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Apple WWDC 2012 Coverage

wonderfield said:
How much for a comparable laptop without a similar display, though?
Click to expand...

Yea I kinda wanted to throw this in there at the end. Go ahead and find one without that display, with comparable specs, in that tiny form factor, for that price. I'm not going to hold my breath... Because I haven't even seen a 15" that thin, never mind one with comparable specs.
 
and yes, the 256 you just posted is $300 plus tax when it's not on sale but you already knew that because you pay attention to detail, right?
 
mope54 said:
check prices on the 512gb ssd
Click to expand...

The one for $2200 has a 256gb SSD.........So $400 instead of $215...for...$600 more?

So a 512gb SSD that costs ~$200 more and the processor would have to cost $400 more to make up for the cost?
 
I find it hard to imagine that Apple would be paying $400-650 for 256GB of NAND and a controller.
 
wonderfield said:
I find it hard to imagine that Apple would be paying $400-650 for 256GB of NAND and a controller.
Click to expand...

My thoughts too....They will probably make quite a big profit on these since they are the first of its kind. I bet if they had gotten out a quad core iPhone (5?) before all the others came out they would have been able to slap on a huge premium and it would have been fine since it was the first of its kind.
 
Im sure Apple has a 40% profit margin on the machine, as they have repeatedly thats what they shoot for in products.
 
EPOQ said:
I'm not going to tell you that it wouldn't look awesome when doing those things. I'm telling you it would look and perform better on any other mid to high end machine on the market. It has the display going for it. A display that is not made directly by Apple, just one that they were the first to integrate into their mobile fleet. In this regard, yes, they are pushing the industry forward. This will undoubtedly push other manufacturers to offer the same resolution displays in the near future. Apple did it first, now we just wait for any other computer manufacturer to come along and do it better, and cheaper.
Click to expand...

How is the screen not being made by Apple relevant? The point is that Apple is leading the way period. You didn't see Dell, Clevo, or anyone else do this and likey wouldn't have for a long time. They need Microsoft and a smorgasboard of other hundreds of companies to make the transition.

Apple can do it very quickly across their entire platform.
 
Cali3350 said:
Im sure Apple has a 40% profit margin on the machine, as they have repeatedly thats what they shoot for in products.
Click to expand...

I thought they didn't make very big profits on iPhones? Maybe I am mixing that up with consoles from Sony/Microsoft.

That said, wow for how cheap are these built then, would come around $1300 or so for the lower end model...Damn.
 
mope54 said:
and yes, the 256 you just posted is $300 plus tax when it's not on sale but you already knew that because you pay attention to detail, right?
Click to expand...

Because they pay the same for all the parts that we do right? No. They buy bulk which usually makes it cheaper for them.
 
wonderfield said:
I find it hard to imagine that Apple would be paying $400-650 for 256GB of NAND and a controller.
Click to expand...
well you don't get to evaluate end-sale prices relative to their cost ROFL what the heck kind of standard is that?

do people walk around saying oh man that dell keyboard only costs $7 bucks where is all the cost coming from? no, you say 8gb of ram is $40 bucks so I'm not going to pay dell $100 dollars to install it.

similarly, it's not how much apple pays for a 512gb ssd. it's about how much *you* have to pay to put one in before deciding that the 600 dollar up charge is a rip-off or not.

the 2200 mbp comes with a 2.3 and a 256ssd

the 2800 mbp comes with a 2.7 and a 512ssd

the ssd alone would cost anywhere from 400-650 dollars depending on how good a deal you can find so there's not a huge markup going from the 2.3 to a 2.7. maybe 200 dollars for the processor bump? that's right in line with other companies although it's been a while since I bought a dell it seemed like that's what it takes to go up in processor
 
Bman123 said:
Good ole apple, thsts a high res screen. The price is fucking crazy tho. I know someone personally who will buy one of these and its a shame because its so over priced
Click to expand...

wonderfield said:
How much for a comparable laptop without a similar display, though?
Click to expand...

xIronCrossx said:
Well its a new processor so no one else has used it yet.
Click to expand...

Ah so there isn't a comparable laptop on the market really, even given the handicap of a lower res screen.

I thought ivy bridge was being used in other laptops already?

But regardless, the fact that there aren't any comparable laptops makes me say: How can you say it is overpriced, when there is nothing for it to be priced over? With the stock specs I honestly expected the high-end price they list to be the low-end price, because they could charge that. Instead they gave it specs slightly better than the high end (non-retina) MBP and charged the SAME price for it. The same price they have had on their high-end MBPs for years! But with all these new features, smaller form factor, all at the same price the "old" high end was priced at, it is still overpriced....right. :rolleyes:

The fact is they could price it wherever they want, and people would buy it. I think if they bumped the base model up to $2500+ then it would be overpriced, but at $2200 for the base retina model, which only has a slightly slower processor than the high-end non-retina but adds a standard SSD and retina display, the price is more than fair.
 
Absentee said:
Ah so there isn't a comparable laptop on the market really, even given the handicap of a lower res screen.

I thought ivy bridge was being used in other laptops already?

But regardless, the fact that there aren't any comparable laptops makes me say: How can you say it is overpriced, when there is nothing for it to be priced over? With the stock specs I honestly expected the high-end price they list to be the low-end price, because they could charge that. Instead they gave it specs slightly better than the high end (non-retina) MBP and charged the SAME price for it. The same price they have had on their high-end MBPs for years! But with all these new features, smaller form factor, all at the same price the "old" high end was priced at, it is still overpriced....right. :rolleyes:

The fact is they could price it wherever they want, and people would buy it. I think if they bumped the base model up to $2500+ then it would be overpriced, but at $2200 for the base retina model, which only has a slightly slower processor than the high-end non-retina but adds a standard SSD and retina display, the price is more than fair.
Click to expand...

Woah, I never said it was overpriced. I am just saying its expensive as fuck and quite an investment.
 
wonderfield said:
No, the iPhone has the highest margins in the phone industry.


The 40% figure is speculative.
Click to expand...

Yeah I was just checking what it would be with 40%.

And I shouldn't be surprised, Apple would kill Tim Cook before they sold at anything less than a very healthy profit.
 
xIronCrossx said:
Yeah I was just checking what it would be with 40%.

And I shouldn't be surprised, Apple would kill Tim Cook before they sold at anything less than a very healthy profit.
Click to expand...

40% is not for certain. There was a interview back where Steve Jobs said thats what they design around when making a product.
 
EPOQ said:
In this regard, yes, they are pushing the industry forward. This will undoubtedly push other manufacturers to offer the same resolution displays in the near future. Apple did it first, now we just wait for any other computer manufacturer to come along and do it better, and cheaper.
Click to expand...

So how did that play out in the 27" 2560x1440 market?
 
yeah, that's how you do it.

16:10 ratio high resolution.

I would be happy with just a 1920 x 1200 15". But it's good that apple is pushing the envelope.

goddamn pc makers need to get away from 1366x768. Give us 1600 x 1000 at least.
 
I've never owned macbook and probably never will, but I'm very happy with the update today. Maybe now other laptop manufacturers will stop using 1366x768 screens like freaking idiots. That was by far my biggest complaint about laptops for now. The few that can do 1600x900 or 1920x1080 are usually too fat, heavy or lacking in some way. Now we need some crazy 30" monitor resolutions.
 
mope54 said:
the ssd alone would cost anywhere from 400-650 dollars depending on how good a deal you can find so there's not a huge markup going from the 2.3 to a 2.7. maybe 200 dollars for the processor bump? that's right in line with other companies although it's been a while since I bought a dell it seemed like that's what it takes to go up in processor
Click to expand...

No.
:rolleyes:
 
face2palm said:
No.
:rolleyes:
Click to expand...
um...yes?

2nd generation Intel® Core™ i7-2670QM processor (2.20 GHz with Turbo Boost 2.0 up to 3.10 GHz) [Included in Price]
2nd generation Intel® Core™ i7-2760QM processor (2.40 GHz with Turbo Boost 2.0 up to 3.50 GHz) [add $199.10 or $2/week-1]
Popular Choice
2nd generation Intel® Core™ i7-2860QM processor (2.50 GHz with Turbo Boost 2.0 up to 3.60 GHz) [add $520.30 or $5/week-1]
Click to expand...

http://configure.ap.dell.com/dellst...&c=au&l=en&s=dhs&cs=audhs1&model_id=xps-l502x

The trolls are out in full force today...do you guys even bother to look at the things you buy or do you just blindly click through pages without even looking at options and just click on the cheapest shit you can find?
 
evilsofa said:
So how did that play out in the 27" 2560x1440 market?
Click to expand...

IPS is a different market segment I'd say. How many manufacturers sell IPS displays? Now, how many manufacturers sell laptops? IPS was a niche market, Apple just threw the retina display at the masses by replacing their 2 of their 3 models with these higher res displays. I think because of this, it will become much more standardized vs. IPS market which was always niche.
 
next-Jin said:
How is the screen not being made by Apple relevant? The point is that Apple is leading the way period. .
Click to expand...

Simple, lets say Goodyear Tires makes this new tire with new type of tread making the tire better performance and Ford Motor Company makes it standard on one of their vehicles.

Is Ford or Goodyear actually leading the way?

Same here, Samsung makes the 28x18 display, they deserve the credit not Apple for 'leading the way.'
 
Looks like getting rid of the ethernet port also helped them to make the laptop thinner.

Come on Apple, give us paper thin.

Anyway, comparing prices.........

an HP thick ass plastic laptop with some glued faux aluminum bits costs $1000, comes with disk hdd, 1080p.

using that as a base, add $100 for chassis, $150 for ssd, $150 for retina, $50 for glow in the dark apple logo, $50 for thunderbolt and a few other new shits, and you get a $2199 - 500 -1000 = $700 overpriced laptop.
 
Tetrahedron said:
Simple, lets say Goodyear Tires makes this new tire with new type of tread making the tire better performance and Ford Motor Company makes it standard on one of their vehicles.

Is Ford or Goodyear actually leading the way?

Same here, Samsung makes the 28x18 display, they deserve the credit not Apple for 'leading the way.'
Click to expand...

I still don't get why Samsung even does business with Apple since Apple sues them every time.
 
the glow in the dark apple logo is $500 bucks...they throw the rest of the gear in for free :D
 
Absentee said:
Have you actually compared a retina display vs lower DPI displays side by side? I've seen an iPad 2 and iPad 3 side by side and the difference is quite impressive. I only bought an iPad 2 because I can't afford the extra $$ for the 3. The same difference will be seen in the MBP as well. I can't wait until I get a chance to go to the apple store and see these things side by side with the old screen.
Click to expand...

Yes, I have seen them side-by-side (New iPad vs iPad 2 of course, which was the only comparable hardware until recently) and I won't argue that the display does look very nice. Let's keep using the iPads for compairson's sake so I can explain what I'm trying to articulate.

Were it not for other hardware changes beyond the screen, the iPad with higher screen resolutions doesn't do anything the previous model didn't do already. If you take the other upgrades out of the picture (which probably isn't fair, but humor me) what does it do beyond look nicer? Fonts, UI elements, icons...all that stuff has to be scaled up to remain easy to see so there's a lot of aspects like web browsing or reading e-mail where the higher res screen just doesn't add much.

Is it a bad thing to have lots more pixels? Nope, not at all! I just don't plan on worrying about it until they're really common in the bottom-feeder price brackets.
 
Tetrahedron said:
Is Ford or Goodyear actually leading the way?
Click to expand...
Both. Goodyear is leading the way in terms of technological developments; Ford is leading the way in terms of the implementation of those developments across their line-up. Assuming these tires aren't directly purchasable by consumers, you have a scenario where the implementation of developments is much more important than the developments themselves. Developments don't reach consumers until implementation.

Important to note that these displays do not become developments without demand from implementers, so the true driving force from a consumer perspective in the market is Apple, not the panel manufacturers.
 
Tetrahedron said:
Simple, lets say Goodyear Tires makes this new tire with new type of tread making the tire better performance and Ford Motor Company makes it standard on one of their vehicles.

Is Ford or Goodyear actually leading the way?

Same here, Samsung makes the 28x18 display, they deserve the credit not Apple for 'leading the way.'
Click to expand...

Do you really believe that anyone else, including Samsung's own laptop division, was asking for a 2880x1800 display?
 
Tetrahedron said:
Same here, Samsung makes the 28x18 display, they deserve the credit not Apple for 'leading the way.'
Click to expand...

It's IPS so likely an LG screen.

Apple is the one driving up with a truckload of cash, asking for new LCD specs and practically buying production lines to get them.

Apple has been dragging the LCD industry forward for since at least the first 30" 2560x1600 screens. Just about every consumer screen above 1920x1200 started life in an Apple product.

I don't buy Apple products, but I am damn glad they drag this stuff forward.

The anti Apple troll contigent is so ridiculous here. Highest resolution laptop screen ever. And the reactions are moaning about it being too high. :rolleyes:
 
Snowdog said:
It's IPS so likely an LG screen.

Apple is the one driving up with a truckload of cash, asking for new LCD specs and practically buying production lines to get them.

Apple has been dragging the LCD industry forward for since at least the first 30" 2560x1600 screens. Just about every consumer screen above 1920x1200 started life in an Apple product.

I don't buy Apple products, but I am damn glad they drag this stuff forward.

The anti Apple troll contigent is so ridiculous here. Highest resolution laptop screen ever. And the reactions are moaning about it being too high. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

There's no way I'll ever buy a Macbook but I have to commend Apple for pushing the notebook space forward. Lots of trolls, just like for the iPad 3. Not surprising here.
 
Tetrahedron said:
Simple, lets say Goodyear Tires makes this new tire with new type of tread making the tire better performance and Ford Motor Company makes it standard on one of their vehicles.

Is Ford or Goodyear actually leading the way?

Same here, Samsung makes the 28x18 display, they deserve the credit not Apple for 'leading the way.'
Click to expand...

Ok and if no other car maker was willing to use those tires which is the case here? Ford brought those tires to market years ahead of anyone else forcing GMC, Honda, Toyota, etc to switch to those same tires. Ford deserves credit for pushing the industry forward, not inventing something.
 
I'm also sure that Samsung would have put the R&D into developing that screen if they weren't certain of a multi-million unit order.
 
wonderfield said:
Both. Goodyear is leading the way in terms of technological developments; Ford is leading the way in terms of the implementation of those developments across their line-up. Assuming these tires aren't directly purchasable by consumers, you have a scenario where the implementation of developments is much more important than the developments themselves. Developments don't reach consumers until implementation.

Important to note that these displays do not become developments without demand from implementers, so the true driving force from a consumer perspective in the market is Apple, not the panel manufacturers.
Click to expand...

good points, always a different perspective :) but in the same regard developments do not get demand from implementers without consumers; meaning that Apple has x amount of consumers (which they are relying on) to now purchase the new MBP w/28x18 display, because if they never implemented new features, the consumers wont be there...

so another alternate perspective is the consumer is leading the way because they consume implemented developments, not Apple or Ford in case point
 
Snowdog said:
The anti Apple troll contigent is so ridiculous here. Highest resolution laptop screen ever. And the reactions are moaning about it being too high. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

The anti-apple/apple envy on the [H] forum would be hilarious if I didn't love this forum so much.

In any case, Apple is pushing laptop screens into the future with higher quality and impressive technology.... Just another reason why Apple is so damn successful: they actually push boundaries every so often....
 
obs said:
There's no way I'll ever buy a Macbook but I have to commend Apple for pushing the notebook space forward. Lots of trolls, just like for the iPad 3. Not surprising here.
Click to expand...

After owning a 2009 MBP, I will probably never buy another one, but I agree with the two posts above (obs and Snowdog). This is a good thing that Apple is pushing out these high resolution laptops. Even if many of you see their products as smug and trendy, it will benefit us all as other companies adopt high res screens and drive down the cost for production. This is the best Apple annoucement I've seen in years.
 
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