Popular Mac Developer Slams Apple for “Sad State of Macintosh Hardware”

Megalith

Megalith

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Rogue Amoeba developer Quentin Carnicelli is criticizing Apple for not committing to the Macintosh platform: it has been more than a year since any Mac, with the exception of the iMac Pro, has been updated. Being an employee of a Mac-based software company, Carnicelli is rightfully worried, as the current lack of updates is "baffling and frightening to anyone who depends on the platform for their livelihood."

"Apple needs to publicly show their commitment to the full Macintosh hardware line and they need to do it now," writes Carnicelli. Carnicelli's comments on the state of the Mac lineup came just before Apple released a new Mac advertising campaign. Called "Behind the Mac," the campaign highlights creators who use their Macs to "make something wonderful."
 
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Its a bit sad Apple went this route with their PCs.
I don't remember Apple having so much of a price premium in their shit.
They are just over-doing it and counting on people to never catch on.
Well, they are right so far, and can prove it billions of times over.
 
I wonder how much hardware Apple would sell if they did commit to a yearly upgrade cycle? I know some people that would upgrade yearly. Even if they just did minor speed bump upgrades with Intel processors, that'd be something...

The Mac Mini is about 4 years old and is way over priced. They also ruined it by soldering the ram (and I think hard drive?) into the system. I was going to buy one to be a Jenkin's build server a while back. I ended up going with an iMac as it had more ram and a much better CPU. (This was to build Xcode and Android Studio projects).
Our IT department wanted a rack mount. Haha - they killed those off years ago.
 
I also agree with the assessment. The Mac hardware is really dated. They make so much money selling the iPhone. I hope they don't lose sight and ignore the developers. My MBP runs XCode and and even Xamarin quite well.
 
It's so sad that people even keep supporting a platform that makes no apologies for making it un-upgradeable and has prices that border on the insane. I remember when I wanted to chose extra ram for my iMac, they wanted $600 for it, and I was able to buy that same ram on newegg (even w/ the exact same stepping) for $60. Yes, you read that correctly... sixty fucking dollars compared to six HUNDRED.

Fuck apple. Everyone bitches and whines about MSFT and afraid of them becoming evil and Apple just does it right out in the open and people freaking love them for it. What a fucked up world we live in.
 
Come on, the reason is because Apple is currently developing their own CPUs for future Macs, in house. Give Apple some time. I'm sure their CPUs are going to be awesome and in fact I think Intel and AMD should both be worried. Apple could develop their own discreet GPUs one day also.

Future Macs are not going to use Intel or x86 CPUs.
 
I wonder if he'd like some cheese with that whine, geez. Apple is not in business to provide up to date anything to anyone except profits, that has never changed since day one. Apple is in business to make the shit they want to make and use and if consumers happen to decide it's cool enough to blow excessively bloated piles of cash over, so much the better for Apple.

I mean really, people need to come to grips to why Apple exists.
 
SickBeast said:
Come on, the reason is because Apple is currently developing their own CPUs for future Macs, in house. Give Apple some time. I'm sure their CPUs are going to be awesome and in fact I think Intel and AMD should both be worried. Apple could develop their own discreet GPUs one day also.

Future Macs are not going to use Intel or x86 CPUs.
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They've done that with PowerPC. They'll go to ARM, there will only be a few programs that run on them, they'll charge outrageous prices, and Apple lemmings will buy them, just like before.

They'll cherry pick meaningless benchmarks and say "Mac is 4x faster than PC", just like before.

As for discreet graphics, they could do it, but there will be tons of patent issues.
 
jfreund said:
They've done that with PowerPC. They'll go to ARM, there will only be a few programs that run on them, they'll charge outrageous prices, and Apple lemmings will buy them, just like before.

They'll cherry pick meaningless benchmarks and say "Mac is 4x faster than PC", just like before.

As for discreet graphics, they could do it, but there will be tons of patent issues.
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Only a few programs? They are going to migrate to iOS. Have you seen how many quality apps there are for iOS?

Also have you seen how fast their chips like the A11 are? Intel had better be worried. If and when Apple ramps up their CPUs to a higher TDP with more cores they are going to be massively powerful with way better power consumption than anything Intel makes.
 
You don't go Apple unless you enjoy being bent over and prison raped on overpriced hardware. Always been that way.
 
Apple doesn't want you as a customer. This took ages for the professional broadcast and film community to accept, despite Apple actively breaking everything Pro's used, even down to multi-screen, monitor stuff. They out-right killed one of the leading edit packages and replaced it with a kiddie version with the same name. They killed Color and Shake for no reason. They killed the 17" macbook. They killed servers. The killed X-Raid without warning leaving those with millions in Apple storage high and dry. The killed their beautiful Mac Pro case and replaced it with a single socket toy, yet people still tried rack mounting the round bastard, deep in infinite denial.

This is a company that removed "save as" and is moving towards a phone grade file system without multi-level folders, etc.

They don't want you on their platform.
 
steakman1971 said:
I wonder how much hardware Apple would sell if they did commit to a yearly upgrade cycle? I know some people that would upgrade yearly. Even if they just did minor speed bump upgrades with Intel processors, that'd be something...

The Mac Mini is about 4 years old and is way over priced. They also ruined it by soldering the ram (and I think hard drive?) into the system. I was going to buy one to be a Jenkin's build server a while back. I ended up going with an iMac as it had more ram and a much better CPU. (This was to build Xcode and Android Studio projects).
Our IT department wanted a rack mount. Haha - they killed those off years ago.
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The only mac I've owned is a mini from 2013. The last generation I believe that had upgradable ram and hdd. Mac had the mini computer market solid, even bringing the price down to $500. A couple of years later and there are tons of better PC/windows versions out there.
 
How about you guys write your software to work on any OS and just get everyone as clients? Why limit yourself?
 
Apple is the most valuable company in the world and that came about from the iPhone. x86 these days means jack shit to Apple in terms of profit and there's no reason for them to do a lot in that area, Mac folks are super loyal. I think that Apple is working to ditch Intel and use ARM in it's x86 lineup which would be a HUGE win for them. It's certainly possible especially with the amount of control that Apple has over its ecosystem and clearly they aren't looking for top desktop performance levels anymore.
 
Vocal fry? Check. Goth eyeliner? Check. Combat boots? Check. Translucent emo skin? Check. Highly contrasting black hair/clothes? Check. Talent? Ummm....who is she again?
 
GoldenTiger said:
You already know why. Linux isn't worth it financially.
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Desktop Linux has it's advantages. But in regards to this thread and the lack of Apple desktop/x86 hardware support, hard to see how an OS that comes on so few devices with no better support for 3rd party hardware or software is really any different than macOS today.

I do think that part of the problem for Macs and Linux when it comes to the desktop is just how fucking much shit Windows supports these days as PC gaming has exploded. Some are quick to dismiss the importance of inspirational markets like gaming but those markets drive tech.

Gaming is at best an afterthought on Macs and Linux. And people can talk about slow updates and spyware all they want, but when you plug tons of fucking hardware into a PC and the shit just screams like a scalded dog, that's inspirational.
 
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heatlesssun said:
Desktop Linux has it's advantages. But in regards to this thread and the lack of Apple desktop/x86 hardware support, hard to see how an OS that comes on so few devices with no better support for 3rd party hardware or software is really any different than macOS today.

I do think that part of the problem for Macs and Linux when it comes to the desktop is just how fucking much shit Windows supports these days as PC gaming has exploded. Some are quick to dismiss the importance of inspirational markets like gaming but those markets drive tech.

Gaming is at best an afterthought on Macs and Linux. And people can talk about slow updates and spyware all they want, but when you plug tons of fucking hardware into a PC and the shit just screams like a scalded dog, that's inspirational.
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I agree gaming has been very important for pcs. MS should have embraced it fully and made a console OS part of all windows... or more like a gui...The whole point of consoles is the game pad, you make a whole GUI to use the game pad, and magically you have a console... They can still do it.. they just might, I think this is the last xbox we will see.
 
Apple is no longer cares about any thing but the iPad and iPhone deal with it
 
Prisoner849 said:
Vocal fry? Check. Goth eyeliner? Check. Combat boots? Check. Translucent emo skin? Check. Highly contrasting black hair/clothes? Check. Talent? Ummm....who is she again?
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The standard "I'm a rebel" that I guess represents most mac users?
 
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Okay, so I guess it didn't occur to you that this is a MAC program, and there are more operating systems than just Linux?

There are plenty of applications that do, successfully, release programs for Windows, OSX, Linux and others. Oh, and they make profit too.

I like the part though that you assumed I meant Linux, when really I meant Windows. But if it were platform agnostic they could sell the product to all three, and others. Again, why limit their market?

If you want an example of a closed source product that is profitable on all three, just look at STEAM. There's also every major browser out there, and plenty of other software too.

Whether you like to believe it or not, x-plat releases are profitable.

GoldenTiger said:
You already know why. Linux isn't worth it financially.
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Apple just needs to outsource the Mac hardware to companies that care about it.

Not wholesale cloning, but licensing to companies willing to once again push the envelope.

I feel worse about Mac hardware now than I did in the 90's :(
 
LFaWolf said:
I also agree with the assessment. The Mac hardware is really dated. They make so much money selling the iPhone. I hope they don't lose sight and ignore the developers. My MBP runs XCode and and even Xamarin quite well.
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Only developers I know that still use macOS is because they work on iPhone apps. But awhile back the Mac was a go to OS for many web developers too. Nowadays, most people I know just use a Windows laptop. Some of the hardware offerings are now comparable to Apple's build quality and Windows 10 has made life for devs a lot easier.

The appeal of macOS to me was that it is UNIX like, so it was easy to get all my usual Linux dev tools setup in it. However, I can do that just as easily now in Windows with the WSL. Microsoft has also come out with new apps like VSCode that have been getting very popular, and it has been earning them a lot of goodwill among developers.

Unless I have a need to develop an iOS app in the future, I'll probably never buy any Mac hardware.
 
I enjoy my iPad and iPhone but never found a use for a mac computer, tried afew times.
 
BloodyIron said:
If you want an example of a closed source product that is profitable on all three, just look at STEAM. There's also every major browser out there, and plenty of other software too.
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Currently the Steam game catalog is 30% macOS compatible and only 20% Linux compatible so a solid majority of game devs there aren't seeing any profit outside of Windows and a few hardcore Linux folks that use WINE or some other technique. Of the games that are cross platform the large bulk of the revenues are coming from Windows users. Without Windows users no one would be making any money from Steam including Valve. This stagnant hardware situation with Macs can't be helping with gaming in that ecosystem.
 
SickBeast said:
Only a few programs? They are going to migrate to iOS. Have you seen how many quality apps there are for iOS?

Also have you seen how fast their chips like the A11 are? Intel had better be worried. If and when Apple ramps up their CPUs to a higher TDP with more cores they are going to be massively powerful with way better power consumption than anything Intel makes.
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Have you seen how shitty their software is? Their OS upgrades and software stability are on par with Windows 98. I had a mac OS update delete PostgreSQL folders from my machine a year ago. Apps crash constantly. How is this instability acceptable to anyone? They are riding on UNIX/FreeBSD coattails only because it is more convenient to develop in that environment. They really dropped the ball on software, forget about hardware, that doesn't matter.
 
Apple has been getting out of the computer business for some time now. server hardware.. gone. server software.. now gone. Airports.. gone Final Cut Pro.. gone. which made me laugh as they were some SERIOUS apple diehard fans.. kicked in the crotch.

everything they have done clearly show that any remaining "desktop" style computers will be ARM based running iOS, and not OSX soon..


and from a financial business point of view.. makes sense. The ROI is a whole lot lower on the MAC computer line then any of their other businesses.

Like Valve and its focus on steam.


as a MAc developer, you should have seen this a LONG TIME ago...
 
x3sphere said:
Only developers I know that still use macOS is because they work on iPhone apps. But awhile back the Mac was a go to OS for many web developers too. Nowadays, most people I know just use a Windows laptop. Some of the hardware offerings are now comparable to Apple's build quality and Windows 10 has made life for devs a lot easier.

The appeal of macOS to me was that it is UNIX like, so it was easy to get all my usual Linux dev tools setup in it. However, I can do that just as easily now in Windows with the WSL. Microsoft has also come out with new apps like VSCode that have been getting very popular, and it has been earning them a lot of goodwill among developers.

Unless I have a need to develop an iOS app in the future, I'll probably never buy any Mac hardware.
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Yup, only reason to use Mac nowadays it to develop native iOS app to run on mobile iOS devices, but you can do that now using Xamarin. I have been looking to get a Windows laptop probably around this coming Black Friday or something.
 
20% is still a LOT of games. Considering Linux hasn't really been in the public's eye from a gaming perspective for anywhere near as long as OSX, 20% is quite substantial. And, it's growing faster than OSX.

heatlesssun said:
Currently the Steam game catalog is 30% macOS compatible and only 20% Linux compatible so a solid majority of game devs there aren't seeing any profit outside of Windows and a few hardcore Linux folks that use WINE or some other technique. Of the games that are cross platform the large bulk of the revenues are coming from Windows users. Without Windows users no one would be making any money from Steam including Valve. This stagnant hardware situation with Macs can't be helping with gaming in that ecosystem.
Click to expand...
 
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