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DLSS 5.0

MikeTrike said:
Or they had time to pivot from the backlash, reforming their strategy.
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https://investor.nvidia.com/news/press-release-details/2026/NVIDIA-DLSS-5-Delivers-AI-Powered-Breakthrough-in-Visual-Fidelity-for-Games/default.aspx#:~:text=DLSS 5 then uses its deep understanding,applied to maintain each game's unique aesthetic.
DLSS 5 provides game developers with detailed controls for intensity, color grading and masking, so artists can determine where and how enhancements are applied to maintain each game’s unique aesthetic.

that was on the first march release, nothing I saw in siggraph seem new versus what the API was rumoured to be announcement week, it was not fully public but it leaked a bit from the people that had access

https://www.tomsguide.com/computing...pc-gaming-breakthrough-or-nvidias-ai-slop-era (closed to public backroom q&a and extra demo)
, but this is all completely in the hands of devs to use however they wish.
There’s changes being made to the cinematic lighting and material depth too, which all contribute to another breakthrough, but one that developers are going to have to figure out the right way to use. Nvidia confirms this is an early build of DLSS 5, and probably with sliders turned all the way to max. So between now and the fall, devs will tune it however they wish.
 
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That was fast.

when-you-criticizes-nvidia-v0-4vca2udlvrag1.jpeg
 
MikeTrike said:
That was fast.

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No point in commenting anything negative about nvidia on here, we're talking about 10+ year loyalists who've had maybe one or two criticisms over that period. I just stick to other topics or ignore them.

The implementation they're showing here is interesting, but it's also more dev overhead and not creating a simpler solution. It also won't work on AMD which means it wont work on consoles, so there's that. RT was a time savings or at least that's the claim. This seems like it's another tool you have to layer on top of an existing techniques. It's something you need to manually adjust and tweak on a asset basis. It's interesting, but it seems like belongs in the RTX Remix Suite and doesn't have anything to do with DLSS.
 
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kram182 said:
AMD will have their own version - and I'm sure you'll all love it then - as we saw with upscaling, framegen, etc etc

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I wont, don't care for it at all. Why I play at 1440P, no need to upscale or use frame gen. Don't particularly care for either ones implementation of it and I would rather turn off ray tracing than use it, if the performance hit is too high. Very few games make excellent use of Ray Tracing for it to be worth the performance sacrifice.
 
Gideon said:
I wont, don't care for it at all. Why I play at 1440P, no need to upscale or use frame gen. Don't particularly care for either ones implementation of it and I would rather turn off ray tracing than use it, if the performance hit is too high. Very few games make excellent use of Ray Tracing for it to be worth the performance sacrifice.
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Still won't stop the tech from coming into existence from either side nor stop it from being implemented in games for those who do want it - for all the people like yourself who said they'll never use ray tracing/framegen/upscaling etc those still persist while still becoming ever more prevalent to even required in games. No reason to think this will be or go any different. Just turn the toggle off to all those who don't like it - while you still can at least.

Destiny.gif
 
kram182 said:
AMD will have their own version - and I'm sure you'll all love it then - as we saw with upscaling, framegen, etc etc

View attachment 816247
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I have no problem with new tech, it's just not upscaling tech like DLSS. The initial showcase I hated. What i just watched was much more interesting and useful. FSR and DLSS i like, i even liked FSR 3.1 quality at 4k on my couch. It was okay enough in Ghost of Tsushima when i was sitting back a few feet. DLSS is better. I'm kind of a double hater at this point though, because i know they don't want us as customers anymore. AMD makes it more obvious we're an irritation to their AI focus though.
 
are closed said:
To me, DLSS is simply a tool. If it lets me have playable framerate at desired settings, it gets enabled.
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That's the correct way to look at all of the DLSS tech. Each part of it (I really wish they didn't call everything DLSS) does something and if you find it useful in a given game, use it. DLSS super resolution, the AA/upscaling I use in basically every game. It is free frames at quality more or less. DLSS frame generation, that depends. I've had both good and bad experiences with it. In Cyberpunk 2077, it is great. In Satisfactory, it is not. Also some games just flat out run fast enough to not need it, I'd rather run at 150fps native than 220fps frame gen'd.

This new tech? Well we'll just have to see. I'm very interested, what they've showed off look like some real nice improvements to me. More than the characters I'm impressed by the lighting and shadows in the world. To me it is making things look more real, more grounded. But it'll depend on how it looks in operation. I'm sure there will be per-game variance. As I said: The easy thing for a developer to do to "support" it would be pick a model, crank it the fuck up, and just apply it to everything. Low effort, but also might not look great. Other games will probably spend the time to use it carefully and artfully and those I expect will look great.

MikeTrike said:
That was fast.
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This is, by far, the silliest take. A straw man/genetic fallacy and the idea that if someone criticizes what a big company does, you aren't allowed to disagree with that criticism because it is a multi-trillion dollar company therefore you are some kind of chud for "defending" them.
 
MikeTrike said:

View: https://youtu.be/drQVF9eNVx8
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I rather developers, artist work on the game vice moving sliders for trivial differences which has a cost. A cherry-picked demonstration, no rapid movement, no performance cost info. Pointless. As for FG and Nvidia, use it when it does not degrade image quality significantly and increases smoothness enough to give a better overall gaming experience. For Doom TDA, for me it is pure crap, motion with severe fringing on objects, textures, add in Path tracing and I get inconsistent frame times making timing for fast actions out of sync. Not a better gaming experience. Gaming experience should be the overall goal not a number of FPS. Anyways in the video I see zero gaming experience improvement.
 
Sycraft said:
This is, by far, the silliest take. A straw man/genetic fallacy and the idea that if someone criticizes what a big company does, you aren't allowed to disagree with that criticism because it is a multi-trillion dollar company therefore you are some kind of chud for "defending" them.
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You are allowed. But I'm still amused because it's powerfully magnetic for white knighting.
 
I'm reserving judgement on DLSS 5 until I see some Indy games using it. What I'd really like to see from this tech is small studios being able to get a lot closer to AAA games on graphics. AAA game development has gotten hugely expensive to the point that companies that make them are playing it safe. I'd love it if a low budget indy game could look almost as good.
 
zandor said:
I'm reserving judgement on DLSS 5 until I see some Indy games using it. What I'd really like to see from this tech is small studios being able to get a lot closer to AAA games on graphics. AAA game development has gotten hugely expensive to the point that companies that make them are playing it safe. I'd love it if a low budget indy game could look almost as good.
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It'll be even nicer if it can be done with reasonable performance on a $500-$600 GPU as opposed to the original demonstration with $8,000 worth of GPUs. I think that 10x~ is the key on this one to make it useful to any reasonable degree.

I still hate that it's proprietary.
 
Sycraft said:
And either way, it is more logical fallacies (ad hominem this case) when you run around saying people are "white knighting" because we say "Many this looks cool and I think it could be good."
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I'm gonna stop before I get in trouble for leading the blind off a cliff.
 
MikeTrike said:
I'm gonna stop before I get in trouble for leading the blind off a cliff.
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By all means, if you think you are so clever "lead" on. To me it seems like you just like to obliquely insult people.

learners permit said:
I often think how boring life would be if we all had the same way of seeing things
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I don't mind disagreements, heck that's part of the reason for a forum like this is to discuss different views. If you look at the Steam Machine thread you can see that I feel it isn't a good system, ands tate why. However I also don't shit on the people buying it, I'm not going to tell someone not to buy a toy if they want it.

I just get annoyed when people go to personal attacks because they don't like your opinion, but lack a good counter argument.

zandor said:
I'm reserving judgement on DLSS 5 until I see some Indy games using it. What I'd really like to see from this tech is small studios being able to get a lot closer to AAA games on graphics. AAA game development has gotten hugely expensive to the point that companies that make them are playing it safe. I'd love it if a low budget indy game could look almost as good.
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Unfortunately, I don't know how much this, or any, technology will help with that. I mean one thing that better tech does, particularly things that deal with improving realistic lights and shadows is that an artist doesn't have to work as hard on a scene, things will look "right" if they are placed in the scene. That can help a lot but you still need artists to make things look good. The issue a lot of indies have is just not having the budget to hire enough artists.

So while this, like path tracing, looks to help make things look more realistic with less artist effort, it isn't magic. A beautiful scene is still going to require good assets and a lot of time to assemble them, and that is what it expensive.
 
The ignore list is still functional if I recall correctly. I use it occasionally as it allows me to state things the way I see them openly and pay attention to only reasonable comments. Just saying I do not frequent this forum to be annoyed by combative adolescence.
 
My problem is that developers would be overly reliant on the tech and become even more lazy like with DLSS and frame Gen. Why put extra work in making the game engine more efficient when people can just use Nvidia tech to make up the short comings in performance. Games will just look even more the same then they already do using UE 5.
 
vegeta535 said:
My problem is that developers would be overly reliant on the tech and become even more lazy like with DLSS and frame Gen. Why put extra work in making the game engine more efficient when people can just use Nvidia tech to make up the short comings in performance. Games will just look even more the same then they already do using UE 5.
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I mean, I'd day that is not a good way of looking at things for two reasons:

  1. You say they'll be "more lazy" as though you get better art through just wanting it bad enough. Good art takes time and effort, and thus money. Games are already getting stupidly expensive. We should want things that make them cheaper. It isn't like if programmers just "coded harder" or artists just "art'd harder" we'd have games that looked photo real and did so without requiring new technology.
  2. Many of the things they are doing, like simulating subsurface scattering and such, are just expensive to do computationally. To do it "correctly" is slow and there's just no way around that. This *IS* an optimization. One of the ways we optimize rendering is figuring out how we can take shortcuts that give us something that looks good without doing the full calculations to do it right.
I mean, if you know of a way that can make games look realistic and perform well and not require new hardware and techniques then by all means, please reveal it. However I think it is pretty unfair to call game developers lazy when it is one of the areas of tech where people work the hardest and have the biggest crunch times.
 
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