x850 xt or 6800gt

[Travagin]

compUSA has both these cards for $399. X850 XT here. What should i go for?

 

[GoldenTiger]

Go for the X850XT. It is faster by default, and will overclock to be far faster than an overclocked 6800GT will be. Plus, the Nvidia drivers have issues like bands in the water in many games as well as other visual quality issues brought on by excessive performance "optimizations". ATI tells you what they do through their Catalyst AI feature and allows you to disable it if you want, plus theirs does not bring on heavy image quality degradation like Nvidia's "optimizations" do. It really just comes down to speed for most people, however.

Also, might I point out this link:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814102492

It is an AIW X800XT for $389 + $5 shipping, minus a $50 rebate. The X850XT you are thinking of has no tv/radio tuners like the AIW does and is only marginally faster. Plus, it's more expensive... $450 minus a $50 rebate compared to $394 minus a $50 rebate.

 

[tranCendenZ]

6800GT
-Shader Model 3.0
-OpenEXR FP16 HDR lighting
-$100 cheaper at newegg

6800GT has more features and will last longer due to its featureset. It has better IQ and visual effects than the x850xt in newer games.

examples:
For example:

http://www.reflectonreality.com/images/hdr/FarCry0005.jpg
ATI X850XT playing FarCry
(Copy/paste to browser url)

http://www.reflectonreality.com/images/hdr/FarCry0006.jpg
Nvidia 6800GT playing FarCry
(copy/paste to browser url)

***

ATI X850XT playing Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory

Nvidia 6800GT playing Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory

For High Quality HDR for the upcoming Half Life 2: The Lost Coast patch you will also need SM3.0/FP16 HDR, again not available on ATI X850 cards (which will default to a lower quality/contrast ratio integer HDR in the upcoming hl2 patch). Other upcoming games like AoE3, UT2007, and Unreal3 will also likely have an advantage on the 6800GT due to SM3.0/FP16 HDR. Doom3 engine games will also have an advantage, which includes Quake4, Enemy Territory: Quake Wars, and Prey.

The AGP version of the 6800GT is $300 at newegg.com
The PCI-Express version is $375 but allows you to nearly double your performance on modern games using SLI. I assume you are using AGP though as you linked to an AGP card at compusa.

Either way, 6800GT is a win-win card.

The best buy:
eVGA 6800GT 256mb AGP8x $299
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814130203

to the previous poster: the hl2 water banding bug was fixed several driver revisions ago. You can also disable NV optimizations by setting the drivers to "High Quality." But you can't make up the differences shown in the above screenshots on the x850, because it doesn't support FP16 HDR or SM3.0

 

[Nazo]

Plus, the Nvidia drivers have issues like bands in the water in many games as well as other visual quality issues brought on by excessive performance "optimizations".

Wha?! Funny. I've never seen bands in water or other visual quality issues. Then again, I choose the high quality setting not performance. Perhaps people getting issues are choosing performance? You don't need that on one of THESE babies, trust me...

I second the 6800GT.

 

[GoldenTiger]

I've read it in numerous places such as HardOCP's reviews even.

As far as SM3.0 goes, by the time it's ever really in actual use or required, the 6800GT will be too slow for that day's games. Plus, HDR CAN be done with SM2.0b, just different bit depth (24 vs. 32). In addition, the SM3.0 just plain doesn't do much extra. It provides tons of features that aren't even used, nor will be for a long time. Hence why I said it comes down to speed mainly.

 

[Nazo]

Isn't the point of cards in this sort of area to be that they DO last? 6800GT is already well ahead of it's time (come on, things like Doom 3 can't even challenge it) so I disagree with your claim that by the time it's advantages start showing through it will be too outdated.

SM3.0 admitedly was more for the programmer than the gamer. I don't care about that much myself. I just have direct experience with what this line of cards can do and I know it's not dissapointing.

 

[tranCendenZ]

I've read it in numerous places such as HardOCP's reviews even.

Right, and the water banding bug in Half Life 2 was fixed in the latest driver release 71.89, it no longer exists.

As far as SM3.0 goes, by the time it's ever really in actual use or required, the 6800GT will be too slow for that day's games.

You don't know that, and currently SM3.0 offers the 6800GT performance boosts, not losses.

Plus, HDR CAN be done with SM2.0b, just different bit depth (24 vs. 32). In addition, the SM3.0 just plain doesn't do much extra. It provides tons of features that aren't even used, nor will be for a long time. Hence why I said it comes down to speed mainly.

It seems you are misinformed.

6800GT is capable of FP16 16-bit floating point precision HDR /w blending and also supports the OpenEXR HDR format
x850XT is only capable of FX16 16-bit fixed/integer precision HDR
(neither card can do FP24 or FP32 HDR)

Quite a large difference, especially when most HDR games do not support the older, outdated method ATI uses - meaning you will get no HDR at all most of the time with an x850xt. The screenshots in my first post make it clear how massive the difference is.

You are confusing HDR precision with shader precision, where 6800GT is capable of FP32 and ATI is only capable of FP24. They are two different things.

6800GT essentially offers you the featureset of nextgen ATI R520 and Nvidia G70 cards, while x850xt does not.

 

[{NG}Fidel]

For High Quality HDR for the upcoming Half Life 2: The Lost Coast patch you will also need SM3.0/FP16 HDR, again not available on ATI X850 cards (which will default to a lower quality/contrast ratio integer HDR in the upcoming hl2 patch). Other upcoming games like AoE3, UT2007, and Unreal3 will also likely have an advantage on the 6800GT due to SM3.0/FP16 HDR. Doom3 engine games will also have an advantage, which includes Quake4, Enemy Territory: Quake Wars, and Prey.

Get real the 6800gt will be too dated to play those games with any of those things.
A single GT cant even play Far Cry with HDR at 1280x1024 without hideous frames.
Thats Far Cry imagine next gen games. If you plan to go SLI get the 6800GT if not get the X850XT.

 

[Sizer]

Wha?! Funny. I've never seen bands in water or other visual quality issues. Then again, I choose the high quality setting not performance. Perhaps people getting issues are choosing performance? You don't need that on one of THESE babies, trust me...

I second the 6800GT.

I get bands in Source water with my 6800... everywhere.

 

[tranCendenZ]

I get bands in Source water with my 6800... everywhere.

download latest 71.89 drivers, no banding. if you get banding with 71.89, there is something wrong with your card or driver installation.

 

[dayamdave]

i have a 6800gt....now i want the x850xt

 

[Tengis]

Ide say ATI, I got an Nvidia card now (6800GT) but I wouldve much rather had an ATI card... I just like ATI better, and the SM3.0 doesnt do anything for me.

 

[Siciliano]

X850 XT is faster and though the 6800 GT has SM 3.0, lets face it...you have to play at 1024x768 without any AA or AF just to play SCCT without hideous frames, god, check Hardocp's reviews!

Oh, and I'd rather have AA and AF on at high resolution, then to sacrifice resolution and AA and AF just to get a bright-ish lighting effect. From what I have seen of the lost coast too, apparently, the same AA problem exists. G70 and R520 is where it's at for HDR and SM 3.0. It's just a slight perk on the current 6800 series.

 

[^eMpTy^]

The x850xt is the faster card (it's basically an x800xtpe clock wise right?)...but now that the 6800GT has dropped to $300...you might give it a shot...got some cool toys you can play with which games are starting to use...

If it's worth an extra $100...the x850xt is faster...personally I see no reason to get anything but a 6800GT or an x800xl if you're more into 6xAA than HDR and all that PS3.0 jazz...that's where the bang for the buck is at right now...

 

[JadeDM]

i had a bfg 6800 ultra oc and a XFX 6800 Ultra and i had 2 x800 xt platinum editions. Let me just say, the 6800 ultra was pretty bad in half life 2 and counter strike source compared to the x800 xt pe. Everytime a bomb would go off, my frame would drop to 20-30 fps... and at the start of a round, ALWAYS drop to 40-50 fps. With the x800 xt pe, it would constantly be 80-120. no matter what stuff was going on. I think there was 2 times when there was atleast 10 people on the screen and it dropped to 50... but that was it. I just sold my 6800 ultra and bought an x850 xt myself. Ill let you know when it arrives (its shipping as we speak). I plan to OC it to platinum edition speeds when I get it also.

 

[Nazo]

HL2 runs smoothly as silk at maxed out settings for me. What were you doing, 1280 with 8xFSAA and 16xAF?

Maybe the Radeon is a bit more powerful, I don't know. I just know that there's a bit more features with these things and they are, overall, very good cards. I can't help but wonder how much difference you'll really see between them several years down the road and if the Radeon is going to be so much better that at such a date it'd actually be noticably better than the NVidia.

 

[GoldenTiger]

i had a bfg 6800 ultra oc and a XFX 6800 Ultra and i had 2 x800 xt platinum editions. Let me just say, the 6800 ultra was pretty bad in half life 2 and counter strike source compared to the x800 xt pe. Everytime a bomb would go off, my frame would drop to 20-30 fps... and at the start of a round, ALWAYS drop to 40-50 fps. With the x800 xt pe, it would constantly be 80-120. no matter what stuff was going on. I think there was 2 times when there was atleast 10 people on the screen and it dropped to 50... but that was it. I just sold my 6800 ultra and bought an x850 xt myself. Ill let you know when it arrives (its shipping as we speak). I plan to OC it to platinum edition speeds when I get it also.

While Nvidia still lags far behind in certain engines such as HL2's, ATI has caught up in others such as Doom 3's that it had lagged behind in previously thanks to driver updates. My ATI X800XT AIW 256mb AGP card is currently at 567mhz core, and 601mhz memory, which is beyond X850XT PE speeds. It is completely stable with no artifacts in games such as DAOC, Psychonauts, Half-Life 2, and Counter-Strike: Source. I only got it today, so I'm sure it can be pushed farther with a bit of settling in. I haven't tried higher on the core yet, going slowly on it to make sure things are OK first . If you're overclocking the 6800GT, and overclocking an X850XT as the original poster is considering, the X850XT will be a lot faster than the 6800GT which will usually overclock only to about 6800U speeds. Even stock, an X850XT is about the same as a 6800U. So, once you overclock it, it's a lot faster .

 

[banGerprawN]

Travagin:
Fact of the matter is, the 6800GT should be slightly cheaper than the X850XT, but the X850XT is definitely the faster card in a _majority_ of games. I say majority, because unless you play Doom 3, Chronicles of Riddick or Splinter Cell, you will definitely find better performance at the highest quality settings on just about every other game, and ATi is finally getting out some decent OpenGL support, so if you're prepared to wait for probably another 2 driver releases, nVidia's lead in these games will all but have disappeared.
Yes, to all, the latest drivers for the 6xxx series fixes the water-banding problems. This is therefore a moot (m00t?) point.
SM3.0 is used in what I like to term "sweet FA" amount of games at the moment. As it stands, the implementation of SM3.0 is very gimmicky on nVidia's side.
If you are very, very conscientious on how you spend your money, and are expecting future proof gaming, get the 6800GT. It supports SM3.0 and later on the SLI upgrade path is always there for when it starts to lag behind.
If you are after what is simply a better card RIGHT NOW, with more headroom in current games, and fairly high potential, get the X850XT. Besides the fact that that it's faster at higher image quality, the name is just so much cooler!

 

[R1ckCa1n]

6800GT
-Shader Model 3.0
-OpenEXR FP16 HDR lighting

Glad your major features are useless or require a lower resolution to work....... NEXT

And good luck finding a PCI-E GT at/under MSRP.

 

[GoldenTiger]

Travagin:
unless you play Doom 3, Chronicles of Riddick or Splinter Cell, you will definitely find better performance at the highest quality settings on just about every other game, and ATi is finally getting out some decent OpenGL support, so if you're prepared to wait for probably another 2 driver releases, nVidia's lead in these games will all but have disappeared.

Actually, from the benchmarks I have seen recently, it has pretty much disappeared. Even if it hadn't in an alternate reality, two driver releases is a matter of a month to a month and a half at the pace ATI has been releasing drivers lately.

Travagin:
If you are very, very conscientious on how you spend your money, and are expecting future proof gaming, get the 6800GT. It supports SM3.0 and later on the SLI upgrade path is always there for when it starts to lag behind.QUOTE]

Even in current games, the 6800GT is too slow to use SM3.0 and other features at a playable framerate in normal resolutions that many people's LCD's or large CRT's use. Why would you think that it would be better in FUTURE games that will be MORE stressful?

 

[GoldenTiger]

Oh, well. There you go. What is the point in getting a 6800GT then? Thanks GoldenTiger, another ATi F.a.N.b.O.y happy here.....

I don't give a flying crud who makes my card, so long as it has good drivers, good support, and good performance. The 6800GT does not meet this criteria for me, while the current ATI cards do. If I'm a "fan" of ATI for that, good day, sir! These are not the kinds of forums to be calling people "fan"s. If you wish to debate, construct an argument and use some facts, not a subjective opinion.

 

[banGerprawN]

Even in current games, the 6800GT is too slow to use SM3.0 and other features at a playable framerate in normal resolutions that many people's LCD's or large CRT's use. Why would you think that it would be better in FUTURE games that will be MORE stressful?

Oi. I'm totally barracking for ATi here!
I'm just trying to see the sides of the story.
YES, I KNOW that running SM3.0 is virtually impossible at a resolution where the difference from SM2.0 will be noticed.
YES, I KNOW that it performs crap now, and will likely perform crap in next gen games.
YES, I KNOW that everyone should just support their fav video card, but I can't help seeing the point others have. It's because I'm a frickin' Virgo, damn you!
That said.....buy the ATi, goddammit.

 

[Roberty]

Personally I'd go with the EVGA 6800GT @ Newegg as it's $270 shipped after a $30 rebate. Then again, I'm always the most "Bang For the Buck" kind of guy.

 

[pandora's box]

The next person to say that Shader Model 3.0 makes games run slow on the 6800 GT is going to get smacked.

Openex HDR is not a bloody part of Shader Model 3.0. Shader Model 3.0 BOOSTS performance on the GeForce 6 series. Granted the method of HDR in use in FarCry does have a performance hit but quite frankly its worth the image quality.

http://www.hothardware.com/viewarticle.cfm?articleid=550

(http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=31104)

See, Shader Model 3.0 clearly boosts performance in Far Cry

Plus to the people that say the GeForce 6 series is too slow for Shader Model 3.0, I don't recall you saying the samething about the Radeon 9700 Pro in regard to Shader Model 2.0. Hell the Radeon 9700 Pro can run todays Shader Model 2.0 enabled games fairly well. Granted not with tons of AA and AF piled on but it can handle Far Cry and Half Life 2 at 1024x768 fairly god damned well considering its age.

9700 Pro HL2 Performance:
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2278&p=1

It gets around 50-80fps at 1280x1024 no AA no AF. Not bad for a 3 year old card!

Personally I believe that if you're looking for a card that will last you 2+ years, you want to go with a card that has the advanced features the games of the future will use. I would really like to go into the future about 2 years and see how the GeForce 6 series is playing games compared to the Radeon X series.

Also a small note: You can force the 6800 Series to run in Shader Model 2.0 mode, that way if say in 2 years time for some reason the card isnt capable of performing acceptably with Shader Model 3.0 you can simply force it to run in SM2.0 mode. If however, it is capable of performing well in SM3.0 mode then all is good, unfortunately for those that bought the Radeon X series are stuck with Shader Model 2.0 and will have reduced image quality over those of us who invested in a Shader Model 3.0 capable card today.

 

[Peach]

My friend has a 6800GT and is really happy with it, upgraded from a 9800Pro

 

[Siciliano]

That is just with the shader model 3 path enabled, try using any of the SM 3.0 path features(HDR) and then tell me what you get.

EDIT: Oh and what Reduced IQ? IQ has been proven identical in current games, unless you are talking about using HDR and such again, refer to any of the games using just one feature of SM 3.0 with a 6800 card, and once again...you see, it's almost counter effective to enable HDR and then go and have to turn down like 3 other tried and true IQ settings that do so much more for the game just to have it playable.

HDR would be awesome if it worked with AA atleast, but apparently, it's a system hogging feature. Perhaps ahead of it's time? It's a shame too, cause it seems like such a COOL feature, if it could be used in conjuction with all the norms.

 

[pandora's box]

That is just with the shader model 3 path enabled, try using any of the SM 3.0 path features(HDR) and then tell me what you get.

OMFG! SMACK


dude OPENEXR HDR IS NOT A BLOODY PART OF SHADER MODEL 3.0!!!


smacks head against wall. Actually I might talk to the wall instead, might get some intelligent response from it.

 

[delusion_2005]

Go got the X850XT mate you can't go wrong.

 

[legcramp]

omg is there even a point for this thread lol..and no, I am not a phanboi @ all...ok..

go for the dang x850xt, it's faster, yes there are exceptions, and yes..there are exceptions other than DOOM 3 lol..most people always say, well ati is faster in eevrything, EXCEPT DOOM 3 lol, this is not true but anyways moving on, the x850xt is more comprable to teh ultra, not gt, but anyways..the x850xt is faster in most games vs the mid/high range 6800gt if they are both the same price, get the overall afster card, x850xt.....

a comparison of 6800gt vs x800xl is more appropriate. and I will also say, if the gt is the same price or very close to the XL, the gt is the better card

 

[FanATIc]

deleted for respect

 

[BullseyeBob]

Another vote for the x850xt if you're not going to wait for this summer/falls new line-up.

 

[holycpu]

let me clear things out.

If you want AA/AF max , go for ATI.

if you want HDR max, go for Nvidia.

AA/AF is enabled = HDR disabled, or the other way around.

doesn't matter whether u a SM 3 or SM 2, its a choice between AA/AF and HDR.

NOW, you can choose ur card from there.

 

[SuddenDemise]

What about the X850PRO is that a better choice then a 6800GT, after reading this thread you guys have made me re-think my decision to buy a 6800GT....

 

[FanATIc]

What about the X850PRO is that a better choice then a 6800GT, after reading this thread you guys have made me re-think my decision to buy a 6800GT....

Yes.

Card for card it will hold the lead.

The speeds of an X850 Pro are the exact same as the X850XT i believe and the same core. However its laser cut i believe so its stuck at 12 pixel pipes compared to the 6800gt 16.

It will win in ALL current games *save Doom3* because of raw horsepower, nothing more. I'v noticed its been void of reviews, so im wondering if its a non-official card that manufactures are putting out.

If you want to or plan to OC the 6800GT and you can get it to Ultra speeds you can problably surpass it by a realistically unoticable amount of FPS. However if you plan on plugging it in and forgetting it, yes, it would be faster.

 

[Siciliano]

What about the X850PRO is that a better choice then a 6800GT, after reading this thread you guys have made me re-think my decision to buy a 6800GT....

X800 XL is better then a pro, it has a lower clock speed then the pro, but it more then makes up the performance by having 16 pipes. It's also cheeper from what I gather.

 

[FanATIc]

X800 XL is better then a pro, it has a lower clock speed then the pro, but it more then makes up the performance by having 16 pipes. It's also cheeper from what I gather.

no, not necissarily.

X850 Pro----------- X800 Pro
520 Core speed ----------- 475 Core Speed
1080 Mem speed ----------- 900 Mem Speed
12 Pipes----------- 12

Average 3Dmark03 score for the X850 Pro is ~12400
I think the X800 pro was around 10000 and the X800XL 11k
Use that for comparison.

 

[pandora's box]

ok I would like to ask the OP as to why he made this thread, x850xt vs a 6800 GT? comon there is no competition, the x850XT will win in almost all games (Doom 3 being the exception)

Fanatic: Currently there is no difference in image quality as far as 2.0 vs 3.0 is concerned.

The main reason I replied to this thread was to clear 1 thing up. And that is that OPENEXR HDR is not apart of Shader Model 3.0 specs.

 

[FanATIc]

ok I would like to ask the OP as to why he made this thread, x850xt vs a 6800 GT? comon there is no competition, the x850XT will win in almost all games (Doom 3 being the exception)

Fanatic: Currently there is no difference in image quality as far as 2.0 vs 3.0 is concerned.

The main reason I replied to this thread was to clear 1 thing up. And that is that OPENEXR HDR is not apart of Shader Model 3.0 specs.

cool, no more using Nvidia graphs though, pretty please.

 

[pandora's box]

cool, no more using Nvidia graphs though, pretty please.

Yeah I didn't realize the 1.02 patch was bugged that much anyway now I do.