Finally - News on Samsung Thin Bezel Displays is Suckage

[Conker]

Needs to be tall enough. Rather just get 3 27-30 inch screens. Width is good but like others have said..eventually your going to be centering in on the middle screen and it has to be big enough

 

[Finkus]

I'll provide my opinion on whatever I please, i don't like eyefinity and I dont have to use it first person to understand that I dont like it

This is lulz. It's like looking at a photograph of a man wearing a pair of skis and deciding that skiing sucks because it looks very clunky attached to your feet like that and to just stick to walking.

And then you try it and...Why would you worry about things attached to your feet when you're practically flying?

 

[Manfromx]

im just going to repeat 1 thing...

i said... and i quote:

there isnt a person on this here planet that will look at my 20" s-ips monitors @ 3600x1600 and then turn to the 23" s-ips monitors @ 3240x1920 and say... yep... that setup over there is worth 3 times as much as this first one...

to add: all 3 of my monitors cost me, total... for all of them, less than $400 - i checked on ebay and craigslist just now... and found multiple deals for dell 2007fps from $110 to $179 - some of the sellers on ebay that have a lot of 20 or more will make you a deal when you buy 3 or more...

You got a good deal on them for sure. Though it really isn't fair to compare a product that's been around for 2 years and can be bought second hand to a product that isn't even out yet on only price.

The new monitors are better than yours in many ways. Yes currently I'd agree you got more "value" out of your money. No doubt about it. Someone who buys Dual core usually gets better value than those who buy Quad (for now). "Value" is determined by the person making the purchase though. So the guy who bought the Quad core may not see all 4 cores getting used very often. But the extra money was worth it to him when he does (I only have dual btw)

So most people out there who would consider buying this package probably already know about cheaper alternatives.

 

[kllrnohj]

im just going to repeat 1 thing...

i said... and i quote:

there isnt a person on this here planet that will look at my 20" s-ips monitors @ 3600x1600 and then turn to the 23" s-ips monitors @ 3240x1920 and say... yep... that setup over there is worth 3 times as much as this first one...

to add: all 3 of my monitors cost me, total... for all of them, less than $400 - i checked on ebay and craigslist just now... and found multiple deals for dell 2007fps from $110 to $179 - some of the sellers on ebay that have a lot of 20 or more will make you a deal when you buy 3 or more...

Except you bought used, and 20in displays are rather small. You can't really compare used to new. For example, I don't want used, and I want something larger than 20in. I'm looking at 24in displays for Eyefinity, and I'm definitely buying new.

I'm sure your setup rocks and getting great deals on hardware is always cool, but comparing used prices on an old product vs. new prices on a brand new product is rather unfair.

 

[GoldenTiger]

I'm hearing from most places that these are 1920x1080 panels, not 2560x1600... that's the make-or-break as to whether I'd consider it, with the low-res setup being a no-go.

 

[PrincessFrosty]

im just going to repeat 1 thing...

i said... and i quote:

there isnt a person on this here planet that will look at my 20" s-ips monitors @ 3600x1600 and then turn to the 23" s-ips monitors @ 3240x1920 and say... yep... that setup over there is worth 3 times as much as this first one...

to add: all 3 of my monitors cost me, total... for all of them, less than $400 - i checked on ebay and craigslist just now... and found multiple deals for dell 2007fps from $110 to $179 - some of the sellers on ebay that have a lot of 20 or more will make you a deal when you buy 3 or more...

Are you insane or something?

Not being funny here... but you're comparing a SMALLER screen with a SMALLER RESOLUTION which has been OUT LONGER, at SECOND HAND PRICES...

To...

a BRAND NEW set of BIGGER screens using new technology to provide THIN BEZELS, with a CUSTOM STAND and all running HIGHER RESOLUTIONS.

I am baffled how anyone can do the mental gymnastics to pull this one off.

 

[jamhamm]

that's because you dont have eyefinity nor do you have your very own calculator ... but i do have eyefinity... ive sat in front of a 3x30" setup clear down to a 3x19" setup... so excuse me if i dont take the advice of someone, anyone... who has only seen what we're talking about in pictures and vidoes

and, i do have a calculator... so let's do the math

first let's look at pure number of pixels:

1920x1200 = 2 304 000
1920x1080 = 2 073 600
1600x1200 = 1 920 000

in all the situations... you're look at pushing about 2 million pixels

now frosty you keep comparing the price with the samsung 1080p displays with dell 1200p displays because you say they are so similar...

well, again... simple math tells you that in pure pixels... the difference between a 1200p and 1080p display is 230,000 pixels...

and the difference between my 20" and the samsung 23" is only... why looky here, 153,600 pixels...

so, you say i cannot compare my SMALLER screens with a SMALLER RESOLUTION to the BRAND NEW and BIGGER screens...

yet here you are... comparing 1080p to 1200p with the gap between the two is even larger than what im comparing...

so... you can no longer use any price reference of 24" 1920x1200 monitors... because they are in a completely different league... according to your ability to use the CAPS LOCK key...

now... moving on

my current monitors in portrait provide me with 16" tall... 42" diagonal... and a wonderful 40" wide of actual viewable space... that's inside the bezels - at a native resolution of 3600x1600 = 5,760,000 pixels

that's a hair shy of 6 million pixels ... for reference the samsung displays will be just a hair plus of 6 million... 6,220,800 to be exact

the samsung displays are going to be taller... but more narrow each and not as wide total

same if we flip them into landscape... they will be wider... but not as tall

now pay attention... whenever you say anything... then say 'but' right after... that means there is a trade off...

yes the samsung special eyefinity displays are taller... BUT (see i know where that key is too) they are not as wide

meaning there is indeed a trade off...

and to anyone... anyone, who's actually seen eyefinity you know its about one thing... have a wall of monitors in front you and fill your view of the game world and immerse you into what you are doing...

so again... to someone not sitting in front of triple portrait monitor setup i can see how 20" and 4:3 may seem like a far stretch from 23" and 16:

but in the real world - where real games are played... the difference is a lot closer than you think...

so my dearest pal frosty... no im not insane... what i am is a computer gamer... what i have is hands on experience with more than 6 eyefinity setups across the gamut from cheap 19" tn panels to 30" behemoth beasts

and what i chose... for a magical mix of price vs performance was my current setup...

honestly... there's no point to any of this because you've never even used eyefinity, nor do you even like it... so you're yelling from your treetop about something you have zero experience with... what's the point?

want to know mine - its the same as its always been...

anyone smart enough to flash their own bios should know... that the samsung md230 does not represent a good deal - it is a niche product... that has noticeable shortcomings and is over priced

anyone who's actually sat down and played on eyefinity would know that... now if you'll excuse me... i have to get back to killing kpa

 

[jamhamm]

in case anyone is wondering what that looks like in screenshot form:

 

[Neb]

Wow, that was certainly a bit of stream of consciousness writing there.

 

[GoldenTiger]

in case anyone is wondering what that looks like in screenshot form:

[*IMG]http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/7049/screenshot0000xi.jpg[/IMG]

Good job, it took three monitors and an inch between each 1/3 of the screen to do that! Yet it's not that much wider than my Dell 3007WFP-HC and provides little extra FOV since it's in portrait mode, oh and did I mention spacing+bezels yet between each 1/3 of the screen?

 

[siliconnerd]

Good job, it took three monitors and an inch between each 1/3 of the screen to do that! Yet it's not that much wider than my Dell 3007WFP-HC and provides little extra FOV since it's in portrait mode, oh and did I mention spacing+bezels yet between each 1/3 of the screen?

Solution: 3x Dell 3007WFP-HCs.

 

[GoldenTiger]

Solution: 3x Dell 3007WFP-HCs.

That would be slick .

 

[MJZ]

Whats wrong with 1080p? I'm loving my P2310Hs.

Nothing really, they're just... not as good as 1200p. You get some vertical resolution chopped off because they said so and the consumer HDTV market uses it.

 

[Pantalaimon]

that's because you dont have eyefinity nor do you have your very own calculator ... but i do have eyefinity... ive sat in front of a 3x30" setup clear down to a 3x19" setup... so excuse me if i dont take the advice of someone, anyone... who has only seen what we're talking about in pictures and vidoes

You're still comparing the price of a used 2 year-old product to a new product.

 

[ecmaster76]

Didn't see this mentioned yet.

$1800 is the *MSRP*. When was the last time you paid MSRP? Thats right! Never (unless buying x25s or 5800s lol). It only exists so that retailers can pretend they are giving you a discount. Considering these are new models with a custom stand thrown in, I think paying $1500-$1700 is a reasonable price.

 

[jamhamm]

Good job, it took three monitors and an inch between each 1/3 of the screen to do that! Yet it's not that much wider than my Dell 3007WFP-HC and provides little extra FOV since it's in portrait mode, oh and did I mention spacing+bezels yet between each 1/3 of the screen?

when i measured my diag it was 42"... and my width was close to 40"

now... take out 2" for the 2 bezels and ... that's 40" diag / 38" wide

again, correct me if im wrong... your 30" monitor is not 40" across the diagonal is it? nor is it 38" wide... and im pretty sure the resolution isnt 3600x1600 - and... while we're on the topic... im positive you didn't get it for $400 bucks...

so... what was the point of comparing those two setups - your horizontal resolution is 2560 - mine is 3600

hmmm. yea, that's not much wider at all... only over 1000 pixels and over 10" more...

best price i could find on a refurb 3007 was $800 / twice the price of my setup

look you guys (who dont have eyefinity in any way shape or form) can offer opinions and hate all you want... the point is... for a very minimal investment... i have an array of s-ips panels that offer me a wall of eyefinity goodness

 

[jamhamm]

Didn't see this mentioned yet.

$1800 is the *MSRP*. When was the last time you paid MSRP? Thats right! Never (unless buying x25s or 5800s lol). It only exists so that retailers can pretend they are giving you a discount. Considering these are new models with a custom stand thrown in, I think paying $1500-$1700 is a reasonable price.

i did mention that in the other thread when these monitors first surfaced [month ago ish]

and i said the same thing i think they will be cheaper than msrp - but how much cheaper is the real question...

supply and demand drove the 5xxx cards up in price... well over msrp

so time will tell... there isnt even an official spec sheet out yet on these... i mean, we know they are 23" and we know they are 1080p - but that's about it...

 

[Tudz]

If you're trying to convince people of anything good, that is a horrible picture to do it, it just looks bad to me... huge bezels cutting through quite close to the centre of the display. Most eyefinity set ups it slike "yeah, I can see how those bezels vanish when you actually start playing", but that set up just looks like "WOW those gaps in the image are huge". To me it just looks like a 40" TV which has been sliced up (though I'm aware it must have awesome resolution so you might no longer need AA).

The thing I like about Eyefinity (and why I want to get a set up myself) is the huge aspect ratio, and having it kinda wrapping around you a bit. What you've got there just looks like the people who buy big TVs and put them on a desk to play PC games (again I'm aware of resolution difference).

EDIT: Also, why not overlap the bezels? The screens wont line up as perfectly, but without bezel management the images are offset anyway. Even with bezel management you could probably come up with something that almost eliminates the effect of the overlap. I just ask because I always see people with Eyefinity set ups with the bezels perfectly lined up when I thought overlapping them would give a better result.

 

[jamhamm]

eyefinity doesnt work in pictures - you cannot see a picture of it and make up your mind on what works for you...

the only reason i tried it is because i got a good deal on a single 2007fp and i though hmm, used these guys are like $150 - so for less than the price of a single good 24" i could check this out...

i found two more and landscaped them up... windows7 was sexy - but the games i play [shooters] were crap... didnt like them... crysis, bioshock, borderlands, half life, etc - didnt like any of them

and then i loaded up nfs:s and poof! amazingness - so i switched it into portrait and tried my shooters again... that's when things 'clicked' and i understood

see reading about eyefinity and thinking about eyefinity is a completely different experience from actually having it

in your head you're thinking yea... its this way, and i can have it really wide and and and - what you dont get it a game is bound by how it was made... you can't all of a sudden make a game into something it's not

for instance... if a game was developed with 16:9 as the widest aspect ratio available... then where do you think the action and content and attention is going to be set?

right smack in the middle of the screen...

so sure - line up 3 wide monitors and eyefinity them into 1 big display and what do you get? a lot of random landscapes and pretty pictures on your wide display but no actual game content... no one to see doing anything sneaky, nothing to notice that aids your game...

its just extra space out there...

but with your monitors in portrait... you're in a much closer to optimal aspect, that's what's important about the games we have out now... the content is focused towards the center - not extremes of left and right

and as far as why not overlap the bezels... because once you are playing... they. dont. matter.

honestly - when you're gaming with eyefinity they melt away and you just play, you dont notice them [just like everyone in every forum across the entire internet are saying...]

or do you think that everyone with eyefinity, softTH, etc are all lying?

 

[jamhamm]

this has gotten away from what the op intended. it's turned into ... well i don't even know but it's certainly not about the samsung displays or their price

i 'think' they are overpriced because after having used eyefinity for a few months now, having slim bezels doesn't matter as much as i thought it would before i got hands on...

that being said - i 'think' it would have been better to make big sexy 5:4 aspect ratio monitors with thin bezels - that way, you central monitor is both taller and wider

but that's just one mans opinion - 23" and 16:9 just isnt optimal, not when there are better options available for a lower price

 

[kllrnohj]

To me it just looks like a 40" TV which has been sliced up (though I'm aware it must have awesome resolution so you might no longer need AA).

Higher resolution does *NOT* necessarily mean you will or won't need AA. In this case, it most definitely will not have any effect whatsoever on jaggies. For you to no longer need AA, the DPI of the display must be much, much higher than it currently is. As of now, there aren't any displays (that I know of) with a DPI high enough to completely negate the benefits of AA - there certainly aren't any computer monitors with a high enough DPI. Highest DPI monitor I've ever used was a 1920x1200 15.4in screen (~150 dpi vs ~100 dpi for a 30in), and I assure you jaggies were still noticeable. My Droid's screen, on the other hand, has a DPI of ~260 and jaggies are hard to spot.

 

[Manfromx]

i found two more and landscaped them up... windows7 was sexy - but the games i play [shooters] were crap... didnt like them... crysis, bioshock, borderlands, half life, etc - didnt like any of them

and then i loaded up nfs:s and poof! amazingness - so i switched it into portrait and tried my shooters again... that's when things 'clicked' and i understood

see reading about eyefinity and thinking about eyefinity is a completely different experience from actually having it

in your head you're thinking yea... its this way, and i can have it really wide and and and - what you dont get it a game is bound by how it was made... you can't all of a sudden make a game into something it's not

for instance... if a game was developed with 16:9 as the widest aspect ratio available... then where do you think the action and content and attention is going to be set?

right smack in the middle of the screen...

so sure - line up 3 wide monitors and eyefinity them into 1 big display and what do you get? a lot of random landscapes and pretty pictures on your wide display but no actual game content... no one to see doing anything sneaky, nothing to notice that aids your game...

its just extra space out there...

but with your monitors in portrait... you're in a much closer to optimal aspect, that's what's important about the games we have out now... the content is focused towards the center - not extremes of left and right

Pricing and bezels aside I have to disagree portrait mode is the only way to go.

I'm sure it works good with a lot of FPS. I'd be playing Flight Sims mostly in which case seeing more in my peripheral is more important than seeing more vertically.

To me it seems like your 3 displays are pretty much equal to one big display. The FOV increase is minor. So you got a nice big fat display for $450. That is a good deal .

I don't think there is any "one way" to use eyefinity. That's why they let you customise it. Portrait mode is nice especially if a game always puts the fight right in your face. However being able to have a wider field of view especially in competitive FPS can make a big difference and I think you're brushing the advantage aside without much thought.

Your set up is very nice and I'm definitely not talking it down. Whether you go portrait or wide is dependent on your monitor setup and the game involved.

Anyways it doesn't matter we got off topic. The whole topic thread is erroneous claiming these displays are suckage without knowing any of the hard facts.

I admit these displays could be a let down but it's a little too early to tell.

 

[Spare-Flair]

Geez, I paid $1300 for my first LCD. You read that right.

That's what happens with new technology. Give it some time.

 

[Met-AL]

having slim bezels doesn't matter as much as i thought it would before i got hands on...

Nope, you are wrong cause Frosty says so. And please stop cluttering up the forums with pictures of your clearly inferior stuff. j/k

Nice setup and thanks for sharing your opinion on Eyefinity, clearly you have actually used Eyefinity and your opinion matters something on the subject.

 

[GoldenTiger]

Geez, I paid $1300 for my first LCD. You read that right.

That's what happens with new technology. Give it some time.

I paid $400 or so for a 15" 50ms response time 1024x768 LCD... and that was a blazing hot deal too!

 

[MrAgmoore]

I don't much care for this thread but the link made me laugh:

http://blogntech.com/nec-crv43-43-inch-ultra-widescreen-curved-monitor-announced.html

"NEC has recently announced its new LCD monitor “NEC CRV43″ that made especially for professional graphics, higher education, government, financial, command & control and home office. The NEC CRV43 is an 43-inch ultra-widescreen Curved monitor which equipped with a double WGXA resolution (2880 x 900) with a 32:10 aspect ratio, a LED backlight, 200 cd/m² brightness, 0.02ms Rapid Response, 10,000:1 contrast ratio, USB 2.0 connectivity for easy use of peripherals and DVI-D and HDMI 1.3 port.

The NEC CRV43 43-inch ultra-widescreen Curved Monitor will be available in July 2009 with estimated price of $7,999."


- Sounds like gamer heaven.

 

[LostInRehab]

I don't much care for this thread but the link made me laugh:

http://blogntech.com/nec-crv43-43-inch-ultra-widescreen-curved-monitor-announced.html

"NEC has recently announced its new LCD monitor “NEC CRV43″ that made especially for professional graphics, higher education, government, financial, command & control and home office. The NEC CRV43 is an 43-inch ultra-widescreen Curved monitor which equipped with a double WGXA resolution (2880 x 900) with a 32:10 aspect ratio, a LED backlight, 200 cd/m² brightness, 0.02ms Rapid Response, 10,000:1 contrast ratio, USB 2.0 connectivity for easy use of peripherals and DVI-D and HDMI 1.3 port.

The NEC CRV43 43-inch ultra-widescreen Curved Monitor will be available in July 2009 with estimated price of $7,999."


- Sounds like gamer heaven.

Thats old news there were pictures of that monitor in an eyefinity set up as well on this forum.

As for the eyefinity bezel issue it isn't a problem if you see it in person for the most part although I'd rater have a 4k monitor but we need hdmi 1.4 and/or dp 1.2 to be on cards already.

 

[kllrnohj]

To me it seems like your 3 displays are pretty much equal to one big display. The FOV increase is minor. So you got a nice big fat display for $450. That is a good deal .

Actually since he has 4:3 monitors his FOV increase in portrait mode is actually pretty significant. 3600x1600 gives an AR of 2.25.

 

[Manfromx]

Actually since he has 4:3 monitors his FOV increase in portrait mode is actually pretty significant. 3600x1600 gives an AR of 2.25.

Yah I don't mean to suggest there isn't a change. I was just trying to say wider can be better as well.

Like I said, his setup is nice.

 

[sethk]

Hmm.. which is worse, bezels or a little banding?
http://www.brightsideofnews.com/news/2010/1/28/ostendo-fails-to-deliver-in-more-than-one-way.aspx

In the end it doesn't matter because this is ridiculously expensive.

 

[fochkoph]

Maybe he just wanted a single thin-bezel LCD ... I wouldn't buy Samsung anyways though.

My younger brother had an absolutely horrid time with their customer service. Actually horrid would be an understatement. Cannot for the life of me conjure up a word that so describes the utterly pathetic effort by Samsung's useless and outsourced service. Nonetheless never ever buying Samshit ever again.

By the bye, nice setup jam. I scoff at people who are quick to draw conclusions on anything they've never personally experienced. Arm-chair warriors rule.

 

[alxnet2003]

Hmm.. which is worse, bezels or a little banding?
http://www.brightsideofnews.com/news/2010/1/28/ostendo-fails-to-deliver-in-more-than-one-way.aspx
In the end it doesn't matter because this is ridiculously expensive.

Even worse, it's a projection based DLP setup so expect a little uneven focusing (which people have confirmed in the extreme outer edge). If you can stand the banding, soft focusing in the edges and the crazy price, go for it. Otherwise save a ton of cash and deal with the bezels. Bezels and all, it's still leagues better than a single monitor.

 

[Kinesis]

@jamhamm,
have you looked into removing bezels from those 2007's?(how easy it would be or and more importantly how much if any bezel/edge is left)

I'm wondering if wouldn't make an affordable 5x1 portrait(when the eyefin 5870 six port card is released)or even 3x2 landscape solution.

Thanks

 

[Manfromx]

5x1 would win me over with those 20" Dells

Best of both worlds then for gaming.

Though watching movies on your PC wouldn't be so hot.