Got my Westinghouse LVM-37W3 37" 1080p display today!

DVI is not same as HDMI

HDMI
Devices are manufactured to adhere to various versions of the specification, where each version is given a number, such as 1.0 or 1.3. Each concurrent version of the specification uses the same cables, but increases the throughput and/or capabilities of what can be transmitted over the cable. For example, previously, the maximum pixel clock rate of the interface was 165MHz, sufficient for supporting 1080p at 60Hz or WUXGA (1920x1200), but HDMI 1.3 increased that to 340MHz, providing support beyond the highest resolution computer monitors available today
Bandwidth 10.2 Gbps at 340 Mpixels/sec
DVI
Maximum clock frequency in single link mode: Capped at 165 MHz (3.7 Gbit/s)
Maximum clock frequency in dual link mode: Limited only by cable quality (more than 7.4 Gbit/s)

HDMI 1.3
Released 22 June 2006.[2] [3]

Increases single-link bandwidth to 340 MHz (10.2 Gbps)
Supports 30-bit, 36-bit, and 48-bit xvYCC with Deep Color or over one billion colors, up from 24-bit sRGB or YCbCr in previous versions.
Incorporates automatic audio syncing (lip sync) capability.
Supports output of Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio streams for external decoding by AV receivers.[4] TrueHD and DTS-HD are lossless audio codec formats used on HD DVDs and Blu-ray Discs. If the disc player can decode these streams into uncompressed audio, then HDMI 1.3 is not necessary, as all versions of HDMI can transport uncompressed audio.
Availability of a new mini connector for devices such as camcorders.[5]
The Sony PlayStation 3 is the first product available on consumer market with HDMI 1.3.[6]
Epson has released the EMP-TW1000 as the first display supporting 30-bit deep color.[7]


37w3 do not have HDMI 1.3 <----- i believe
 
facesnorth said:
I am following the threads for several different tv/monitors, and I am just not sure yet what I want to do. I would very much like if I can ask everyone to momentarily temper their excitement over this monitor, just to bring an ounce of objectivity. I am especially interested in those who share my point of view with regard to budget, what I intend to use this for, and particularly if you have seen any of the other monitor/tv's I am looking at and thinking about for the future.

I currently own an old 27" tube TV and a 21" NEC tube PC monitor, and that's it. I've never bought an LCD monitor an HDTV. Realistically I will able to purchase one large screen (37" I will consider large) that will cover all of my needs w/ regards to TV, movies, XBOX 360, PC usage, etc. Although, my PC is in a seperate room from my main TV/movie watching area (the living room). I will most likely leave the 37" in the living room as an entertainment device for TV/movies/X360, and continue using the 21" NEC tube as my PC monitor. However, I really like the idea that I could eventually purchase the HDTV I really want, which they don't sell yet, to use for my entertainment TV and eventually bring the Westy in to use as my PC Monitor/spare TV/movie watching.

The TV I really want is a 37-42" LCD w/ 1920x1080p, 120Hz, HDMI 1.3 (even if they say it doesn't matter, I want it), ATSC/NTSC/QAM tuners (I am on a budget, and would rather not pay for cable/satellite, but rather pick up the local HDTV channels with an antenna), 1000:1 contrast or better, 8ms or better, plenty of screen options such as normal/wide/anamorphic/zoom/etc, plenty of adjustability of settings including RGB levels & backlight.

Granted, this TV is not available yet, and I will not buy it until it is in the sub $1500 price range. I do not have an urgent need for an HDTV/monitor, but I am getting very antsy for one. I am NOT sure that if I buy this Westy, I will ever be able to buy another one (for many years). So I hestitate to bite the bullet because of the features it lacks that I fear will disappoint me in a few years when I can't afford to upgrade. In particular, I think the lack of tuners will disappoint because I won't be able to upgrade any time soon to an expensive monthly cable/satellite bill. I know I will also eventually wish I had 120hz to be able to show 24fps film optimally. HDMI 1.3 I will eventually wish I had for deepcolor, DTS TrueHD and all that stuff, even if it takes a while for content to come up to speed. As well as easy adjustability as far as normal/wide/anamorphic settings, etc, which the Westy seems to lack, I think will come in handy for watching TV & movies, and RGB and backlight adjustability comes in handy for finding optimal picture quality.

My brothers-in-law just bought the Vizio VX37L, which they chose over the Scepter Komodo 37". Their budget was $800 as opposed to $1000 for the Westy, so they sacraficed 1080p, but they gained tuners, 1000:1 contrast, 8ms, wide/anamorphic/etc, backlight & RGB adjustability, etc. It's quite a nice unit. To be honest, if I am to buy a TV/monitor in the next 3 months or so, I don't know which unit I should choose. Should I purchase the Westy with hopes that it will eventually become a PC monitor and I can replace it with the HDTV I really want? When can I realistically expect prices for the TV I really want (listed above) to be available and come into the $1000-1500 price range? Because maybe I can just try and hold out until then. If I choose to buy now, will the Westy suit all of my needs? (TV - much of which will be SD quality, unless I can get an external tuner to tap in the HD local channels - or perhaps a year or so from now I can get an HD package with Dish network or soforth; XBOX 360; perhaps PC but likely it will be in a different room unless I decide to upgrade to a better monitor down the road, then it would become a PC monitor; and movies - using a progressive DVD player - I will unlikely upgrade to HD DVD or Blue ray for quite some time). Is it difficult to add an external tuner? Would I be better off with a unit like the Vizio VX37L until that time, so I can have the tuners, adjustability, etc, and simply sacrafice 1080p - and later if I upgrade, use the Vizio as a PC monitor/spare TV? Is 1080p even all that crucial?

I appreciate the help!

Thanks,
Ryan
Click to expand...

Hey man I think you came to the right place for your questions. First I have to answer your question about "Is 1080p even all that crucial?" Hell yes! If you want to one day use a TV/ Monitor as your computer monitor it is critical that you get the highest resolution that you can. 1920 x 1080 IMO is the lowest you should ever go on a 37" screen. You might be able to get away with it on a 32" but i haven't seen that many people do it. You concerns with the specs on this monitor are valid but I think you are analyzing what if you are not happy a little to much. I barely watch any tv and believe that HD programming is still sub par as of now. I think getting rid of my digital cable package and getting the CSPAN package was the best choice I made. Think of it like this, there are no 1080p TV signals yet and won't be for atleast another 5 - 7 years. So if you go with a 720p set for your living room you can't go wrong. I haven't watched any TV on my westy but was impressed by dvd going through DVI on my PC. The 360 looks amazing in VGA but would love to see a digital connection going to it.

As for your dream TV, go with the westy the TV tuner is not a big deal seeing that they are always limited in contrast to the box you get from your cable or satellite provider. So you end up paying for something that you never use. If I were you I would go and pick up the westy, keep your SD TV for watching DVDs and hook your pc and 360 to the westy. You won't be disappointed.

As for gripes about the TV, it didn't come with a million dollars in the box, I really can't find any. I wish their was an auto adjust feature for DVI and a way to change the color temperature using the kelvin scale.

Buy the westy!
 
diefathin said:
The Sony PlayStation 3 is the first product available on consumer market with HDMI 1.3.

37w3 does not have HDMI 1.3 <----- i believe
Click to expand...

You are correct. Especially since the 37w3, 42w2 and 47w1 came out long before the PS3. There's a few that are slated to get HDMI1.3 but those will be newer pricey models (some new Bravias and Aquos slated for release this year).
 
Anyone have any contrast problems over component? I have tried my PS2 and my RCA DTC100 HD receiver are extremely ooogly (both over component). Just curious to see if anyone else has a solution before I have to send this baby back. VGA, composite, and svideo look good though.

Picture049.jpg

Zoomed a little so you can see the face a little better.
Picture054.jpg


Sorry I couldn't get better pics.
The problem is most apparent on faces. Time to send back?
 
The DCT-100 has four output options for video, three of which will ALWAYS look crappy on a HDTV. The coax, composite, and s-video are not compatible with a HD signal, and will make even a SD signal fugly. Looking at the manual, there are no component connections on this tuner.

You should be using the VGA connector only on your DCT-100.
You need the component (Y, Cb/Pb, Cr/Pr) cable for your playstation 2 (SCPH-10100U) to get the best picture out of it, then you need to be sure you have the PS2 set up to provide output of 480P or even 720P using something like Xploder.

Having said all that, I'm sending a SD satellite signal to the 37W3 via a wireless av transmitter, and bringing it in using regular component. Not seeing any contrasts issues similar to your pictures.
 
Oops forgot to say I have the VGA to component converter for the DCT100. The DCT isn't the only source that has this problem; I have a Pioneer DVD player, my PS2, and my DCT that share this problem when on component. I am filling out my Mwave RMA form now :( I don't wanna send it back....
 
Oh, that makes more sense now.
Some thoughts are possibly low quality component cables- or need for menu settings adjustment on the TV...have you run an AVIA or equivalent calibration disk on the TV?

Is the picture the same regardless of which set of composite in connections you use?

What cables are you using?

If you get great picture quality out of the VGA connector, and have no dead pixels. Man, I would really hesitate to go through the whole RMA ordeal. IMO, composite is dead. Your future is HDMI and DVI. If those work great....then....why RMA?
 
It isn't composite it is my component :(. I haven't run AVIA (it's on the way) but no matter the settings it always is bad. It looks bad over my Monoprice component cables and the Sony PS2 Component cables. VGA looks great, hell even the Svideo/Composite look better than the components now.

Here is a shot of how awful the PS2 looks now.
Picture.jpg
 
I'm clear that you're using component, not composite. The tuner specs had me thinking you were mixing up the two.

Only thing I can say is if you haven't tried different cables, its worth borrowing some from someone to try it (only valid if you're using the same cables each time)

This looks like a problem to me, too. Have you tried both sets of composite in with the same results?

If everything else works great, again, you're going to have to make a judgement call on how important composite is to you in a world where HDMI and DVI are the future.
 
Yeah it is on both sets of component. Component is still pretty important for now so I def and gonna RMA. Thanks for the help.
 
SleeplessIncubus said:
hey guys thanks for all ur help with the vga sound. i bought a rca to mini stereo cable and a female adapter ($15 @ radio shack...freakin rip offs) and it works great. there is one dead pixel and I contacted Westinghouse about it and they have not replied to my email yet. Its not noticeable on the 360 or HDTV though...and only if u stare closely at the screen while connected to the PC. Overall I am very happy with it and people that come over and see it are amazed.

Outside view of my office.

IMG_2004.jpg
Click to expand...

Nice furniture. IKEA or?


Also...

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-cni8BzGMEHP/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?search=Sanus+PFFP2B&i=051PFFP2B

Anyone have pics of this or the 42" hooked up to a Sanus PFFP2B? I know they sell a different version with just one shelf, either one, doesn't matter. I think I've seen one before in this thread. Going backwards and only on page 115 so far.
 
diefathin said:
DVI is not same as HDMI

HDMI
Devices are manufactured to adhere to various versions of the specification, where each version is given a number, such as 1.0 or 1.3. Each concurrent version of the specification uses the same cables, but increases the throughput and/or capabilities of what can be transmitted over the cable. For example, previously, the maximum pixel clock rate of the interface was 165MHz, sufficient for supporting 1080p at 60Hz or WUXGA (1920x1200), but HDMI 1.3 increased that to 340MHz, providing support beyond the highest resolution computer monitors available today
Bandwidth 10.2 Gbps at 340 Mpixels/sec
DVI
Maximum clock frequency in single link mode: Capped at 165 MHz (3.7 Gbit/s)
Maximum clock frequency in dual link mode: Limited only by cable quality (more than 7.4 Gbit/s)

HDMI 1.3
Released 22 June 2006.[2] [3]

Increases single-link bandwidth to 340 MHz (10.2 Gbps)
Supports 30-bit, 36-bit, and 48-bit xvYCC with Deep Color or over one billion colors, up from 24-bit sRGB or YCbCr in previous versions.
Incorporates automatic audio syncing (lip sync) capability.
Supports output of Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio streams for external decoding by AV receivers.[4] TrueHD and DTS-HD are lossless audio codec formats used on HD DVDs and Blu-ray Discs. If the disc player can decode these streams into uncompressed audio, then HDMI 1.3 is not necessary, as all versions of HDMI can transport uncompressed audio.
Availability of a new mini connector for devices such as camcorders.[5]
The Sony PlayStation 3 is the first product available on consumer market with HDMI 1.3.[6]
Epson has released the EMP-TW1000 as the first display supporting 30-bit deep color.[7]


37w3 do not have HDMI 1.3 <----- i believe
Click to expand...
I brought my LCD to bestbuy and we tested with two blu-ray players. we tried to set 1080p, but the monitor could not allow to set 1080p. it could set 1080i, but when we set 1080p. Either the monitor went back 1080i or black screen showed. well, i could say you can use for computer monitor, but you will regret to use as a playing blu-ray. if anyone can not believe it, buying blu-ray player and test it.
PS: we used monster HDMI cable.....
 
whatthe said:
I brought my LCD to bestbuy and we tested with two blu-ray players. we tried to set 1080p, but the monitor could not allow to set 1080p. it could set 1080i, but when we set 1080p. Either the monitor went back 1080i or black screen showed. well, i could say you can use for computer monitor, but you will regret to use as a playing blu-ray. if anyone can not believe it, buying blu-ray player and test it.
PS: we used monster HDMI cable.....
Click to expand...

It sounds like the Blu-ray players are requiring HDMI 1.3 when 1.2x would suffice, and not providing any backward compatability.

It's just more 5 billion standards revisions so that nothing works right. Seems, at least with the PS3, a lot of 1080p sets have problems, but it's more a problem with people building thier players with total disregard of that fact that HDMI 1.3 is so new, and that HDMI 1.2x is in the vast majority of the products and the ones they are in are extremely expensive.

Since Sony is pushing Blu-Ray and the PS3s and Blu-Ray players don't like anything less than full HDMI 1.3, and the expensive Sony LCDs are the first ones with HDMI 1.3.. Gotta wonder if they are doing that to push more of thier expensive TVs.

Guess that would explain why a friend of mine went to a Best Buy a few weeks ago wanting to get an HDTV and Blu-Ray player and they tried foisting one of the most expensive Sony XBRs they had, claiming it's the only one that will work with Blu-Ray they had.

I am interested in seeing if the same will be the case with HD-DVD players.
 
UrielDagda said:
It sounds like the Blu-ray players are requiring HDMI 1.3 when 1.2x would suffice, and not providing any backward compatability.

It's just more 5 billion standards revisions so that nothing works right. Seems, at least with the PS3, a lot of 1080p sets have problems, but it's more a problem with people building thier players with total disregard of that fact that HDMI 1.3 is so new, and that HDMI 1.2x is in the vast majority of the products and the ones they are in are extremely expensive.

Since Sony is pushing Blu-Ray and the PS3s and Blu-Ray players don't like anything less than full HDMI 1.3, and the expensive Sony LCDs are the first ones with HDMI 1.3.. Gotta wonder if they are doing that to push more of thier expensive TVs.

Guess that would explain why a friend of mine went to a Best Buy a few weeks ago wanting to get an HDTV and Blu-Ray player and they tried foisting one of the most expensive Sony XBRs they had, claiming it's the only one that will work with Blu-Ray they had.

I am interested in seeing if the same will be the case with HD-DVD players.
Click to expand...

Let's put it this way Sony can kiss my a$$! They never do anything right, that is what happens when a conglomerate like them has their hands into many jars. They want to make gaming systems but also push sony studios which in turn want copy protection, which means they have to build their TV's/ monitors to play them. I have been screaming the little black box was a Trojan horse for a while now and it keeps proving it self. If you want 1080p with out all the BS, go and spend $200 on the 360 ad on and hook it up to your computer and run it through DVI. I was going to pick one up last week but the raptor went on sell for the same price (couldn't pass that up), but I plan on buying one soon :D!

Either way that thing is a bunch of hot air. I have been looking at the games and since they were the ones making such a big deal about 1080p being full HD, they have less 1080p games then the 360 :eek:! Hey Microsoft needs to pull their head out of their butt and give us a digital connection but besides that I have no complaints!

Sorry I digress, You can play 1080p on this beautiful monitor just make sure the source isn't messing it up.
 
whatthe said:
I brought my LCD to bestbuy and we tested with two blu-ray players. we tried to set 1080p, but the monitor could not allow to set 1080p. it could set 1080i, but when we set 1080p. Either the monitor went back 1080i or black screen showed. well, i could say you can use for computer monitor, but you will regret to use as a playing blu-ray. if anyone can not believe it, buying blu-ray player and test it.
PS: we used monster HDMI cable.....
Click to expand...

What BD Players did you use I know some early FW BD Players had issues with 1080p. I wouldn't classify all the players in a Lump. I'm not Pro BD (Far from it actually). Just that I wouldn't go by the players in the stores since they've been used and abused and also didn't recieve critical fw Updates (This goes for (Especially) the 1st gen Toshiba HD DVD players).
 
I did some research early this morning, and found out the PS3 problems have nothing to do with HDMI versions, the problem is some devices try to handshake faster than the HDMI interface of the TV is designed to reply..

So it theoretically can happen at any time with two devices with thier handshaking set off by even a millisecond.. As soon as the reply doesn't come fast enough to the request from the device, it decides it's pirated and cuts out!

I place the blame for this on the people that designed the HDMI spec.. Why didn't they standardize the handshaking down to the picosecond and put in some form of fault tolerance into the system so it can miss handshaking once in a while without completely cutting out?

Just leads me to believe the problem could become widespread in the future as more companies make high definition players. Apparently they didn't really go through the motions of actually TESTING the HDMI crap!

sigh.:mad: :(
 
UrielDagda said:
I did some research early this morning, and found out the PS3 problems have nothing to do with HDMI versions, the problem is some devices try to handshake faster than the HDMI interface of the TV is designed to reply..

So it theoretically can happen at any time with two devices with thier handshaking set off by even a millisecond.. As soon as the reply doesn't come fast enough to the request from the device, it decides it's pirated and cuts out!

I place the blame for this on the people that designed the HDMI spec.. Why didn't they standardize the handshaking down to the picosecond and put in some form of fault tolerance into the system so it can miss handshaking once in a while without completely cutting out?

Just leads me to believe the problem could become widespread in the future as more companies make high definition players. Apparently they didn't really go through the motions of actually TESTING the HDMI crap!

sigh.:mad: :(
Click to expand...

HDMI and this whole HDCP thing is crap. They need to stop trying to block us from our content, we already know that if people want to pirate these things they will. So get over it and figure out ways to make us not want to. :)
 
duce3 said:
HDMI and this whole HDCP thing is crap. They need to stop trying to block us from our content, we already know that if people want to pirate these things they will. So get over it and figure out ways to make us not want to. :)
Click to expand...
That pretty much sums up the whole issue. It's always the same story, anyway. Nobody really cares about piracy--it's not widespread enough to cause serious damage. They just want to impose an overpriced cartel, and this is the way they think they're doing it. Sooner or later some enlightened CEO will realize that supply and demand is still the way to go, and prices will go down, and all will be happy. I don't fret too much over it. *shrugs*
 
today, i tested it with two players which are Pioneer BDP-HD1 and Samsung BD-P1000.
it works with pioneer only HDMI to DVI, but samsung would not allow to set 1080p at all. Also, one of the techs said that I need to update my HDMI input. So, it works with DVI for 1080p not HDMI.
PS: These are pictures of my blu-ray play.
I need to call best buy and I think that I will exchange or fix the problems that my monitor have now.

http://www.sendspace.com/file/9ky6px
http://www.sendspace.com/file/24c2uz
http://www.sendspace.com/file/om04k8
http://www.sendspace.com/file/d1yw5v
 
claudione314 said:
That pretty much sums up the whole issue. It's always the same story, anyway. Nobody really cares about piracy--it's not widespread enough to cause serious damage. They just want to impose an overpriced cartel, and this is the way they think they're doing it. Sooner or later some enlightened CEO will realize that supply and demand is still the way to go, and prices will go down, and all will be happy. I don't fret too much over it. *shrugs*
Click to expand...

Exactly once either they figure out that we will buy when the geeks say it is ok, then they will be able to lower the price. I am a geek and have to say we are the ones that push this stuff. Our coworkers, friends, and family trust our opinion and if we don't like it we won't recommend it. Further more once the general public figures out that they don't need these huge entertainment companies to have nice things to watch and hear they will be in a world of trouble. Can't for the first Internet group to go platinum. No matter what genre, I will buy just to support!
 
whatthe said:
today, i tested it with two players which are Pioneer BDP-HD1 and Samsung BD-P1000.
it works with pioneer only HDMI to DVI, but samsung would not allow to set 1080p at all. Also, one of the techs said that I need to update my HDMI input. So, it works with DVI for 1080p not HDMI.
Click to expand...

are these only Blu-Ray that you are trying? If you don't really care which format to use. Try out HD-DVD and see if the work. I hate sony but I don't impose my view on anybody. Just give it a shot and if that doesn't work then you know it might be your set. But if it does then you know it might be the format. If you already did disregard. lol
 
whatthe said:
today, i tested it with two players which are Pioneer BDP-HD1 and Samsung BD-P1000.
it works with pioneer only HDMI to DVI, but samsung would not allow to set 1080p at all. Also, one of the techs said that I need to update my HDMI input. So, it works with DVI for 1080p not HDMI.
Click to expand...

Actually the Sammy is Notoriously Flawed Without the FW update. It's not the 37W3 it's the Sammy BD-P1000. Even with the FW Updates I would highly recommend NOT getting that BD player. It has the most problems of all BD players. My Advice to you IF you want to insist on buying a BD player. Wait for the 2nd Gen players (Mostly cause they'll have all the newer things like BD-J Support, Ethernet port for on the fly FW updates) Or get a PS3. Also Sony has a $599 Standalone coming out this summer. The Stats on the 2nd Gen Sammy Looks NICE and it's gonna MSRP for $799. Again I'm not a BD Supporter (Heck I have a HD DVD Drive for my 360 and love it) But I'm gonna lay it on the line cause I have also been researching both formats a bit.
 
duce3 said:
HDMI and this whole HDCP thing is crap. They need to stop trying to block us from our content, we already know that if people want to pirate these things they will. So get over it and figure out ways to make us not want to. :)
Click to expand...

Agreed. I'll buy a BD or HDDVD player when I can find one for less than $100. And then only if and when they abandon their ill-conceived war on the consumer.

My belief: standard DVD isn't going anywhere for at least 5-7 years.
 
yevaud said:
Agreed. I'll buy a BD or HDDVD player when I can find one for less than $100. And then only if and when they abandon their ill-conceived war on the consumer.

My belief: standard DVD isn't going anywhere for at least 5-7 years.
Click to expand...

I agree with you totally and don't for see DVD's going anywhere for quite some time. Even though I do believe we have it better this time around than last time when we made the transition from VHS to DVD, at least we can keep our old stuff. Thanks for the link to upload the pictures. I uploaded them and here is the link http://www.sendspace.com/file/r2m08q only thing is I don't have any of the more recent pictures but people can go back a couple of pages to get those. I have all the older pictures from the first page on though. Hope this helps some people out. I did delete some of the more redundant ones though.
 
I love this monitor so much, such a great value.
Here are some dvd/bluray comparisons from Kingdom of Heaven.
Dvd:
d3ae3.jpg

bluray:
b3to8.jpg

dvd:
d1rf2.jpg

bluray:
b1wt1.jpg

pictures don't do it justice.
 
MickeyKnox said:
I love this monitor so much, such a great value.
Here are some dvd/bluray comparisons from Kingdom of Heaven.
Dvd:
d3ae3.jpg

bluray:
b3to8.jpg

dvd:
d1rf2.jpg

bluray:
b1wt1.jpg

pictures don't do it justice.
Click to expand...

Man I can't stand sony but i have to give credit where credit is due. Those first 1080p shots made me think of the comparison, DVD looked like an 1985 escort next to a Bluray 2004 Enzo. Yea they both due the same thing of drive you from point a to point b or show you a picture but damn you would look 100 times better in the Enzo! Nice shots man. lol :;
 
zomg liek you can't even tell the diff between DVD and Bluray/HDDVD!?!??! Codecs used for HD moviez are crap!!??!? REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!@?!@?!!?!!??!!! :mad: :mad: :mad:
Click to expand...




rofl, jk. Looks great. I love watching HDDVD's on mine and comparing the image quality back and forth to DVD. Makes me wonder why newbs still say stuff like I imitated above.
 
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