Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim Announced for release on 11/11/11.

The beauty of the game system is that you can play the way you want to play. The trade off is balance. Since it is single player, the choice is completely up to you.

For instance I took the opposite way in my new play through, and tried to avoid some of the overpowered stuff. I have no perks in smithing, enchanting, or alchemy. I've also only been using store bought or found enchanted gear. I will avoid stacking mp cost enchants. I'm sticking with robes/light armor. This is just how I want to play. You do not need to min/max in this game to be viable. It isn't multiplayer either, so what other people choose to do shouldn't affect you.
 
So let me ask this... With being able to reduce a school's magicka cost to 0, you could effectively plan on doing that and skip every single one of the mastery perks which reduce the cost of magicka by half for X level spells?
 
Sorry to add to this, you can't skip every one depending on the build. Novice cost reduction is a prereq for every magic tree. Alternation cost reductions are also prereqs for the other perks in the tree. So if you want to incorporate those, you still need some cost reduction perks.

Equipment MP reduction is calculated after the reduction from skills/perks as another note. You cannot get 0 mp cost with 50% reduction perk + 50% reduction equipment.
 
having a spell cost of 0 does not make the game easy. I still die, just not necessary as much. In previous posts people were ripping destruction as being too weak. Others talked of killing dragons with three hits of a sword. I can't do that. Really there is nothing realistic about the game. Everyone uses exploits, just different ones. Beating horses to unconsciousness, companions as pack mules, pickpocketing clothes off people, climbing rocks or ledges, etc. The difference is if an exploit is a "perk" then it is officially sanctioned. But get real. It is just a game, the main point is to have fun with it along with a reasonable challenge.
 
jiminator said:
having a spell cost of 0 does not make the game easy. I still die, just not necessary as much. In previous posts people were ripping destruction as being too weak. Others talked of killing dragons with three hits of a sword. I can't do that. Really there is nothing realistic about the game. Everyone uses exploits, just different ones. Beating horses to unconsciousness, companions as pack mules, pickpocketing clothes off people, climbing rocks or ledges, etc. The difference is if an exploit is a "perk" then it is officially sanctioned. But get real. It is just a game, the main point is to have fun with it along with a reasonable challenge.
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In my mind, an "exploit" is something you are able to do that is not what the developer intended. By that definition, almost none of what you listed qualifies as an exploit, except maybe the horse thing since it's kind of bizarre. Using the companion as a pack mule is an exploit? They give you the option to look at their inventory, come on now. Pickpocketing clothes...there is a perk which allows you to pickpocket equipped items (i.e. clothes) so even by your definition it is not an exploit. I agree it's probably intended as more of a "steal the enemy's weapon before they can attack you" type thing, but it's not weapon-specific. If they didn't want you to be able to climb rocks, they would put an invisible barrier. Plus, horses are able to climb them normally whereas you are not, which is why you can still get up them if you move carefully (probably realistic as well, like rock climbing except not a cliff face).

I agree the balance for leveling skills like Enchanting and Smithing could have been better, but it's the system the developers chose to use that allows it to happen. The only way to fix it would be something like only allowing you to progress to a new armor set after you had created the previous one, or after X amount of iron daggers crafted (for instance) you start to get less and less experience for doing them. Enchanting I'm not sure, maybe the same thing...enchanting the same thing over and over yields less of a skill increase.
 
The magicka trick is most definitely not an exploit, even less than the "use alchemy potions and smith gear to stack effects over and over" trick.

If you have 100 Enchanting, you can use the 4 mana % enchants to get 0 mana cost. It doesn't require any extra modifiers (no potions).
 
MavericK96 said:
the only way to fix it would be something like only allowing you to progress to a new armor set after you had created the previous one, or after X amount of iron daggers crafted (for instance) you start to get less and less experience for doing them. Enchanting I'm not sure, maybe the same thing...enchanting the same thing over and over yields less of a skill increase.
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I think they should have based it off of the materials it takes to create the item. Better materials = better progress, as does more materials = better progress.

That way, an iron dagger would still level you up, but you'd reach a point where it's not worthwhile, and instead would be seeking after the best materials you can craft with, and use those on whatever you wanted, as creating 5 elven daggers at one ingot a piece would net the same progress as 1 chest guard which took 5 ingots.
 
For anyone who wants a less boring way to level smithing (i.e. daggers), try making jewlery and raid the Kolskeggr gold mine (east of Markarth). Also get the spell that turns iron into silver and gold. You get much more money than daggers give.
 
UtopiA said:
The magicka trick is most definitely not an exploit, even less than the "use alchemy potions and smith gear to stack effects over and over" trick.

If you have 100 Enchanting, you can use the 4 mana % enchants to get 0 mana cost. It doesn't require any extra modifiers (no potions).
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I don't even see THIS as an exploit. Rather, one of the MANY tools that they give you to overcome a challenge you may be facing.

If you can't beat the boss you're fighting, go get a companion, or equip your staff to summon something, or if you fly solo, go beef up your characters gear, enchants, or make some potions so you may return and emerge victorious!
 
I just noticed something about the dark brotherhood that makes me really said.

The first contract you get is to assassinate "Narfi". Narfi is from Ivarstead, you meet him on your way to see the Greybeards for the first time. His sister got killed while picking herbs (you find her corpse) and you have the break the news to Narfi about her death.

Additionally, I think Narfi is mentally handicapped as well. He acts really strange, if you meet him you know what I'm talking about.

NOW I want to know why Bethesda decided to make me KILL him?! I want to know who bought this contract.
 
chockomonkey said:
I don't even see THIS as an exploit. Rather, one of the MANY tools that they give you to overcome a challenge you may be facing.

If you can't beat the boss you're fighting, go get a companion, or equip your staff to summon something, or if you fly solo, go beef up your characters gear, enchants, or make some potions so you may return and emerge victorious!
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Amen.

I mean if I need to get to a spot way up a mountain and feel too lazy to walk all the way along the path to get there, then I don't feel bad toggling clipping so I can just go straight up to my destination and skip the whole exploring thing. My justification: it's not an exploit...it's fucking MAGIC! I'm shooting fireballs and lightning from my hands...what the hell is stopping me from walking on air and through obstacles??!! :cool:

Nah, I get what you're saying though, and totally agree. There's nothing exploitative about utilizing companions or enchantments or stocking up on health potions. All that stuff is there for you to utilize and is in no way "cheating".

I won't lie, though, after beating the main story quest I tend to get impatient when I see an undiscovered location on my compass. If I have already been through the general area and there's an obstacle between that and whatever I'm trying to get to, I sometimes toggle clipping and stroll on through. If it's a totally new area, though, I'll get off my lazy ass and actually explore it. :p
 
Talking about what is and isn't an exploit in an elder scrolls game makes me cringe. It's like talking about what is or isn't an exploit in fishing irl. Some people prefer fishing with a line that will break if you stress it too much, and a barbless hook. Others might get the most out of dragging a giant net through the water and catching every fish in the pond.

That being said, I think smithing and enchanting (even without the enchanting/alch loop) definitely have some of the most potential to make the combat easier.
 
I'll say it again, it is single player game so feel free to play it the way you want. How you enjoy your game is up to you, it doesn't effect anyone else.

The only thing that does not make sense would be complaining about "balance" while trying to min/max in an abusive way or even worse use cheats. If you think for instance stacking 100% mp cost reduction is broken and makes the game not enjoyable, than just don't use it, there is nothing in the game forcing you to.
 
Crash250f said:
Talking about what is and isn't an exploit in an elder scrolls game makes me cringe. It's like talking about what is or isn't an exploit in fishing irl. Some people prefer fishing with a line that will break if you stress it too much, and a barbless hook. Others might get the most out of dragging a giant net through the water and catching every fish in the pond.

That being said, I think smithing and enchanting (even without the enchanting/alch loop) definitely have some of the most potential to make the combat easier.
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An "exploit" is taking advantage of a bug or a glitch, something the developers DID NOT intend for the player to do.
There are a ton of these in Skyrim (and previous Elder Scrolls games), like the infinitely respawning vendor chest, and the book that allows you to get 100 of all skills within a few minutes. These are obviously in the game by accident, they are without a doubt cheats.

There may be an intended limit on enchanting/alchemy/smithing bonuses, and getting weapons that do 999 damage is a bug.
 
Parmenides said:
For anyone who wants a less boring way to level smithing (i.e. daggers), try making jewlery and raid the Kolskeggr gold mine (east of Markarth). Also get the spell that turns iron into silver and gold. You get much more money than daggers give.
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Not if you in turn enchant those daggers using Petty soul gems. Banish and Absorb Health are good money-making enchants. Plus, then you level up Enchanting as well.
 
UtopiA said:
like the infinitely respawning vendor chest, and the book that allows you to get 100 of all skills within a few minutes.
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Just out of curiosity, what are you referring to? I've never heard of these...unless you're talking about some bug with the Oghma Infinium or whatever it is for the latter.
 
Loving this game. level 12 now but i have a stupid bounty on me and the guy im suppose to deliver some false documents tells me that i have to either pay 1k of gold, got to jail or fight him. i chose to fight him but the bastard wont die. He simply cannot die even if all his health is gone. probably because his part of a quest objective :(

I got the bounty when i was in some "inn" getting the original documents fom the Stormcloud people and they guy wanted to fight me so i killed him plus the owner of the "inn" LMAO.

i had a message popped up saying i have a 40 bounty on me but it then later said i have killed all witnesses so i though im good to go :)

i guess not :(

im working for the imperior crew. my plan is to earn their trust and then kill the general/leader and take control of imperior. They are the ones who try to kill u in the beginning of the game. Is that achievable? My mate said he took control of whiterun in a similar fashion.
 
jonneymendoza said:
im working for the imperior crew. my plan is to earn their trust and then kill the general/leader and take control of imperior. They are the ones who try to kill u in the beginning of the game. Is that achievable? My mate said he took control of whiterun in a similar fashion.
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So I guess you decided this game isn't a disaster like Rage after all? ;)


Quest related NPCs can't be killed. Shoot, there's a pretty decent number of NPCs that can't be killed.


It can be an exploit that can work in your favor, though. Like I told people earlier: Go get Barbas, a quest dedicated NPC, and have him roll with you as a companionyou go around doing other things.

It's an exploit and a cheat basically. It's downright laughable to watch this invincible dog destroy everything on your behalf. Roaming the world is a piece of cake without every damned wolf and sabre cat attacking you when you got him cleaning house for you.

That's another perk I miss from Fallout 3: Animal friendly. I really do get sick and tired of every dipshit wolf attacking me and interrupting me when I'm trying to get something done. The saber cats and the bears need to DIAF as well. They've gotten pretty old.




There are a number of NPCs that I notice can't be really killed. I expect at some point there will be either an .ini tweak and/or a mod that changes that.


Your last statement...I'm not sure what you mean...taking over towns?

I'm not affiliated with either the stormcloaks or Imperials.


The most I've ever seen is if I've gone into some fort that bandits reside in, clean it out, and the map says "cleared" on that fort and a few days later if I go back there imperial soliders have taken it over but they aren't really friendly and encourage you to get lost.

Easy example: There's a forth south of Helgen. I forget it's name. I cleared it out and a few days later Imperials moved in.


I don't take well to that sort of gruff rudeness being directed my way nor do I take orders from anyone. ;) So that means that area simply gets cleared out again. :)


I'm not sure if stormcloaks do the same thing if you clean out a fort in their territory come to think of it. I'll have to check.
 
Now that I'm done with the Dark Brotherhood and Thieves guild quests (and have Dragon/Deadric stuff for me and Lydia) I think I'm ready to finally go after the main plot over the next couple days.

Is there any downside to that? I remember Oblivion and Fallout pretty much going nuts with hard enemies once you got too far into the plot. Other than dragons, is there anything like that?
 
jonneymendoza said:
Loving this game. level 12 now but i have a stupid bounty on me and the guy im suppose to deliver some false documents tells me that i have to either pay 1k of gold, got to jail or fight him. i chose to fight him but the bastard wont die. He simply cannot die even if all his health is gone. probably because his part of a quest objective :(
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Find another guard in a different part of town and pay off your bounty.

im working for the imperior crew. my plan is to earn their trust and then kill the general/leader and take control of imperior. They are the ones who try to kill u in the beginning of the game. Is that achievable? My mate said he took control of whiterun in a similar fashion.
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The Empire, you mean? I don't think you can become Emperor. There's a lot more to it than just killing the guy who currently holds the position.
 
Q-BZ said:
That's another perk I miss from Fallout 3: Animal friendly. I really do get sick and tired of every dipshit wolf attacking me and interrupting me when I'm trying to get something done. The saber cats and the bears need to DIAF as well. They've gotten pretty old.

The most I've ever seen is if I've gone into some fort that bandits reside in, clean it out, and the map says "cleared" on that fort and a few days later if I go back there imperial soliders have taken it over but they aren't really friendly and encourage you to get lost.

Easy example: There's a forth south of Helgen. I forget it's name. I cleared it out and a few days later Imperials moved in.


I don't take well to that sort of gruff rudeness being directed my way nor do I take orders from anyone. ;) So that means that area simply gets cleared out again. :)


I'm not sure if stormcloaks do the same thing if you clean out a fort in their territory come to think of it. I'll have to check.
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I've rarely seen much of the stormcloacks and legion. Only one skirmish between the two. Definitely not taking over a fort. That's odd. I must be visiting the wrong places.

As far as animal friendly... there calm illusions spells.... and there is a dragon shout specifically towards getting animals to be friendly (and deer to not run away)
 
Q-BZ said:
That's another perk I miss from Fallout 3: Animal friendly. I really do get sick and tired of every dipshit wolf attacking me and interrupting me when I'm trying to get something done. The saber cats and the bears need to DIAF as well. They've gotten pretty old.
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there's a Shout which gets animals to not attack...Spell Tome as well
 
Any of you higher level sneaky backstabby type guys find anything you can't 1-hit (well, one power attack...so like 4 hits) kill with a sneak attack?

Two beyond legendary daggers + Assassin's Blade perk + power attack perks from 1-handed tree + Ancient Shrouded Gloves + Orc's Berserker Rage power = KERSPLAT!
 
Update 1.3 Notes (all platforms unless specified)

General stability improvements
Optimize performance for Core 2 Duo CPUs (PC)
Fixed Radiant Story incorrectly filling certain roles
Fixed magic resistances not calculating properly
Fixed issue with placing books on bookshelves inside player purchased homes
Fixed dragon animation issues with saving and loading
Fixed Y-look input to scale correctly with framerate
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And LAA support for PC version next week.
 
Seems like a pretty good patch. Hopefully (unlike 1.2) it won't break gamepad support.
 
"Fixed Y-look input to scale correctly with framerate"

I'm really curious to see what this does!!

and a question: I'm a sneaky backstab type... Sneak so far has been awesome to use, but ever so often something just stumps me. I'm wondering if anyone knows what's going on here.

There's this one Forsworn guy which i can't sneak up on. He doesn't spot me, but when i get near him, he stands up and turns around. I'm making no noise... do some NPC's have a sense ability? or did they make some NPCs immune to sneak in this way?

There's just no answer i can think of for why sneak works well against everything but this one guy.
 
I'm honestly completely surprised and blow away that they are going to do official support for LAA.
 
Domingo said:
Now that I'm done with the Dark Brotherhood and Thieves guild quests (and have Dragon/Deadric stuff for me and Lydia) I think I'm ready to finally go after the main plot over the next couple days.

Is there any downside to that? I remember Oblivion and Fallout pretty much going nuts with hard enemies once you got too far into the plot. Other than dragons, is there anything like that?
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No. In fact, depending on what level you are, it's probably going to be too easy.
 
chockomonkey said:
"Fixed Y-look input to scale correctly with framerate"

I'm really curious to see what this does!!
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Nice! Guessing that's going to get rid of the horrible Y-look choppiness I get when there's a lot of particle effects on the screen.
 
Also, regarding the patch..."Core 2 Duo improvements"? Lol what? I thought this game only used 2 cores, anyway. What it needs is a quad-core improvement.
 
Q-BZ said:
Cool. I need to look into those more. Those are only temporary effects, though, right? 60 seconds and the like?
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Yeah. I think the spell is called Calm. There are also Fear-related spells/enchants that cause creatures of a certain level or lower to flee. But none of them are actually permanent AFAIK.
 
Parja said:
Nice! Guessing that's going to get rid of the horrible Y-look choppiness I get when there's a lot of particle effects on the screen.
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That's what the Bethesda boards seem to imply back when the game came out. The effects bogdowns were somehow related to Y-look.
 
Parja said:
Any of you higher level sneaky backstabby type guys find anything you can't 1-hit (well, one power attack...so like 4 hits) kill with a sneak attack?

Two beyond legendary daggers + Assassin's Blade perk + power attack perks from 1-handed tree + Ancient Shrouded Gloves + Orc's Berserker Rage power = KERSPLAT!
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Some dragons, bosses, certain NPC's. I'm using Mace of Molag Bal since I didn't try smithing this time.
 
MavericK96 said:
No. In fact, depending on what level you are, it's probably going to be too easy.
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I'd have to agree. I just got into the second act of the main quest and it can be very easy at times at lvl 37. Plus some of the perks you get along the way with the main quest would have been nice.

Next play through I think I will knock out the main quest first and then work on the factions.
 
Yeah, they (people on the wiki) recommend you start the main quest before level 35 if you want it to be halfways challenging.

And yeah, doing the main quest sooner is great because you get a ton of good Dragon Shouts from it. Most of the ones I found randomly questing were not all that interesting.
 
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