Google Employees Protest Secret Work on Censored Search Engine for China

Discussion in '[H]ard|OCP Front Page News' started by Megalith, Aug 18, 2018.

  1. Megalith

    Megalith 24-bit/48kHz Staff Member

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    While rumors of dissent began immediately after Google’s plans for building a censored search engine for China leaked, the opposition is now clear, as hundreds of employees have signed a letter demanding transparency: specifically, over 1,400 “Googlers” want to know whether their talents are being used for morally or ethically questionable reasons. “Google employees need to know what we’re building.”

    The internal activism presents another obstacle for Google’s potential return to China eight years after the company publicly withdrew from the country in protest of censorship and government hacking. China has the world’s largest internet audience but has frustrated American tech giants with content restrictions or outright blockages of services including Facebook and Instagram.
     
  2. Ocellaris

    Ocellaris Ginger @le, an alcoholic's best friend.

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    Get another job? What a bunch of fucking babies. If they are against censorship so much, the last thing they should do is keep working for Google.
     
  3. Tiburon1186

    Tiburon1186 Gawd

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    You know what most companies do when their employees don't do the work they are given?? Fire them and hire new ones.
     
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  4. SixFootDuo

    SixFootDuo [H]ardness Supreme

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    They do know that they work for a company right? I wonder if the lax 'creative' working environment has given rise to some sort of entitlement. Well, I'm sure it has.

    I wish I knew more about the ramifications of such a move would make in regards to a censored Google search engine in China but I don't so I want to be careful to make a comment out of my ass.
     
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  5. SixFootDuo

    SixFootDuo [H]ardness Supreme

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    Yeah but these are cherry picked highly paid engineers, coders, managers, etc etc. Amazon warehouse? Sure, fire the fukkers. But these are not those type of people and or jobs. It's not such a black and white issue for Google.

    It's not exactly easy to get hired on at Google from what I've read. These issues are probably a lot like a chess game for Google.
     
  6. commissioneranthony

    commissioneranthony Gawd

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    Honestly, I was against google re-entering china when the news first broke. But now that I mulled about it a few days, it really is a good thing for them to re-enter china, even with filtered search. Sure, it makes good economic sense to expand your market reach. But most importantly, their re-entry would squash Baidu and other chinese internet search companies, which can only be a good thing from a US perspective. Google's presence could help to squash or dampen the made in china 2025 initiative and end the unchecked growth Baidu is experiencing. Also, Google, since you're listening, you have my contact info. You can hire me now ;)
     
  7. Nytegard

    Nytegard 2[H]4U

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    The average tenure of a Google engineer is about 1 year. There are tons of ex-Googlers, for the right money, who would have no moral qualm about being rehired. Second, prices there are expensive. Sure, having Google on your resume is great for getting another job, but not if thousands of people all leave at once. Companies then can pick the best and brightest of them, and I'm not sure the others will chance joblessness in a housing and rental market that's sky high.

    The main problem is, they're in a very "leftist" bubble, and naïve about how the real world works, and this is going to be a wakeup call for them.
     
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  8. Laowai

    Laowai [H]Lite

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    I won't say it's really too late for Google in China, but it certainly would be an uphill battle.
    Just as goggle is used as a verb in many places, baidu (popular but craptastic Chinese google ripoff) is used as a verb in China.

    There are Chinese versions of every Google service I can think of and they're deeply entrenched in the market and culture.

    Those in China who want access to Google typically do so because they want uncensored search which is not hard to access with a VPN. I'm not sure most folks outside of China realize just how easy it is to find and access VPN's in China. What a censored Google search offers over alternatives is a mystery to me.

    EDIT: I'd love to see the Play Store and Google Maps available in China without a VPN though.

    As to the whiney children who threaten to quit because of this or any other political issue, I think they should all be fired.
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2018
  9. jamesv

    jamesv [H]Lite

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    Protest, sure.
    Quit working for the shareholders?
    No way.

    Fake out rage, fake human rights, FakeBook, it’s all fake, except for the dollar.

    At the end of the day its always about the money, even when they say it isn’t.

    Chinese government pays big bucks for high tech, wonder what Google will sell their AI data for.
    App£€ is 1T.
    That’s what Google wants.

    Gotta love good dishonest competition.
     
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  10. Dead Parrot

    Dead Parrot [H]ard|Gawd

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    So censoring US results and tracking US folk's locations even when location settings are set to off is OK with these employees but do the same to the poor Chinese and all of a sudden they are upset?
     
  11. Madoc

    Madoc Gawd

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    The Chinese have probably already stolen and copied whatever they needed from Google already, so they have no reason to throw out the welcome mat for them now, though maybe they want the ability to steal more recent and advanced code/tech.

    As for "Googlers"... you should already have a pretty good idea of what you're company is doing. If you don't like it (and I can understand why you wouldn't), then do the right thing and quit. Otherwise, your outrage seems pretty shallow and ephemeral.
     
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  12. MV75

    MV75 Gawd

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    What was the last big thing that was built by teams that weren't told what it was they were really building....... ? Oh yea, the bomb.
     
  13. sparks

    sparks 2[H]4U

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    they block Facebook and Instagram ?
    those lucky bastards.
     
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  14. Meeho

    Meeho 2[H]4U

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  15. Holonist

    Holonist n00bie

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    Funny, i saw zero outrage when the very same sjw put up a tantrum and flat out refused to work with the DoD helping to secure the US, yet now they are all cry babies and need to suck it up cause its a private corp and such. Color me amused, one could even taste the bias right there.
     
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  16. Meeho

    Meeho 2[H]4U

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    I'm not sure who you're referring to. Personally, I think they were laughable in both tantrum instances.
     
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  17. IndyColtsFan

    IndyColtsFan Limp Gawd

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    They were asshats in the first incident too. If they don’t like the work, they’re free to resign and go somewhere else. They forget that Google isn’t a playground or social club, it is an employer and they can do the job or GTFO.
     
  18. Holonist

    Holonist n00bie

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    Not you directly, just replied on top of you due to the point being made. We had people in these forums straight up defending them for not working with the DoD and are now really quiet or even against them not working with China, amusing like i said. For the record , im more shocked with them even being allowed to share this type of IP with an overtly hostile state, and after that DoD contract lapsed , they would get all security clearances pulled and swampec in a never ending tax audit , yeh , you dont get to use the country system and laws as a safe space and then turn your back and go work with an official adversary, in less political correct times there was a word for this shit.
     
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  19. steakman1971

    steakman1971 2[H]4U

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    If you don't like what you are working on, leave. I get assigned stuff to do at work I don't like sometimes. It's my choice to do it, quit, or get fired. I don't go to social media and post a bunch of drama about it.
     
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  20. HockeyJon

    HockeyJon Gawd

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    So all of a sudden they’re making a stand for idealism now despite knowingly working for a company who recently admitted to ignoring privacy settings specified by their users and tracking their every move anyway? Like, that part was ok with them?
     
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  21. Holonist

    Holonist n00bie

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    You got to love sjw right?
     
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  22. HockeyJon

    HockeyJon Gawd

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    Exactly my thoughts.
     
  23. Holonist

    Holonist n00bie

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    Half of them or more arent US naturals or even citizens , the vast majority are from India , China and EU countries, the EU ones are VASTLY socialistic in nature, that company doesnt give a flying f about the US interests or the US citizens. Make a move against the social cause of choice of those snowflakes and watch the rage that ensues, thats their allegiance.
     
  24. PaulP

    PaulP Gawd

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    Hardly the last thing. This goes on all the time, in both the government and private industry.
     
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  25. kinjo

    kinjo Gawd

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    Google Motto:"Don't Be Evil"*




    *Unless it makes you a shit ton of money
     
  26. DeathFromBelow

    DeathFromBelow [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I'm betting this is actually something they're doing on behalf of the US government. Google had a hard time competing last time around and it opened them up to espionage. The Chiners will still use Baidu even if Google is better.
     
  27. GoldenTiger

    GoldenTiger 3.5GB GTX 970 Slayer

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    Yep. The China support here is baffling.
     
  28. jpm100

    jpm100 [H]ardness Supreme

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    The Google name, ads, and data mining. Which for fiscal purposes, Google probably does better.
     
  29. jpm100

    jpm100 [H]ardness Supreme

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    Do you think we have zero China or China Connected Posters on here? They care little for SJWs, so don't let the disparaging remarks there fool you. You have a lot of 'Corporations can do nothing wrong' republicans in there, too. Probably as many of those.
     
  30. Siersoren

    Siersoren n00bie

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    Why on earth are so many people cool with cooperating with "The Great Firewall of China"? This is not a good thing for anyone, Chinese or American.

    True Google has certainly strolled off the beaten path some time ago, but I'm certainly glad the employees are finally making a stand for the right thing to SOME degree. At least they have a line in the sand SOMEWHERE, even though it would be ideal for that line to be much closer.

    If Google wishes to censor search results in support of a communist regime, shame on them.
    If Google wishes to censor search results in America of any regime (Democrat, Republican, or otherwise), shame on them for that also.
     
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  31. Laowai

    Laowai [H]Lite

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    You may be right. Though it brings us back full circle....without customers their ads and data mining won't be worth much and the Google name does not carry any weight with most Chinese. Google has been in China before and Google censored itself before....so the moral outrage they're getting from employees now is laughable. Anyway, China played all sorts of tricks to make Gmail and other services slow as molasses and often not work at all. I have little reason to think the Chinese gov't would not play the same old tricks again. Either way, it has already soured many in China against using Google services and....as mentioned earlier, a VPN allows those who want unrestricted access to Google to have it so another censored offering would probably not interest them much.

    baidu = censored and really crappy but reliable and used by nearly everyone in China
    google = censored and less crappy but likely unreliable and many have had negative experiences with Google previously