YOUR OPINIONs on 20 AMD Powered Rigs for LAN/CYBER Cafe

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ShiShKaBoB

Gawd
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Aug 10, 2004
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Im about to partner up with some guys to open a Lan/Cyber Cafe/Tech Bench here in AZ. We're looking to build 20 rigs to start with. Budget is somewhat important, as this is a gigantic venture to do.

My question may seem simple, I'd just like all your opinions on which components (namely CPU's) would be best gaming 24/7.

My original thought was 939 Opteron 144 clocked to 2.4ghz, however Im also thinking possibly 165's or 3800+'s for the future games which will support both cores.

Other questions that arise are : do the 144's generally clock to 2.4ghz with ease? Or if I am going to go with a single core, would it be best to put an order in for 146's instead if 2.4ghz is my goal?

The rest of the systems looks much like this:
CPU: your opinion?? Opteron 144,146,165, X2 3800+, 3700+ SanDiego
Board: DFI Ultra-D or ??
Ram: (your opinion on best overclocking value ram??)
GPU: eVGA 7800GT (1 for now, we'll add another later)
HD: 74gb Raptor, or best value SATA II drive??
Case: Undecided
PSU: Antec Tru550 2.0 or ?? sub $100 SLI PSU
Monitor: Best 19" Gaming LCD, or Best 19", 21" Gaming CRT???

I appreciate any responses, and will give [H] mad props when we open up. I don't expect every one to suggest everything, but if you know of something that you would highly reccommend.. just throw it out there, i'll do my research.
 
I'm wondering why in the world you would consider overclocking twenty machines an a cybercafe type setting?! You're not going to be using those machines why do you give a fuck? I'd just get some affordable solution, maybe overclock one or two of them, and make them your reserved stations.

I'd reccomend A8n delux's or something cheap. All they need to do is play games, so you dont need to pick out anything super special :p

Mcdonalds doesn't hire college graduates to serve dollar menu items do they?
 
i don't mean to sound like an ass, but your going to lose money on this business venture. The only lan centers that really are long term still lose money and have coporate sponsership. These places still lose money. Just so you know what your getting into.
 
Yea cybercafes only work in smaller countries....like most in South America (Ecuador from experience, seeing as how thats where I met my wife). Everyone has a computer and internet here in the states.
 
are you guys nuts? that list of parts is way too high end for cyber cafe PCs. have you even done any research?
 
lol cyber cafes ususally run old p4's 9800pros 512gb ram etc etc. You really want to spend 1200 on a box and prolly get 100 bucks ROI a year on it? Not to mention, boxes need to be upgraded, maintained the network etc etc.
 
It sounds like hes wanting to do a gaming type cyber cafe, where everyone can game with the newest games with decent fps. At least thats what it seems like. Again, as stated before not to dump on your buisness but it unfortunately probably wont work out profit wise.
 
Your giving yourself to much overhead.
Back down to a 3000+ Venice S754, 6600GT(or 128mb X800GTO), and that Biostar M-atx board. Should not cost more than $500 a machine (Not including Winblows of course)
 
HmmmDonut said:
Your giving yourself to much overhead.
Back down to a 3000+ Venice S754, 6600GT(or 128mb X800GTO), and that Biostar M-atx board. Should not cost more than $500 a machine (Not including Winblows of course)
Click to expand...
No, no, and no. Since he will always need to be on the edge of technology, he needs to be in a position to upgrade to the newest technology as cheaply as possible.

OK, that aside, let's tackle some of your theories. Don't overclock a machine that you depend on for the next meal. You just don't do it. You also do not skimp on the quality of these machines (read: ASUS > DFI). Dual-core, not necessary. Gaming machines will do better with a fast single-core than a slow dual-core. No SLI, since these must always be the top end of technology, one current-gen video card will be better than two previous-gen. CRT > LCD for both lifespan and bang/buck. My suggestion:

CPU:3700+ or 4000+ SanDiego
Board: ASUS A8N-E
Ram: 2GB G.Skill Value stuff ($150 for 2GB, I kid you not)
GPU: eVGA 7800GT (you might be able to get by with a 6800GT)
HD: Western Digital SE16 250GB (250GB, 16MB Cache, $100)
Case: Chieftech Dragon-based case. Cheap, big, good cooling
PSU: Antec Trupower II 550
Monitor:19" or 21" Gaming CRT (depending on budget)
Click to expand...

You should be able to get these in the $1000/each neighborhood.
 
I'd go for value if it's for a business. Maybe a low end 939 setup with CRT monitors. Maybe just get some cheap Dell systems, but do be buying 20x X2s for a cyber cafe, it's just wasteful.
 
I think your best bet is going to be to get 2-4 higher end machines, and have the rest lower end. For the higher end machines I would go with something like what sac_tagg said. For the lower end machines I would go with something like what HmmmDonut suggested.

Another thing to keep in mind is the power bill on these things. get good high efficiency power supplies, they will probably pay themselves off if you can stay in business long enough.

Sell snacks and drinks, as well as something else, games or something. You most likely will not make enough on the LAN part alone. I think you should keep it to like 10 computers MAX at start with room for a BYOC section. If the business is successful you can always get more machines later.
 
I say since the risk factor is so far against you, go with the 3000amd, the 6600gt, some CRT monitors and upgrade as needed with a few top of the line systems for reserved higher paying customers. That way if you fail you are out a lot less. I would also consider making it a repair/building/upgrade shop for extra revenue and really push to get bday parties and such. Though that is of course coming from a business stand point, but if you want to just think gaming, then sure blow all your cash on 2-3k machines :)

As far as it succeeding, I am not going to be an ass and crap on your dream, but living 15 feet off one of the busiest boulevards in southern california, I have seen roughly 15-20 internet cafes go under, some within just months. There is even one about 10 min from my house that no joke, has had 4 diff owners (and names) and all have failed.

Just some food for thought :)
 
Erasmus354 said:
I think your best bet is going to be to get 2-4 higher end machines, and have the rest lower end. For the higher end machines I would go with something like what sac_tagg said. For the lower end machines I would go with something like what HmmmDonut suggested.

Another thing to keep in mind is the power bill on these things. get good high efficiency power supplies, they will probably pay themselves off if you can stay in business long enough.

Sell snacks and drinks, as well as something else, games or something. You most likely will not make enough on the LAN part alone. I think you should keep it to like 10 computers MAX at start with room for a BYOC section. If the business is successful you can always get more machines later.
Click to expand...
Agreed, think like the movie house. Sell inordinately overpriced snacks and meals: $2 for a slice of pizza, $1.50 for a bag of chips, $2 for a fountain drink, etc. The BYOC section could probably make you more money than your systems. Just get a big room, foldup tables, electrical, networking, air conditioning, cheap carpet, cheap sofas or rolling chairs. Then charge per seat (seat = network & electrical connection). Good money there.

EDIT - Yep, $1100 shipped:
http://www.geocities.com/scortiaus/misc/Newegg.pdf
 
$2 a slice isn't that expensive. i usually pay about $5.50 for 2 slices and a drink at pizza places
 
What if you got these computers used? It would knock off the reliability but really if computer parts run and aren't overclock "used" really dosen't matter. I paid 10 bucks for a Tyan mobo for my server and 30 bucks per P3 cpu and it runs dead on. 70 bucks for 2 gigs of ram in it and everything works perfectly. Look used man, check the forums; rigs will be oddballs but it'll be much cheaper.
 
Thanks for all your opinions.. but most of them suck ..j/k. ;) . I understand the risk factor here, but what most if not all of you didnt realize is the fact that this is mainly a TECH BENCH.. and that is where the money is.. I dont plan to MAKE any money on the lan/cyber cafe aspect of it, but rather maintain a reason for coming to the bench.

I currently work at a tech bench and we average 40K a month in revenue. This is not going to be just another outdated quake4 unplayable pentium powered shit sack of a lan shop like most the ones I have seen, this is going to be a place that people will brag about. Again the money is coming from the tech bench, not from the lan/cyber cafe.

Thanks sac_tagg, your post made sense. I'll look into those components.
 
ShiShKaBoB said:
Thanks for all your opinions.. but most of them suck ..j/k. ;) . I understand the risk factor here, but what most if not all of you didnt realize is the fact that this is mainly a TECH BENCH.. and that is where the money is.. I dont plan to MAKE any money on the lan/cyber cafe aspect of it, but rather maintain a reason for coming to the bench.

I currently work at a tech bench and we average 40K a month in revenue. This is not going to be just another outdated quake4 unplayable pentium powered shit sack of a lan shop like most the ones I have seen, this is going to be a place that people will brag about. Again the money is coming from the tech bench, not from the lan/cyber cafe.

Thanks sac_tagg, your post made sense. I'll look into those components.
Click to expand...

I would back down on the hardware. I would build:
Aspire x-qpacks -$75
Thermaltake 430 watt 24 pin pci-e psu-$40
Biostar tforce 939 motherboard-$75
Processor-??
6800GS-$200
200GB 16MB cache maxtor drive-$88

That would deffinately be the best bang for the buck. You can oc 6800GS's really far and get past past 6800U performance.
 
We're not going to run anything less than a 7800 GT, we might do customer builds with the Aspire x-qpacks, but I don't think we're going to run mATX boards (granted it would work) I'd just rather have assured ventilation. Put it this way, the investor I am partnering with wanted to drop $500 on each MONITOR.... I have persuaded him from that idea for more efficient money spending.

Speaking of Maxtor.. did you all hear Seagate bought Maxtor for $1.9 Billion!

The 430w Thermaltake ehh? Hows the warranty on those? Think it'll power the 512GTX's? For future references ;).
 
From experence, dont bother overclocking floor machine at LAN centers... no one cares if it 5% faster, and it causes more headacks that its worth.

DreamLAN Master might be able to help you out better, he has been in busness going on 4-5 years. Thats pretty good IMO, he got to be doing something right because he is only getting bigger...
DreamLanGames.com
 
I would agree...OCing isn't going to be worth it...just go with stock or a mild OC...200mhz maybe.
 
I(illa Bee said:
From experence, dont bother overclocking floor machine at LAN centers... no one cares if it 5% faster, and it causes more headacks that its worth.

"DreamLan Master" might be able to help you out better, he has been in busness going on 4-5 years. Thats pretty good IMO, he got to be doing something right...
DreamLanGames.com
Click to expand...

I wonder how BF2 plays on these:

AMD Athlon XP 3000+ 512mb DDR PC3200 RAM
NVIDIA Nforce3 ultra400 motherboards
-with NVidia GeForceFX 6600GT/6800 video cards
DVD Drives
For your viewing pleasure 22" High Resolution Viewsonic P220f Monitors
Optical mice
Comfortable High Back Chairs.
XSpanet High speed Broadband Internet access.

Thanks Killa im going to put that on my fav's list and keep in touch.
 
ShiShKaBoB said:
I wonder how BF2 plays on these:

AMD Athlon XP 3000+ 512mb DDR PC3200 RAM
NVIDIA Nforce3 ultra400 motherboards
-with NVidia GeForceFX 6600GT/6800 video cards
DVD Drives
For your viewing pleasure 22" High Resolution Viewsonic P220f Monitors
Optical mice
Comfortable High Back Chairs.
XSpanet High speed Broadband Internet access.

Thanks Killa im going to put that on my fav's list and keep in touch.
Click to expand...

thats the thing, it plays fine, and 95% of the kids that go in there dont know the diffrence between 800x600 medium settings and 1280x1024 high. And when they do notice the diffrence, they dont care as long as there fragin there buddie. im sure you will quickly find that most of your customers are sub 15 of age, and are there because there dell with intel Xtreme graphifs wont play anything.

I say pick and choose your battles, the last 2 LAN center iv been to that had really kick ass machines, are no longer open, and didnt last longer than 2 years. ouch.. like I said Master is doing something right.

Also up untill BF2 those machien ran everythign really well. Sicne he is constiantly selling off machines hes allways upgradeing. the current GPU going into replacements is 6800GS.

ShiShKaBoB said:
The 430w Thermaltake ehh? Hows the warranty on those? Think it'll power the 512GTX's? For future references ;).
Click to expand...

thats easy!! Dont buy thermaltake! ever!

on that note Master runs all genric ass crapo PSUs that I personally hate to see in use and to my knowledge in 4 years has olny had one or 2 die on him and one was from a puwer surge on a genorator at a outside event... His new AMD64 boxes are getting 400watt antec I think.
 
ShiShKaBoB said:
I wonder how BF2 plays on these:

AMD Athlon XP 3000+ 512mb DDR PC3200 RAM
NVIDIA Nforce3 ultra400 motherboards
-with NVidia GeForceFX 6600GT/6800 video cards
DVD Drives
For your viewing pleasure 22" High Resolution Viewsonic P220f Monitors
Optical mice
Comfortable High Back Chairs.
XSpanet High speed Broadband Internet access.

Thanks Killa im going to put that on my fav's list and keep in touch.
Click to expand...

BF2 will run fine on that, as long as nothing is set higher than medium. You can easily tweak the settings for performance and no one who goes to a cyber cafe to play will be able to tell the difference. I can play BF2 with good framerates with mostly medium settings on my Dell 8600 and it only has a Radeon 9600 and a 1.6 PM.
 
Another thing to think about is your customer base.. I got news for you, if you customers are worried about running 1280x1024 Maxed BF2, there there NOT going to be in you store. They are going to be at home on there power house boxes!

EDIT: Master is writeing a replay, but he is very slow and like to triple check is work...
 
scottemad123 said:
i don't mean to sound like an ass, but your going to lose money on this business venture. The only lan centers that really are long term still lose money and have coporate sponsership. These places still lose money. Just so you know what your getting into.
Click to expand...

I agree, so long as this is in the USA. I've seen about 5 cybercafes flop within 3 years here on the coast.

The only two that lasted a decent time were before broadband hit the market here, but once broadband hit, they went downhill FAST (this was around 6 - 7 years ago).
 
threedd97 said:
I agree, so long as this is in the USA. I've seen about 5 cybercafes flop within 3 years here on the coast.
Click to expand...

DreamLan is going on 5 years, no corp sponsors, jsut smart managment and decicated work
 
system IMO, form experence helping Master at DreamLAN

CPU: Opteron 144 or 3200+ tops!!!!!

Board: WHY SUCH A EXPENSIVE BAORD??? get a cheapo Nf4 baord with PCIe, it will preforme jsut as good as any other, might not overclock well, but who cares..

Ram: cheapest psoible, i would even say shoot for singal 1gb sticks of PC3200 and upgrade to 2gb later if nessary...

GPU: 6800GS, more than you need

HD: why the hell would you need to waste money ona raptor? Get a 80gb WD SATA drive (50 bux)

Case: whatever...

PSU: Antec 400watt with 24pin and a PCIe plug

Monitor: Depends, CTRs will keep you shop warm in the winter lol! IMO 19" LCD is well worth it
 
I(illa Bee said:
DreamLan is going on 5 years, no corp sponsors, jsut smart managment and decicated work
Click to expand...

Well, it is one of the few that made it. Congratulations. We're trying to help this guy from making what looks to be a mistake as the odds are undoubtibly against him and his partners. I wish him luck, a lot of it. Just because one LAN center made it, doesn't mean it's a viable venture. It just obviously happens to be in the right location and got itself grounded before online gaming seriously blew up.

All the centers around here were dedicated and most had the right idea, even being located near our Air Force Base. They did all the normal LAN/cybercafe crap and sometimes above and beyond. The world of cheap broadband and explosion of online gaming just crushed that sort of business. To be honest, I'm amazed that DreamLan is still up and making any sort of considerable profit.
 
makeing enought that he no longer works with me and jsut dose DreamLan now. And doin well enough that his store is abotut o undergo a major overhaul (paintin, carpet, new tables, swapign out the 22" CTRs for 19" 3ms LCDs, mMMM its gonna be fun)

BTW: anyone in the So cal area wanna donait some time to help us do it? on Jan 8th-12th the construction begins... muhaaaa
 
Cyber Cafes really do fail easily. In San Francisco i have seen at least two close down. One was even popular-CyberHunt. I would just go with a fairly low end machine. Socket 939 +Amd 3000, 512mb-(Maybe 1gb for $70 of Value RAM), 6600GT (maybe 6800GS). Do you want kids breaking those expensive Socket 939 computers with AMD 4000+s?
Also, you're going to have to probably BUY all those games and get them licensced. That will cost you $$
Plus your internet Bill$$ you probably need like T1.. :eek:
 
{NcsO}ReichstaG said:
Cyber Cafes really do fail easily. In San Francisco i have seen at least two close down. One was even popular-CyberHunt. I would just go with a fairly low end machine. Socket 939 +Amd 3000, 512mb-(Maybe 1gb for $70 of Value RAM), 6600GT (maybe 6800GS). Do you want kids breaking those expensive Socket 939 computers with AMD 4000+s?
Also, you're going to have to probably BUY all those games and get them licensced. That will cost you $$
Plus your internet Bill$$ you probably need like T1.. :eek:
Click to expand...

With T1 you're looking at around $1,000 a month for the connection. And that's saying it will be enough for the 20 computers all sucking the bandwidth on games. And don't run any public internet servers off that connection aside the 20 computers using that connection, you'll really be hurting it and pissing off customers with a bogged connection.
 
Master can agree with you there. Games are EXPENSIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

then there is the stupid game companys!!!!!!

Blizzard you have to pay $1000 dollars a year for 20 lisensies of there game, and thats after you buy the game. (per game)

Valve (yea HL2) wants as much as 10 bux a mouth per copy of the game if its used in a LAN center. again, that after you buy the full retail game. so 20 copies of HL2 is 200 bux a mounths to use there game... for one dumb ass game!
 
The fact that gaming centers never come out ahead is not valid. I have a friend near St. Louis that has been in bussiness ever since 1996 when we started playing Quake 1. They bought a new million dollar establishment to get out of the house they were using when they started. If you keep the bussiness small with minimal employees and maybe build machines on the side for extra income, there is no reason why wouldnt be able to stay ahead. As long as you make sure you cater to your customer base and keep the hard core gamers happy with up to date patches and new demos from time to time. Use gaming cards where the more hours you buy at one time is cheaper in the long run for the gamers is a good idea. Everyone can practically play online with broadband nowadays, but not everyone can find a big place to bring 8 to 10 friends for LAN gaming on short notice. The LAN is where its at. I have run 2 gaming centers in the past but had bad dealings with the "owner" of the places. We did fine till the ass ran off to california and took all the money with him. As far as paying for the games thing, we just never contacted the gaming companies in the past. We charged for computer time, "not game time" :D
 
While I agree that money needs to be saved during the investment in the machines.
There is a counter productive point.

if the machines suck and can't play the games at high resolutions smoothly nobody is going to want to come there. So within a few months time word will spread that the PC's there suck and nobody will bother comming there to game.
 
I didnt read much of ANY of this, but me and my Dad have been seriously considering opening up a gaming cafe, and here is what you need to NOT skip out on:

A cafe in my home town makes, literally, 6x more money from drinks/food. They are a COFFEE shop (this is important) that sell other types of drinks as well. Akward energy drinks, Gatorade, Coke...

Sell muffins, donuts, and smaller things of that nature. Find a local bakery that will make these things for you or something... the one in my hometown sells these LIKE MAD. People stop in and buy them all in the mornings. Of course something like this depends on whats in the area and such.

DEFINITLY go for the computer shop inside the store idea. We were going to be doing this if we got anything open. We were basicly saying, "This is a storefront for a computer business, any revenue from the computer gaming, drinks, and food is 100% extra profit. There are TONS of repair shops that make tons of money, you will definitly make assloads if the area you pick is nice.
 
{NcsO}ReichstaG said:
Cyber Cafes really do fail easily. In San Francisco i have seen at least two close down. One was even popular-CyberHunt. I would just go with a fairly low end machine. Socket 939 +Amd 3000, 512mb-(Maybe 1gb for $70 of Value RAM), 6600GT (maybe 6800GS). Do you want kids breaking those expensive Socket 939 computers with AMD 4000+s?
Also, you're going to have to probably BUY all those games and get them licensced. That will cost you $$
Plus your internet Bill$$ you probably need like T1.. :eek:
Click to expand...
in most major metro areas a dedicated T-1 is pointless. Why get 1.5Mbps when most cable companies such as comcast offer buissness class services for $100/month giving you 6Mbps.

Also for a cyber cafe you don't need monster upload speeds.
The games should be run on an in house server
the rest of the people will be surfing and need download speeds.
 
SKy042 said:
in most major metro areas a dedicated T-1 is pointless. Why get 1.5Mbps when most cable companies such as comcast offer buissness class services for $100/month giving you 6Mbps.

Also for a cyber cafe you don't need monster upload speeds.
The games should be run on an in house server
the rest of the people will be surfing and need download speeds.
Click to expand...

No... no no no. You NEED upload. The games have to be able to connect to the internet or opening the shop is pointless (with gaming intent). The place isnt going to always be filled up. Gaming online is more fun anyways. Grab a server with double the capacity of your store and make sure you put the location of the cafe in the title. People in the area will see this and stop by. No asshat admins either.

Rent 1 Counterstrike server, 1 Battlefield2 server, and maybe another server later on for whatever your most popular game is. Those games are plagued with bad servers... make sure you get a good one.

Try to make EVERYTHING sound like a deal too... pull a Bestbuy on their asses.
 
First of all, as already mentioned, why would you overclock cyber cafe computers? Second of all, that part list is WAY too expensive. Third, you and your partner will lose money and not survive a year on this venture. You might as well put all your money in a brief case, go to the tallest building around you, and open the brief case and let the money flow down to the street.


If you DO decide to try it, then I wish you the best of luck.
 
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