Help! HTPC/Media Server for under $400???

I

investinwaffles

Limp Gawd
Joined
Apr 26, 2010
Messages
495
Whats up guys?

I want to build myself an Media Center/server combo but I am kind of lost. I am pretty terrible with networking :eek:

Basically, its going to be next to my TV in the living room and I want it to be an HTPC, as well as a media server. I dont want to keep my gaming rig on 24/7, and I want to be able to access my media library on my TV (now I have to dump things on a flash drive and plug my laptop in).

Will windows home server do all of this for me? And can my roommate's apple laptops connect to the media server somehow?



1) What will you be doing with this PC? Gaming? Photoshop? Web browsing? etc
HTPC/Media Server use. 1080p MKV's + Bluray playback + DVR Features (tv tuner).
2) What's your budget? Are tax and shipping included?
~$400 ish tax + shipping included, excluding all software
3) Where do you live?
Bolder, CO 80303
4) What exact parts do you need for that budget? CPU, RAM, case, etc. The word "Everything" is not a valid answer. Please list out all the parts you'll need.
Case, Mobo, CPU, Ram, HDD, PSU, and a SILENT cpu cooler. Bluray Drive and TV Tuner will be added in as I can afford them.
5) If reusing any parts, what parts will you be reusing? Please be especially specific about the power supply. List make and model.
Only part that I may re-use is an ATI 4850 if it is even needed.
6) Will you be overclocking?
Yes, if needed. If not, ill undervolt to make it as quiet as I can.
7) What size monitor do you have and/or plan to have?
42" Panny Plasma, 1080p
8) When do you plan on building/buying the PC?
Within the next month, I can wait for black friday/cyber monday I guess.
9) What features do you need in a motherboard? RAID? Firewire? Crossfire or SLI support? USB 3.0? SATA 6Gb/s? etc.
Onboard HDMI + Sound capable of HD playback
10) Do you already have a legit and reusable/transferable OS key/license? If yes, what OS? Is it 32bit or 64bit?
Vista Business 64bit or Windows 7 32bit



Prelim build I put together in 15mins for around $450, how could I compromise to lower the price, but still not have to upgrade any of the core hardware for a long time?

Is this build powerful enough for HTPC use (1080p mkv's + bluray's)? The MOBO has an AMD 785g Chipset (ATI 4200 integrated graphics). I decided to spend some extra coin on a nice ass case (with good hdd cooling), and probably overboard on the PSU.
Code: 
Antec Mini P180 White Steel MicroATX Mini Tower Computer Case 
Item #: N82E16811129044 - $80

Western Digital Caviar Green WD20EARS 2TB SATA 3.0Gb/s - $90
	
OCZ ModXStream Pro OCZ700MXSP 700W - $55

A-DATA 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) - $40

AMD Phenom II X3 715 Black Edition Heka 2.8GHz Socket AM2+ 95W Triple-Core 
GIGABYTE GA-MA785GM-US2H 785G HDMI Micro ATX AMD Motherboard - $120 for the combo

Used Thermalright TRUE with some silent fan - $35
Total: $450 + shipping

I will be adding (as I need, and can afford them) a bluray drive, tv tuner, and multiple HDDs as I need them.

What would you guys do in my situation? Does this sound like a good option (the build above, coupled with WHS)?
Is my build way overpowered (i would like it to be running 24/7 so power is a concern)? I was looking at some of the 45w AMD processors, but I am unsure if they are worth it (only $30 to upgrade to the Phenom II x3).
I went with the Phenom II X3 so I could have enough power to do things in the background such as recording cable, torrenting, etc but will playback be smooth at 1920x1080 with just the integrated graphics?? Also, would it be a better idea to have a desperate OS drive for the WHS machine such as 80gb OS drive, 2tb Storage drives??
I will probably unlock the 4th core and undervolt unless I need the speed (then I will overclock).

I also have my old 4850 that I can stick in there, but I would really prefer not to due to power use and heat.


Sorry for all the questions, i am just a little lost! Any help would be greatly appreciated!!! :D
 
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http://www.amazon.com/SilverStone-M...8KYM/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1289796044&sr=8-2 Silverstone Case + PSU 93usd
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...IsFeedbackTab=true&Keywords=(keywords)&Page=1 ASUS AM3 mITX board 125usd
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820211387 AData 2GB DDR3 SODIMM 29usd
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185129&Tpk=Scythe Big Shuriken Scythe Big Shuriken 38usd
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148452 160GB 2.5" HDD 42usd
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103714 Athlon II X2 49usd


376usd, if my math isn't wrong

Some cavets:

LPCM is ONLY 2 channel.
Dolby Digital/DTS bitstreaming is ONLY 6 channel (5.1) No Dolby HD or DTS HD [via HDMI. other 3 ways of getting audio off this boards are immune to these issues, iirc]
Only one expansion slot, and it's PCIe (16, but you can use PCIe1-->PCIe8 cards in it, too) so you have to chose between better AMD GPU or an PCIe tuner.
Needs expensive internal slim Bluray drive (I found one on newegg for 152usd...)



Advantages:
Quiet.
Small... very small.
It's silky white.
Very rewarding system to build.
 
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I thought about building an Mitx system but it is just too limited for me.

I may end up running racing sims on it (F1 2010, Dirt2, etc), so I really do want the option of a Video Card, TV tuner, and possibly a sound card. I also want to be able to stick 3 or 4 2TB HDDs in the case and the Sugo is just too crowded. I also was toying with the idea of a second DVD burner so I could make backups on the fly.

I have tons of room, so a mini tower would be perfect IMO. More room for HDD's (can fit 6+ in that mini p180) and much better cooling (will probably 7v mod all the fans in the case). What would a good M-atx board be? Something that will play nice with HDMI and audio is a huge plus.
What about a good matching CPU? Is that X3 too power hungry and overkill for my application? Would a 65w dual core be a better idea than a 95w (potential) quad core??
 
The X3 is a bit overkill, unless if you are really wanting to go gaming on it.

I listed the mITX build because it's one I have been considering for a while (modified to fit within 400usd), so I knew for normal HTPC use it would be more than enough (add HD5000 series card in).

For gaming/HTPC...


I'll think of something later tonight. Likely one of the epic forum build generators will make something better before I post it, though :p
 
Yea, gaming isnt a huge concern right now. I would love to hook up a G27 to my 42" plasma for some racing action though.
Im thinking a tri or quad core CPU would be better in that regard, and I can aways undervolt while im not gaming, and just overclock it when I decide to add in a nice vid card. Or will there be a huge power difference (keeping in mind that this thing will be idling 80% of the time)?
 
First of all: Do not use that OCZ PSU. It cannot provide 700W at all under realistic conditions. So not a good PSU at all. If anything, you went cheap on the PSU, not overboard at all.

Second, it's generally recommended by the gurus over in the HTPC subforum to not combine your HTPC and server as that generally adds more complications than necessary:
http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1419906

Third, to answer some of your questions:
- AFAIK, the popular and well recommended blu-ray disc playback software, Arcsoft Total MediaTheatre 3, does not work with WHS. In addition, IIRC, some of the GPU drivers that offloads the decoding of HD content do not work in WHS. And only a handful of TV tuner software actually work with WHS (Sage IIRC). So using WHS as your HTPC OS is not a good idea at all.
- Yes your roommate's Macs can access a WHS server quite easily.
- If you are gonna do a WHS setup, use the largest drive for the OS install for one very simple reason: It means that it will be a longer time before you have to upgrade that OS drive for more storage later on. The data storage subforum is full of threads of people who went with small OS drives for WHS and are now regretting it when they need more storage now. WHs isn't exactly as easy to reinstall as others have said.

In your situation, I would do this: Have a seperate file server and HTPC. Yes it costs more but trust me, your life will be much simpler and easier that way. No performance issues. No dealing with incompatibility issues. No dealing with heat and power issues (for the HTPC). Besides, you can temporarily use your laptop as the HTPC anyway.

I'll come up with a dedicated file server build later tonight.
 
I cant afford both right now, so i guess your right. Going with a dedicated fileserver now would be the best idea.
Unfortunately, they are both going to have to be in the living room which is why I would have loved to combine them. I dont have anywhere else for the media server to be (other than in my bedroom next to my gaming pc, I dont want that).
The cable modem is in the living room and there are not any other cable jacks in the house.

What are the main issues with a htpc/file server? The HDD cant handle playing, say a 1080p .mkv file, and streaming an SD tv show to another computer at the same time (Over gigabit ethernet)?
I dont think its necessary for one front end to do "everything" on the htpc. I can use one program to play Blurays, and another for my media library, another for music, etc. I mainly want to be able to share my files throughout my house (watch TV on my bedroom gaming PC, or watch a movie in the living room, etc). I cant really see more than 3 users accessing it at once.

Also, I planned to have the drives in no array, and just as seperate drives.
1TB System Drive, for music (only 30gb or so right now) and an intermediate torrent/newsgroup drive (will be transferred to the other drives as they complete).
2tb Movie drive
2tb TV drive #1
2tb TV drive #2
and so on (as I need more space)
Or will that be a bad performer? I havent really looked into RAID options.
Sorry im so clueless :p
 
The main advantage of keeping your file server separate from the HTPC are:
- You can easily expand the storage without interrupting your HTPC. When adding a drive to WHS, the performance of the server is greatly affected, at least in my experience.
- You can lower the heat generation in the HTPC
- You can take down the HTPC for repair or OS configuration and such without it affecting every other PC that still needs to access the data on the file server.
- There are a few occasions where streaming videos or serving files to other PCs will affect playback of video on the HTPC itself (Jerkiness, slow-down, skipped frames, frozen frames, etc, etc). Especially if you use the stock NICs.
- You can actually use an OS more suitable for NAS/file serving duty like Windows Home Server, FreeNAS, FreeBSD with ZFS, Linux with MDADM RAID, etc, etc. That means that your data is safer.
- WHS is not a good choice for a HTPC OS as illustrated in the thread I linked to.
- To repeat my earlier notes on WHS: "AFAIK, the popular and well recommended blu-ray disc playback software, Arcsoft Total MediaTheatre 3, does not work with WHS. In addition, IIRC, some of the GPU drivers that offloads the decoding of HD content do not work in WHS. And only a handful of TV tuner software actually work with WHS (Sage IIRC). So using WHS as your HTPC OS is not a good idea at all. "

So those are the main issues with combining a HTPC/file server.

Note that 9 people in the thread I linked earlier said that combining the file server and HTPC was a bad idea. Only one person said it was a good idea and that was due to him having a relatively small amount of data. Your storage plans happen to exceed that one person's storage.
 
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Danny Bui said:
The main advantage of keeping your file server separate from the HTPC are:
- You can easily expand the storage without interrupting your HTPC. When adding a drive to WHS, the performance of the server is greatly affected, at least in my experience.
- You can lower the heat generation in the HTPC
- You can take down the HTPC for repair or OS configuration and such without it affecting every other PC that still needs to access the data on the file server.
- There are a few occasions where streaming videos or serving files to other PCs will affect playback of video on the HTPC itself (Jerkiness, slow-down, skipped frames, frozen frames, etc, etc). Especially if you use the stock NICs.
- You can actually use an OS more suitable for NAS/file serving duty like Windows Home Server, FreeNAS, FreeBSD with ZFS, Linux with MDADM RAID, etc, etc. That means that your data is safer.
- WHS is not a good choice for a HTPC OS as illustrated in the thread I linked to.
- To repeat my earlier notes on WHS: "AFAIK, the popular and well recommended blu-ray disc playback software, Arcsoft Total MediaTheatre 3, does not work with WHS. In addition, IIRC, some of the GPU drivers that offloads the decoding of HD content do not work in WHS. And only a handful of TV tuner software actually work with WHS (Sage IIRC). So using WHS as your HTPC OS is not a good idea at all. "

So those are the main issues with combining a HTPC/file server.

Note that 9 people in the thread I linked earlier said that combining the file server and HTPC was a bad idea. Only one person said it was a good idea and that was due to him having a relatively small amount of data. Your storage plans happen to exceed that one person's storage.
Click to expand...

I see, for some reason I thought WHS was a program, not an OS.
Sorry im so clueless. looks like the way to go is a dedicated home server and separate HTPC. Thanks for your advice!

Any advice on a budget HTPC build, and a budget WHS build?
I dont mind a mini tower for the server, but id prefer a sff build for the HTPC.
Easy dust filtration for both is a huge plus, and noise is a big factor.
 
Hmm, would $600 for both be doable?
Or $400 for the HTPC to start and $300 for the home server when I can afford it later would also be doable.

Is it worth it to wait for Black Friday/Cyber Monday?
 
A $400 HTPC coming right up:
$104 - AMD Athlon II X3 425 CPU OEM + Biostar A880G+ AMD 880G HDMI mATX Motherboard Combo
$30 - Rendition by Crucial RM25664BA1339 2GB DDR3 1333 RAM
$55 - Western Digital WD5000AAKS 500GB 7200RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive
$50 - Antec NEO ECO 400C 400W PSU
$110 - Silverstone GD04B mATX HTPC Case
$38 - Scythe Big Shuriken SCBSK-1000 120mm HSF
------
$387 plus tax and shipping

For the file server, it's also gonna cost $400 as well.
 
So, my good friend told me to go check out the Boxee by Dlink.
I think that it will do everything I want an HTPC to do, for $200. Am I wrong?
Apparently it will play all of my questionably attained files flawlessly (I am still doing research on this).

If it can, I will surely go with a Boxee + WHS server.

What kind of power does WHS need though? Can I get away with this combo?


$104 - AMD Athlon II X3 425 CPU OEM + Biostar A880G+ AMD 880G HDMI mATX Motherboard Combo

$30 - Rendition by Crucial RM25664BA1339 2GB DDR3 1333 RAM

$60 - SeaSonic S12II 430B 430W w/ 5 YR Warranty
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151074

$55 w/ Rebate - Antec Mini P180 White
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129044

$55 w/ Rebate - HITACHI Deskstar 7K1000.C HDS721010CLA332 (0F10383) 1TB

= $355 before shipping

How does that build sound? Regardless, I think im going to pull the trigger on the Mini p180 tonight as it would make a great case.
I only wish it had hot-swap bays but its not a deal breaker (easy enough to pop off the side panel and add/swap.)

Excellent dust filtration (with easy to get to filters), excellent cooling for 5 (possibly 7 with the lower two 5.25 bays), isolated PSU ventilation, and sound-deadening on the panels. At $55, i dont think I could pass it up.

EDIT:
Also, does anyone know how many fans I can hook up to the built in fan-controller on the mini P180??
 
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I haven't heard of that DLink device.

You're missing a HSF from that setup dude. If you don't mind the additional noise at all, you can go with this setup with its stock HSF:
$124 - AMD Athlon II X3 445 CPU + Biostar A880G+ AMD 880G HDMI mATX Motherboard Combo

Besides that, looks good to me. Though I don't factor in MIR so the real price will be higher actually.
 
I was going to buy a used, oversized cooler (TRUE or the like) and possibly run a duct to the rear 120mm fan (very easy, i have extra 120mm ducting) and run all fans on low (prob will only need 1 120mm fan for the HDDs for now).

I am thinking that the PSU wont get proper ventilation in the mini P180 though.
If you look at the bottom chamber, there is little room for a PSU with a 120mm fan to breathe.

Do you think this would be a better option, or will that seasonic be better?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371033

Antec is cheaper, but the Seasonic has more power and I think will be quieter...
 
investinwaffles said:
I am thinking that the PSU wont get proper ventilation in the mini P180 though.
If you look at the bottom chamber, there is little room for a PSU with a 120mm fan to breathe.
Click to expand...
It'll be fine.

investinwaffles said:
Do you think this would be a better option, or will that seasonic be better?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ... the better choice. That Antec is overpriced.
Click to expand...
 
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