop buying it, and currently they have 5 million sold in it's first year which is about the same as what the 360 had in its first year.
Also if the 360 has so many more developers how come when you compare the list of games for the 360 and ps3 in Wikipedia the 360 only has 76 more games with a year head start?
You should use beta max to try and prove your next point against the ps3 that would be a nice way to use another fallacy to base your logic on.
Well, I don't think the quantity of games is really at question here. The thread is directed at the quality of those games, and how well the community of gamers will accept them. I think the paramount question involved here is does the PS3 have a rabbit in it's hat to compare to Halo3. Now, of course Halo3 is the Xbox's flagship (ex)franchise... and we have to take into account that the PS3 might not have a single compariable franchise to Halo, but it has a good number of relatively good titles to pull from. However, unlike in the PS2 era - the PS3 has seemingly has less contential steam. It needs that good content to overcome it's competition - which has more than twice as many units in the hands of consumers, and more games available for it. Even compariable content won't be enough for the PS3 to gain it's required market share. I've pointed out several shortcomings of Sony in relation to their marketing. When you mention the PS3 has had the same amount of sales in the same time as the Xbox360 had, you're not taking these things into context. For instance, as I had mentioned several times previously - there is a considerable amount of PS3 owners that are not gamers - they purchased the unit as a Bluray player - really the best player for the money for quite some time - that severely weakens those figures, since the actual game revenue is what makes or breaks a console. Also, a large portion of those sales are from Japan - where Microsoft has had quite a lot of difficulty penetrating. But, remember we don't live in Japan - so what we should really be focusing on is domestic sales figures. We can't calculate how many of those 5 million are from the US, and how many of them are actually going to be gamers, and not just watching movies on their systems. Obviously what I'm saying is speculation - but the facts exist where you would expect them to in support of this theory.
DragonMasterAlex
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I realize you aren't very intelligent, so I'll go slow:
Year 1, Xbox 360 sold around 9 million units.
Year 1, PS3 has sold around 4.9 million units.
Those are both WORLDWIDE numbers.
Once more: There are DOUBLE the number of developers working on 360 titles as PS3 titles. There are nearly TRIPLE the number of developers working on Wii titles as PS3 titles.
When there are less games being made for a system, it sells fewer units. When a system sells fewer units, fewer publishers are willing to invest the money to build exclusive content for said system.
PS3 is akin to Gamecube and Xbox IN THE SENSE that it is currently a)selling far fewer units than the competition, and b) has far fewer exclusives in development for it than the competition.
The lesson we learned from GC and Xbox last gen is that, when you're in that position, the odds of catching up are *very* long indeed.
Take 5 minutes. Get your mom to explain it if need be. I know extrapolating a concept from a concrete can be difficult, so please don't hurt yourself, I look forward each day to your inane commentary to give me a chuckle
I realize you aren't very intelligent, so I'll go slow:
Year 1, Xbox 360 sold around 9 million units.
Year 1, PS3 has sold around 4.9 million units.
Those are both WORLDWIDE numbers.
Once more: There are DOUBLE the number of developers working on 360 titles as PS3 titles. There are nearly TRIPLE the number of developers working on Wii titles as PS3 titles.
When there are less games being made for a system, it sells fewer units. When a system sells fewer units, fewer publishers are willing to invest the money to build exclusive content for said system.
PS3 is akin to Gamecube and Xbox IN THE SENSE that it is currently a)selling far fewer units than the competition, and b) has far fewer exclusives in development for it than the competition.
The lesson we learned from GC and Xbox last gen is that, when you're in that position, the odds of catching up are *very* long indeed.
Take 5 minutes. Get your mom to explain it if need be. I know extrapolating a concept from a concrete can be difficult, so please don't hurt yourself, I look forward each day to your inane commentary to give me a chuckle
Alright, enough bashing, we're trying to set an example for console discussion without the use of violence and personal pot shots.
I realize you aren't very intelligent, so I'll go slow:
Year 1, Xbox 360 sold around 9 million units.
Year 1, PS3 has sold around 4.9 million units.
Those are both WORLDWIDE numbers.
Once more: There are DOUBLE the number of developers working on 360 titles as PS3 titles. There are nearly TRIPLE the number of developers working on Wii titles as PS3 titles.
When there are less games being made for a system, it sells fewer units. When a system sells fewer units, fewer publishers are willing to invest the money to build exclusive content for said system.
PS3 is akin to Gamecube and Xbox IN THE SENSE that it is currently a)selling far fewer units than the competition, and b) has far fewer exclusives in development for it than the competition.
The lesson we learned from GC and Xbox last gen is that, when you're in that position, the odds of catching up are *very* long indeed.
Take 5 minutes. Get your mom to explain it if need be. I know extrapolating a concept from a concrete can be difficult, so please don't hurt yourself, I look forward each day to your inane commentary to give me a chuckle
Your problem is that you think that because you say it's true that it makes it true. The only thing we have learned from the xbox and Gcube is that they didn't do as well as the PS2 they have nothing to do with the ps3 you are trying to imply that because the xbox and gcube couldn't catch that neither can the ps3 which is faulty logic.
Wikipedia has 5.9 million for its first year not 9 mil.
Q4 2005 1.5 million
Q1 2006 1.7 million
Q2 2006 1.8 million
Q3 2006 0.9 million
If the Xbox 360 has 2X the development staff then it would logically develop twice the amount of games but if you check out the list of 360 games next to the list of ps3 games the 360 only has 76 more games. The ps3 has 295 games listed so the xbox 360 if it truly has double the development staff should have at least 590 games listed and they don't so you are full of shit the xbox 360 has no ware near double the development, and the Wii doesn't have 3X the development either.
Just so you know using ad hominem to try and prove your point just makes you look stupid.
I realize you aren't very intelligent, so I'll go slow:
Year 1, Xbox 360 sold around 9 million units.
Year 1, PS3 has sold around 4.9 million units.
Those are both WORLDWIDE numbers.
Once more: There are DOUBLE the number of developers working on 360 titles as PS3 titles. There are nearly TRIPLE the number of developers working on Wii titles as PS3 titles.
When there are less games being made for a system, it sells fewer units. When a system sells fewer units, fewer publishers are willing to invest the money to build exclusive content for said system.
PS3 is akin to Gamecube and Xbox IN THE SENSE that it is currently a)selling far fewer units than the competition, and b) has far fewer exclusives in development for it than the competition.
The lesson we learned from GC and Xbox last gen is that, when you're in that position, the odds of catching up are *very* long indeed.
Take 5 minutes. Get your mom to explain it if need be. I know extrapolating a concept from a concrete can be difficult, so please don't hurt yourself, I look forward each day to your inane commentary to give me a chuckle
How is this correct? The 360 has outsold the PS3 every month since Feb. If this is true then the PS3 somehow magically sold 5 million units while the 360 sold 3 million with out outselling the 360 in every month. Does this mean that the PS3 sold over 3 million at launch?
DragonMasterAlex
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LOL, Wikipedia is NOT a valid source, thanks
. Not ONE of the major sales tracking sites shows it as 5.9 million worldwide for year one. While none of them are guaranteed dead accurate, VGCharts and nexgenwars both have much higher numbers than what your wishful thinking proclaims.Further, your numbers on games for each platform are OBSCENELY far off. Observe the numbers as of the July 2007 update for console EXCLUSIVES:
PS3 exclusives in development: 47 (up 3 from the prior update)
360 exclusives in development: 96 (up 5 from the prior update)
Wii exclusives in development: 113 (up 37 from the prior update)
Now, 47 x 2= 94, so as I posited previously, 360 has more than TWICE the exclusives in development as PS3 does. Further, Wii has 113 exclusives in development, but the most telling bit is that the number had increased from the prior update by *37* titles. 37! That's indicative of a significant shift in development resources, undoubtedly driven by *publishers* who see the Wii beating PS3 down like a cur dog and are directing developers to shift resources. Remember that PUBLISHERS foot the bill for the games being developed, they call the shots. 113 vs 47--as I said, NEARLY TRIPLE the number of exclusives that are coming for PS3 so far.
In the time since July there've been a few new announcements across all the platforms, but not that many, and the sales patterns haven't significantly shifted either, so it's quite likely that development continues as it was in July, and I'm sure the next update to the exclusives tracking chart will bear that out.
Further, it's kind of sad that you aren't able to observe parallels and extrapolate patterns from one generation to another. I wonder why that is?
Last but not least, with you around it's hard for *anyone* to look stupid. A little mean spirited perhaps, but stupid? Not with your shining face beaming back at us, kiddo
DragonMasterAlex
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No, the US and Japanese launch was pretty stilted, though the European launch was pretty massive (a story recently pointed out that the bulk of PS3's european sales happened inside of the first week it was available).
So far PS3 hasn't outsold 360 during *any* month, much less *every* month, with the exception of Japan, which was a foregone conclusion given 360's performance to date in Japan.
LOL, Wikipedia is NOT a valid source, thanks
Further, your numbers on games for each platform are OBSCENELY far off. Observe the numbers as of the July 2007 update for console EXCLUSIVES:
PS3 exclusives in development: 47 (up 3 from the prior update)
360 exclusives in development: 96 (up 5 from the prior update)
Wii exclusives in development: 113 (up 37 from the prior update)
Now, 47 x 2= 94, so as I posited previously, 360 has more than TWICE the exclusives in development as PS3 does. Further, Wii has 113 exclusives in development, but the most telling bit is that the number had increased from the prior update by *37* titles. 37! That's indicative of a significant shift in development resources, undoubtedly driven by *publishers* who see the Wii beating PS3 down like a cur dog and are directing developers to shift resources. Remember that PUBLISHERS foot the bill for the games being developed, they call the shots. 113 vs 47--as I said, NEARLY TRIPLE the number of exclusives that are coming for PS3 so far.
In the time since July there've been a few new announcements across all the platforms, but not that many, and the sales patterns haven't significantly shifted either, so it's quite likely that development continues as it was in July, and I'm sure the next update to the exclusives tracking chart will bear that out.
Further, it's kind of sad that you aren't able to observe parallels and extrapolate patterns from one generation to another. I wonder why that is?
Last but not least, with you around it's hard for *anyone* to look stupid. A little mean spirited perhaps, but stupid? Not with your shining face beaming back at us, kiddo
I'm at the work so anything with the word game in it is blocked except if it's in wikipedia not the most creditable but no site really is.
I don't want to spend time quoteing you but you never onces said that they had double the amount of exclusive titles you just said double the developers you really need to pay and read and type more carefully.
As for the wikipedia game list it is pretty accurate it list all games release and in development. PS3 has 290 released and in development and xbox360 has 375 which shuts down the double development......even though you ment exclusives but just didn't say exclusives.
The main flaw with you "extrapolated patterns" is that cercumstances aren't the same. You could say that Microsoft is going to drop all development on the xbox360 in 4 years/2009 becuase thats what they did with the first xbox they have to follow their pattern even though the cercumstances are completely different.
I'm at the work so anything with the word game in it is blocked except if it's in Wikipedia; not the most creditable but no site really is.
I don't want to spend time quoting you but you never once said that they had double the amount of exclusive titles you just said double the developers you really need to pay attention and read and type more carefully.
As for the Wikipedia game list it is pretty accurate it list all games release and in development. PS3 has 290 released and in development and xbox360 has 375 which shuts down the double development claim......even though you meant exclusives but just didn't say exclusives.
The main flaw with your "extrapolated patterns" is that circumstances aren't the same. You could say that Microsoft is going to drop all development on the xbox360 in 4 years/2009 because thats what they did with the first xbox. Also using your logic the Wii should have lagged behind just like the N64 and Gcube because that is their extrapolated pattern but what o yeah the circumstances were different. So you can continue to extrapolate all you want but all your really doing is spilling out bull shit because you have no clue what your really talking about.
Here is a good pattern for you The PS1 owned all the PS2 owned all so using your flawless pattern extrapolation the ps3 should own all right .
DragonMasterAlex
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Actually the circumstances are quite similar: launched a year late, not as many developers on board as are on board with the competition, and the competition--both of them--are selling gangbusters compared to PS3.
"PS1 owned all...PS2 owned all" isn't an extrapolation of a pattern, it's an attempt to pretend a pattern exists without actually considering any of the accompanying factors. Clearly, PS3 has better support than did Xbox 1 at launch, but that doesn't change the fact that 360 still has far more developers working on its platform, as does the Wii. I'm sorry, but those items are facts that you can't escape from.
PS3 will undoubtedly fair well enough to not be a total failure, and indeed, I expect that in the long haul it will do better than either GC or Xbox 1 did, but the odds of it pulling ahead of Wii and 360 are very, very slim, and every month that it's outsold by the competition is another month that makes it even more unlikely they'll recover this generation.
Your wrong and its just that plain and simple the Gcube had Mario, and the The xbox had halo and thats it, where the ps3 has; GT5, FFXIII, MGS, SingStar & Buzz. Also some huge x factors tied to LBP & Home. You have also a handful of other 08 games destined to become multi-million sellers like Killzone 2, MotorStorm 2, Socom 4, White Knight, possibly Resistance 2 if it releases. Is there any doubt Fifa/Pes won't be dominant on the system next year? There are quite a handful of other games like disgaea 3 as well but we dont need any more list wars.
Anyways, I believe a global second place is coming much faster than some people expect. The X360 lead isn't that big as some people feel, after 23 months on the market (where 12 of them were totally without competition) it has managed ~10 million. The PS3 after 11 months (eight in Europe) and a high price point have managed ~4.5million and they haven't come near to releasing their biggest software bombs and just now it's apparent they had this global price decrease (40GB model release) planned for this Christmas. You will see a large upturn in 2008 starting slightly with this Christmas. By end of 2008 xbox 360 and PS3 will be fighting neck and neck with ps3 pulling ahead in the end
DragonMasterAlex
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Right, and as I recall, Motorstorm 1 was supposed to turn it around...then Lair was supposed to...then Ninja Gaiden Sigma...in short, you keep saying the same thing, just like all the fanboys do: "Just wait, one more title...no wait...that one! No I meant that next one!" Yes, there are some nice titles coming for PS3; not nearly as many as are coming for 360 and Wii. Sorry kid, but so far your argument is all based on "just wait and see!" and so far all we've seen is PS3 sliding further and further behind.
OK, so you've called your predictions, here are mine:
1. PS3 will not overtake 360 any time in 2008.
2. PS3 will NEVER overtake Wii.
Stereophile
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You're including two Christmas seasons and then some with that X360 sales figure. X360 didn't reach 9 million units sold until around March/April '06, 16 months after launch.
The ONE YEAR total i.e. late November/early December '05 to late November/early December '06 is around 5.5 million. We don't have one year sales totals for PS3 yet since we have another 5 weeks to go. Add some more time after that for the analysis to come to NPD and the other industry tracking organizations.
At this point in their respective histories they are virtually tied. Which is incredible, since up to this point, the PS3 costs considerably more and had two competitors its first year, unlike X360.
A major price drop is coming. You'll see a large spike in PS3 sales the end of this year just like X360 had during its second holiday season.
PS3 should sell another 1-2 million consoles by the end of the year with a steady increasing trend into the 1st and 2nd quarters of '08 as some of the big AAA exclusives hit. PS3 may not reach 9 million quite as soon as X360, it depends on a lot of things.
You intentionally distorted the numbers. You're such a bullshitter.