Developer: Consoles 'Couldn't Possibly Handle' Star Citizen

[Deleted member 83233]

I can't recall what version it was (I think WC 2), but I had the opposite experience where the game played way too fast, like the world was in fast forward, lol!

Did you run Moslo to slow it down?

 

[Talyrius]

I didn't hear about the game until February of this year. I would have backed it earlier otherwise.

I enjoy watching the weekly content they release on their YouTube channel to keep us updated on its progress.

 

[Xrave]

Spent the better part of last night looking at the pledge options.

Is there anything that is actually worth to pledge/gain access to? Nothing really seemed worth it. Even if I did $5 for the dog fighting thing, you would still need to pledge more money to actually get a ship to fly. Cheapest one I saw was $40.

So unless I'm missing something, that's $45 spent on a game that isn't even a game yet...plus dropping another ~$60 when it's officially released?

 

[Talyrius]

...So unless I'm missing something, that's $45 spent on a game that isn't even a game yet...plus dropping another ~$60 when it's officially released?

No, the game packages include access to the final game. You can buy additional ships separately.

 

[Xrave]

What's the minimum game package that includes final release of the game? The $5 dog fighting module?

 

[Talyrius]

What's the minimum game package that includes final release of the game? The $5 dog fighting module?

The Aurora MR ($30). However, it doesn't include access to the alpha and beta. The Aurora MR + includes beta access for an additional $10. Unless you're willing to wait for the dogfighting module (Arena Commander) to enter beta, you'll have to pay $5 for alpha access.

 

[Xrave]

Thanks.

I don't suppose you have alpha access? (is it worth it, especially if you only have the starter ship)

 

[Talyrius]

I'm patient, so I'll be waiting for it to enter beta. If you want to see it being played, you can watch a Twitch stream.

 

[chockomonkey]

So with any given kickstarter campaign, the funds are gifted right?

Which means that when the game launches, 100% of sales are pure profit?

 

[Ducman69]

Which means that when the game launches, 100% of sales are pure profit?

Yup, except they aren't likely to even spend close to what they have already raised right now, and are continuing to get more donations.

In other words, the dude's grandkids will be set for life.

 

[kbrickley]

So with any given kickstarter campaign, the funds are gifted right?

Which means that when the game launches, 100% of sales are pure profit?

Kickstarter takes a 5% cut of the amount for the project and Amazon charges around a 3-5% processing fee for the credit cards ... depends on the game and the size of the team ... if they are a full size developer then they likely have ongoing expenses for the game (bug fixing, patching, enhancements, etc) as well as potential SG&A expenses (office rent, utilities, etc) ... if it is a really big title they might have supplemented the money from other sources that they are repaying (loans, official investors, etc) ... but if they received a lot of funding and they were responsible on how they spent it then they should see a larger profit potential on the post launch sales

Note that one of the biggest advantages for a developer using KS over a publisher is the IP ownership ... the publisher almost always takes ownership of the IP for titles they agree to fund and publish ... with KS the developer can retain their full ownership of the IP they are developing

 

[kbrickley]

Yup, except they aren't likely to even spend close to what they have already raised right now, and are continuing to get more donations.

In other words, the dude's grandkids will be set for life.

Hard to tell ... Didn't GTA V cost over 100 million to develop ... high profile graphically intense titles can also cost as much as a movie to develop or more (40-50 million) ... it isn't beyond the realm of possibility that he and his team can't spend that much money (and still be using it responsibly)

 

[LeninGHOLA]

Hard to tell ... Didn't GTA V cost over 100 million to develop ... high profile graphically intense titles can also cost as much as a movie to develop or more (40-50 million) ... it isn't beyond the realm of possibility that he and his team can't spend that much money (and still be using it responsibly)

Over 250 million.

 

[DPI]

Yup, except they aren't likely to even spend close to what they have already raised right now, and are continuing to get more donations.

In other words, the dude's grandkids will be set for life.

LOL so you've seen the finances for this game, have ya? Do you have any idea how many employees, subcontractors and teams around the globe they have working on the game? Didn't think so.

 

[Phoenix333]

Good grief, so much misunderstanding about this.

Anyone ever play Wing Commander? It's the same guy making this. It's what he wanted to do before EA pulled the plug on Origin Systems. It's pretty much going to be the modern equivalent of what Privateer Online was supposed to be: Open universe, trading, exploration, combat, build your own space empire or just spend time gunning down pirates and aliens if that's what you like - or being the pirates and aliens. This is the spiritual successor to the Wing Commander franchise. He just can't use the name since EA still owns the trademarks.

There's also a single player campaign they're working on at Foundry 42 called Squadron 42 that's going to play a lot more like Wing Commander.

The ships have wings because you'll be taking off and landing on planets, so atmosphere + ship = wings make sense. Not all the ships have wings, either. The Banu Scout has no wings and relies purely on thrusters.

Chris Roberts stated out the gate that this is a game for PC's, and that he's doing this to show a few things:

1) The PC is not dead as a platform.
2) The PC is THE gaming platform. Period.
3) Publishers can collectively go spork themselves. They're obsolete. Direct-to-user is the future.
4) The Space Sim is a genre that still has life, despite what the publishers think.

So to the naysayers, you can scoff if you want, but I've already flown my Hornet fighter and walked around inside my Freelancer MIS. The spaceflight uses real physics and is entirely thruster-based, though they've stated they'll bend realism to a certain point if the gameplay suffers, but they want to keep the space flight simulation as accurate to real life physical laws as possible.

Now some of you think this is a big scam. You do NOT know Chris Roberts, and you underestimate the Wing Commander fandom. I'll be happily blasting Vanduul into space debris while you're waiting for Call of Doody: Homeland Security Edition or whatever the next crap rehash title will be called. Chris will deliver for us. You just wait and see.

P.S: The promo video of the Bengal carrier (USS Paul Steed - that name ring a bell?) and the fight between the Vanduul fighters and the Hornet escorts was showcasing what was possible right then and there without any additional development, in real time, rendered live on an actual PC with existing off-the-shelf hardware. Having flown around in the asteroids already and walked around in my hangar, it's wasn't BS.

 

[RealityCrunch]

LOL so you've seen the finances for this game, have ya? Do you have any idea how many employees, subcontractors and teams around the globe they have working on the game? Didn't think so.

Not to mention the costs of running an MMO-style universe (which are so high most studios who try to make an MMO lose money just trying to keep the game running)

 

[Ducman69]

Do you have any idea how many employees, subcontractors and teams around the globe they have working on the game? Didn't think so.

13, the rest vary and primarily just sit in a drum circle experimenting how different doritos flavors go with various dips. Cool ranch and avocado is a surprise favorite.

 

[CreepyUncleGoogle]

One of those decisions to make things look/feel cool.

Evochron Mercenaries does a fantastic job at being a real space sim... and boy is it a learning curve to fly in real space!

Evochron really doesn't model physics very well, though it at least gets some of the no friction and turning doesn't mean you start moving another direction unless you use your engines stuff. It's still kinda like not that accurately simulating space. But you hafta give up realism for fun too and it is a fun sandboxy kinda game.

I'd suggest Orbiter for a closer attempt at realistic space physics:

http://orbit.medphys.ucl.ac.uk/

 

[XvMMvX]

This game makes me laugh. It looks amazing but "leet PC gamers" are falling for every thing they "hate" about console gaming/big publishers.

Paid add-ons, DLC, pre-ordering, etc and lapping it up like good little lemmings all because he says that it will crush consoles and tax their systems. You are buying ships at $40 a pop and then will bitch because a major publisher asks $15 for some maps.

Right up until release point when they start to try and polish and optimize for a true market and realize that they fucked themselves. No worry though they will do what every other business does and try and hit as many markets as they can. This games hype has reached epic proportions and it may crash hard. Then the delay comes to revisit the "can't run on consoles or whatever" and all of the sudden it starts to move down to lowest common denominator.

People are funding a plush lifestyle for these devs with no deadline. Hook, line, and sinker.

 

[RanceJustice]

This is yet another reason why I am a huge fan of Star Citizen.

I generally object to "console" gaming on ethical and technical bases. At one time consoles were necessary as they were the only affordable way to get a gaming experience to the public; commodity gen-use hardware was tons more expensive (ie thousands of dollars for a PC minimum, to $300 or so for a Nintendo/Famicom - and those are both in 1980s dollars!) Consoles today are nothing but (often overpriced for the power), limited PCs that are locked down with proprietary practices at every level, both in technical and business strategy. There are near to zero player-focused and developer-focused reasons for modern consoles to exist - they and their manufacturers are instead unctuous middlemen that siphon money from players and developers alike. We all know of at least one game that was hobbled considerably due to it also being released on consoles. I like to offer "Defiance" as a great, recent example. There were posts on Trion Worlds forums saying "We're sorry, we have the PC patch ready to go to fix these issues, but the X360/PS3 version will take another few weeks of our time, plus vetting on behalf of XLive itself, and Microsoft/Sony insists that we can't release anything before their platforms in the required agreement to release on their consoles so...sorry." There were also other issues where the chat system and lots of other features were cut considerably because it wouldn't have been "console friendly". Finally, it cost the studio a fortune because to roll out a patch or some content on XLive literally costs them tens of thousand of dollars in fees, just from Microsoft!

Overall the gaming world would be much better if there were no "consoles" any longer. Imagine being able to purchase Super Smash Bros 4 via Steam (or elsewhere) for the PC and play with any controllers of your choosing, including Nintendo's first party controllers which would be sold as peripherals with an open driver kit for PC usage. Now imagine if Nintendo and Valve partnered to offer a code for SSB4 with purchase of a Steam Machine "console" - a SFF "living room" PC prefabbed by any of a hundred conventional or boutique builders, that may come preconfigured with SteamOS and BigPicture mode, yet doesn't limit the user at all in what they wish to do; add XBMC or MythTV and make it into a unified media box, or just connect a keyboard and do word processing by downloading LibreOffice (WINE into MSOffice, or hell even install Windows if you want!). We don't need people sitting in the middle of our gaming experience giving more limitations, selling us an often overpriced box that we don't really control and jacking up the cost of doing business and setting limitations for developers too.

I'm so very pleased that Star Citizen is being built exclusively with the PC in mind. Star Citizen is a blue-sky project; they are making something that is orders of magnitude beyond anything else that has been done before. They're not poisoned by the limitations of the industry and just picking another "safe" designed-by-committee mediocrity title meant to keep the quarterly projections high. Chris Roberts (and a few others of those like him - consider Richard Garriott's "Shroud of the Avatar" for instance) want to make games that break the mold, dream titles that come from an uncompromising vision and drive to make something that they've always wanted to design and play. This is why they went to crowdfunding - so they wouldn't have to answer to public investors, publishers, or any third parties that would have creative control. I can only imagine what others would be saying now "You don't have to animate people getting in and out of vehicles like that - it takes too much time and money!! Just have the player press E and zap to the cockpit like in Cawadoody 3: The Shootening or Battlefiend! You don't need a system where people have to manually load cargo physically represented in game, fit it and secure it properly! Just have a counter that each ship holds X cargo units and a menu that displays what you have!" I can't even comprehend the amount of restriction that would be necessary to get Star Citizen onto XBOne/PS4 and I'm glad I don't have to do so - I want them to make a no-compromises vision-driven title, not more mediocrity. Thus, they went to the community and said "We don't want to be beholden to all these interests, so we're crowdfunding to prove it to ourselves that they're wrong - there IS a market for the game want to make." And they were right - many times over!

Some seem to be worried about a few things and while I understand the skepticism because of how the industry has broken so many promises in the past, but as one who's paid enough attention to Star Citizen and Cloud Imperium Games, I don't think that much of what's being cited here is worth worrying over.

For instance, I've seen a lot of comments about delivering the product ranging from "Its vaporware, they'll never bring it out" to "why are there delays" or some form of "They have all this money and the game isn't done yet". It is important to remember that Star Citizen isn't meant to have a "full" release for another year or two. We're talking 2016! They're building something entirely new and different on a massive scale, and it is going to take time.Expecting the game to be almost finished or whatnot isn't reasonable and they never said it was going to be for quite some time, not to mention the time needed to "do it right, do it the best". CIG has been incredibly willing to be transparent and interact with the players - just looking at Chris Roberts own posts, even when there's an issue of concern, is a welcome rarity these days. Furthermore they've been delivering consistent interim content as they promised. We had the Hangar Module for instance and now Arena Commander (for dogfighting) and both are not just frequently updated, but were built with expanding the game experience in mind. Add this to the Jump Point magazines for subscribers detailing expanding game systems and it is a monumental amount of information, transparently given to the players.

The issue of delays is perhaps the most important here. Yes, there have been some delays but moreso than many other elements how they handle them and their overall paradigm is why I feel confident dropping way more money than most into Star Citizen. Along with the transparency and honest communication listed above, CIG has proved they are willing to do something even more rare in the industry - take the time they need to do it right. Where 99% of the industry would rather push something out the door for one reason or another, often to the detriment of the project, CIG has the vision, desire, and money to do it right. Case in point the Arena Commander Dogfight module. They said "We could have rigged up some standard cryengine multiplayer backend, but it wasn't worth us to make something we'd only throw away. Thus, we need some time to build the new, from scratch backend server implementation starting feature, that we can then build and expand as the game grows." This is absolutely the right way to go about it, but its staggering how rare the kind of testicular fortitude a developer needs to do such a thing. Furthermore, they've been willing to go back and realize that say... earlier parts of the game aren't living up to their expectations, such as with the ship interiors. Earlier designed interior are notable smaller (especially in multi-person ships) compared to later ships, so instead of doing like most of the industry and saying "screw it, its done. Move forward", they're going back to update the designs to bring them in line with the remainder of the game. This is incredibly admirable yet again, rare.

When people question the money the game has raised, it is important to know that besides the baselines of how much it takes to run a AAA game development process, especially without 3rd party funding, the money that has been raised and more importantly the WAY it was raised, means they can do all the things that I described above that are so rare. Having that money means a huge buffer - they can afford to take the time they need, expand (like building their own mo-cap studio, or buying out the VoiceAttack software so they can incorporate it into the game natively) to make a better game, and much more. The press has gotten too much of a boner for the amount of cash itself and are irritatingly starting to poke at things like stretch goals "Hurr durr how can a space plant cost a million dollars", which is besides the bloody point. That they continue crowdfunding is a boon to the playerbase in many ways. As said multiple times by Chris Roberts in his Letters to the Chairmen and 10 For the Chairman Q&A sessions, all the money they raise goes into expanding and improving the game. The fact that multi-player and capital ships will have meaningful "task consoles", Star Trek style, or the ability to set/contain fires and blow out the airlock, is because they didn't stop funding early on! Lots of what we saw in 2013 was a dream even for CIG, when the game had not yet reached 5 million in funding. Now, coming up on 50, we're getting a MUCH expanded game than we ever would have had if they just stopped at 5. Look at all the Stretch Goals on the website (especially the early ones, sub 25 million) and then realize tons of additional depth has been added to that that isn't listed there. Don't forget that there is also a personal benefit to you, the potential player. By backing now, you get the game significantly cheaper than at launch, with additional benefits along the way (ie many stretch goals awarded free items to players who had backed prior to the attainment of such goal, as a bonus), so if you're at all interested, I say it is worthwhile to get in now - for $40 minimum you're set to start, and can always upgrade from there! Crowdfunding is great for everyone involved and if there is any crowdfunded game project that seems poised to meet or exceed expectations when all is said and done, it is Star Citizen.

Everything that I've seen so far showcases that CIG is making something ground-breaking in Star Citizen and I can only hope their transparency, perfectionism, attention to detail, and vision will continue until it is ready to be released. I'd much rather wait longer and have a better end product than have them rush something out and compromise.

Finally, with regards to hardware and consoles - it is important to note that "Wingman"'s comments don't necessarily mean that you can't play Star Citizen just because your PC is as, or less powerful than a PS4/XBone today. First of all, it is important to realize that the game is , as previously mentioned, not going to be final for a long time, around 2016! Its likely you'll want to upgrade something (perhaps GPU) by that time, not matter what kind of system you own. If you've already backed andh ave access to Arena Commander / Hangar, you can see a completely unoptimized demo experience along the way. They've said multiple times that during the Pre-Alpha through Beta phases, all the modules will be less optimized of course than the final game, so if you can play these modules, you'll be able to play the final especially after optimization.

If you haven't so far, check out the thread on the PC games section - there are a handful of members like RangerXML, Lorien, Shifty68, Wildace and others who are up on, and discuss the game frequently along with posting news and updates. I'm also more than happy to answer any questions about the game you wish, via PM.

Hope this is helpful to someone at least

 

[DPI]

^ first thought at Wall'OText = insane person, but gave benefit of doubt and glad I did. Excellent post.

 

[Wildace]

This game makes me laugh. It looks amazing but "leet PC gamers" are falling for every thing they "hate" about console gaming/big publishers.

Paid add-ons, DLC, pre-ordering, etc and lapping it up like good little lemmings all because he says that it will crush consoles and tax their systems. You are buying ships at $40 a pop and then will bitch because a major publisher asks $15 for some maps.

Right up until release point when they start to try and polish and optimize for a true market and realize that they fucked themselves. No worry though they will do what every other business does and try and hit as many markets as they can. This games hype has reached epic proportions and it may crash hard. Then the delay comes to revisit the "can't run on consoles or whatever" and all of the sudden it starts to move down to lowest common denominator.

People are funding a plush lifestyle for these devs with no deadline. Hook, line, and sinker.

you can not really compare DLC to what star citizen is doing atm. because you are not paying for the ships you are paying for the game to get completed and more features added post release.

unlike the majority of dlc that is already completed or almost completed and then they tack on 5-15$ after the fact to unlock it in the game.

there is no reason to pledge to get a specific ship beyond the aurora pledge package because all those ships can be purchased ingame for ingame credits. really not even in the same ballpark as DLC.

The "DLC" area for Star Citizen is the Voyager direct store and then again all those items can be purchased in game for credits. they have yet to release any digital content that can not be purchased in game with credits. i am sure there will be some custom vanity stuff at some point that is $ only to purchase but there is none yet and nothing game balance changing.

i personally do not have a problem pre ordering something tho. i like knowing i have it purchased so i can play it when it is released. do not care if i get anything special for pre ordering or not.

$40 gets you a pre order for Star Citizen/Sq42 at a discount so that is incentive to pre order instead of paying 60 on release day.

if you spend more than 40$ it should only be for people that have disposable income because after that you are just helping the project more but no one forces you to spend more than $40 to get into the V1.0 release of the game.

 

[Xrave]

$40 gets you a pre order for Star Citizen/Sq42 at a discount so that is incentive to pre order instead of paying 60 on release day.

Although I'm confident that Star Citizen will eventually become a game, in this case one specific thing to note is that preorders are refundable until the product ships. In this case you don't get back your $40 if there is no game as you are only crowd funding.

if you spend more than 40$ it should only be for people that have disposable income because after that you are just helping the project more but no one forces you to spend more than $40 to get into the V1.0 release of the game.

As someone else noted, one thing that can cause heartache about this strategy is that the $60 a game costs typically covers the development cost + profit. In the case of Star Citizen, all of their development costs are covered by the crowd funding process (in theory). So hopefully the game would be less than the standard $60 for a new game...

However since people are effectively preordering this game for $30, you would have to hope that the actual game value is at least $30...because if the game is cheaper due to no additional development costs, the initial investment/preorder people probably wouldn't be too happy if they paid more than others at the final release...

 

[FiveFig]

They have raised 50 million dollars (!), and that thread is now 450 pages deep, yet still no game.

It almost sounds like a giant marketing ploy to sell trinkets. Citizen cards, dog tags etc. Is there an actual release date for this thing?

Sounds like old school Blizzard games... endless delays, constant waiting...

But when the game came out, OMFG winning!

So, yea I don't mind delays as long as there is constant updates on progress.

Sometimes only programmers seem to understand the frustration and time wasted/lost/used to learn just how something works 99% only to have to re-code everything to get that last 1%.

I can only hope that the money is going to the right people for the right things, and to know that, only time will tell.

 

[FiveFig]

Although I'm confident that Star Citizen will eventually become a game, in this case one specific thing to note is that preorders are refundable until the product ships. In this case you don't get back your $40 if there is no game as you are only crowd funding.



As someone else noted, one thing that can cause heartache about this strategy is that the $60 a game costs typically covers the development cost + profit. In the case of Star Citizen, all of their development costs are covered by the crowd funding process (in theory). So hopefully the game would be less than the standard $60 for a new game...

However since people are effectively preordering this game for $30, you would have to hope that the actual game value is at least $30...because if the game is cheaper due to no additional development costs, the initial investment/preorder people probably wouldn't be too happy if they paid more than others at the final release...

If the release cost of the game ends up being $20 (yea right, but we can wish)
Then they have to justify the extra $10 to the pre-orders with in-game trinkets and whatnot, even though getting to play the game early (I say this because 90% of preorders don't actually help with testing and finding bugs, they just want to play a fully functional game before everyone else) is IMO more than enough reward for paying a few bucks to help fund a game.

 

[rflcptr]

However since people are effectively preordering this game for $30, you would have to hope that the actual game value is at least $30...because if the game is cheaper due to no additional development costs, the initial investment/preorder people probably wouldn't be too happy if they paid more than others at the final release...

those that pledge are guaranteed instant access to in-game ships/hangars/etc that the non-backers will have to spend hours/days/weeks acquiring. that's not including the *physical* items backers will receive, depending on the pledge tier. "pre-order" is not the correct terminology.

 

[SGA76]

Right now the developers can't handle it either.... ZING!!!
Seriously though, looks incredible, let me know when its ready for release.

 

[Frankie]

it has the most realistic physics of any space game.

Kerbal Space Program is a space game, so no, it doesn't.

 

[nilepez]

I can't recall what version it was (I think WC 2), but I had the opposite experience where the game played way too fast, like the world was in fast forward, lol!

I can say though that Wing Commander Privateer was one of my most favorite games of all time for quite a while... except that alien spaceship thing at the end was so overpowered the game was basically unplayable with it. Then again, I was super gay for the show Quantum Leap back then too, which in my mind was awesome until I rewatched some episodes and had to question why Scott Bakula had such a drag fetish, and the 5 meter jumping board that used to scare the crap out of me at the pool didn't seem very high at all.

That was only true after it'd been out for a while and processors got faster. At that point, you had to get WC Slow. I just remember someone complaining and I also remember my machine seriously lagging when there were tons of ships on the screen. People say they want 30FPS, but I can remember sub 20 (and LIKING IT ).

 

[nilepez]

Yup, except they aren't likely to even spend close to what they have already raised right now, and are continuing to get more donations.

In other words, the dude's grandkids will be set for life.

I think Chris Roberts was in pretty good shape before this. I have no knowledge of what a game costs to develop, but I seem to recall WC IV running into the millions (which was unheard of at that time), so who knows what they'll spend.

 

[RanceJustice]

For what it is worth, checking out some of the costs shown here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_expensive_video_games_to_develop - I think it ssafe to say that 50 million isn't that much for a AAA game, much less such an expansive one. They're actually running on a relative shoestring budget and doing more with less, without having to pay publishers, investors, consoles, tons of marketing etc....

But Chris Roberts himself is definitely well off. He's produced quite a few movies in the past, pehaps most notably Lord Of War, besides all his game industry work. He's picked up quite a few contacts from all aspects of the game and movie industry over the years, which has made things easier for Star Citizen (ie there will be big name stars and fan faves in the Squadron 42 single player campaign, in live action ).

 

[Ducman69]

But Chris Roberts himself is definitely well off. He's produced quite a few movies in the past, pehaps most notably Lord Of War, besides all his game industry work.

$25 million net worth already... after this, who knows. Regarding movies, he produced one of the worth of all time though, Wing Commander the movie!!! He was the director and the writer, so there's no excuse... and god was the writing awful, lmao!

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/wing_commander/

 

[Ducman69]

*derp, WORST not worth.

 

[Phoenix333]

Paid add-ons, DLC, pre-ordering, etc and lapping it up like good little lemmings all because he says that it will crush consoles and tax their systems. You are buying ships at $40 a pop and then will bitch because a major publisher asks $15 for some maps.

Ugh, you're completely off the mark. It has been stated numerous times from the beginning:

EVERYTHING AVAILABLE TO EARLY BACKERS WILL BE AVAILABLE TO ALL PLAYERS IN THE GAME.

Let me repeat that, in case you didn't get it the first time:

EVERYTHING AVAILABLE TO EARLY BACKERS WILL BE AVAILABLE TO ALL PLAYERS IN THE GAME.

Right up until release point when they start to try and polish and optimize for a true market and realize that they fucked themselves.

The people backing the game ARE the market. Clearly you have no clue as to how crowd funding works. If there was no market for the game they would not have almost $50 million from us joystick jockeys now would they?

No worry though they will do what every other business does and try and hit as many markets as they can. This games hype has reached epic proportions and it may crash hard.

Really? That's funny, because the whole reason Chris Roberts went to crowd fund this game is precisely to AVOID that problem. They don't have to answer to a publisher, or worry about profitability and pushing the game out to be released against whoever's AAA title of the year because the development costs are already covered. The initial crowd funding goal to make the game a reality was only $2 million. Everything past that is extra gravy.

Then the delay comes to revisit the "can't run on consoles or whatever" and all of the sudden it starts to move down to lowest common denominator.

That's never going to happen because there's no publisher or shareholders pointing a gun to their heads and screaming "CONSOLES == PROFITS!!!!" Chris started this specifically with the goal of PC-only, and by having it crowd funded by PC gamers he ensured that nobody except the intended market and the devs themselves would have any say over that. Go tell him your "lowest common denominator" line and he'll laugh at you.

People are funding a plush lifestyle for these devs with no deadline. Hook, line, and sinker.

So you'd rather have a deadline and get a buggy, unfinished game rushed out the door only half-tested because some publisher says so rather than allowing the devs to take their time and do it right, and then you'll complain about said game suffering from consolitis, having bad textures, crappy AI, broken game play, and being overly linear and scripted to death - because that's what everyone else is doing right now. Along comes someone that decides to do something different, just like everyone's asking, and immediately you call bullshit and say it's a scam, without knowing a damned thing about what's going on under the hood. I already have a playable alpha, along with some PHYSICAL swag, and - get this - the devs regularly engage in Q&A with the backers. I've had questions personally answered by the programmer in charge of that particular part of the programming I asked about, and answered in less than 24 hours. But... it's all BS.

You're also going off and assuming that Chris is just going to take the money and run. That's where your problem is, and why you don't get it - you don't know the people putting this together, nor do you know the people backing it. Some people do actually believe in things, and actually hold true to their word. I know that's shocking in this day and age, but it's true and I can give you one very good example: Myself. I've been working on a project for over 10 years that I said at the beginning I would complete unless Jesus returns or the earth explodes. Jesus isn't here, and the earth is not space dust, and 10 years in and I'm on that path to completion - and I've not asked for nor received a penny for my efforts. I could stop any time I want, but that's just it. I WANT to do this, just like Chris WANTS to make Star Citizen a reality. Passion and commitment are real things. Perhaps your own life experiences have jaded you to this concept, but it's still alive and well in some of us.

 

[Deleted member 83233]

Just pledged finally. I've been holding off, telling myself I don't have enough time to play something like this, etc... However, I found that I couldn't keep away from the threads for this game, and just got more and more interested.

Now I just need to get through my work day, and start mucking about with the bits that I have access to.

 

[XvMMvX]

Ugh, you're completely off the mark. It has been stated numerous times from the beginning:

EVERYTHING AVAILABLE TO EARLY BACKERS WILL BE AVAILABLE TO ALL PLAYERS IN THE GAME.

Let me repeat that, in case you didn't get it the first time:

EVERYTHING AVAILABLE TO EARLY BACKERS WILL BE AVAILABLE TO ALL PLAYERS IN THE GAME.



The people backing the game ARE the market. Clearly you have no clue as to how crowd funding works. If there was no market for the game they would not have almost $50 million from us joystick jockeys now would they?



Really? That's funny, because the whole reason Chris Roberts went to crowd fund this game is precisely to AVOID that problem. They don't have to answer to a publisher, or worry about profitability and pushing the game out to be released against whoever's AAA title of the year because the development costs are already covered. The initial crowd funding goal to make the game a reality was only $2 million. Everything past that is extra gravy.



That's never going to happen because there's no publisher or shareholders pointing a gun to their heads and screaming "CONSOLES == PROFITS!!!!" Chris started this specifically with the goal of PC-only, and by having it crowd funded by PC gamers he ensured that nobody except the intended market and the devs themselves would have any say over that. Go tell him your "lowest common denominator" line and he'll laugh at you.



So you'd rather have a deadline and get a buggy, unfinished game rushed out the door only half-tested because some publisher says so rather than allowing the devs to take their time and do it right, and then you'll complain about said game suffering from consolitis, having bad textures, crappy AI, broken game play, and being overly linear and scripted to death - because that's what everyone else is doing right now. Along comes someone that decides to do something different, just like everyone's asking, and immediately you call bullshit and say it's a scam, without knowing a damned thing about what's going on under the hood. I already have a playable alpha, along with some PHYSICAL swag, and - get this - the devs regularly engage in Q&A with the backers. I've had questions personally answered by the programmer in charge of that particular part of the programming I asked about, and answered in less than 24 hours. But... it's all BS.

You're also going off and assuming that Chris is just going to take the money and run. That's where your problem is, and why you don't get it - you don't know the people putting this together, nor do you know the people backing it. Some people do actually believe in things, and actually hold true to their word. I know that's shocking in this day and age, but it's true and I can give you one very good example: Myself. I've been working on a project for over 10 years that I said at the beginning I would complete unless Jesus returns or the earth explodes. Jesus isn't here, and the earth is not space dust, and 10 years in and I'm on that path to completion - and I've not asked for nor received a penny for my efforts. I could stop any time I want, but that's just it. I WANT to do this, just like Chris WANTS to make Star Citizen a reality. Passion and commitment are real things. Perhaps your own life experiences have jaded you to this concept, but it's still alive and well in some of us.

DUKE NUKEM FOREVER PART DEUX!!!!!!!

 

[Deleted member 83233]

DUKE NUKEM FOREVER PART DEUX!!!!!!!

So far I see no infighting, mismanagement, complete rebuilds ad-infinitum, publisher issues, engine changes, etc. All I see is a team doing something right. Which is why I bought in today. Duke Nukem was absolutely plagued with the worst types of problems a game can have in development. The fact that it eventually came out, (though limited in some ways,) was an effing miracle.

 

[Phoenix333]

DUKE NUKEM FOREVER PART DEUX!!!!!!!

SHOUT SLOGANS BECAUSE I CAN'T THINK OF ANYTHING TO COUNTER A WELL-THOUGHT OUT REBUTTAL!

Why do you want this to fail so badly anyway?

 

[kbrickley]

DUKE NUKEM FOREVER PART DEUX!!!!!!!

I don't think that is a risk here ... DNF was in development hell for a decade (switching studios, caught up in legal rangling, etc) and it was in a genre that had kind of moved on to new things (a problem that plagued the later Doom programs as well)

Chris Roberts is one of a handfull of programmers/developers who are known by name ... I would definitely put him up there with Carmack, Sid Meier, Wil Wright, Richard Garriott, Brian Reynolds, and others as deserving of Hall of Fame status

Although he has a tough hill to climb he is not a johnny come lately programmer/developer ... he has earned his reputation and I don't think you have to worry about a Battlecruiser 3000 or DNF here

 

[sleepeeg3]

Let's not turn this thread into more Kickstarter "scam" bullshit discussion.

Save it for the real Star Citizen kickstarter scam thread.

Kickstarter should require the devs to set deadlines and automatically refund a portion or all of your money if they fail to meet those deadlines.