Feel Like I'm Being Shafted -- Advice Needed

R

rusty12

Limp Gawd
Joined
May 2, 2007
Messages
443
I’m in need of some advice.

I took my desktop into a local PC repair shop here in town because I was running into trouble with a reinstallation of Windows Vista Home Premium. I gave the technicians my OEM DVD of Home Premium to see if they could get Vista up and running for me (it would freeze during the install phase).

I picked up my desktop later that week and took it home and realized they had installed Vista Home Basic, not Premium. I called them up, and the guy said they would fix that for me free of charge.

This morning I called them to give them a heads up that I would be bringing in my PC for the fix and I spoke to a different guy who was familiar with my case and said this (paraphrasing here…) “We used your DVD to install Vista. It actually gave us a couple of options of which version to install and the Home Basic version installed.” I responded with an ‘Oh really that’s interesting, I’ve installed Vista using that same DVD 4 or 5 times and have never seen that option given anywhere and I paid for Home Premium and I’d like that to be installed. I brought my PC in for a reinstallation of Vista and I gave you my DVD which plainly says Windows Vista Home Premium on the face and I would like that to be installed. You never even mentioned when I picked up my computer that you weren’t able to install Premium and so you had to revert to Basic.’

The gentleman then went on to say that he could try and get Premium installed but it would be a “crapshot” to see if they could get Premium up and running or not. They could run into the same problem that I ran into and then would have to revert back to Basic and possibly bill me additional hours if they go above the original time they put into it!

…First of all, is there really an option on the DVD to install different versions of Vista, if so, where? Secondly, what do you all think I should do? I wonder if my DVD is bad and if just ordering a new one from Microsoft would be a better solution than to deal with these asshats ever again.


Thanks
 
Vista DVDs can be used to install any version of Vista from Basic to Ultimate.
You can install Vista without a product key, as you can install any version from the DVD and use it for 30 days before having to activate.

I have to wonder why they could only get Basic installed rather than Premium. You can upgrade it with Windows Anytime upgrade, or just reinstall yourself.

It could be a case of a bad optical drive, as that was affecting a machine I helped fix for a friend recently.
 
If it's an actual Vista Home Premium OEM disc, and he's got the key, that shop is full of morons (which unfortunately is the majority of 'em). There's absolutely no legit reason for them to have installed Basic on it - and the idea of the disc being bad doesn't fly since all Vista versions share the same base file structure and content. If you can't install one version from that disc, you won't be able to install any of 'em.

As for "how" such a thing happens, at the point where you're asked to input the key, if you uncheck the box about activating when online and then click Next, you'll get a popup saying something to the effect of "Hey, you're not putting in the key, and you can do that, but are you sure?" and click No - make sure it's No or you do this again - and the next screen that appears will list all the versions of Vista and a checkbox stating "I have chosen the version of Vista" blah blah blah, then click Next again after you highlight the one you want to install.

My guess is they could have swapped the key possibly for something not quite so legit, it's tough to say. But there is no reason to put Basic on a machine using a disc that plainly states which particular OEM version it is. The KEY is what determines the version, and the KEY for that disc is a Vista Home Premium disc - they couldn't install Vista Home Basic on his machine unless they had a key for it and then installed/activated it.

If all they did was install Vista Home Basic off the menu listing the available versions - meaning they didn't use the Product Key to install it - then the OP is stuck anyway for a key to get Basic activated, but that's not what he requested or paid for.

Take it back, with the DVD (mark the DVD somehow with a felt tip marker, just a tiny mark that you can find later on to verify they're not swapping discs - something I see constantly in my visits with clients to "Mom & Pop" PC shops), and tell 'em "Here ya go, I'll wait this time" and stay there in the shop.

If it takes more than 45 mins to get the job done properly - and DO NOT LEAVE the store till they power the PC up on the counter in front of you so you can verify it's Vista Home Premium and verify the Product Key too if possible. I've seen entirely too many situations where those little shops are ripping people off constantly by taking their keys and installing hacked OEM copies with SLIC-tables embedded in a BIOS loader that pops up for a fraction of a second before the OS loads.

It's amazing that with all the business and competition in the PC repair industry that some scumbuckets still resort to those underhanded practices. Geez...

But don't leave the store, wait for them to get it up and running, verify all of it before leaving, and don't put another dime in their pockets. If they do get it done to your satisfaction, never go back to 'em ever again and be honest about their level of service with friends and family if they ask.

Word of mouth will make or break 'em... hopefully if they're doing what I think they're doing it'll break 'em and fast.
 
Thanks for that passionate response. I’m right there with you!

Here’s the deal, I’m 110% positive they gave me back my Vista DVD. The original problem I had had been on that product activation screen during the install process. Essentially, anytime I got to that 3rd screen and I clicked my USB Razer mouse it froze (whether or not I entered the key) and I wasn’t able to get to the screen to choose which version of Vista to install as your describing.

When I picked up desktop they told me about 2 or 3 times that they installed Vista but I would have to activate it when I got home. (Not sure why I would have had to do this myself as my sticker with the key was on the back of the case). Regardless, I got home and found Basic. Using the computer, Vista does ask me to activate the product.

Right now my blood pressure is still excessively high from my phone conversation with the tech. from the shop and at this point I’d like to avoid dealing with those guys as much as possible. I’m willing to try and upgrade Basic to my Premium or try again at the reinstall process but I’m worried that it will freeze up on me again and then I’ll be forced to take it back in. I’m not sure why it ever froze on me in the first place (could it be that I’m using a USB mouse and not a PS/2?...I’ve always used a USB mouse during previous installs though and no problems…) ...They said they had absolutely no problem when installing it and never saw the problem I described and brought it in for.

I won’t try anything yet until I see what you all think; attempt myself or be force to deal with asshats.


*Oh, and don’t you worry, I’ll spread bad news about them like a god damn wild forest fire.
 
When I picked up desktop they told me about 2 or 3 times that they installed Vista but I would have to activate it when I got home. (Not sure why I would have had to do this myself as my sticker with the key was on the back of the case). Regardless, I got home and found Basic. Using the computer, Vista does ask me to activate the product.
Click to expand...

Wow, this shop makes me a little angry.

The reason they had you activate it -- you don't have a key for basic, you have a key for premium. They installed it without a key then sent you home to worry about it knowing that you'd be back in 30 days when you couldn't figure out why your OS stopped working.

Personally, I'd have them reload premium. It's what you paid them to do. If they gave you grief, I wouldn't hesitate to take them to small claims court over the issue. They're trying to screw you and they know full well what they're doing.

If you want to reload vista yourself, skip putting in the product key and do it after it's up and running. Thats the way you should do the install anyway -- install the OS, install the drivers, update everything.... if it's working, activate it. I actually wait a few days before activating my copies so I don't have to do it again if I need to rebuild...

Good luck, and keep us posted!
 
You paid for a service that wasn't done correctly. Be assertive. Take it back and have it done right.
 
How about you install it yourself without the Razor mouse connected?
Eliminate all non essential hardware when installing and see if that fixes the problem. IF it installed for them at the shop then there is nothing wrong with the internal hardware, it is something you have plugged into the computer.
 
It’s been a few hours and I’ve calmed down. I plan on taking it back into the shop tomorrow without giving them any sort of heads up of me coming (unfortunately I can’t go anymore today, have business I must attend to).

I will tell them that I originally brought my computer in to have Home Premium installed and that’s what the service & labor I paid was for and they did not deliver on their end.

Before I go in there I want to be clear on a couple things. Please correctly me if I am wrong, but it seems that from what you all are saying is my product key that came with my OEM of Home Premium will only work with a Home Premium install and not Basic? …If this is true then it could be viewed as a way for them to screw me over!

Also, one responder suggested I take in my PC and request they look at it right then and there and not even leave the store until the problem is rectified, is that reasonable or should I give the business day and by the end of the day have it fixed?

I appreciate the help and advice guys!


*One additional note, it seems bs to me that they would install Basic to begin with. I don’t understand why you would do that. Customer brings in computer to essentially have Vista installed. Customer provides service provider with Vista Home Premium DVD to install from. Service Provider instead installs Home Basic and returns product back to client without informing client of the switch.

As I stated before when I picked up the PC from the shop they told me they had no problems what so ever installing Vista and never encountered the issues I described when I took it in. …Then why the hell would you install Basic instead of Premium? And, why would you suggest over the phone they if they attempted to upgrade they could run into the problems I initially had? Shouldn’t/wouldn’t they have seen the problem I described when I brought it in for fix the first time around when they were initially inspecting my system and then realized that Premium wouldn’t work so Basic needs to be installed?

This whole thing seems VERY, VERY fishy to me at this point the more I think about it. I’ll be taking along a friend who doesn’t take no for answer and will raise hell if they try and push me over.
 
I would take along a friend who understands the Vista install process, first. The fact you've never seen the options to install any version of Vista worries me a bit, and makes me wonder if part of the problem is that something is lost in the translation.....not that I am defending the shop either. It sounds like they don't know anything about the Vista install process either.

My suggestion would be to go in, ask for your money back, and then spend the time swapping hardware until you find out what the issue is/was.

Or, if you don't want to take the time to do so, have them boot from your disc, choose the option for Home Premium without a key, and finish the install. Assuming that goes well, shut it down, and take the computer home to be finished yourself.
 
There are two types of Vista OEM:

First is System Branded, like a copy you get with a Dell, HP, Gateway etc machine - it'll say the brand name on the disc itself, and it's effectively "tied" to that brand of hardware. Installing the branded copy on the branded hardware will never require you to input the Product Key on the COA sticker, ever. If it does, something is jacked with the machine or the installation media. This is the type you can't just buy for shits and giggles as it's supposed to be distributed with a "new" PC.

Second is System Builder, which is what you can buy, but technically it must be sold with hardware at the time of purchase - not specifically an entire PC complete, but hardware of some kind, be it a mouse, a video card, a floppy drive, doesn't matter.

While you haven't said one or the other so far, I'm going to jump and make the assumption that you have an OEM System Builder copy of Vista Home Premium that you bought someplace, somehow. If that's the case, then it came with a Product Key on a COA sticker that's supposed to be attached to the machine you install it on. That Product Key, when entered, is a Vista Home Premium key which means as soon as you punch it into Vista when asked, the next step jumps to the EULA acceptance screen and skips over the step where you would pick the version of Vista - the key ties the installer to the version the key is for.

So the only possible way those idiots could have installed Vista Home Basic would have been to not input the actual OEM System Builder Vista Home Premium key that came with the media you bought, and then just skipped the key input as I explained above and did it the manual way, choosing Vista Home Basic and leaving you screwed once you got home because it wasn't activated. If it was activated, then they are seriously doing something wrong because now you'd have a Vista Home Basic installation and a key as well as a Vista Home Premium install with your original key.

Doesn't make sense...

So take it back, and take a friend that's knowledgeable about 'puters and Vista (as Deacon noted) if you can find someone that's available. Explain the situation, and after he or she stops laughing at how stupid this all seems, head to the store, drop it, tell them you're going to wait for it to be done (they need to get this done as you already paid for it, this isn't a situation where you drop it off and come back a few days later - you have a priority for this "fix up" job), and then when they do get it done - better be less than 60 mins - verify all of it before you take possession of the machine and media and leave a second time.

Not much else to say. If you paid them to do a clean installation of Vista Home Premium using your own disc, that's what you should get and nothing less will suffice. If necessary, you might consider some small claims court action against them if they don't fulfill their end of the deal.

Gotta wonder why a shop would let a machine go with a bogus installation of an OS that's not even licensed or activated... that right there is a red flag that even blind people might take note of. :D
 
The shop said they would fix it free of charge. Let them do it and move on. If they were able install Basic on it, then they can install Premium on it, it's all the same stuff.

Most likely it was something external connected that caused it to freeze. I have seen this before myself where the system appears to have frozen, but if you waited long enough, it might have actually continued on.
 
Yes, my version of Vista is an OEM System Builder version that I purchased from Newegg when I bought all the parts to my PC. I have a legit COA sticker that is stuck to the back of my case and all. I don't ever go the sketchy route on my end, everything I own is legit.

Unfortunately, I do not have anyone who is knowledgeable about computers that can go with me to the store...Only someone who'll make sure they don't f*** me over.

From everyone's explanations, it seems to me that they may have used my DVD to install Basic from but never attempted to install Premium or even check for the symptoms that I brought my computer in for in the first place. It seems to me they ran some hardware tests to make sure everything worked (according to the invoice) and installed Vista but decided NOT to plug in my activation key from the sticker on the back, which I told them was there when I brought it in, and just installed Basic as I guess it's the first choice to choose from when you are given the option. Then they updated everything and gave it back to me.


I've talked to them twice over the phone about this. The first time was last Friday, the gentlman I spoke to, Pat, said that they would fix it of course free of charge and would make it a priority as a goal to get it done the same day I bring it in, but to call ahead and give him a heads up on the day I bring it in.

The 2nd time I called (today) was to give them that heads up, however, I got this guy named "Doc", Doc came back on the phone and told me that they used my DVD to install from. Then we went had a brief exchange about what I spoke of in my first post. Then Doc said that I could bring it back in for them to try the upgrade path but said it would be a "crapshoot" as they could run into the same issues I had and then would have to revert back to Basic, causing them to put in more labor essentially. He said he'd have to bill more for more labor basically. I called him out on that as that is 'right' and then he said he'd give me credit for the original time(2 hours) put in but would have to charge for any additional time. He even went so far as to give me a sob story as they are trying just like everyone else to keep their heads above water in this current economy.

So...they said they would do it free of charge with a big ol' asterisk( * ) attached basically.

I plan on going in there tomorrow and asking for the Owner of the shop and deal directly with him and if they give me any grief then I will threaten them with Small Claims Court as it is BS in my mind. We'll see what kind of customer service they can provide, I have a small glimmer of hope from the guy I spoke with on Friday. The douchenozzle I dealt with today over the phone will be avoided at all costs.
 
Print out this entire post, point them to the replies that tell how to install your version with your key and go from there.
 
I don't seem to comprehend why they keep feeling this is an "upgrade path" in any respect. It's a clean install of Vista Home Premium with the provided media and Product Key, upgrading the OS has absolutely nothing to do with this at all.

As I think I've made clear, I fully believe this is total BS and the OP chose the correct word in the title: he's being shafted.

Take it back and don't leave till it's done, and done right with Vista Home Premium on it. If they choose not to activate it, so be it - personally I would say don't activate it until it's 100% functional with all the drivers and basic hardware in the machine. Once that's accomplished, then it's acceptable to activate which will tie it to that system for the most part.

Get 'er done... :)
 
To be honest, if I were you I'd never let this team of halfwits anywhere near my PC again - at best they're incompetent, at worst they're downright dishonest. You might for example find at a later date that your HDD had been "upgraded" to a similar-sized model that had been kicked around their repair shop for months and was just about to fail.

They're treating you like an idiot, and you have every right to be furious.

Really, I'd take the PC somewhere else and get it fixed properly if you can't do it yourself, and send this shower the bill. I guess from your use of words you're in the US, so I wouldn't presume to advise you on your rights under US law (I have enough trouble keeping up with UK consumer legislation), but I wouldn't be surprised if they had too many dirty secrets to risk a court case anyway...
 
Met-AL said:
Most likely it was something external connected that caused it to freeze. I have seen this before myself where the system appears to have frozen, but if you waited long enough, it might have actually continued on.
Click to expand...

+1 on this. I'm not going to rehash this thread but how long was it actually "frozen"? I've had two installs for customers that took a "longer than usual" amount of time and they came out of it. First, I believe there are too many monkeys in the cage. It doesn't take the entire store to do this. I'd resort to one point of contact and I'd figure out the exact person that is working on your pc.

I believe you are more than capable of doing this on your own and we are here to help if needed. I would ask for a refund and be done with them. Your profile says you have 4gb of ram. I'd try limiting that to 2gb for the install and see if that helps.
 
I'm getting ready to go over there and deal with these guys. As I've said, I have hope that they'll fix the problem. I'm going to ask to deal with the owner and that's it. I'll also ask "Brian" the tech that worked on my PC why he did what he did.

The PC would hang during the install phase for me for literally hours. I left it over night and it didn't proceed to the next screen.

I don't have any extra ram to try. I originally had 2 gigs installed and ran into this problem at which point I ran memtest and found my 2gigs full of errors. I then purchased this 4 gig set and it works.

I know I'm able to do this on my own but for whatever reason it always got stuck for me and I couldn't do anything and after 2 weeks of trying to get it to work myself I decided to take it in for someone else to work on.....that's how I ended up here.

I really don't want to deal with them anymore but at this point its getting what I paid for. They aren't going to give me a refund so the best I can get is to get them to install the correct OS.

I'll keep you all updated when I have more to report back on.



Thanks guys
 
rusty12 said:
I don't have any extra ram to try. I originally had 2 gigs installed and ran into this problem at which point I ran memtest and found my 2gigs full of errors. I then purchased this 4 gig set and it works.
Click to expand...

Good luck man. I figured a refund would be impossible. What I meant was....you have 4gb's of memory now....I assume it's not one stick, therefore, take out a two gb stick and then try. After the install completes, put the other stick back in.
 
Well I just returned from returning my Desktop back to the shop. As I left, all I could think of was "who the fuck are these guys?!"

I'll try and give you a break down of what happened...

I take the PC in there and the owner was surprisingly no where to be found. I dealt with this "Doc" character again. I told him I want a clean install of Home Premium and he tried to sell me on the upgrade path to Home Premium. He even went ahead and pulled up some website that told me the differences between Basic and Premium and insisted that there were 6 main differences and the upgrade would just "add those additional features on the existing OS".

I insisted on my clean install and he just didn't get it but finally relented and said ok. As I think about it, I think why he was trying to sell me on the upgrade was that in his mind, if we went the clean install route and they ran into trouble with the install of Premium they would be forced to revert to Basic again and that would entail more time as he would then have to run updates again. ....I said no, no, no, first of all when you installed my Vista you should be able to tell me right now whether or not you ran into the problem that I brought my computer in for the first place and you can't. You you didn't do the job I asked which was diagose the problem and install OS which they then pulled the invoice and it is stated that my OS disc I brought in was of Home Premium, but that the description of problem was to install "vista". (period, nothing about which version). I got pretty testy at that point cause it was bullshit.

I then said, you guys should know or not whether you will encounter that problem I brought in for and from the sound of things it sounds like you didn't encounter it. I said "correct me if i'm wrong but the screen during the install process at which point you can choose which version of Vista to install is after the screen that would freeze for me, so it sounds like you wont run into the problem I had and haven't had it happen to you either!" "Doc" responded "Good Point", he then said, get this hold your shit, "I don't know I haven't installed it" ....Which brings me to my second sentence of this post..."Who the fuck are you then?!"

He said they would give me a 2 hour credit and do the clean install. I told them if it at all comes close to the 2 hour timeframe which it shouldn't give me a call immediately. It should only take an hourish. Don't run the updates, I'll run them myself at home. Just install Vista Home Premium from a clean install.

And I left.


Here is my next question. Since they insisted pretty hard on the upgrade path, is there anyway to verify they gave me a clean install instead of an upgrade when I pick it up at 5 pm?

*I wasn't able to leave it there cause I had to get back to my work, otherwise I would have sat and waited.

**sorry for not breaking up the paragraphs better..I'm short on time and wanted to post a status update.

***TypeO...LOL at myself, that was a durrrr moment. Of course I can remove one stick. Silly me. :-p
 
*edit i was wrong*

too me it sounds like they just installed vista without your CD key in which it asked them which version and they picked basic.

there are ways to look at your installed CD key from windows. i really wish someone whould have pointed that out before you took the PC back.. you could see if they had used your key or another key or no key.

but like others have said, if they can install basic they can install prem.

they either

1) are just idiots (my guess).
2) are trying to get a few extra hours of work/money outa ya so they messed up knowing you would be back.
3) tryed to pull a jack move on your legit key.
 
oMek said:
umm, once you get it back you could go into the C: drive and look at the propertys of some files. they should all have todays date if it was a clean install today.. if not they would have the old install date. (nothing should have a older date than today..)
Click to expand...
That isn't the case, unfortunately. Many files are simply copied down from the install media, and retain their original dates.

I don't know of an easy way to tell, aside from staying there with the computer to watch the progress. Honestly, if it was me, I wouldn't have left it there. I would have made the appointment for when I could sit with it, or do everything to get my money back. If you absolutely want to make sure you have a fresh install, why not do it yourself, now that you know the system is capable of taking the install?
 
DeaconFrost said:
That isn't the case, unfortunately. Many files are simply copied down from the install media, and retain their original dates.

I don't know of an easy way to tell, aside from staying there with the computer to watch the progress. Honestly, if it was me, I wouldn't have left it there. I would have made the appointment for when I could sit with it, or do everything to get my money back. If you absolutely want to make sure you have a fresh install, why not do it yourself, now that you know the system is capable of taking the install?
Click to expand...

sorry you are correct
 
I'm running XP, so I don't know much about Vista, but in XP there is a system utility called "systeminfo" that will tell you the OS installation date. It's run from a command prompt. Vista doesn't have something similar?? Or maybe the same command does work in Vista - it's worth a try!!!!! .
 
Here's the final update to this mess.

I picked up the PC and I ran the systeminfo command prompt that was suggested by maven. It looks as if they did a proper clean install of Home Premium which is what I wanted all along.

There is one weird thing I have noticed however. When it boots up into the desktop you can hear crazy activity on the HDD for long periods of time and you can't do much until I "CRTL-ALT-DELETE" into the task manager and then simply close it. Once I do that everything is honkey dorey. Minor annoyance but I really don't care anymore.

While I don't believe they were intentionally trying to screw me over, I do believe they were rather incompetent and careless regarding what the customer wanted and what they did. The shop manager apologized for the misunderstanding as their tech simply installed the first version he saw. (Disregarding on the invoice that the OS disc I brought in was for Home Premium). There were many mistakes on their part, but they finally did what I wanted all along.

Needless to say I'll never be going back there if I can't fix an issue myself. I'll also be recommending to all friends and family to avoid them at all costs.

Thanks for all the advice ladies and gents!
 
After an initial of Vista you will have a fair amount of activity going on with SuperFetch caching and indexing if its turned on, it should get better in a few hours. Sorry for your problems and good luck!
 
You should double check and make sure they installed the proper drivers for your hardware.
 
Create an image of the partition in case you may need to do this again in the future.
 
MrF said:
Create an image of the partition in case you may need to do this again in the future.
Click to expand...

That. After all that hassle, it would be much easier to just restore an image from a DVD through Vista's Restore Utility (Make sure it is the complete PC Backup).

And this sounds like a case of laziness if anything. I do internship work in IT at my school district, and know how lazy techs can get. But usually, they are smart enough to know to read the damn invoice and know that the version is for Home Premium. The least he could do would look at the damn sticker on the OEM machine.

The fact that he told you you need to activate at home tells me that they have an enterprise install disc, and you just type in your key at home when you have the proper version installed. But again, you need the right version for the key to work..

Avoid these people if you can. They are obviously incapable at keeping customers happy and are more worried about getting their job done than the quality of the work. Not good for customer approval..
 
It very well could have been that yor razer usb mouse was causing a conflict. I have a Razer diamondback that used to cause blue screens and lock-up the system if I used the microsoft drivers rather than the razer ones and it was a pain in the ass to fix since windows loved to replace my driver with the microsoft driver.

For me Vista seem to either install perfect or hang on something in the background as it saw fit.

Still those techs sounded about par for the course unfortunately. Glad to hear it was resolved.
 
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