Gigabyte P965-P35 X38 overclocking and BIOS tweaking Guide

Punisher77 said:
Well, I tried installing the Gigabyte XPressRecovery 2 bios back up tool and it killed my disk partition. It now shows up as RAW instead of NTFS and I'm searching for a way to fix it. So far I haven't had any luck. :(
Click to expand...

Wow, what a miracle, I'm back up and running!

I used Hiren's Boot CD (http://www.hiren.info/pages/bootcd) to load Acronis Disk Director Suite 9.0.554 and deleted the mysterious 2TB partition that the Gigabyte tool created. Once that was gone I was able to recover the drive with the Vista recovery disk. Vista is back up and running and I can start tweaking again. :)
 
well now after 4 months of having my E6600 OC'd I decided to get a Q6600.

after having the initial fluke of 400x8 running no problems I pushed my luck even further and just swaped the CPU out and left the Bios settings as they where.

To my surprise the system booted with the OC and vista didn't seem to care that 2 extra cores appeared from no where and booted as well :confused:

I still have the following settings with a Q6600 and 4x1GB OCZ ram (965p-ds3):

MB Intelligent Tweaker(M.I.T.)
Robust Graphics Booster___________ [Auto]
CPU Clock Ratio (Note)____________ [8]
CPU Host Clock Control_ [Enabled]
CPU Host Frequency (MHz)__________ [400]
PCI Express Frequency (Mhz)_______ [102]
C.I.A. 2__________________________ [Disabled]
System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [2.0]
Memory Frequency (Mhz) 800
DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Manual]
CAS Latency Time_____________ 5 ____ [5]
Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay______ 5 ____ [5]
Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_____5 ____ [5]
Precharge Delay (tRAS)________15 ____[15]
ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_______4 _____[auto]
Rank Write to READ Delay______3 _____[auto]
Write to Precharge Delay______6 _____[auto]
Refresh to ACT Delay________42 ______[0]
Read to Precharge Delay_______4 _____[auto]
Memory Performance Enhance__________ [Fast]
High Speed DRAM DLL Settings________ [Option 1]
******** System Voltage NOT Optimized ******** <<---IGNORE This.
System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.200V]
PCI-E OverVoltage Control_ [+0.1V]
FSB OverVoltage Control___ [+0.1V]
(G)MCH OverVoltage Control [+0.1V]
CPU Voltage Control_______ [1.375]



It hasn't frozen, blue screened or anything else bad sofar so I'm happy :D


couldn't have done it without youre guide Bill, Cheers!!
 
I'm getting an annoying problem where sometimes my MB will boot up but not POST which requires me to cycle the power and try again. When it does boot up all of my BIOS settings are gone. No big deal, I can load it from the bank of BIOS settings that I saved with F11. The only problem is that the F11 save doesn't work for me! :(

When I try to type in a name and hit enter to save it, nothing happens. The screen exits back to the main menu and if I press F12 to load from the banks there is just a single entry with no name. Any ideas for either problem?
 
Punisher77 said:
I'm getting an annoying problem where sometimes my MB will boot up but not POST which requires me to cycle the power and try again. When it does boot up all of my BIOS settings are gone. No big deal, I can load it from the bank of BIOS settings that I saved with F11. The only problem is that the F11 save doesn't work for me! :(

When I try to type in a name and hit enter to save it, nothing happens. The screen exits back to the main menu and if I press F12 to load from the banks there is just a single entry with no name. Any ideas for either problem?
Click to expand...

I have not messed with it in a while, but I do not think you need to hit enter, just type in the name, use spaces to clear out any un-needed leftovers and then hit the "save" button.
 
BillParrish said:
I have not messed with it in a while, but I do not think you need to hit enter, just type in the name, use spaces to clear out any un-needed leftovers and then hit the "save" button.
Click to expand...

Is the "save" button just the enter key? No other key seems to work and my profile isn't saved when I hit enter.
 
Punisher77 said:
Is the "save" button just the enter key? No other key seems to work and my profile isn't saved when I hit enter.
Click to expand...

hmm let me reboot and see how mine works. brb.

My apologies, I was wrong.

On my machine at the main bios screen I hit the "save bios" F key, tab to an entry, type in the name and hit enter, then I can escape to the main screen and hit the "load bios" F key and the entry is on the list.

I do not know why it would not work for you, the only things I can think of that would prevent it working are; there is a jumper on the clear cmos pins, battery is weak or dead, or you completely remove power from the PC with a power strip, and frankly none of them make any sense because they dont even bother to give us a jumper, the board is too new, and the battery would keep the settings anyway. I would fill out an support query at the Gigabyte web site and carefully tell them exactly the procedure you use and ask them why it is not working. Expect a game of ping pong for several msgs back and forth but in the end if something is wrong you can get quick approval for an RMA for a new board if you decide you want one. There are a few reports of boards with bios that will just not keep settings no mater what. I hate to think you got one but if it turns out to be the case the conversation with Gigabyte tech support will docuemnt your issue.

If you save everything to factory defauts, reboot, shutdown, add 10MHz to the FSB, save bios settings and reboot, it will not keep that simple change ? if that is the case, there is something wrong with that board.
 
BillParrish said:
My apologies, I was wrong.
Click to expand...

None needed! ;)

BillParrish said:
On my machine at the main bios screen I hit the "save bios" F key, tab to an entry, type in the name and hit enter, then I can escape to the main screen and hit the "load bios" F key and the entry is on the list.
Click to expand...

That's not how mine works. If do I that then nothing shows up on the F12 (Load) screen. Do I have to have the Express Recovery 2 installed or be using QFlash?

BillParrish said:
If you save everything to factory defauts, reboot, shutdown, add 10MHz to the FSB, save bios settings and reboot, it will not keep that simple change ? if that is the case, there is something wrong with that board.
Click to expand...

The BIOS is saved when I shut down and reboot. Every now and then it loses its settings and the F11 save key doesn't work for me.
 
@ BillParrish

I tried to PM you, but I suppose this thread may be why you have that disabled. Just wanted to say thanks for the great Tutorial, and was wondering If I may Copy/Use/Repost this at a Gigabyte Forum I am a Mod at? And of course I would Thank you as the Source, and if you want (Which you may or may not) reference this thread so users could directly ask you questions as well, but I doubt that would be cool cross posting to sites. But ya never know....

Just thought I would be nice and ask.

Thanks again
 
I appreciate that, NP reference it all you want as far as I am concerned, not sure about HOCP policies but we link to external sites all the time here, I am fairly certain (but don't want to put words in his mouth) that kyle would welcome new posters.

Anyway NP here and I am happy to try to help people, its the whole point.
 
Ok, Thanks

So you dont mind if I copy it over to there then? And yeah I will go ahead and post a link to here, I just thought maybe you personally wouldnt want to deal with the extra people that may bring in. But yeah I guess you are right it would mean more traffic here, which i dont think the owners here would be upset about.

I'd like to just copy over the main first few posts, as they really need something like that there I think. I see Alot of issues that can easily be solved if the OP's would have just seen your thread or had basic knowledge of GA boards.

BTW this is the forum I was planning on adding your guide to, and sticky'n it
Code: 
http://forums.tweaktown.com/forumdisplay.php?f=69
 
a573573 said:
Ok, Thanks

So you dont mind if I copy it over to there then? And yeah I will go ahead and post a link to here, I just thought maybe you personally wouldnt want to deal with the extra people that may bring in. But yeah I guess you are right it would mean more traffic here, which i dont think the owners here would be upset about.

I'd like to just copy over the main first few posts, as they really need something like that there I think. I see Alot of issues that can easily be solved if the OP's would have just seen your thread or had basic knowledge of GA boards.

BTW this is the forum I was planning on adding your guide to, and sticky'n it
Code: 
http://forums.tweaktown.com/forumdisplay.php?f=69
Click to expand...


Np whatever works.

Rename it too, as I edited the on the first post, while P965 specific, its 90% or more accurate for the P35s and even X38 with just some advanced settings missing.
 
Ok, Thanks again!

And Superb job on the Thread/Tutorial as well! Helped me much when I first got a 965P, P35-DS4 owner now and if I needed it you are right still a major help and pretty much all the same
 
Hey Bill, I got forwarded this link from another forum and I want to say great job on the guide. As an OC neophyte, this guide was exactly what I was looking for. I do have a couple questions however:

Before I came across this guide, I poked around with setting the CIA in BIOS to cruise and voltages to "AUTO". Checked out the results in Windows with CPU-Z and set it back to disabled and voltages to manual. I was reading in this thread about halfway back someone was saying that setting the voltages to "Auto" and setting back to manual does not restore the factory voltage defaults. Does anyone know any more details about this?

I was wondering what my voltages are currently set at, but the BIOS doesn't seem to offer any readouts of the board voltages. I tried installing that EasyTune utility which gave me a memory reading of 1.9v and IIRC 1.31 for vcore. Is there another utility for displaying voltages? I'm not sure what is correct.
 
The Lurv said:
Hey Bill, I got forwarded this link from another forum and I want to say great job on the guide. As an OC neophyte, this guide was exactly what I was looking for. I do have a couple questions however:

Before I came across this guide, I poked around with setting the CIA in BIOS to cruise and voltages to "AUTO". Checked out the results in Windows with CPU-Z and set it back to disabled and voltages to manual. I was reading in this thread about halfway back someone was saying that setting the voltages to "Auto" and setting back to manual does not restore the factory voltage defaults. Does anyone know any more details about this?

I was wondering what my voltages are currently set at, but the BIOS doesn't seem to offer any readouts of the board voltages. I tried installing that EasyTune utility which gave me a memory reading of 1.9v and IIRC 1.31 for Vcore. Is there another utility for displaying voltages? I'm not sure what is correct.
Click to expand...

Welcome !!!
Well things might have changed a bit since I did most of my testing but I did build a 3L recently and refreshed my memory somewhat. What I am saying is that I do not have a recent board on hand atm to verify my answer so it could be incorrect from a "the way it works now" viewpoint. Tech info about voltages etc should be correct as I do keep up with the Intel data and spec sheets for all the new chipsets and CPUs.

Default memory voltage should be 1.8v (speedfan will report this as Vcore2 )
Default MCH voltage should be 1.25v
Default Vcore will depend on your CPU, its typically on the side of the box it came in and several programs will measure it.

OK now the "real world"
it is fairly well known the DS3L and some others, that when the Vdimm is set to Manual and the Default voltage is selected the board will "cheat" and the Vdimm runs a bit high, about .9V. So your 1.9V sounds about right. There are lots of reasons for this, inexpensive memory power supply circuitry, better compatibility when booting with high performance memory, ability to handle high loads (4+ GB of memory which loads the memory voltage supply more). and in general just a little stability boost. I am conflicted about this, the engineer in me says that if set to default then by darn it ought to be at the standard JEDEC DDR2 default voltage of 1.8V. However having helped a lot of people in the past whose boards would not boot with high voltage memory installed I can see where the extra voltage at default is very helpful and I know of NO memory module that would have the slightest issue with 1.9V and in general it should help with stability. So bottom line, yes the default memory voltage of this board runs high, maybe for good reason, it is trivial and nothing to worry about other than the annoying fact that it does not default to what one would think it should be.

The CPU has a Voltage ID (Vid) set at the factory that tells the board at what voltage to run the CPU. It will vary slightly even with CPUs of the same exact model number. If you leave CPU voltage on "manual" and "default" the CPU voltage should be close to this value. What confuses people is that many programs read this ID and report the value however if you go into the bios and set a CPU voltage the Vid is ignored by the board and the board sets what you told it to in the bios. However the program still reads the Vid. Its kinda like setting your cruise control to 55mph and then stepping on the gas to go 70. If some program reads the "what is the set speed of the car" it will say 55 but you are looking at your speedometer and it is saying 70. To complicate matters even more there are good engineering reasons why if you set the Vcore to 1.350 in the bios it will not be exactly 1.350 at the point where monitoring chips read the CPU voltage and report it to any programs that might be trying to monitor it. The difference will typically be small, somewhere around .05 V but people get all bent out of shape about it not understanding power supply design and "overshoot" etc. If it is a big deal you just add another bump in CPU voltage to make up for the "droop" or "drop". Only at very high Vcore values approaching 1.5V will this need to be taken into consideration and care exercised.

I know of no one program that reads all the voltages correctly and none that read the (G)MCH at all. Speedfan gives me fairly accurate Vdiimm and Vcore but that is on my board. I hate easy tune and do not recommend it for much of anything but in the advanced mode its voltage readings are fairly accurate.

Concerning the bios, if you reset all voltages to Manual and choose the Default your voltage should go back to very close to standard settings. If you choose "reload Factory Defaults" I believe last time I tried it all voltages returned to normal.

Be aware that setting everything to "Auto" can result in some very high voltage settings, so high that I recommend that after doing that, you take note of what the auto setting are listed as or use Easytune, and immediately start testing to find lower voltages that are still stable. I never let the board "automatically" set the CPU voltage, some of the values available will instantly fry your C2D, This is the one place you must be very careful when choosing a value. 1.55V is the Absolute Max Vcore for a C2D and it may be lower for the brand new 45nm models. I stay under 1.45 at all times and do not run about 1.4v day to day. Just a recommendation, its your CPU.

So I know of no program that will read all the voltages with high reliability. I use Easytune for CPU voltages and memory and double check with speedfan for memory and I just have to trust Gigabyte that for FSB and MCH voltages the proper offset from stock is implemented correctly.

BTW do NOT use Easytune to monitor temps, it is awful unless they fixed something recently. Coretemp or speedfan work better. Speedfan gives some wacky power supply voltages so don't be alarmed if you do use it.

The really only accurate way to measure any of these voltages would with with a digital voltmeter on the proper pins while the machine was in operation.

You might also check if you have the latest bios, I have seen reports that under PC Heath bios menu some boards now report the voltages instead of the useless OK or Fail values. However it all needs to be taken with a gain of salt. The best test in the world is to place your finger on the side of a memory module or the MCH/Northbridge heatsink. IF you cannot hold it there for a count of ten you need to reduce the voltage or FSB and get come additional cooling.
 
Thanks for the info Bill. I forgot to add my current setup:

E4300
P965-DS3 Rev 2.0 Bios F10
2x 1GB Corsair XMS PC6400

I have a few questions on memory and OCing. In your guide and other guides on OCing I have read, they usually start off with telling the user to set the memory timings to something loose like 5-5-5-18 with a 1:1 ratio at 2.1 or 2.2 volts before beginning to OC.

The memory voltage increase confuses me because it would seem to me that underclocking the memory to 400mhz and having loose timings would not require higher voltages than running at 800mhz and their default timings. Is the voltage increase due to some architectural burden of having the memory running underclocked? Or is it in preparation of tightening the timings after a stable OC has been reached?

Speaking of memory timings, I've also wondering why most guides advise tightening the memory timings to their best stable settings. Is there a notable performance gain to a 4-4-4-12 timing over a 5-5-5-18 timing?
 
Can someone help me I got a E6600 with stock heatsink, 2X1GB ocz gold edition rev2 PC6400 timing 4-5-5-12 and the most stable I can get it is at 2.8



here are my settings

MB Intelligent Tweaker(M.I.T.)
Robust Graphics Booster___________ [Auto]
CPU Clock Ratio (Note)____________ [9]
This should be set to your processors highest multiplier, for now.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...roproc essors
The option will display "Locked" and read only if the CPU ratio is not changeable.
CPU Host Clock Control_ [Enabled]
CPU Host Frequency (MHz)__________ [315] <<<----FSB Speed (Front Side Buss)
PCI Express Frequency (Mhz)_______ [102]
C.I.A. 2__________________________ [Disabled]
System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [2.00]
This is a 1:1 divider, memory speed will be 2x FSB.
Memory Frequency (Mhz) 690
Your actual memory operating speed is always show above.
DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Manual]
CAS Latency Time_____________ 5 ____ [4]
Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay______ 5 ____ [5]
Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_____5 ____ [5]
Precharge Delay (tRAS)________15 ____[12]
ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_______4 _____[auto]
Rank Write to READ Delay______3 _____[auto]
Write to Precharge Delay______6 _____[auto]
Refresh to ACT Delay_________42 ____[auto]
Read to Precharge Delay_______4 _____[auto]
Memory Performance Enhance__________ [Normal]
Leave at Normal for now, we will get back to it very shortly.
High Speed DRAM DLL Settings________ [Option 1]

******** System Voltage NOT Optimized ******** <<---IGNORE This.
System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.400V]
PCI-E OverVoltage Control_ [+0.1V] <--- a little extra for stability
FSB OverVoltage Control___ [+0.1V] <--- a little extra for stability
(G)MCH OverVoltage Control [+0.1V] <--- a little extra for stability
CPU Voltage Control_______ [1.37500V] <--- very mild overvoltage so we can start playing
 
Is the voltage increase due to some architectural burden of having the memory running underclocked? Or is it in preparation of tightening the timings after a stable OC has been reached?
Click to expand...

Mainly historical. When this was first written the issues with high voltage memory and booting a P965 board where awful. Many times a stick of "plane jane" memory had to be used to boot the system and the voltage increased before it would even boot with 2.1V or 2.2V memory. The issue no longer exists. However it does no harm and gets the chore out of the way and there is still some high voltage stuff that even with loose timings does not like 1.8V. Gskill had a batch that was twitchy about voltage not too awful long ago. So it is just a conservative approach to make sure the memory is not an issue while we investigate the CPU.

Speaking of memory timings, I've also wondering why most guides advise tightening the memory timings to their best stable settings. Is there a notable performance gain to a 4-4-4-12 timing over a 5-5-5-18 timing?
Click to expand...

Can be and as long as it is not at the expense of CPU speed which is much more powerful than memory bandwidth. Notice in my sig, I had to go to very high FSB because my el-cheapo CPU only has a max multiplier of 7 and with a lowest memory multiplier of 2.0 (1:1) my memory is VERY overclocked. However while I had to go to CL5 I spent the time testing with memset and memtest96+ and some memory benchmarking tools and a lot of reading on the relationships between the memory timings and how they interact and instead of 5 5 5 15 determined I was able to run at 5 4 4 12 (the real boost came in the sub-timings Trfc If I recall (I don't want to reboot to check while I am writing this :p) . Anyway it will not give any huge increase in games etc but doing things just feels snappier. As an aside the Memory Performance Enhance is a very powerful memory tuning tool, get it off Normal if at all possible. This is Trd and set it to fast and then tune your main timings as a start. then look at sub-timings. This is a hugely complex subject and I am more of a CPU guy so I hesitate to say much more. Also I took a first cut at an OCing procedure and then burnt out on the guide before getting to the CPU. Tons of guides out there and from your questions I don't think you will have much trouble. This is highly interesting too, MCH straps are nothing new but the presentation is good. http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=3239
 
Can someone help me I got a E6600 with stock heatsink, 2X1GB ocz gold edition rev2 PC6400 timing 4-5-5-12 and the most stable I can get it is at 2.8
Click to expand...

The settings you gave look fine and I would think you could do better than 2.8 even with the stock heatsink but I need to know what your coretemp cpu temps are at idle in windows and when running Orthos in large FFT . Also your board model number so I know what chipset we are talking about. How are the fans in your case set up, size and location ? Are you perfectly stable at 2.8 ? Can you put your finger on the MCH/Northbridge heatsink and count to 10 without discomfort ?
 
Hey Bill can you help a noob out plz?

my system spec are
Q6600 GO +thermaltake extreme 120 hs
Crucial Ballistix tracer 1x1 2gb 8500
8800gt
GA P35 DS3P
750 WATT psu

Now problem is when i try to overclock my q6600 from 266 to 333 on bios option without changing the any voltages with dual channel ram it doesn't boot up at all had to reset cmos like 30 time so far no luck. I took out of my one of the ram stick from mobo used single stick to overclock from 266 to 333 it boot up fine then i though maybe i have bad ram? so i swap out my other stick and ran on single stick to see if this stick is defective but it ran fine without any problem. so i can't seem overclock my q6600 with 2 sticks for some reason. any ideas ?
and I even ran memtest86 for almost 8 hour no error found.
 
Hey Bill, thanks for the help so far. I've been giving thought as to how high I want to take this overclock. Since the P965-DS3 can run at 266 for E6XXX cards, I think slowly upping the FSB to 267 will provide an easy OC for my E4300 that shouldn't require upping the voltages (other than perhaps the CPU.) It will also let me run the memory at 801mhz with a 3:2 divider.

I had a little free time yesterday and I tried again to work on setting the memory. I followed the guide's memory settings, but I left the DDR2 voltage at 1.9v as I don't plan on tightening the timings beyond the specs of the RAM (my ram is 2x1GB Corsair XMS TWIN2X2048-6400).

I saved the settings and restarted the PC. I got into Windows, but when I started CPU-Z to check the memory settings, my PC blue screened. I restarted and started Memtest (which is probably what I should've done first.) Memtest got 40% though the first pass before I started getting thousands of errors. Rebooted and backed out my changes. Ran Memtest for 3 passes at default memory settings with no errors.

Below are memory settings I attempted:

System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [2.00]
Memory Frequency (Mhz) 400
DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Manual]
CAS Latency Time_____________ 5 ____ [5]
Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay______ 5 ____ [5]
Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_____5 ____ [5]
Precharge Delay (tRAS)________18 ____[18]
ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_______3 _____[auto]
Rank Write to READ Delay______3 _____[auto]
Write to Precharge Delay______6 _____[auto]
Refresh to ACT Delay_________26 ____[auto] (at 2:1 ratio (800mhz) this was 42. BIOS lowered the setting after the restart.)
Read to Precharge Delay_______4 _____[auto]
Memory Performance Enhance__________ [Normal]
High Speed DRAM DLL Settings________ [Option 1]

******** System Voltage NOT Optimized ********
System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.100V] to 1.9v

I suppose the next step is perhaps try it again at 2.1v and then 2.0v. I am curious about the Refresh to ACT Delay setting. That was the only setting that changed when I lowered the divider to 1:1. Could that be the issue? Why is that setting left at Auto and is there any danger to manually setting it at 42?
 
Teh Lurv said:
I had a little free time yesterday and I tried again to work on setting the memory. I followed the guide's memory settings, but I left the DDR2 voltage at 1.9v as I don't plan on tightening the timings beyond the specs of the RAM (my ram is 2x1GB Corsair XMS TWIN2X2048-6400).
...


DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.100V] to 1.9v

I suppose the next step is perhaps try it again at 2.1v and then 2.0v. I am curious about the Refresh to ACT Delay setting. That was the only setting that changed when I lowered the divider to 1:1. Could that be the issue? Why is that setting left at Auto and is there any danger to manually setting it at 42?
Click to expand...

Try 2.1V (+0.3). Your memory is rated at 2.1V according to this link:
http://www.corsair.com/_datasheets/TWIN2X2048-6400C4.pdf

If I have it wrong, select the right memory:
http://www.corsairmemory.com/products/xms2.aspx
 
No that's the C4 version. I have the 5-5-5-18 @ 1.9v version. Wish I bought that version, but I built my current rig Feb 07 when 2GB DRR2-800 kits were going for $200 and opted for the cheaper Corsair kit. :(
 
I tried fiddling with the memory settings again tonight. Instead of a 1:1, I instead tried a 3:2 divider and bumped the ram to 2.0v. This time the auto settings did not change in BIOS and Memtest made a pass without errors, however when rebooting the PC would not POST and required the CMOS to be cleared. Very odd.

System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [3.00]
Memory Frequency (Mhz) 600
DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Manual]
CAS Latency Time_____________ 5 ____ [5]
Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay______ 5 ____ [5]
Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_____5 ____ [5]
Precharge Delay (tRAS)________18 ____[18]
ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_______3 _____[auto]
Rank Write to READ Delay______3 _____[auto]
Write to Precharge Delay______6 _____[auto]
Refresh to ACT Delay_________42 ____[auto]
Read to Precharge Delay_______4 _____[auto]
Memory Performance Enhance__________ [Normal]
High Speed DRAM DLL Settings________ [Option 1]

******** System Voltage NOT Optimized ********
System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.200V] to 2.0v
 
fatmario said:
Hey Bill can you help a noob out plz?

my system spec are
Q6600 GO +thermaltake extreme 120 hs
Crucial Ballistix tracer 1x1 2gb 8500
8800gt
GA P35 DS3P
750 WATT psu

Now problem is when i try to overclock my q6600 from 266 to 333 on bios option without changing the any voltages with dual channel ram it doesn't boot up at all had to reset cmos like 30 time so far no luck. I took out of my one of the ram stick from mobo used single stick to overclock from 266 to 333 it boot up fine then i though maybe i have bad ram? so i swap out my other stick and ran on single stick to see if this stick is defective but it ran fine without any problem. so i can't seem overclock my q6600 with 2 sticks for some reason. any ideas ?
and I even ran memtest86 for almost 8 hour no error found.
Click to expand...

Give it some more Vcore and make sure your memory voltage is set to the high end of the manuf specs. Raise MCH voltage to +.2.
 
Teh Lurv said:
I tried fiddling with the memory settings again tonight. Instead of a 1:1, I instead tried a 3:2 divider and bumped the ram to 2.0v. This time the auto settings did not change in BIOS and Memtest made a pass without errors, however when rebooting the PC would not POST and required the CMOS to be cleared. Very odd.

System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [3.00]
Memory Frequency (Mhz) 600
DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Manual]
CAS Latency Time_____________ 5 ____ [5]
Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay______ 5 ____ [5]
Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_____5 ____ [5]
Precharge Delay (tRAS)________18 ____[18]
ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_______3 _____[auto]
Rank Write to READ Delay______3 _____[auto]
Write to Precharge Delay______6 _____[auto]
Refresh to ACT Delay_________42 ____[auto]
Read to Precharge Delay_______4 _____[auto]
Memory Performance Enhance__________ [Normal]
High Speed DRAM DLL Settings________ [Option 1]

******** System Voltage NOT Optimized ********
System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.200V] to 2.0v
Click to expand...

Aye, odd, but the increased memory voltage apparently helped.

Set the MCH voltage to +.2
Set the DDR2 voltage to +.3 (total of 2.1V and still covered by Corsair Warranty).
Use a memory mulitplier to run your memory at spec 800MHz speed (4.0) at a stock 200MHz FSB.

Then do an overnight run of memtest. I too am somewhat baffeled as to why you are getting memtest errors with that ram way underclocked. One thing I am wondering about is the sub timings. You noticed they changed. I am thinking the board is not re-setting them properly and there are some, a lot actually, you dont see listed in the bios.

Try this, load factory defaults, leave everything on auto, make sure memory timings are set to SPD. Reboot to let the machine compeltely determine what settings it likes. It might cycle a few times. Then take note of the voltages etc.

Then go in and bump the FSB to say 266 adjust your memory mulitplier to a ratio that will get you near 800MHz. Raise the Vcore to 1.35 (or reduce it if board sets it higher).
set memory voltage to 2.1V (+.3). Leave memory timings alone, leave it on SPD.

Reboot and see what happens, check your temps. If that boots and is stable you can then work on backing off all the voltages a bit. If it will not boot or is unstable back off the FSB , try 250, 230 etc. Let me know.
 
Thanks for the assistance, Bill. I was finally able to achieve a stable (so far) O/C.

I was wondering about the sub-timing setting with my memory as well, especially as running the memory at 600mhz was stable with memtest than 200mhz (despite the PC hanging on the reboot.) I did notice in CPU-Z on the SPD tab, my memory had settings for 400mhz and 270mhz. Perhaps under clocking the memory to 200mhz forced the BIOS to assign its own values that were too aggressive for the memory?

Anyways, I used the advice you gave in the previous post about setting the FSB to 266 and the memory to 800mhz on another multiplier. I first tried the below with normal voltage settings except for DDR2 at +0.1v and the vcore at 1.35. I rebooted and the PC refused to POST. Cleared the CMOS and tried again with the NB and FSB upped to +0.1 volts. This time, the machine rebooted and went into Memtest. Ran the first 5 tests to make sure there weren't immediate memory problems then rebooted into Windows. I got into Windows successfully and was able to run Prime95 for a half hour to confirm that there wasn't any immediate problems with the OC. Rebooted again with no hang ups and went back into BIOS, saved off the profile, and set the PC back to stock for the time being.

When I have some free time, I'll need to try scaling back the voltages to see how much is needed for those OC settings and possibly reduce the temps I saw a bit. My PC's temps when using the settings below were:

Idle:50C
Prime95 Load: 58C

Looking back on the rebooting problems I was having running the memory at 600mhz, I think I'll need to go back and revisit that issue, but with the MCH voltage upped +0.1v. My current guess is that MCH is the source of my reboot hanging issue when the memory was at 600mhz.

Here is my current OC profile so far:

E4300
P965-DS3 bios F10
TWIN2X2048-6400

CPU Clock Ratio (Note)____________ [9]
CPU Host Clock Control_ [Enabled]
CPU Host Frequency (MHz)__________ [266]
PCI Express Frequency (Mhz)_______ [100]
C.I.A. 2__________________________ [Disabled]
System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [3.00]
Memory Frequency (Mhz) 800
DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Manual]
CAS Latency Time_____________ 5 ____ [5]
Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay______ 5 ____ [5]
Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_____5 ____ [5]
Precharge Delay (tRAS)________18 ____[18]
ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_______3 _____[auto]
Rank Write to READ Delay______3 _____[auto]
Write to Precharge Delay______6 _____[auto]
Refresh to ACT Delay________42 ______[0]
Read to Precharge Delay_______4 _____[auto]
Memory Performance Enhance__________ [Normal]
High Speed DRAM DLL Settings________ [Option 1]

******** System Voltage NOT Optimized ********
System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.100V]
PCI-E OverVoltage Control_ [Normal]
FSB OverVoltage Control___ [+0.1V]
(G)MCH OverVoltage Control [+0.1V]
CPU Voltage Control_______ [1.35v]
 
Excellent, it certainly does seem that for reasons I dont understand your board likes extra MCH voltage and ram voltage at the upper end. /shrug I have specificaly asked the Coursair Rep in the Memory sub-forum and he replied that Corsair will honor XMS memory warranty up to and including 2.1V.

Frankly I am a bit more worried about the MCH/Northbridge. The amount of extra voltage you are giving it is by no means excessive, some people run them at +.3 or more. You might want to think about hot melt or silicon RTV glueing a 40mm fan onto the MCH heatsink in the future. You can use your "digital" finger probe to check how hot it is getting, the standard 10 sec rule also applies here.

Anyway very glad you are stable, now you can mess around as time permits. Have fun and with a decent HS and watching temps do not be worried about going to 1.375 on Vcore if you need to. 1.55 is max so not even close.
 
E2140 w/ Tuniq Tower 120, Gigabyte DS3L, G.SKILL 2GB DDR2 800, Corsair 520HX, Antec Nine Hundred.

My E2140 was stable at 3.2GHz with 1.35vcore but I decided to take some time today to try and get it a bit higher. I put RAM timings back to 5-5-5-15 and put voltage at +.3v.

This is the RAM: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231098

I upped cpu vcore to 1.48 and now I'm in windows with 8x450 = 3.6GHz. But prime95 blend test restarts the computer almost immediately(tried only once). FSB: DRAM is 1:1 with 450, so RAM is running at 900MHz.

Any opinions on what I should do to try and get it stable? Do RAM timings matter? Should I try to get it back to 4-4-4-12?

Idle CPU temp right now is 41c.
 
I dont think you will be able to run the ram @ 900 MHz with 4 4 4 12 you will need the relaxed timings to help it be stable with the overclock.

What I would do now is back off the FSB a bit say 430MHz and start booting into memtest86+ boot CD and testing that memory. If you get 1 full pass with no errors, add 5 or 10MHz to FSB and retest. The point is you are trying to validate your memory, in other words trying to prove that your memory can do the 450MHz and if it can then you know the issue is with the cpu. It should be able to do it with those relaxed timings. Also if you get a fail, try increasing the mch voltage one "bump" over the existing setting and try again. Perhaps even two bumps. Without all the specifics of what voltages you have set I can give only general guidelines. I do not recommend messing with the FSB voltage unless a last resort. In general at high FSB its all about the MCH/Northbridge and its cooling. If you do not have a small fan glued to it, do it. Its simple to Silicon RTV a 40mm fan onto it. If you have a spare fan laying around plug it in and anyway you can have it blowing on the NB while you test.

So in general, sometimes you can just bang numbers into the bios and get lucky, most of the time you cannot and need a rational approach to testing the machine as you increase the OC to identify what sub-system is sensitve and needs help with the OC.
 
Hi,

I followed your (excellent) guide, BillParish, but cannot complete the "Baseline" section of your tutorial. I am quite puzzled, and was hoping that you could shed some light on what is happening.

My system:

MB: GA-EP35-DS3P (F3 BIOS - latest as of 16th March 2008)
RAM: 4 x 1 GB Corsair 6400C4
CPU: Q6600 (G0 Revision)
PSU: Corsair HX-620

I also have a Gigabyte 7600GT graphics card in PCIe slot 1, an Intel gigabit NIC in another PCIe slot, and finally, an Audigy 2 soundcard in one of the PCI slots.

(let me know if you want more details).



I follow the steps in the "Baseline" section of your tutorial, but I then get a double boot and the following are set back to defaults:

CPU Host Clock Control (Disabled)
PCI Express Frequency (Mhz) (Auto)

Through experimentation, I have found that if I simply set CPU Host Clock Control to "Enabled", and set the fsb to its stock value I STILL GET DOUBLE BOOT AND THE VALUES ARE RESET TO DEFAULT! So it is as if this motherboard does not allow any sort of manual fsb setting. (?!)

Any thoughts?

Thanks,

L0max
 
Through experimentation, I have found that if I simply set CPU Host Clock Control to "Enabled", and set the fsb to its stock value I STILL GET DOUBLE BOOT AND THE VALUES ARE RESET TO DEFAULT! So it is as if this motherboard does not allow any sort of manual fsb setting. (?!)
Click to expand...

This is not good. On the surface it sounds like you have the the dreaded "cold boot" issue. Those are the exact symptoms. For reasons unknown the board will not retain any manual settings and resets to stock. Normally the board is susposed to do this if ridiculous OCing settings are made the board cannot handle and normally the board is a very good OCing board. What your board is doing is not normal. Either it is defective or there is something it really really does not like about your setup.

I would try a couple of things before throwing in the towel. First make double damn sure your cpu heatsink/fan is installed correctly, take a look at the cpu temp in PC Health, at stock it should be around 40C or less. Clear the cmos by unpluging the power supply from the wall and using the jumper. Let it sit for 5 min before putting it back to normal. If you do not have a jumper use a flat bladed screwdriver and lightly touch both cmos clear pins for at least a slow count of 10 and/or remove the battery and let it sit an hour. Remove 2 sticks of memory. Remove the sound card. Remove the NIC. Then boot an go into the bios and set everything to "auto" in the MIT menu, memory to SPD. Reboot. Go into the bios and raise the FSB 10MHz. If it will not reboot and keep the settings RMA the board with the reason "Will not maintain bios settings on cold start".

If the issue goes away, add a card one at a time to find the one the board is having an issue with.

If you have any USB external drives/cameras/scanners/printers etc. disconnect them when doing the above testing.
 
BillParrish said:
Excellent, it certainly does seem that for reasons I dont understand your board likes extra MCH voltage and ram voltage at the upper end. /shrug I have specificaly asked the Coursair Rep in the Memory sub-forum and he replied that Corsair will honor XMS memory warranty up to and including 2.1V.

Frankly I am a bit more worried about the MCH/Northbridge. The amount of extra voltage you are giving it is by no means excessive, some people run them at +.3 or more. You might want to think about hot melt or silicon RTV glueing a 40mm fan onto the MCH heatsink in the future. You can use your "digital" finger probe to check how hot it is getting, the standard 10 sec rule also applies here.
Click to expand...

Thanks Bill. I turned down the voltages slowly and was able to run Prime95 SmallFFT for 6 hours w/o errors with the following voltages using my above setup:

******** System Voltage NOT Optimized ********
System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.100V]
PCI-E OverVoltage Control_ [Normal]
FSB OverVoltage Control___ [Normal]
(G)MCH OverVoltage Control [+0.1V]
CPU Voltage Control_______ [Normal]

I wish the DS3 had finer voltage control for the MCH, I bet that +0.1 is overkill for the O/C I am setting my rig at. The load temp dropped to 57C after dropping the voltage back to stock, but that still is a bit high. I tried taking off the case side panel and the temps dropped to 52C, which is much better. I believe I need to rework my cooling scheme.

Now that the OC is stable, I'm working on the memory settings. I noticed that my Corsair memory has two SPD timings for 400mhz and 270mhz. I have heard that C2Ds have better performance with a 1:1 divider, so I tried upping the FSB 4mhz to 270 and adjusting the memory settings to timings listed in the SPD tab in CPU-Z:

System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [2.00]
Memory Frequency (Mhz) 800 540
DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Manual]
CAS Latency Time_____________ 5 ____ [4]
Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay______ 5 ____ [4]
Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_____5 ____ [4]
Precharge Delay (tRAS)________18 ____[13]
ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_______3 _____[auto]
Rank Write to READ Delay______3 _____[auto]
Write to Precharge Delay______6 _____[auto]
Refresh to ACT Delay________21 ______[0]
Read to Precharge Delay_______4 _____[auto]
Memory Performance Enhance__________ [Normal]

I saved the settings and rebooted. Memtest86 ran a pass fine and Prime95 blend test ran without errors. However, rebooting is problematic. My PC will sometimes refuse to POST on reboot or go back to stock speeds. I'll need to revisit this once my cooling has improved.

Thanks for the advice on the 40mm fan Bill, although I'm not familiar with glue. What type of glue is silicon RTV glue?
 
What type of glue is silicon RTV glue?
Click to expand...

The RTV means room temp vulcanising (basically its liquid silicon rubber that cures to semi solid at room temps) its the clear slicone adhesive you find in any hardware store. Its just clear (can find colors if you want) silicone glue. Its like a clear thick paste and in about 10 minutes it "sets" into a flexiable solid hunk of clear silicone. I think DOW sells it under the name RTV and a zillion other people sell it as "Silicone Adhesive". 3M makes it too.

I love the stuff (other than the acid smell as it dries/sets up ) take a small fan and put a "blob" in each fan mounting hole so the "blob" is 1/2 in the hole and 1/2 above the surfface of the ran. You can then just set the fan on the MCH heatsink (well my MCH heatsink had a flat finned top so it made it easy after I ripped the "Gigabyte" bling piece of metal off ) and gently press down just a little bit so that some of the "blob" sticking up from the fan gets on/in the fins. Wait 10 minutes and you have a shock mounted/ vibration absorbing fan mount. If you ever need to take it off it will all peel right off with no mess.


Do not be worried about giving that ram another .1V for a total of +.2 . It might solve your boot problem. Worth a try, that 4 x 1 GB will put a load on the memory voltage supply and just a bit more might help. 2.1 (+.3) is as high as you want to go with that memory but even that is no concern I have been running mine at 2.1V for 18 months at the speed in my sig with no issues. The 4 GB will be a little more tricky to get memory OC out of just due to the 4 sticks.
 
dropping by to say thanks to BillParrish. build my rig a year ago with GA 965P DQ6 and E6600 and pc 6400 memory. it was my first built and had no prior experience with over clocking. the first thing i did was print the the over clock guide from this thread. after i put all the parts together i followed the guide step by step and had no problem booting in 3.0ghz. then i oc the processor to 3.2ghz with all default voltage and run orthos for 9 hrs. finding it stable i kept that setting. last one year was one of the most satisfying computing experience for me. i didn't have a single hick up with my system. couldn't have been more happier then this. Thank you BillParrish, you have been doing a great job for a long time. i hope you will keep up the good work :D

ps. just noticed you also got the ver. 1.0 of DQ6 like me.
 
BillParrish said:
The RTV means room temp vulcanising (basically its liquid silicon rubber that cures to semi solid at room temps) its the clear slicone adhesive you find in any hardware store.

....

Wait 10 minutes and you have a shock mounted/ vibration absorbing fan mount. If you ever need to take it off it will all peel right off with no mess.
Click to expand...

Ah, okay. So something like this then: GE Silicone Household Glue

That sounds perfect from your description. I was curious if I glued a fan to the NB what'd I do if the fan ever needed replacing. Your suggestion sounds like the way to go.

EDIT: Home Depot link didn't work.
 
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The Lurv said:
Ah, okay. So something like this then: GE Silicone Household Glue

That sounds perfect from your description. I was curious if I glued a fan to the NB what'd I do if the fan ever needed replacing. Your suggestion sounds like the way to go.

EDIT: Home Depot link didn't work.
Click to expand...

Aye thats exactly the stuff, its pretty common.

OK now the bad news, "will it have to be replaced". In my experience these fans last about a year. I get a bit more out of them by once a year (I keep my machines a long time compared to most people and I am basically a cheap bastid) by peeling back the label on the fan hub and putting one drop of light weight machine oil on the bearing, not 3 in 1 oil, it evaporates, sewing machine oil would be ideal and I have used 30w motor oil in a pinch and brought many a "stuck" fan back to life for another 6 months. However I usually buy them in pairs and keep the spare in the "junk" drawer because the shipping usually costs more than the fan. So yes, sooner or later you will need to replace it and thats why the silicon glue is so great. Pop the side panel off, grab the old fan and it will pull right off, a few scrapes with a pencil or other tool you can get in between the fins and the old silicon will peel right off and in 5 min you can have a new one glued on. The major trick it to not overdo it on the glue when you first put it on. Just a blob in each corner in the mounting hole. The fan is lightweight and as long as it does not fall off it is on good enough. I forgot to mention I lay the machine on its side when I first glue one on so gravity helps hold the fan in place and keeps me from having to continue to hold the fan while the RTV sets up. Again, I do not squish the fan down hard against the heatsink, I set it on and just give it a very gentle push so some silicone just barely gets into the fins at the four corner locations. If there is a small gap, a "standoff" if you will, between the fan and the heatsink it is not a problem and makes removal a snap.

My other trick it that instead of paying 3.99 per 40mm fan + shipping on each, I find a HD bay cooler that has 3 fans in it for 5.99 and buy one or two and end up with 3 or 6 fans and just one shipping fee. Depending on how the fans are wired you might need to have some soldering ability to wire connectors on the ends of the fan wires. A cheap and easy skill to learn and I highly recommend a $9.00 pencil soldering iron kit and some small diameter heatshrink sleeving from Radio Shack or some other source. 15 minutes of practice soldering some scrap wire following any of the many guides on the net and you can do some nice work consolidating fan wiring or getting rid of excess fan wire length you don't need.

They are out of stock but this is the one I buy,
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835888104

This might even be a cheaper alternative.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835150077
You can see on this one how the two fans are connected to one plug, You just cut the wire for the 2nd fan off close to the plug and make sure the cut ends are neat and do not short to one another. 2 years from now if the fan fails you cut the wire in the middle and using small wire nuts ( the tiny gray ones work great) or better using heatsink and solder splice the connector onto the spare fan.

The same fan runs $3 and up, each, + $5 shipping each if you buy just the fan.

You want something that is under 2000 rpm or it will be "whiny" and if necessary you can do the 7v mod to make it run even quieter (and probably extend its life). The main thing is you have some air blowing directly down onto the MCH heatsink, it does not have to be a lot to greatly reduce the working temp of that chip. And it might be that your OC is not increased much but I absolutely assure you stability and the possibility of a long life for the board will be enhanced.

Practice what I preach. (this was taken 2 seconds before I fired it up for the first time, the wiring has been much cleaned up since. One of the three fans has failed in 17 months and had to be replaced. Other two still going strong. Damn expensive, $15+, PCI slot fan for cooling video card lasted less than 6 months before it became noisy and no amount of oil has helped it. Going to eliminate it for a "normal fan" on some kind of bracket when I get unlazy. ) :D

computer003.jpg
 
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Thanks for the advice, Bill. I picked up a pair of Scythe mini-kazes 10L 40mm fans and a thermometer probe for a few bucks extra to get some temp readings. I wasn't able to follow your application instructions exactly as the DS3 rev 2 NB heatsink has a middle T-bar fin that's half a millimeter above the surrounding fins. I wound up dabbing the corners with the glue as well as a smidge on the label. Mounted it and let it set for an hour before trying it out. The PC has been running for a few hours now and the fan is still set on the NB. I'm still gonna be keeping an eye on it to make sure it doesn't pop off at a later time.

Before the install, the NB with my minor OC was topping out at 47C. With the fan the NB temp dropped to 38C. A great result for less than $20 in equipment!
 
I updated to the F130 Bios and I can't get it to post with the E8400 installed. I cleared the CMOS etc. and nothing. Has anyone got this to work?
 
Hi Bill,

Slightly Off Topic Here.... but do you know a way of reading out the Northbridge temp on the ds3?
after a bit of googling i've found after the first boot after a bios update it dissapeers from the bios, also speedfan shows me a 3rd sensor on the MB but it seems to sit a -2° :s i spent months assuming that the "system" temp sensor was the NB temp but that seems to be a sensor next to the PCIe slot (Explainging why i have such High system temps if its right under the damn GFX card lol)

i've upgraded the HS on the NB but am having worries it maybe getting to hot (CPU hits 55° when all 4 cores run at 100%)

any Idea if there is a way to read the NB sensor? i can't find any info from gigabyte :'(
 
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