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CachyOS VS Nobara

C

ChadD

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Feb 8, 2016
Messages
8,403
I said if I found a bit of time this weekend I'd install nobara and do a little direct comparison to Cachy. As I expected the two are pretty close. KDE on both under wayland. Both installed on XFS. Don't laugh at the choice of games they were installed on one of my XFS NVMEs already and they both have built in benchmarks. Same game files on the same drive... only change is distro and version of proton in use. Hardware AMD 3600x AMD 5700xt resolution 2560x1080. I ran the benchmark once and tossed the results for each setting just in case it did any shader building.

As far as performance goes raw FPS is essentially =. Slight win for Cachy in Guardians. Personally I prefer cachy... fedora feels odd, but that is just a personal preferense. Nobara has a nicer looking base KDE theme.

Nobara
Boarderlands 3 Proton-GE-Experimental
Ultra Setting 2024-10-19-12-06-02 Average FPS 65.40 Average Frametime 15.29
High settting 2024-10-19-12-09-19 Average FOS 78.22 Average Frametime 12.78

Marvel Guardians
Ultra Setting - FSR ultra quality FPS Avg 106 Min 70 Max 137

Cachy
Boarderlands 3 Proton-CachyOS
Ultra settings 2024-10-19-14-22-15 Average FPS 65.19 Average Frametime 15.34
High settings 2024-10-19-14-29-07 Average FPS 79.07 Average Frametime 12.65

Marvel Guardians
Ultra Setting - FSR ultra quality FPS Avg 111 Min 71 Max 145
 
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Nothing much changed in terms of these two games anyway. I realize now the Marvel Guardians benchmark records how much GPU ram it used... I should have recorded that last time. The newest Proton is supposed to improve DXVK memory fragmentation and reduce overall GPU ram used. The stuff they pulled through from 6.12 kernel may effect other games more, or Zen4/5 CPUs. I'm running V3 optimizations and not V4. Overall I would say in these two games anyway its margin or error, though is ever so slightly to the better. I should go through my library and try and find a game with iffy performance to test instead of these two.

Linux 6.11.7-2-cachyos
Boarderlands 3
Ultra Settings 2024-11-12-15-14-29 Average FPS 66.29 Average Frametime 15.12
High Settings 2024-11-12-15-09-25 Average FPS 80.07 Average Frametime 12.49

Marvel Guardians
Ultra Setting - FSR ultra quality FPS Avg 112 Min 72 Max 145
 
I installed CachyOS back in late October and did seem to notice some improvements with an MMO which runs only on a single core and needs all the help it can get. At first I had no issues but wasn't really gaming much. I started doing a little more gaming a bit later and ran into an odd issue which I haven't been able to figure out. While actively playing a game everything runs fine for about 40-50 minutes but then turns into a stuttering mess. CPU and GPU usage and speeds stay at normal levels but the framerate is extremely inconsistent. Normally it's locked at 75 to match my monitor but when this point hits it will be all over the place between 20 and 75.

Nothing has changed with the hardware and it does it in at least two games. If I have the game running in the background without doing much in the way of inputs it can go much longer before it hits the point of stuttering mess. If I exit the game and restart, everything is fine again until it hits the 40-50 minute mark. I reinstalled CachyOS last night in case I had messed something up but the issue is the exact same. At the moment I've only tested a couple of games running through Steam as I don't have any non-Steam games installed.

I've done some searching but haven't run into anyone else with a similar issue. Before the reinstall I tried multiple different kernels such as a release candidate for the next version, an LTS kernel, the standard Arch kernel and at least one other with no change. I've tried different versions of proton from the Steam auto selected to Proton Experimental to the CachyOS build proton with no change.

Nothing else has any issues. Distributed computing projects on CPU and GPU work just fine. I've done quite a few video encodes on the CPU without a hitch. The only thing to have a problem is gaming.

I might try a couple more things later tonight but if I can't the issue fixed I'll end up going back to Manjaro for now.
 
Reinstalled Manjaro and only installed barebones stuff to get Steam running. The problem isn't CachyOS specific as it's happening with Manjaro as well. My guess is there was some update around the end of October or the beginning of November which caused the issue. It could be a driver, Steam or DE issue. I did find one report of a couple people having the exact same issue with Ubuntu/Mint (although for them it took 10 minutes for it to start) but no solutions. At least one of the people did a reinstall but without updates and they didn't have the issue.
 
I've not had any issues that you're describing with EndeavourOS running KDE Plasma 6.2.3 with the linux-xanmod-git 6.12.1 kernel & various other helpful packages for gaming.
 
It looks like the issue was specifically with Steam. After more investigation I found even more people having the same problem. It turns out this was an issue at a previous time which I managed to avoid (this is the first real problem I've ever had with Steam/Proton.) There's an issue with Steam and keyboard/mouse input if you have the Steam Overlay disabled as I normally do. Turning on the Steam Overlay seems to have fixed the issue. Did at least an hour of gaming last night with plenty of keyboard/mouse inputs without the stuttering issue and a couple more hours tonight with no problem.

I'm glad the issue seems to be fixed but the amount of time and effort spent troubleshooting it was annoying.
 
SmokeRngs said:
It looks like the issue was specifically with Steam. After more investigation I found even more people having the same problem. It turns out this was an issue at a previous time which I managed to avoid (this is the first real problem I've ever had with Steam/Proton.) There's an issue with Steam and keyboard/mouse input if you have the Steam Overlay disabled as I normally do. Turning on the Steam Overlay seems to have fixed the issue. Did at least an hour of gaming last night with plenty of keyboard/mouse inputs without the stuttering issue and a couple more hours tonight with no problem.

I'm glad the issue seems to be fixed but the amount of time and effort spent troubleshooting it was annoying.
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I just read your first one and was trying to think what would cause that. Glad you figured it out. Strange issue. I haven't noticed any slow downs at all.

I play a few old MMOs as well. I play Star Trek online often which is a terrible game honestly but ya. It runs much better on Cachy then it does on windows. That game is always annoying with map loads. Some of that is their servers. I used to believe it was 100% their end, I realize now using cachy with XFS that no its not all their servers. That game is way more responsive and loads assets much faster under cachy. To be fair maybe I'm comparing to my last windows install which probably had some age on it. NTFS is pretty terrible after you have installed and uninstalled things on it for a few years. Not going to bother doing a windows install to try and test load times either. lol
 
ChadD said:
I just read your first one and was trying to think what would cause that. Glad you figured it out. Strange issue. I haven't noticed any slow downs at all.

I play a few old MMOs as well. I play Star Trek online often which is a terrible game honestly but ya. It runs much better on Cachy then it does on windows. That game is always annoying with map loads. Some of that is their servers. I used to believe it was 100% their end, I realize now using cachy with XFS that no its not all their servers. That game is way more responsive and loads assets much faster under cachy. To be fair maybe I'm comparing to my last windows install which probably had some age on it. NTFS is pretty terrible after you have installed and uninstalled things on it for a few years. Not going to bother doing a windows install to try and test load times either. lol
Click to expand...
The old MMO I play is Lotro and no matter what it runs like absolute ass on Windows compared to Linux. I have an old/fresh install of Windows I keep around for very rare dual boot needs. It's at least three years old but never used. I can fire up Lotro on Windows and literally everything is slower and a lot of it has to do with disk access. Logging into a high level character with a lot of quests and deeds done can literally take minutes and will sometimes crash or time out the game under Windows. Under Linux logging the exact same character takes maybe ten seconds. Linux also maintains more stable framerates with fewer dips and bad lows. It's like playing a completely different game.

CachyOS seems to do a small but noticeable job of handling the CPU bound side better than even Manjaro (which is what I was running for a few years.) Considering how good the experience already was with Manjaro I consider it amazing.

The Steam issue was odd. This problem has come up before but I never had the issue when it had previously cropped up. Either way, it has been mitigated for now and if anyone here runs into it and read this they'll hopefully have the solution.
 
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On the topic of Steam Linux, I keep getting this annoying error but haven't found a fix. It essentially makes the Download section disappear on the bottom unless refreshed or Steam is restarted.
1733068082608.png


I don't have the same issue on my laptop, so I'm guessing its a bug somewhere in my local config or cache.
 
I'm running Cachyos as well and when playing The First Descendant on a particular map grinding something for a while i run into a vram memory leak. It's a proton/wayland/nvidia thing probably. Gpu usage halves, performance drops, random stutters and freezes and then kwin crashes and closes everything. Then dmesg shows a bunch of nvidia errors related to memory allocation.
I think the latest drivers have made it worse actually. But it has happened before.
Needs some more testing but if there are issues don't forget to check dmesg for clues.
 
Subsequence said:
I'm running Cachyos as well and when playing The First Descendant on a particular map grinding something for a while i run into a vram memory leak. It's a proton/wayland/nvidia thing probably. Gpu usage halves, performance drops, random stutters and freezes and then kwin crashes and closes everything. Then dmesg shows a bunch of nvidia errors related to memory allocation.
I think the latest drivers have made it worse actually. But it has happened before.
Needs some more testing but if there are issues don't forget to check dmesg for clues.
Click to expand...
I have heard the open source nvidia driver is making good progress. Seems like it might still trick people into thinking its stable. ;)
Report it if you can I guess. Hopefully the next update sorts that. I'm not running NV right now, from what I have seen though they seem to plug things like mem leaks pretty quick.
 
If you mean the open modules version well that one was giving me even more problems but it has been a couple releases. Maybe i should give that one another shot… Switching it is easy enough :)
As to the memory leak well it might be a case of nvidia playing the blame game with proton and wayland. I’d go Amd if i could but i kinda like dlss and i really need hdmi 2.1.
 
Subsequence said:
If you mean the open modules version well that one was giving me even more problems but it has been a couple releases. Maybe i should give that one another shot… Switching it is easy enough :)
As to the memory leak well it might be a case of nvidia playing the blame game with proton and wayland. I’d go Amd if i could but i kinda like dlss and i really need hdmi 2.1.
Click to expand...
Nvidia Linux support is improving. The open source driver is still pretty new. Nvidia has only really been directly supporting it for a year or so. The plan is to switch to it completely at some point. They do still have the propritary driver you can switch to. It means you have to bolt it to your kernel every kernel update with DKMS. Its not the end of the world... I think the proprietary is more stable for now. Long term the oss version will be the go to.
 
Yup, agreed. I did read somewhere that they are focusing more of their QA efforts on the open version. Hence i might give it a try again, updating drivers has never really been a problem, nor has switching. Having seen Arch breakage in the early days i was a bit hesitant to go back to it but now running with grub-btrfs snapshots there are very little concerns. Not pulling in too much bs from the AUR helps as well lol.
 
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I totally switched over to AMD due to all of the hell I had with NVIDIA. I empathize with the headaches.
 
Subsequence said:
Yup, agreed. I did read somewhere that they are focusing more of their QA efforts on the open version. Hence i might give it a try again, updating drivers has never really been a problem, nor has switching. Having seen Arch breakage in the early days i was a bit hesitant to go back to it but now running with grub-btrfs snapshots there are very little concerns. Not pulling in too much bs from the AUR helps as well lol.
Click to expand...
I use a ton of goodies from AUR & sometimes I do hit snags but not everything works like trash from it thankfully.
 
CrimsonKnight13 said:
I use a ton of goodies from AUR & sometimes I do hit snags but not everything works like trash from it thankfully.
Click to expand...
How can I see a list of available programs within an AUR? Without knowing what there is and what I'm missing, how could I know what to download?
 
auntjemima said:
How can I see a list of available programs within an AUR? Without knowing what there is and what I'm missing, how could I know what to download?
Click to expand...
https://aur.archlinux.org/
You can search all AUR packages here.
If your an power Linux user... don't need to be a kernel programmer you can package software the the AUR yourself if someone hasn't already.
 
Mazzspeed said:
I've been running Nvidia for a good 8 years now with little in the way of issues. Even Wayland works great now.
Click to expand...
I probably had an edge case scenario. I was forced to use the Radeon APU to boot up into Plasma 6 & then utilize the 3090 as a dedicated GPU.

Now that I have a Radeon 7900 XT, no video rendering issues at all.
 
CrimsonKnight13 said:
I probably had an edge case scenario. I was forced to use the Radeon APU to boot up into Plasma 6 & then utilize the 3090 as a dedicated GPU.

Now that I have a Radeon 7900 XT, no video rendering issues at all.
Click to expand...

Any particular reason why you couldn't just boot using the Nvidia GPU?
 
Mazzspeed said:
Any particular reason why you couldn't just boot using the Nvidia GPU?
Click to expand...
For a while it worked fine but eventually it just stopped booting properly with the 3090, even with a new install of EndeavourOS at the time. Might've been the NVIDIA drivers, which I tried many different versions for the closed & open types.
 
CrimsonKnight13 said:
For a while it worked fine but eventually it just stopped booting properly with the 3090, even with a new install of EndeavourOS at the time. Might've been the NVIDIA drivers, which I tried many different versions for the closed & open types.
Click to expand...

Odd, I've never experienced this issue. Did you have secure boot disabled? Aren't Nvidia drivers provided with OS updates now under most Arch based distro's?
 
Mazzspeed said:
Odd, I've never experienced this issue. Did you have secure boot disabled? Aren't Nvidia drivers provided with OS updates now under most Arch based distro's?
Click to expand...
I always keep it disabled for my home systems. Yes, I tried them all with no good result. I migrated to AMD since I wanted a simpler updating path.
 
CrimsonKnight13 said:
I always keep it disabled for my home systems. Yes, I tried them all with no good result. I migrated to AMD since I wanted a simpler updating path.
Click to expand...

How did you try them all when there's no particular recommended way to downgrade Nvidia drivers under Arch using pacman? If you're downgrading/installing drivers outside of OS updates, this could be the cause of your problem.

Many people install Nvidia drivers using the .run script provided with the package direct from Nvidia's site. This is a big no, no and will result in problems.
 
Mazzspeed said:
How did you try them all when there's no particular recommended way to downgrade Nvidia drivers under Arch using pacman? If you're downgrading/installing drivers outside of OS updates, this could be the cause of your problem.

Many people install Nvidia drivers using the .run script provided with the package direct from Nvidia's site. This is a big no, no and will result in problems.
Click to expand...
I did it all through pacman or AUR. I'm very well aware of the pros, cons & warnings since I thoroughly read the Arch Wiki.
 
CrimsonKnight13 said:
;) I did it all through pacman or AUR. I'm very well aware of the pros, cons & warnings since I thoroughly read the Arch Wiki.
Click to expand...

Updating Nvidia drivers outside of Arch OS system wide updates is not recommended for good reason...Just sayin'. ;)
 
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Mazzspeed said:
Updating Nvidia drivers outside of Arch OS system wide updates is not recommended for good reason...Just sayin'. ;)
Click to expand...
Technically, it depends on your choice since there's many available. I didn't use the standard nvidia-inst script.

I used all of the newest nvidia-dkms, nvidia-beta-dkms, nvidia-open-dkms, & nvidia-open-beta-dkms.

Sure does feel patronizing with your replies though. I've done my due diligence & moved on to AMD. Thanks.
 
CrimsonKnight13 said:
Technically, it depends on your choice since there's many available. I didn't use the standard nvidia-inst script.

I used all of the newest nvidia-dkms, nvidia-beta-dkms, nvidia-open-dkms, & nvidia-open-beta-dkms.

Sure does feel patronizing with your replies though. I've done my due diligence & moved on to AMD. Thanks.
Click to expand...
I'm not trying to be patronizing at all, and I apologize if you feel I am. Nvidia drivers are now compiled by Arch devs and bundled with system wide OS updates. This resolves many of the issues people experienced in the past regarding Nvidia driver installation, and generally results in a fairly trouble free experience, to quote the Arch wiki:

Warning: Avoid installing the NVIDIA driver through the package provided from the NVIDIA website. Installation through pacman allows upgrading the driver together with the rest of the system.
Click to expand...
However, AMD is a better choice when it comes to rolling release distro's running the latest bleeding edge kernels. I'm glad you found a solution that works best considering your use case.
 
Nvidia is currently not much more of a PITA vs AMD... just slightly more a of PITA.

It is also 100% true that 6 months ago clearly Nvidia was a PITA. Having to bolt a closed source driver into your kernel was and always will be crap. Thankfully Nvidia seems to be behaving better recently, yes. Hopefully it stays that way. I am pretty sure by this time next year we won't be talking about DKMS and bolting Nvidia closed drivers... or even comparing benchmarks between the open and closed drivers. Nvidia has clearly stated at this point they recommend their open source drivers and that they plan to stop updating the closed source driver sometime soon. (don't think they have set a end date quite yet)
 
ChadD said:
Nvidia is currently not much more of a PITA vs AMD... just slightly more a of PITA.

It is also 100% true that 6 months ago clearly Nvidia was a PITA. Having to bolt a closed source driver into your kernel was and always will be crap. Thankfully Nvidia seems to be behaving better recently, yes. Hopefully it stays that way. I am pretty sure by this time next year we won't be talking about DKMS and bolting Nvidia closed drivers... or even comparing benchmarks between the open and closed drivers. Nvidia has clearly stated at this point they recommend their open source drivers and that they plan to stop updating the closed source driver sometime soon. (don't think they have set a end date quite yet)
Click to expand...
There is no downside to this. I don't think Nvidia was ever against it, in the sense that they wanted to be malicious, but more so they didn't see the work being worthwhile. With a million great distros out there I feel they finally saw the light.
 
auntjemima said:
There is no downside to this. I don't think Nvidia was ever against it, in the sense that they wanted to be malicious, but more so they didn't see the work being worthwhile. With a million great distros out there I feel they finally saw the light.
Click to expand...
I think its more they have more AI customers demanding it. For GPUs in servers running LTS type kernels having a bolt on GPU drivers wasn't a big deal. But more and more AI players are using super custom kernels and incorporating the latest greatest Kernel drops... they have been as annoyed by having to DKMS Nvidia software as gamers have been. :)
 
ChadD said:
Nvidia is currently not much more of a PITA vs AMD... just slightly more a of PITA.

It is also 100% true that 6 months ago clearly Nvidia was a PITA. Having to bolt a closed source driver into your kernel was and always will be crap. Thankfully Nvidia seems to be behaving better recently, yes. Hopefully it stays that way. I am pretty sure by this time next year we won't be talking about DKMS and bolting Nvidia closed drivers... or even comparing benchmarks between the open and closed drivers. Nvidia has clearly stated at this point they recommend their open source drivers and that they plan to stop updating the closed source driver sometime soon. (don't think they have set a end date quite yet)
Click to expand...
I never had a problem with dkms, but I never used Nvidia with Arch. My Nvidia experience has been mostly faultless for about the last 5 years.
 
Mazzspeed said:
I never had a problem with dkms, but I never used Nvidia with Arch. My Nvidia experience has been mostly faultless for about the last 5 years.
Click to expand...
Nvidia works fine with arch. Bolting out of mainline drivers onto you kernel is a PITA no matter what distor your using. The level of BS you'll put up with is just higher then most peoples. ;)
 
ChadD said:
Nvidia works fine with arch. Bolting out of mainline drivers onto you kernel is a PITA no matter what distor your using. The level of BS you'll put up with is just higher then most peoples. ;)
Click to expand...
I think I had a rampant NVIDIA gremlin in my install. :troll:
 
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