• Some users have recently had their accounts hijacked. It seems that the now defunct EVGA forums might have compromised your password there and seems many are using the same PW here. We would suggest you UPDATE YOUR PASSWORD and TURN ON 2FA for your account here to further secure it. None of the compromised accounts had 2FA turned on.
    Once you have enabled 2FA, your account will be updated soon to show a badge, letting other members know that you use 2FA to protect your account. This should be beneficial for everyone that uses FSFT.

Looking for a [H] UPS

E

EnderW

[H]F Junkie
2FA
Joined
Sep 25, 2003
Messages
11,426
So this past week there was a power outage while I was away from home and apparently some kind of power surge because when I got back my computer was off (power was out like 3 hours) and the ethernet port on my cable modem was fried.
Everything was hooked to a Belkin 900VA UPS and the computer is fine, but I'm definitely a lot more nervous now.

Two of my friends lost their computers from the same storm. One on a surge protector, the other on a UPS.

So what can I do to minimize the chance of this happening?
A quick glance at the sticky thread and it looks like double conversion units are the best and after a quick google search, I'm looking at the Tripp Lite SU1000XLa
http://www.tripplite.com/products/product.cfm?productID=3180
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16842111063&Tpk=N82E16842111063

Opinions?
And does APC not make double conversion units?
 
Off the top of my head the APC Double Conversion online units are the Smartups RT models (be careful as there are a lot of units designated Smartups but only some are Online). Though they will be a lot more than a comperable Tripp-Lite. If you are going to get a Online UPS and want to get something economical but still very good look at the Tripp-Lite SmartOnline. If you want to spend the kind of money APC is charging go after a refurbed Liebert instead.
 
Paul_Johnson said:
Off the top of my head the APC Double Conversion online units are the Smartups RT models (be careful as there are a lot of units designated Smartups but only some are Online). Though they will be a lot more than a comperable Tripp-Lite. If you are going to get a Online UPS and want to get something economical but still very good look at the Tripp-Lite SmartOnline. If you want to spend the kind of money APC is charging go after a refurbed Liebert instead.
Click to expand...

The Tripplite is already about the max I want to spend ($400).
But will it do the job? What is better about the APC and Liebert units?
 
EnderW said:
The Tripplite is already about the max I want to spend ($400).
But will it do the job? What is better about the APC and Liebert units?
Click to expand...

The APC nothing really...they just have better marketing. The Liebert's typically have higher surge ratings, wider AC input range (some can drop down below 65V), and better management features. But they cost.
 
Paul_Johnson said:
The APC nothing really...they just have better marketing. The Liebert's typically have higher surge ratings, wider AC input range (some can drop down below 65V), and better management features. But they cost.
Click to expand...
Where can I buy a Liebert?
 
EnderW said:
Where can I buy a Liebert?
Click to expand...

Provantage carries some: http://www.provantage.com/liebert-ups-surge-supression~110LBRT.htm

They aren't nearly as popular as NewEgg but they have been around a lot longer...I think we have been ordering from them since the mid 80's. They do tend to drop ship a lot of items from the manufacturer so shipping times can vary a bit from product to product...but overall I really have had fewer issues with them than anyone else.
 
For 1000VA, the Liebert is significantly cheaper than the Triplight. $310 vs 399.
 
ooops, I was looking at a line interactive model. They also have a $460 online model, but its much less efficient at getting power out of the batteries and only has half the runtime at full load.
 
DanNeely said:
ooops, I was looking at a line interactive model. They also have a $460 online model, but its much less efficient at getting power out of the batteries and only has half the runtime at full load.
Click to expand...

Yeah that is thing even with Liebert they make a range of products so you have to really be careful on which ones you are looking at and buying so you don't get suprised. :)
 
OK, so what about the
Liebert UPStation GXT2 700VA
http://www.provantage.com/liebert-gxt2-700rt120~7LBRT00L.htm

only thing is it only has 4 outlets vs 6 for the
Tripp Lite SU750XL
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16842111098

Here is what I need to power
1) computer
2) monitor
3) router
4) modem
5) speakers
6) printer

right now on the Belkin I have the computer, monitor, router, and modem on the battery back up outlets and the speakers and printer on the surge protection only outlets

on these units, all the outlets appear to be battery back up and I'm not sure if I should be plugging the speakers/printer into those cause they would drain it really fast

however, protection is way more important to me than run time because I just need like 5-10 min for everything to shutdown

the computer and monitor are the important things, would it be better to get the Liebert for the them and the router/modem and then just get a really good surge protector or lower end UPS for the printer/speakers?
or get the Tripp Lite and plug everything into it?

suggestions?
 
Yeah ditch the speakers and the printer...especially if that is a laser printer.......with either that you get.

If the money isn't a deal I would get the Liebert...but that rarely is the case so I personally would be inclined to get the Tripp-Lite and then probably wish I had gotten the Liebert :eek:
 
I have the TrippLite SU1000XLa and have no complaints except that the 80mm Delta fan is a bit louder than I hoped. I'll mod it with a quieter fan soon enough.

I found the best prices at Unistorage.com but you might have to wait a week for them to be in stock. Buy.com also has good prices on TrippLite.
 
aztec61 said:
I have the TrippLite SU1000XLa and have no complaints except that the 80mm Delta fan is a bit louder than I hoped. I'll mod it with a quieter fan soon enough.

I found the best prices at Unistorage.com but you might have to wait a week for them to be in stock. Buy.com also has good prices on TrippLite.
Click to expand...
thanks for the suggestions

noise is something I'm concerned about
I've spent a lot of time making my PC quiet, I'd hate to have a loud UPS ruin it
anyone have recommendations on a quiet unit?

also, how big of a no no is it to plug a splitter into one of these?
I'd like to protect my external hard drive also, so that would be 5 connections, 1 too many if I get the Liebert
I'd think it would be OK based on load as the modem, router, and external hard drive have very little power requirements, but are there other reasons?
 
Well if you don't need a true sinusoidal output, then the SU750XL (600 watt)/SU1000XLa (800w) TrippLite's won't be necessary. These units take the AC from the wall and 'double convert' it, that is, flips it to DC then back to AC. I got it b/c my PSU requires true sinusoidal for battery backup. Many PSU's will do fine on a standard (non-sinusoidal) UPS.

Splitting to an extra one or two peripherals would be OK I would think, as long as you don't exceed the total output rating.

Just FYI: I think the higher speed fan in the Tripplite "SU" models are a bit of overkill for safety's sake, the assumption being that if they run at or near full rated output for longer periods in a very warm environment then they might need this amount of air blowing through them. These are sort of "industrial built" so the stronger fan is expected. Mine is not horribly loud but neither is is quiet. I have not seen the output indicators on mine go past "50%" since I've had it, (has 4 output LED's - 25% > 50% > 75% > 100%). It seems to run cool enough in 'real world' use here -- therefore I think a lower RPM fan would be fine.
 
Most non-sine models are line-interative though not online. So there is a complete different topology in play.
 
Right Paul, but I don't know if the OP wants/needs the "online" (reconstructed, real sine) version or not.
 
You can pick up used APC 2200's with NEW batteries on E-bay for about $250 add $100 to $150 for shipping and you are talking 2200VA as well. I run one at home. Picked it up for $75 at the local colleage propertyt disposition and then bought new batteries for it $140.
 
I paid $120 or so for my Liebert GXT2-1500 on Ebay. I got lucky. It was used with batteries that worked but were still worn out, which I replaced for cheap. The seller of the UPS wasn't a computer shop but more like a pawn shop (from what I understood anyway) so they didn't seem to realize it was worth more.

I have seen GXT2-1000s on Ebay for $100-150 from time to time.

Also, I recommend you plug a UPS like this into a real surge protector like a Panamax or similar if you buy the UPS used. You won't get warranty with the UPS if you get it used, so why not spend the extra $25 to get even more piece of mind (w/ connected equipment warranty)?
 
dandragonrage said:
Also, I recommend you plug a UPS like this into a real surge protector like a Panamax or similar if you buy the UPS used. You won't get warranty with the UPS if you get it used, so why not spend the extra $25 to get even more piece of mind (w/ connected equipment warranty)?
Click to expand...

Any decent UPS should have built-in surge suppression.
 
aztec61 said:
Any decent UPS should have built-in surge suppression.
Click to expand...

Not as good as a dedicated unit, even with the GXT2. My Panamax has "protect or disconnect" which is good for a UPS particularly because it doesn't need the constant power coming in anyway.

I have experienced cases where my monitor goes flaky on lightning strikes through just my Liebert. Have yet to experience it with the Panamax and the Liebert and I have been running them like that for close to a year.
 
Plugging a UPS into a surge protector is not recommended. Quite often this will cause a unit to cycle on and off of battery a lot in addition to the issues with MOV's based surge protectors and they way they shunt surges.
 
aztec61 said:
Right Paul, but I don't know if the OP wants/needs the "online" (reconstructed, real sine) version or not.
Click to expand...
Paul_Johnson said:
Plugging a UPS into a surge protector is not recommended. Quite often this will cause a unit to cycle on and off of battery a lot in addition to the issues with MOV's based surge protectors and they way they shunt surges.
Click to expand...

I just want whatever will give the most protection.
I don't care about running a long time on battery - 5 or 10 minutes is fine.
 
EnderW said:
I just want whatever will give the most protection.
I don't care about running a long time on battery - 5 or 10 minutes is fine.
Click to expand...

Then don't use a surge protector in front most definately not if it shunts to ground.
 
Paul_Johnson said:
Then don't use a surge protector in front most definately not if it shunts to ground.
Click to expand...

Can you use a surge protector on the output side? Lets say you have a dedicated UPS for the CPU and monitor, and had a secondary UPS to power a bunch of low-power electrinics? (printers, hubs, external HDs, etc)
 
dandragonrage said:
I have experienced cases where my monitor goes flaky on lightning strikes through just my Liebert. Have yet to experience it with the Panamax and the Liebert and I have been running them like that for close to a year.
Click to expand...

I don't know if that might be peculiar to the Liebert unit or not. :confused: I've not had that problem with any UPS models I've used from APC or TrippLite plugged straight into the wall.
 
MrkXCeL said:
Can you use a surge protector on the output side? Lets say you have a dedicated UPS for the CPU and monitor, and had a secondary UPS to power a bunch of low-power electrinics? (printers, hubs, external HDs, etc)
Click to expand...

So you would be daisy chaining the UPS's together?
 
MrkXCeL said:
Can you use a surge protector on the output side? Lets say you have a dedicated UPS for the CPU and monitor, and had a secondary UPS to power a bunch of low-power electrinics? (printers, hubs, external HDs, etc)
Click to expand...

Why would you need to do that, when the UPS should have a sufficient internal surge suppressor, and as long as you have enough outlets on the UPS and the rated power is not exceeded? If you need a 2nd unit for more outlets, it should be plugged into a separate AC socket at the wall.
 
aztec61 said:
Why would you need to do that, when the UPS should have a sufficient internal surge suppressor, and as long as you have enough outlets on the UPS and the rated power is not exceeded? If you need a 2nd unit for more outlets, it should be plugged into a separate AC socket at the wall.
Click to expand...

I have heard of people trying to do it to get longer runtime or people have suggested it will increase surge suppression needless to say I am sure you can guess how it really works out ;)
 
aztec61 said:
Why would you need to do that, when the UPS should have a sufficient internal surge suppressor, and as long as you have enough outlets on the UPS and the rated power is not exceeded? If you need a 2nd unit for more outlets, it should be plugged into a separate AC socket at the wall.
Click to expand...

No I'm not interested in extra surge suppression, and I'm not daisy chaining (though it's an interesting idea); and yes I'd be plugging each UPS into seperate outlets.
All I want is more outputs, the reason I tossed out surge suppressor is cuz they're always around the house and have many outputs available.
Sorry for going off subject, I don't want to drift too far away from the OPs' thread but all I wanted to know if the surge electronics in a surge suppresor could somehow interfere with the output stage of a UPS.
 
Paul_Johnson said:
I have heard of people trying to do it to get longer runtime or people have suggested it will increase surge suppression needless to say I am sure you can guess how it really works out ;)
Click to expand...

It works out great. Besides, even if it did get fried, Panamax will cover it in my case (as would Belkin, who makes the other power strip I use for my electronics). But if it gets fried through the Panamax, it definitely would have gotten fried without the Panamax and I'd be SOL.

I think you need to stop spreading FUD when it works just fine. The only problems you hear about are people plugging power strips into cheap UPS and those having their breakers tripped when the UPS switches over to battery power. I'm sorry to say but just because you're a moderator doesn't mean something is true just because you say it is.
 
Right, we shouldn't listen to that great FUD-spreader, Paul_Johnson. He's just an idjit with a mod's license.

"You can give it up now, Paul...you've been caught out!"

:rolleyes: :rolleyes:
 
dandragonrage said:
It works out great. Besides, even if it did get fried, Panamax will cover it in my case (as would Belkin, who makes the other power strip I use for my electronics). But if it gets fried through the Panamax, it definitely would have gotten fried without the Panamax and I'd be SOL.

I think you need to stop spreading FUD when it works just fine. The only problems you hear about are people plugging power strips into cheap UPS and those having their breakers tripped when the UPS switches over to battery power. I'm sorry to say but just because you're a moderator doesn't mean something is true just because you say it is.
Click to expand...

Ummm...no if you daisy chain two UPS together quite often as soon as the first one goes into battery mode the second does as well thereby giving the exact same run time. Now plugging a UPS into a surge protector that shunts to ground during a surge causes a ground contamination that will trip the UPS and turn it off. Not FUD just the way it works.
 
I have an OneAC power conditioner plugged into the wall and an APC SmartUPS 1000 plugged into that..

The OneAC is a true isolation "medical grade" power conditioner. The outputs are completely isolated from the wall outlet. Here is one on Ebay right now..

http://cgi.ebay.com/ONEAC-CB-115-PO...ryZ14980QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

If you went this route, you could run a smaller UPS that will only power the things you *need* when the power goes out. The rest of the stuff can be plugged into the OneAC and it gets full power conditioning.

Currently, I have my PC and monitor plugged into my UPS and my M-Audio LX4's, printer, etc. plugged into the extra outlets on the OneAC.

I bought the OneAC because I was getting a nasty "POP" through the speakers when my fridge cut in/out. The OneAC completely eliminated it... I was even getting the POP when I had the speakers plugged into the SmartUPS.

I also have *everything* in my house except for my kitchen appliances on a UPS.. I bought all my UPS's from http://www.refurbups.com. The 700va SmartUPS were so cheap when I bought them that I bought 4. :D So now I really *know* when the power goes out.. *beeeeeeeeepppp*

Riley
 
As an eBay Associate, HardForum may earn from qualifying purchases.
Skud said:
I
I also have *everything* in my house except for my kitchen appliances on a UPS.. ... So now I really *know* when the power goes out.. *beeeeeeeeepppp*
Click to expand...

So what you're saying is you have UPS warnings in 7.1 surround sound. :eek:

:D
 
EnderW said:
so what about plugging a UPS into one of them?
Click to expand...

They don't bridge out to ground so they should play fine together...but it really is overkill.

If you really want to do it look up SurgeX, and Brickwall in additon.
 
Paul_Johnson said:
They don't bridge out to ground so they should play fine together...but it really is overkill.

If you really want to do it look up SurgeX, and Brickwall in additon.
Click to expand...
why is it overkill?

I thought those were the same technology, just licensed out by zero surge

what kind of surge protection do the Liebert GXT2 and Tripp Lite SU750XL units have?
is it MOV or series?

edit: also, what are my options for protecting against surges through the coax cable?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top