AMD Radeon R9 Nano Video Card PAPER Launch @ [H]

Modred189 said:
No, I disagree. I think the games currently in the lineup are relevant for the purposes of the reviews [H] does: Comparing graphically intensive games on modern hardware.
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That means nothing. That just rewards one company that either supports crapily programmed games, or whose graphics middleware (HW) cripples the fuck out of them.

Brent_Justice said:
Push any of these 5 games at 4K, and they demand high-end hardware.
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Every modern games is like that.
 
The only way to test gaming performance of a game, is to test that game. Video cards are purchased to play games. We play games on the video cards and relate the experience. It is quite logical.
 
Brent_Justice said:
The only way to test gaming performance of a game, is to test that game. Video cards are purchased to play games. We play games on the video cards and relate the experience. It is quite logical.
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I don't think that has anything to do with what I said.
 
I love watching fanboys accuse everyone of biases.

I really don't understand what creates a fanboy in the first place. Is that company doing something for you in particular that the rest of us don't have access to?

I've read [H] since 2003 on and off. I've found it to be reasonably good in terms of showing an accurate reflection of how things are in the real world, and I've also see them sing the praises of various brand achievements over the past few years.

For all of the AMD fanboys, read Kyle's article about the R9 290X when it came out.
 
Remon said:
That means nothing. That just rewards one company that either supports crapily programmed games, or whose graphics middleware (HW) cripples the fuck out of them.
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Not true. Which is why Watch Dogs is no longer in there. Which of the current games fits your description?
 
LeftSide said:
Just wanted to say I have a lot of respect for reviewers who know how to call it like it is. Now that Anandtech has been sold out, this is basically the only review site I trust...
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What happened to Anandtech? I haven't been over there for a while.
 
Might be worth it to run a test suite with one each of the following:

Newest AMD sponsored PC title
Newest NVIDIA sponsored PC title
Reference PC title (think wow, or something that's around forever)
Personal preference title (might be a benchmark type title)

Then, perhaps have follow on reviews, as time allows, on additional titles. Should be, quite literally, impossible for anyone to claim bias with that setup.

Something else I've been thinking about for a long time would be the inclusion of a community benchmark location on this site. Maybe have a reader applet that parses an uploaded dxdiag file with the benchmark scores, using a guide published by H to get specific benchmark numbers within the defined testing guidelines. That might allow for a very comprehensive testing bed that would draw more discussions and build the community.

/shrug, just some thoughts from a coffee deprived mind.
 
Modred189 said:
Not true. Which is why Watch Dogs is no longer in there. Which of the current games fits your description?
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Well, most of them. Look at Alien Isolation, Shadow of Mordor (iirc this has high Vram usage like Dying Light) and Dirt Rally. All three are visually as good as some of the games in the suite, but they perform much better (or they would be used in the reviews, right?).
 
Remon said:
Well, most of them. Look at Alien Isolation, Shadow of Mordor and Dirt Rally. All three are visually as good as the games in the suite, but they perform much better (or they would be used in the reviews, right?).
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Dirt Rally runs on the Ego engine, which is why it runs well: it's ancient. Might as well use HL2. It's also a ported Console engine, so the accompanying issues arise re lack of fidelity, options etc.
Shadow of Mordor was addressed above.
Alien Isolation doesn't stress modern hardware enough to be worthwhile. What's the point in using a game that can be run at over 100 fps as a test bed? You don't learn anything. From the Review:

The one "downside" to games that perform this well is that it doesn't push the need for a faster GPU. That said it is great to see more mainstream GPU owners getting to sample high end graphics quality gameplay...

All of this should explain to you why we are not going to be adding Alien: Isolation to our gaming suite. $200 video cards are plenty powerful enough to play this game at 1440p. At 1080p resolution you can even game with $150 video cards and still play at maximum settings. There is no need to spend $350+ on a video card for Alien: Isolation, unless you are a 4K gamer. At 4K a high-end card will do just fine, but for the majority of people a $200-250 video card is sufficient.
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Zarathustra[H];1041835855 said:
What happened to Anandtech? I haven't been over there for a while.
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Anand sold it to the owners of Toms Hardware. The advertisement has gotten way more intrusive.
 
did you really rick roll the site? man, 2007 wants its joke back.

i never knew paper launches were so interesting! 35 pages for a tiny over priced card? get over it everyone, no one will be buying this thing.
 
trick0502 said:
did you really rick roll the site? man, 2007 wants its joke back.

i never knew paper launches were so interesting! 35 pages for a tiny over priced card? get over it everyone, no one will be buying this thing.
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Requisite "40ppp or GTFO" comment. Welcome to page 18!
 
Modred189 said:
Dirt Rally runs on the Ego engine, which is why it runs well: it's ancient. Might as well use HL2. It's also a ported Console engine, so the accompanying issues arise re lack of fidelity, options etc.
Shadow of Mordor was addressed above.
Alien Isolation doesn't stress modern hardware enough to be worthwhile. What's the point in using a game that can be run at over 100 fps as a test bed? You don't learn anything. From the Review:
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It's not the same Ego engine that run the first Dirt. With that logic the Frostbite engine games shouldn't be used. And it's not a console engine, I don't even know what that means.

Also, what you're saying is irrelevant, I gave you examples of good visual games that don't run like crap, that also happen to be AMD sponsored. (I really didn't see how Shadows of Mordor was addressed earlier btw).
 
Kyle, fake article and the Rick Roll video only serve to cheapen what is normally a great site. [H] should be above the shenanigans that lesser sites indulge in. It's why the site is trusted. I get being pissed at not getting the Nano to review, but come on, you and the site are better than this.
 
Remon said:
It's not the same Ego engine that run the first Dirt. With that logic the Frostbite engine games shouldn't be used. And it's not a console engine, I don't even know what that means.

Also, what you're saying is irrelevant, I gave you examples of good visual games that don't run like crap, that also happen to be AMD sponsored. (I really didn't see how Shadows of Mordor was addressed earlier btw).
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Brent or Kyle stated that SoM isn't used because all it does is eat vram with textures. It's not really doing anything graphically interesting.

And don't confuse "runs like crap" with "stresses a GPU."
 
They are human beings and allowed to have fun. The integrity of the site is hardly compromised. Nothing has changed in their evaluation methods. Allow some humour into your life.
 
Zion Halcyon said:
Kyle, fake article and the Rick Roll video only serve to cheapen what is normally a great site. [H] should be above the shenanigans that lesser sites indulge in. It's why the site is trusted. I get being pissed at not getting the Nano to review, but come on, you and the site are better than this.
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Dude, that was funny. If you can't laugh at that... Well, maybe [H] is not the site for you.

I am not pissed that we did not get a card. I can buy a card. Actually I am not pissed about anything. I do not get emotionally invested in this.

One thing I do not like is being included in a PAPER launch of a product then not being sampled it. That is sort of a shitty thing to do, but it is what it is.

I guess you see me as sitting here beating on the keyboard ferociously because Nano did not come my way. I can assure you that is not the case. That said, I am not going to sit here and not tell our readers what it going on either.

And for the record, I continually cheapen what is a great site. It is sort of my MO. I do not take HardOCP too seriously, and neither should you. ;) I always see it as a place for a bunch of hardware geeks to get together, drink some beers, and discuss hardware. We are all never going to agree on everything, and that is what makes it all fun. When HardOCP stops being fun for me, I will sell it and move on.
 
defaultluser said:
FANTASTIC!

I believe that testing an overclocked 970 would be fair, since the Nano is going to dynamically clock itself for every single game.
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I am trying to get word out of AMD now as to what cases they suggest for Nano and what PSUs fit in those cases that have the proper pin connections and wattage ratings. I asked the PR company last week about the cases and was ignored. Questions are in direct to AMD now. I want to get AMD feedback on this to make sure our test platform is not see as "biased."
 
Zion Halcyon said:
Kyle, fake article and the Rick Roll video only serve to cheapen what is normally a great site. [H] should be above the shenanigans that lesser sites indulge in. It's why the site is trusted. I get being pissed at not getting the Nano to review, but come on, you and the site are better than this.
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Humor stack crash alert. Perform emergency recovery procedure:

1. Locate stick.

2. Grasp firmly.

3. Remove from ass.
 
Bahanime said:
Have you even looked at your behavior over the last 1-2 years? People are talking about your site on reddit, neogaf etc as being very biased. That accusation would never fly back a few years ago.
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People are saying that about a lot of hardware review sites though. I know of at least 3 other sites facing similar allegations of bias on reddit. Are all hardware review sites biased against AMD now? It couldn't possibly be those people posting on reddit who are biased could it? I'd trust sites like HardOCP who have piles of computer hardware and have done extensive testing over random reddit posters any day.
 
First of all, i want to thank Brent and Kyle for there unbiased reviews. I may not agree with the way they test the gpu's (i think stock should be tested against stock, not who can overclock the best and provide the best score). I always come to Hardocp first for big launches of anything, because I know im getting an honest opinion and accurate test results. People can say what they want about the nano, but the truth is its just a nano part of the screw up AMD did with this launch. The hype they sold the public before and during the launch is almost comical. I just don't even know what the hell they are thinking anymore. Because AMD has been the asshat of the gpu industry lately, Nvidia gets to take reap the benefits thus also becoming an asshat. One more year of crap dedicated cards and im selling my rig and getting a console. This is just stupid. I miss the good ol days.
 
Hehe I will never understand fanboys. I have been a reader of this site since late 2000 early 2001 and a member of the forum that long as well. (lost my login info way back in '03 and had to create this account) Hard has been called by fanboys biased to one hardware maker or another many many times. Hell this site used to praise AMD CPUs for several years and and Intel fanboys flooded the threads with H's "biases" but it wasn't a bias, it was the truth. The old Athlon CPUs KILLED Intel and the reviews showed that. Same thing when the R9700 came out and killed big green. Fanboys came out and complained.

I will just never understand fanboys and their need to worship a brand. Cause that is what it is is brand worshiping and nothing else. I read H reviews because they are some of the most trust worthy reviews you can get, have a good sense of humor, are brutally honest, and are incredibly indepth.

Shit man, You have the owner of the site coming on here and commenting on the threads as well as the chief editors. What other major review sites does that happen on?
 
travbrad said:
People are saying that about a lot of hardware review sites though. I know of at least 3 other sites facing similar allegations of bias on reddit. Are all hardware review sites biased against AMD now? It couldn't possibly be those people posting on reddit who are biased could it? I'd trust sites like HardOCP who have piles of computer hardware and have done extensive testing over random reddit posters any day.
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Yeah, Nvidia fanboys get upset and cry bias when Nvidia GPU's review poorly, and AMD fanboys get upset and cry bias when AMD GPU's review poorly.

It's just that AMD fanboys have had more negative reviews to cry about this cycle, because quite frankly the Fury X is not a very impressive card compared to the competition.

Sometimes the facts hurt.

It's a side effect of the stupid Team Red / Team Green nonsense.

Brand loyalty is nothing but stupidity. The brands leapfrog each other all the time (and hopefully will continue to do so despite AMD's declining financials) If you haven't alternated video card manufacturers over the years based on who was doing best at the time, you just don't make very good decisions. Buying something (anything) shouldn't be an emotional decision, it should be a rational one. If you make emotional decisions rather than rational ones then you - quite frankly - are a chump playing into the hands of the marketeers.

I've owned 3D cards by Matrox, 3DFX, Nvidia, and AMD over the years. I've owned more Nvidia cards than any others, partially because I've been a Linux fan, and their Linux drivers are tough to beat, and partially because the timing was such that when I was ready to upgrade, Nvidia was on top.
 
TMCM said:
Hehe I will never understand fanboys. I have been a reader of this site since late 2000 early 2001 and a member of the forum that long as well. (lost my login info way back in '03 and had to create this account) Hard has been called by fanboys biased to one hardware maker or another many many times. Hell this site used to praise AMD CPUs for several years and and Intel fanboys flooded the threads with H's "biases" but it wasn't a bias, it was the truth. The old Athlon CPUs KILLED Intel and the reviews showed that. Same thing when the R9700 came out and killed big green. Fanboys came out and complained.

I will just never understand fanboys and their need to worship a brand. Cause that is what it is is brand worshiping and nothing else. I read H reviews because they are some of the most trust worthy reviews you can get, have a good sense of humor, are brutally honest, and are incredibly indepth.

Shit man, You have the owner of the site coming on here and commenting on the threads as well as the chief editors. What other major review sites does that happen on?
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Well said. I honestly dont think true fanboys exist anymore, or in very limited populations. Bottom line is, if a product is priced the same or cheaper as a rival product and has better performance, it gets my dollar. I think most everyone lives by this and brand loyalty is just bs. I jumped from AMD to intel when the 2500k came out and i had been running AMD cpus for almost 10 years.
 
TMCM said:
Shit man, You have the owner of the site coming on here and commenting on the threads as well as the chief editors. What other major review sites does that happen on?
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Thanks for the kind words. I really do see us as part of the community rather than sitting outside of it looking in. And quite frankly, we listen to a lot of what is said in here and take a lot of it to heart. We have made a lot of changes in the testing we do over the years specifically based on the feedback that we get in these forums from our readers. If we are not producing content that you find important, then we might as well go do something else.
 
Mugato said:
See if there is a copy of the live stream from the 3rd and search around for that case, I know it had an acrylic window and was probably 14" high and like 18" wide. It was sitting under the TV. If you are interested. I still have not seen a response to any of the chat questions about how they were running 4K 60hz, not cool.

Edit: It looked a LOT like this: http://www.lian-li.com/en/dt_portfolio/pc-v33/

My question pertained to the statement in the original post. You mentioned not receiving cards in the past, you had to buy them. Were those launch cards or AIB "new cooler" style releases?

I asked about the conference call system because we are looking at a new one for work, you said you were not happy with it, just curious as to what they were using (if you heard it mentioned) and if you guys use something different. I would take a guess and say you probably join way more conference calls than host.

Thank you for replying!
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Derp Derp MSG to Short
 
I must say I am impressed at the level of participation in here from Kyle and Brent even as things got heated and nasty. Thanks for putting up with us crazies! Definitely a lot of good perspective in here that I can learn and grow from personally.
 
Mugato said:
See if there is a copy of the live stream from the 3rd and search around for that case, I know it had an acrylic window and was probably 14" high and like 18" wide. It was sitting under the TV. If you are interested. I still have not seen a response to any of the chat questions about how they were running 4K 60hz, not cool.

My question pertained to the statement in the original post. You mentioned not receiving cards in the past, you had to buy them. Were those launch cards or AIB "new cooler" style releases?

I asked about the conference call system because we are looking at a new one for work, you said you were not happy with it, just curious as to what they were using (if you heard it mentioned) and if you guys use something different. I would take a guess and say you probably join way more conference calls than host.

Thank you for replying!
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AMD is quoted above on what they though were the "best" cases for the Nano. Links above too.

We have been cut off in the past and left out of launches. Neither NVIDIA or AMD has excluded HardOCP from a hardware launch in a long time that I remember. We do not get included in some of the AMD CPU stuff any more, but that is the result of us not being interested rather than AMD purposefully excluding us...at least I think.

ODMs have excluded us from time to time on card launches. Not in a while though.

That said, we probably buy more motherboards and PSUs for review than anything else. That is a fairly normal deal. ASRock is not big fans of us, but have been sampling lately. EVGA will not send any video cards or PSUs because they always think we are out to get them, and quite frankly I have not gotten along with the executives over there for years, but that was all based on "bad" reviews for years ago. To that, every EVGA PSU review we have ever done has been purchased. One of those got a Gold Award in December...even though we have no relationship with the company.

As for conference call hardware...I have no idea at all. If I host concalls, I use Skype or Google Hangouts.
 
Hey, Kyle. Since you're on about here engaging with the common folk, please respond to this message.

Thanks.

P.S. As a long time reader of this site, I don't believe you guys are biased. Just assholes. <3
 
I would lay money that [H] not getting a review sample had less to do with any statements Kyle or any other [H] staff made, or the Fury X review for that matter, and everything to do with this simply being a niche card for a niche market, that they didn't print that many cards yet, and that they simply targeted sites more likely to "work with them" downplaying shortcomings and giving the card an enthusiastic "A+" anyway.

In fairness I don't honestly believe there was any exec at AMD who looked at a list of sites and said "not [H]!" I realize it's a middleman PR company that often does the interfacing with review sites as I believe Kyle alluded to. Regardless, people may be reading too much into this.
 
EzdineG said:
Hey, Kyle. Since you're on about here engaging with the common folk, please respond to this message.

Thanks.

P.S. As a long time reader of this site, I don't believe you guys are biased. Just assholes. <3
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Some people are special snowflakes and get their feelings hurt when people call it like it is.

Those people will never like the [H] approach :p
 
ah what the heck, might as well say it.

i came here because everywhere else sucks.

for example, i used to have fun with the neoseeker noobs but then the place started often using auto-play video ads. not my cup of tea.
 
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