How much power do I need?

E

EndersShadow

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Dec 27, 2008
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I am in the process of building a server (going to take time due to lack of cash flow). I have the following parts or will be ordering them shortly:

Motherboard (have): Asus P5E
CPU (have): 2.4 Pentium D w/ Stock Intel fan
Case (buying tonight): Antec 182
Video Card (buying newegg): ATI 3450

HDD's (to be purchased later):
2 80 Gig Samsung HDD's in Raid 1 (for OS)
X 1 TB Samsung Spinpoint HDD's in Raid 5
Raid Card: Unknown at this point, will have a min of 4 SATA connections, max of 8

I need to know how much power these items combined would draw to make sure I get a beefy enough PSU. Brand matters only in so much as it needs to be reliable and have preferably more than enough power to drive all these items. 80% efficiency would be nice but not required. Any Suggestions?
 
Antec EA430 would be plenty I would think.
Maybe a 500w to have some extra headroom for the future if you want.
 
You could do that system with a quality 350w supply, but I'd probably buy a 400w just because good ones seem easier to find. Obviously this is not going to hold you if you decide to turn it into a gaming system and go for SLI or something.
 
dandragonrage said:
You could do that system with a quality 350w supply, but I'd probably buy a 400w just because good ones seem easier to find. Obviously this is not going to hold you if you decide to turn it into a gaming system and go for SLI or something.
Click to expand...

Ok. I was looking in that range but was getting some sites telling me I needed 534 watts and others saying around 250. Looks like anything above 500 would be overkill. I currently have no goals of making this a gaming system. I dont even play games on my machine with a quad core @ 3.7 and a 4870x2 lol...Any suggestions on specific models?
 
don't buy the antec 182
i have one for my desktop, for a server it would be a pain-in-the-bum. the internal cable run is dreadful
my server is based on a coolermaster rc590
cheaper and far easier to work with
----
sata card: consider a supermicro SAT2-MV8
it's pci-x but works in a regular pci slot
8 sata ports
inexpensive
 
Asposium said:
don't buy the antec 182
i have one for my desktop, for a server it would be a pain-in-the-bum. the internal cable run is dreadful
my server is based on a coolermaster rc590
cheaper and far easier to work with
Click to expand...

I am more worried about noise than anything. This thing will be on 24/7 with a lot of drives. Running the cables wont bother me too much, I kinda know what I am doing there and it will be simple enough I would think, plus I have seen some mods to allow the cables to run along the sides.

My brother-in-law has that case and while it is nice, it is waaaay to open for my tastes as it will let me hear all the awesome clicking and seeking noise from the HDD's. This is the reason I sold my Thermaltake Armour+ and bought a ATSC 840 for my main rig and then covered it in Acoustimat foam. As far as cable management goes, once the Frontplane is isntalled it wont be something I need to worry about much as I can pull the HDD's out without actually opening up the case.


Asposium said:
sata card: consider a supermicro SAT2-MV8
it's pci-x but works in a regular pci slot
8 sata ports
inexpensive
Click to expand...

I looked at that card but plan on waiting till the PCI-E version comes out as using PCI limits my bandwith options more. To start I will only be using 5 drives and build up from there. I think that by the time I would need more space that card in PCI-E would be out.
 
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EndersShadow said:
I looked at that card but plan on waiting till the PCI-E version comes out as using PCI limits my bandwith options more. To start I will only be using 5 drives and build up from there. I think that by the time I would need more space that card in PCI-E would be out.
Click to expand...

the PCIe version is out :D

Also just so you know your not really bandwitdh limited by the card in either case.
Theoretical Max thorughput is gonna be 125 MB/s because of gig ethernet.
Also I dont know of any mechanical drives that can sustain 100MB/s reads or writes.

So really a PCI slot isnt gonna be the problem....just so you know.
 
nitrobass24 said:
the PCIe version is out :D

Also just so you know your not really bandwitdh limited by the card in either case.
Theoretical Max thorughput is gonna be 125 MB/s because of gig ethernet.
Also I dont know of any mechanical drives that can sustain 100MB/s reads or writes.

So really a PCI slot isnt gonna be the problem....just so you know.
Click to expand...

Good to know, it was something posted in a different thread I started a while back. Where can one find that card? I was looking for it last night with no success.

Here is the current short list of PSU's off the egg. Any other suggestions are welcomed.

CORSAIR 400W 59.99
6 x Peripheral
6 x SATA

I really like that this one has the cables sleeved, also seems to have more SATA and Molex connections than the others

Antec earthwatts 430W 59.99
6 x Peripheral
4 x SATA

I have heard the earthwatts are great performers and low on power usage

BFG Tech 450W 69.99

Dont really know much about BFG, but have seen them recommended a couple of times.
 
nitrobass24 said:
Provantage has them IIRC
NCIX
Click to expand...

Now will I be able to use this to add HDD's to a RAID array? I plan on running 2 80 gig HDD's in Raid 0 off the board and then the rest of the HDD's (including any connected to a SATA controller card) in a Raid 5 array. Would that be possible or am I looking at another card? Also I assume a PCI-Ex4 card will work in a PCI-ex16 slot correct?
 
and bought a ATSC 840 for my main rig and then covered it in Acoustimat foam.
Click to expand...
Like our silence, do we? :)

Theoretical Max thorughput is gonna be 125 MB/s because of gig ethernet.
Click to expand...
I'm just curious...If he's going to use 5 x 1 TB Samsung Spinpoint HDD's in Raid 5 with all the RAID operations going on, what would be the highest theoretical bus speed?

My thinking cap is taking the year off...any ideas?
 
Old Hippie said:
Like our silence, do we? :)
Click to expand...

Yes, yes I do. In addition to being quiet it looks really really sexy. I even have a NXZT Sentry fan controller controlling the 240mm fans on it plus 3 others. I love the Noctua CPU heatsink as well, keeps my CPU cool and silent. As this is in the bedroom I want to keep it as silent as possible. The server will also be in the bedroom where noise = gf not able to sleep = BAD THINGS!!!!

Old Hippie said:
I'm just curious...If he's going to use 5 x 1 TB Samsung Spinpoint HDD's in Raid 5 with all the RAID operations going on, what would be the highest theoretical bus speed?

My thinking cap is taking the year off...any ideas?
Click to expand...

At max it would be a total of 12 1 TB drives (6 onboard - 2 for OS in Raid 0) plus the 8 on this SATA card = total of 12 HDD's in Raid 5. I doubt I will ever need that much space but the more I get into massive rendering for my 3d Animations it might indeed happen. I also plan to stream my recorded OTA DTV shows and ripped DVD's to my Xbox and other computer to watch at times.

Any other comments on the above listed Powersupplys?
 
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Well neither of those cards do RAID...so you will be using FakeRaid if you go that route....Not reccomended.

Old Hippe max theoretical bus speed?
PCI is 133MB/s
PCIe x8 2gb/s IIRC
 
nitrobass24 said:
Well neither of those cards do RAID...so you will be using FakeRaid if you go that route....Not reccomended.

Old Hippe max theoretical bus speed?
PCI is 133MB/s
PCIe x8 2gb/s IIRC
Click to expand...

So what card would I be looking at to do anything other than fake RAID? I will be starting with just 5 drives running off the motherboard (Asus P5E) and adding more to the Raid 5 array later via a card in the PCI-E x 16 slot. Is that possible and if so what kind of card woudl I need (I am very new to this stuff)
 
I've used that Antec unit and it's very nice. If you do refurbs it's 36.00 at MWave.

I don't believe Corsair makes a bad PS but I don't have any experience with the 400W units.

I've never had a BFG anything but because they hired a very honest guy (JG), I have no doubt they recognize ethics and honesty.

I'd probably take my chances, save a few bucks, and go with the Antec.
 
I think I like the Antec better. The fan at the rear rather than the bottom kinda sealed it for me. The Antec 182's bottom compartment has a 120mm fan right before the PSU and that would feed straight into the vent on the front and then the hot air would get pushed out the back of the PSU. I think that works better. I will just have to deal with it not looking as good (due to lack of sleeving) as the Corsair, but it also has more power. I know I could sleeve the PSU, but I lack both the patience and drive to do so. As this build is going to take some time I might decide to sleeve the SATA and Molex stuff, who knows.

Any suggestions on RAID cards that will allow me to add more HDD's to a 3 drive Raid 5 array?
 
How much you want to spend?

Prolly a Dell Perc5 or Perc6 will be the best bang for the buck.
 
I'm sure the P182 makes a great server case (used one for my desktop), ideally you would stay below 6 drives, due to the HDD cages. Highly recommended.
 
timme said:
I'm sure the P182 makes a great server case (used one for my desktop), ideally you would stay below 6 drives, due to the HDD cages. Highly recommended.
Click to expand...

I planned on using a backplane module to turn all the 5 1/2 bays into 3.5 bays. Looking at ones similar to this....
 
I will just have to deal with it not looking as good (due to lack of sleeving) as the Corsair, but it also has more power.
Click to expand...

Oh No, another server that won't make a fashion statement! :D

I just hide mine in a closet with my platform shoes!
 
Just got back from Frye's. While they didnt have the P182 in stock :(, they did have the 180 so I picked it up for 65 dollars. I also picked up a Antec Earthwatts 430 for 52 as well. Now I just need to order the ATI 3450 and wait for HDD's to be on sale to pick up a slew of them....YIPPEEEE!!!

Still looking for suggestions on a PCI-E RAID card however...
 
EndersShadow said:
I am in the process of building a server (going to take time due to lack of cash flow). I have the following parts or will be ordering them shortly:

Motherboard (have): Asus P5E
CPU (have): 2.4 Pentium D w/ Stock Intel fan
Case (buying tonight): Antec 182
Video Card (buying newegg): ATI 3450

HDD's (to be purchased later):
2 80 Gig Samsung HDD's in Raid 1 (for OS)
X 1 TB Samsung Spinpoint HDD's in Raid 5
Raid Card: Unknown at this point, will have a min of 4 SATA connections, max of 8

I need to know how much power these items combined would draw to make sure I get a beefy enough PSU. Brand matters only in so much as it needs to be reliable and have preferably more than enough power to drive all these items. 80% efficiency would be nice but not required. Any Suggestions?
Click to expand...


Just so you will post in the correct board, this link below is for Power Supply questions.
http://www.hardforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=93

The board you are now on is for Data Storage, ie: Hard drives, SSD drives, etc

;)
 
SR45 said:
Just so you will post in the correct board, this link below is for Power Supply questions.
http://www.hardforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=93

The board you are now on is for Data Storage, ie: Hard drives, SSD drives, etc

;)
Click to expand...

Ooops, my bad. I can honestly say I have never noticed that forum before. My thinking for putting it here was that the PSU will be used in a server. My apologies.

On a subject current to this thread. I have a couple of questions being new to this.

1. How much will the cache size on the HDD matter when used in a server?

2. Is there a cache size to avoid going under?

3. What are folks opinions on the following drive for server use: SAMSUNG Spinpoint F1.

4. Would using two SSD's for the OS in a RAID 0 setup have enough performance impact to justify the price cost or is it better to stick with regular HDD's.
 
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1. Cache has less impact on server performance than desktop performance.
2. Again, don't worry too much about cache on server drives. Most of the transfers are either totally sequential (video streaming, etc) or totally random (database, etc)
3. The Samsung SpinPoint F1's are well regarded pretty much universally on this board. They don't have the wonky firmware in RAID setups that WD and some Seagate models have. Linear throughput is top notch, and environmental characteristics are very good too. Keen pricing make them an excellent choice all around.
4. For the OS? On a server? If your server is accessing the system drive too much, you need more RAM, period. Going to 8GB of RAM is a much more cost effective way of increasing server responsiveness than using SSDs and/or RAID-0 to increase disk throughput. Any decent server OS is going to use all the RAM you can throw at it, and RAM is cheap.
 
DougLite said:
4. For the OS? On a server? If your server is accessing the system drive too much, you need more RAM, period. Going to 8GB of RAM is a much more cost effective way of increasing server responsiveness than using SSDs and/or RAID-0 to increase disk throughput. Any decent server OS is going to use all the RAM you can throw at it, and RAM is cheap.
Click to expand...

That is good to know. I wasnt planning on adding that much RAM. It does however bring up another question.

What type of RAM do I need to look for (DDR2 800, 1066) and does the latency type matter?
 
RAM for servers is all about stability. Use the value stuff with the JEDEC standard timings from a reputable brand (Corsair, Crucial, etc). Make sure it's a speed your motherboard supports, and buy as much as the board will take. With RAM at under $20 per GB, there's no reason not to.
 
DougLite said:
RAM for servers is all about stability. Use the value stuff with the JEDEC standard timings from a reputable brand (Corsair, Crucial, etc). Make sure it's a speed your motherboard supports, and buy as much as the board will take. With RAM at under $20 per GB, there's no reason not to.
Click to expand...

My board can do 1066, but if I understand it correct that specification is only DDR2 800 that is repackaged. Is this correct?
 
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