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Apple Mac Studio and Studio Display
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pendragon1
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"in select benchmarks"... guess we'll have to wait and see when review come.
I’m more meaning this is the fist multi die GPU on the consumer side that is capable of presenting itself as a single chip. They’ve apparently linked them together in a manner that gets them a 2.5TB/s interconnect. That’s absurd, I mean I am not sure how their performance numbers are going to stack up but if they did manage to pull off a good set of scaling then they did manage to get it to market first.
TrunksZero
Limp Gawd
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Who currently has an MCM GPU available at a consumer level?
TrunksZero
Limp Gawd
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*rereads*... sob
. Although technically the M1 Ultra would be an MCM SOC, but that would include a GPU. Sorry!I'm still in awe of a 2.5TB/s transfer rate, that is stupid insane.*rereads*... sob
Geekbench 5 scores are up, they look pretty impressive, to say the least. So at least on a CPU side the scaling seems to have come across very well when compared to the M1 Max which was coming in with a single thread of 1781 and multi-core of 12589, single-core is basically the same within the margin of error and multi-thread is seeing a 91% improvement. If the GPU scales equally as well that would be pretty damned awesome. If it scales at that same amount based on the existing M1 Max data and benchmarks that put it ahead of the 3050TI it would actually put it in line pretty well with the 3070 and 3080 laptop cards, I doubt it will reach their performance in gaming because Apple and Games are sketchy at best but in workloads it would probably compete there pretty favorably, assuming it does achieve the same degree of scaling.
https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/13330272
Geekbench 5 Scores
| CPUs | Single-Threaded | Multi-Threaded |
| Apple M1 Ultra | 1793 | 24055 |
| AMD Ryzen Threadripper 3990X | 1213 | 25133 |
| Intel Core i9-12900K | 1997 | 17204 |
| AMD Ryzen 9 5950X | 1686 | 16565 |
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pendragon1
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"it will increase my productivity and ergonomics, hr and ohs would approve"
His argument was basically "my monitor is shit, this is all the things I didn't know I needed", his monitor really is shit 1440p Acer it was their first model that used a USB-C for video input its brightness and pixel density are garbage and the stand is trash, he has to crane his neck down to see it, and he has it proper up at an angle by using a box of business cards. It's getto AF. He runs the place and constantly puts himself last on the list of cool toys so I'm pretty sure he deserves it.
If I want one I just need to fill out 2 forms and find room in my hardware budget which I manage so its more a question how do I justify it to myself and then how do I manage the stares from the other people in the office, but really I would go with the LG model I'm a windows user in a building of Mac's most of those features would be wasted on me. I would rather convince auditing to let me get an Alienware with a 4000 series RTX card and a matching 4K 28+" GSync monitor as I am scheduled for a replacement in Q1 of 2023.
If I really wanted to blow their minds I would order both the mac studio and studio display, the simple fact they managed to convert me to Mac would get the stamp of approval from anybody I needed it from.
pendragon1
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see, "productivity and ergo"
use the same reasoning, they are hr magic buzzwords. if you have an hr...
We approve if and only if we get your opinion on the display in the next couple of weeks.
paradoxical
Limp Gawd
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If Apple made a OLED ultrawide or 4k display I would probably pay $3k for it. But this 27 inch just doesn't do it for me, though I do understand the appeal of it to certain users. I have a lot of Apple products, but their monitors just don't work for my use cases. The Mac Studio is badass though.
TrunksZero
Limp Gawd
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I'm pretty excited to see the performance. Could make a perfect workhorse for certain workloads.
Twisted Kidney
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I hear that. I'm looking forward to seeing how well this scales when they nail a couple of their M1 SOCs together. So far the silicon is really impressive, I hop it continues.
That, and they need to support Vulcan, but that would be unApple of them.
Yeah, would be easier for the big engine people to add Metal support.
paradoxical
Limp Gawd
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As someone who owns a 9900k, 3990X, and a Macbook Pro 14 with the M1 Max with 64GB of memory, I can absolutely promise you there is a metric fuckton of performance in the Mac Studio in virtually every workload.
Twisted Kidney
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It's also vastly more likely than Apple supporting Vulkan.
Unreal 4, 5, and Unity all support the Metal API.
StormNobleheart
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This makes me want to vendor my GPU, take the rest of the rig to an outdoor gun range and put several hundred 10mm rounds into it. DESTROYS my rig in everything at 1/50th the size and at a fraction of the power usage. Not that I have an older machine either at about a year old.
SoC’s are no joke, the removal of sockets and doing away with the established layouts let’s the designers optimize things in a way PC’s can’t and instead get punished for attempting. Apple is making some big power moves, can’t wait to see what they have in store for AR. Based on their patents I don’t think they are trying for a VR setup like Meta and Alphabet are, I’m thinking they are trying to build a consumer version of the HoloLens.
paradoxical
Limp Gawd
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I like you for using 10mm
StormNobleheart
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I guess our hobby's days are numbered. I was tempted to pick-up a 12700K until I saw those numbers.
Full loads too.
paradoxical
Limp Gawd
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As a 9mm and 5.56 peasant, I am jealous. I am very curious to build a 10mm AR or even grab a 1911 in 10mm lol.
That being said, I believe your assessment of our hobby's days being numbered is 100% correct. My 14 loaded MBP has between 25 and 50% of the multi core performance of my Threadripper 3990x CPU, which is watercooled in a rackmount with a 1k psu - while the SSD and memory bandwidth in my MBP are faster than anything commercially available in desktops. And the fan barely spins up. The only thing keeping PCs alive in my opinion is gaming. I think there is little doubt they will be outclassed in every regard by Apple machines in the next year or two - from the ultrabook to the ultra powerful workstation.
I’m not saying I agree with all the doom and gloom here about PC gaming, but if you think of it in that context Microsoft’s purchases make sense. In that if they control most of the gaming studios and they launch a console while they don’t have to make anything exclusive (numbers show developers generally loose out on that now) it does give them more saying power in what architectures things can or can’t move too. They could make a very compelling case for ARM to take over on PC if suddenly new game releases had a windows ARM native launch.
But seriously I have a quote for a Lenovo P620 with a TR 3975, and for my workloads Apple made this a very hard choice for me here. I need to see some specific benchmarks but the Apple might be significantly cheaper and better performing while being much quieter. My other P620’s running 3995’s are loud AF
But seriously I have a quote for a Lenovo P620 with a TR 3975, and for my workloads Apple made this a very hard choice for me here. I need to see some specific benchmarks but the Apple might be significantly cheaper and better performing while being much quieter. My other P620’s running 3995’s are loud AF
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TrunksZero
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PC gaming won't die for a very very long time. This stuff is great, but it's hardly a harbinger for the end of custom built, repairable, socketed etc etc PC's.paradoxical
Limp Gawd
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Yes but gaming will literally be the only use case where a PC is superior to a Mac from a performance standpoint.
TrunksZero
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For now. It's not like Intel and AMD aren't going to react and Apple isn't so far ahead that they can't close the gap.
Its going to be interesting to see real world benchmarks and performance.
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paradoxical
Limp Gawd
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I disagree. Apple has enough liquid cash to purchase either Intel or AMD outright, and they are one of the best run companies in the world. They have assembled the best silicon design team in the world and they are backed by quite literally limitless funds. Most money + most talent + best demonstrated management for the longest period of time usually equals a winner for an extended period of time. Combine that with a desire to aggressively move the needle performance wise and Apple is poised to dominate for a decade or more.
On top of it, CPUs are not CPUs anymore. Devices now demand specific hardware acceleration for various software tasks, like video encoding, encryption, etc. Apple has an insurmountable advantage that Intel and AMD do not; they know how their customers use their software and they can build the hardware specifically to accelerate their own software. My team at work designs custom FPGA solutions to accelerate specific software tasks that run on our own flavor of Linux for large customers; having control over both the hardware and software and customizing the interfaces between where the work is done and what the user sees is the main reason why our designs are so high performing. AMD and Intel can't do that and never will since they don't run an operating system. A future Apple CPU may include maybe ten or fifteen different types of acceleration cores, each leveraged to accelerate a particular aspect of their OS. You can't overcome that kind of advantage.
Silentbob343
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Perhaps that's all true. Though they have a similar advantage in the mobile space, with the iPad and iphone, and yet we still other alternatives in those markets.
TrunksZero
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We'll see. AMD also just bought Xilinx, an FPGA company, so they clearly see the advantage of even more custom designed hardware than they are currently doing. And GPU's are well accustom to it as well, something else AMD is of course totally on-top of.
*late edit* And of course all this competition is just going to be good for us
*late edit* And of course all this competition is just going to be good for us
AMD bought them because they fear the ARM Server CPU’s. AMD can trade contracts with Intel back and forth till the cows come home, but if they loose a datacenter to ARM it’s gone and it’s t likely coming back. Energy efficiency is coming back in a big way as datacenter’s scale up. Custom FPGA’s for specialized workloads is how AMD and Intel both hope to keep their leads over ARM.
Intel’s making some inroads and they could potentially release a consumer CPU with an FPGA. I could see Microsoft working with both Intel and AMD on that front for making it windows accessible possibly in a future version of DirectX. The possibilities there in a console or windows gaming environment would be insanely cool.
Intel’s making some inroads and they could potentially release a consumer CPU with an FPGA. I could see Microsoft working with both Intel and AMD on that front for making it windows accessible possibly in a future version of DirectX. The possibilities there in a console or windows gaming environment would be insanely cool.
paradoxical
Limp Gawd
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There is not even a remotely plausible alternative in the tablet space when it comes to popularity or performance. Android tablets are dead.
In the phone world Apple continues making inroads and is now the majority of the market. I was a die-hard Android guy and still absolutely believe my Pixel 4 XL was a better phone than my current iPhone 12 Max ultra mega whatever XL, but I finally gave in and switched because there was absolutely no denying:
1. If i wanted the fastest 13-14 inch laptop in the world, it had to be a Mac
2. If I wanted the most powerful, fastest, and best tablet in the world it had to be an iPad Pro
3. If I wanted the most powerful, most useful, and best smart watch in the world it had to be the Apple Watch
Apple's performance and feature advantage in those other categories was so unquestionable and so dominant that I had little choice but to admit that I would overall make a net gain due to ecosystem features by moving to an iPhone even though I still prefer Android from a phone OS standpoint. I still miss my Pixel, but moving from my M1 Max 14 MBP with 64GB ram and 8TB SSD, my iPad Pro, or Apple watch to any of their competitors is such a complete, drastic, utter downgrade that I simply can't go back. Frankly, this makes me uncomfortable as this level of dominance can quickly cause stagnation of innovation. I really wish other manufacturers would pull their head out of their asses, but they just don't seem to be able to.
Silentbob343
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The iPad is the best tablet, but there are other companies still offering them and that's my point.
There are a few off points, Apple sets the benchmark they are the baseline standard against which all the others get judged. There’s always going to be an alternative to compete in the specific areas Apple can’t meet, weather that’s price, camera, battery life, screen sizes.
Apple creates boutique items, costly, limited flexibility, focuses on overall polish and experience. But not everyone can drop $1K on a tablet or a phone, the top end isn’t where the battle takes place just where the headlines are made.
Yep, there's a reason Realme, Xiaomi and even Huawei is eating up the mobile computing space. They offer 80% of the experience for like 50% of the cost, while having "great" build quality and looks.
Apple stuff is great if you make money off of it, the whole ecosystem is very efficient. But if you're just a casual Apple makes no sense.
Also, for real people who upgrade every couple generations, you give them a top of the line anything and they'll be blown away, be it Samsung, Xiaomi, Apple, whatever. My wife borked her iPhone 10 Plus and "side-graded" to an old ROG Phone 2 and was blown away at the ease of use and smoothness. She even perceived that the ASUS phone has better camera quality, while it's mainly due to the better screen.
I really dislike this race to increase the halo product cost by Samsung and Apple. They're cutting back features and specs to artificially boost prices.
TrunksZero
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Sorta... it's not regular M.2, it something different. So there is nothing you can buy and plug in yet. Second the SSD's in the studio's appear to be DRAM-less and controller-less. So it's unknown right now if you can do a user upgrade.
*edit* sorry for the late edit!
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