windows 8 pros and cons

ibewok

n00b
Joined
Nov 18, 2012
Messages
43
I waited until the last day to get the $40 upgrade, now I'm beginning to research pros and cons of windows. Is it possible use windows 8 on desktop mode for everything.until you settle into the new start menu? I'm wondering about listening ro music, sharing photos, going into settings or control panel, putting docs side by and using photoshop, lightroom. Everyone seems to.complain about the new start.menu, but can it be completely bypassed until you feel comfortable with it.

Please share any pros and cons you have experienced as well.
 

Eman D. Rahym

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 23, 2012
Messages
424
There is a complete and fully functional desktop in Windows 8. I can't say every Windows 7 program will work without problem, but the vast majority will, and pretty much just as they did in Windows 7.

There is no more Start Menu. If you live and die by your Start Menu, Windows 8 with its new Start Screen may not be a good fit for you. On the other hand, you can still pin programs to the task bar and access them from there. Unless you use more programs than you can fit on your task bar you need only occasionally go to the Start Screen.

You can pin programs to the Start Screen, you can unpin programs from the Start Screen, you can arrange programs on the Start Screen and you can group programs on the Start Screen and name the groups. If you can get over the initial shock of the Start Screen and work with it you can turn it into a useful tool.

You can search for programs by simply typing while in the Start Screen. I strongly recommend you type "help," then click on "help and support" and then click on the "Get Started" link on the help screen and read the articles there.

Windows 8 uses "hot corners" as an integral part of the interface. Just move your mouse to a corner and then slide it up or down the side of the screen you are on. The left side of your monitor is the "apps bar" where thumbnails of your open Metro apps can be shown. The right side of your monitor is the "charms bar" which lets you get to functionality within apps or Windows.

To shut down your PC, the power options are now located within the "Settings" charm on the right side of your screen. If you have difficulty using the hot corners, hold down the Windows key + C to call up the charms bar.

To access a very handy sub menu, move your mouse cursor to the bottom left corner of the screen and then right click. Alternatively, use the Windows key + X.

To close individual Metro apps that you are running, move the mouse cursor to the top of the screen so that it turns into a hand, then left click to grab the app and drag it to the bottom of the screen.
 

Climber

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jul 27, 2007
Messages
5,283
Yes you can do all that. The desktop is identical to WIndows 7 and functions the same. If you need a start button there are several 3rd party apps you can download for that. Take some time and get to know the keyboard shortcuts as it makes navigation considerably faster and user friendly.
 

bigdogchris

Fully [H]
Joined
Feb 19, 2008
Messages
18,406
Pro: Lightweight OS, fast booting, x86 friendly tablet OS

Con: Obtuse and confusing UI, jarring and annoying desktop/modern UI switching, UI built for touch on keyboard and mouse is not user friendly
 

Climber

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jul 27, 2007
Messages
5,283
Pro: Lightweight OS, fast booting, x86 friendly tablet OS

Con: Obtuse and confusing UI, jarring and annoying desktop/modern UI switching, UI built for touch on keyboard and mouse is not user friendly

I'm just gonna disagree on all your cons. It is very keyboard and mouse friendly. You never have to use live tiles nor do you need to use metro. You can navigate and pin programs to the taskbar and desktop as needed.

Switching from 7 to 8 has been painless and the learning curve wasn't bad at all. If you are reliant on a start button than just download a 3rd party app to replace it.
 

ibewok

n00b
Joined
Nov 18, 2012
Messages
43
How about the 2 docs side-by-side, does the win7 snap still work in desktop mode?

Has anyone found any cool live tiles that show core usage, temps and voltage? (Coretemp had an awesome customizable wigdet for win7 that was perfect for overclocking and monitoring temps through the year.

Anyone using lightroom 3 for Win8 (it's saying on LR4 is certified with W8, but I'd rather not upgrade LR if I don't need to)

I have seen videos of the new rightclick on the new start menu and it's definately optomized for a touchscreen (why would I want to drag my mouse half way down a cross the screen just to hit delete.

Does W8 treat you like an idiot and try to setup a home network or workgroup with every new connection or say stupid things like "you need administrative access to run this" - this is my own dam PC windows!!
 

wiseoracle

2[H]4U
Joined
Aug 22, 2002
Messages
2,305
I finally installed it on my computer...

To be honest, It's not all that bad. You can still use the desktop 90% of the time, like you normally would.

New Start Menu isn't too bad. Once you figure out all the shortcuts of using it, it's surprisingly snappy and quick.
 

heatlesssun

Extremely [H]
Joined
Nov 5, 2005
Messages
44,154
How about the 2 docs side-by-side, does the win7 snap still work in desktop mode?

Yes, Aero Snap and Shake still work perfectly in 8.

Has anyone found any cool live tiles that show core usage, temps and voltage? (Coretemp had an awesome customizable wigdet for win7 that was perfect for overclocking and monitoring temps through the year.

Unfortunately live tiles at this point do not update in real time nor does Windows RT allow access to these low level system parameters.

I have seen videos of the new rightclick on the new start menu and it's definately optomized for a touchscreen (why would I want to drag my mouse half way down a cross the screen just to hit delete.

It is possible to have context menus and I don't know why they aren't used here. Overall management of the Start Screen is very primitive at this point and does need a lot more work to be streamline things. That said I don't think that the mouse movement is as big of a deal as some make it out to be. There's more mouse movement here but the movements are courser and targets bigger.

Does W8 treat you like an idiot and try to setup a home network or workgroup with every new connection or say stupid things like "you need administrative access to run this" - this is my own dam PC windows!!

Not exactly sure what you mean by this. When I connect to a new network the only this I see is the dialog about sharing.
 

Climber

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jul 27, 2007
Messages
5,283
He asked for a pro and con list. I provide one, yet the fanbois only see pro's.

I have provided a generic list of common complaints and benefits of the OS.

Fanbois opinions are subjective and thus irrelevant. I will maintain a objective, neutral position on the matter.

Next we'll be asking the NRA what their stance on gun violence is.

Nice using the fanboy retort. Your cons are incorrect, it isn't a matter of fanboy love, they are just incorrect. You have an option to use the desktop or metro or both if you so choose. Windows 8 gives you an option, it doesn't force you to use one or the other. If it did I would agree with you wholeheartedly.

As far as Lightroom 3 it works fine in Windows 8 and yes UAC is still a huge part of Windows 8 but just as in Windows 7 you can foolishly choose to turn it off. As far as dragging your mouse halfway across the screen to hit delete I'm unsure of what you mean by this. If I right click a program, task, or icon I can right click and the delete box comes up right where I clicked it. The desktop version of Windows 8 runs IDENTICAL to Windows 7.
 

ReconSniper

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Apr 3, 2002
Messages
1,860
Well, I bought it but haven't installed it. I play BF3 and right now Origin DOES NOT support windows 8. Some have managed to get it to work, but even on the origin download site it doesn't list Windows 8 as compatible. So until it is, I cant install.
 

Oldie

Mean Old Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Jan 12, 2004
Messages
21,889
As far as dragging your mouse halfway across the screen to hit delete I'm unsure of what you mean by this. If I right click a program, task, or icon I can right click and the delete box comes up right where I clicked it. The desktop version of Windows 8 runs IDENTICAL to Windows 7.

I think he meant when modifying start screen items..there's no context menu on the metro screen so you have to select then go all the way to the bottom for the action you want.

I've been using Windows 8 for a couple of months now as my primary OS and it works pretty well as a traditional operating system. For me the start menu has just been replaced with a whole start screen, I don't use any metro apps at all.

As far as the metro apps do go though, I have to say I'm less than impressed to say the least. I got a new laptop for my kid and he wanted to play some of the traditional windows games and the "Games" metro app would not launch. We would get the load screen for a second then it disappeared. I finally figured out that you could update it from the separate "store" application and now it loads up just fine...BUT I installed microsoft's card games pack (solitaire, etc..) and it also will not load...just flashes up for a second then takes me back to the start screen. It happens on his laptop and my desktop. My completely individual and anecdotal evidence would say that the Windows Marketplace is a broken POS.
 

Computer Ed

Weaksauce
Joined
Nov 15, 2007
Messages
93
The biggest con to Windows 8 in my opinion is the integration/segregation of the Modern UI and the Desktop.

I have talked about this over the three article piece I did on Windows 8 in my blog. However I will summarize it for you here.

Pros: Windows 8 is basically a very streamlined version of Windows 7 at it's core. The mistake people make is saying it is a Tablet OS put on a desktop. This is wrong, it is a Desktop OS with a Tablet interface tacked on. The file management and task management tools have had some very nice updates and the overall OS is snappier.

Cons: Windows 8 has a serious identity crisis on a Desktop system. When you open a Desktop app the system kicks to Desktop and then runs the app, not really a big deal but then when you leave the app it leaves you stranded on the Desktop until you purposefully move it back to the Start Screen. This shows that the Modern UI is tacked on. I understand the need for a compatibility move to the Desktop for some programs but the fact the OS does not keep you in the Modern UI if that is your choice and strands you outside of it is just sloppy programming.

There are other cons and pros as well but these are the most obvious. To me another big con is the very apps provided for the Modern UI. The mail program is crap as is the picture viewer and Acrobat reader. They all lack the basic functionality that has existed for some time and it is again lazy on the part of MS that the same functionality is not present. The good news is you can download and install the desktop versions and regain the functionality you lost.

If you want the underlying code improvements without messing with the modern UI then you are in luck. There are a number of free and low cost solutions to return the traditional interface to the front of the OS. My weapon of choice for this has been Start8, it is the most versatile of the solutions offered and $5 is cheap.

In the end what I suggest to people is this. If you have Windows 7 then stay put, there is nothing in 8 that is compelling enough to make the leap at this time. That is unless you use your PC like a mobile device and use only the kinds of apps found in the Modern UI. If you have Windows Vista, XP or older and want to move forward, or you are building a new system then I suggest going with Windows 8. It will have all the support going forward and it is simple enough to use the old interface style if the Modern UI is to much of a transition.
 

DeathFromBelow

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jul 15, 2005
Messages
7,316
You have an option to use the desktop or metro or both if you so choose. Windows 8 gives you an option, it doesn't force you to use one or the other.

Other than having to install a 3rd party addon to get the damn start menu back... sure. :rolleyes:

Out of the box you have a sort of weird Frankenstein interface where viewing your programs library, opening some system settings, and accessing the shut down menu require you to switch back and forth between a desktop and tablet style interface. It's not a gamebreaker, but it was very poorly done. Microsoft clearly put most of the Windows 8 development time into porting Windows to ARM. I'd expect later versions to be much more refined than this.

I have both 7 and 8 installed on my desktop and 8 on my MSI Windpad tablet. Here's what I don't like about 8:
- The aforementioned Frankenstein combination of desktop and tablet UI's. I personally think Metro (or whatever they're calling it now) is completely worthless. It works, but it doesn't add anything useful. Even on the Tablet I prefer to use the Classic Shell start menu over the new Start Screen.

- I preferred the aero glass theme over the boxy Metro look, but that's entirely subjective.

- Media Center (not media player, media center) has been removed. It was previously a feature included with Vista/7 Home Premium. I use it to watch cable on my PC and as a launcher for my DVD/Blu Ray rips (with the media browser plugin). You can get it back, but you have to buy Windows 8 Pro and then pay an additional $10 for the Media Center Pack. Microsoft claims they did this because Media Center included codecs that they don't want to continue to license, but they don't include the codecs with the new $10 Media Center pack... I don't like being nickled-and-dimed, especially since the new version adds absolutely nothing.

- I'm still having performance issues with the current AMD beta driver and my HD7970. When 8 first launched I was having serious issues with massive framerate drops, even Minecraft was slowing to a crawl (it's buttery smooth on 7). A lot of things are working fine now, but I still get weird slowdowns in a few games. I expect this to be fixed as drivers are refined, I had the same issue when transitioning from XP to Vista. By the time Vista SP1 came out Vista was actually faster than XP.

Pros:
- 8 Boots faster.

- Antivirus is integrated.

- Hyper-V on 8 Pro is nice.

Basically, I don't really see any reason to jump from 7 to 8 on a current machine. If you're building or buying a new machine there's nothing horribly wrong with it if you don't mind the UI.
 

Climber

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jul 27, 2007
Messages
5,283
I think he meant when modifying start screen items..there's no context menu on the metro screen so you have to select then go all the way to the bottom for the action you want.

Oh gotcha. Ya that was annoying. Don't notice it at all anymore though.

As far as the metro apps do go though, I have to say I'm less than impressed to say the least. I got a new laptop for my kid and he wanted to play some of the traditional windows games and the "Games" metro app would not launch. We would get the load screen for a second then it disappeared. I finally figured out that you could update it from the separate "store" application and now it loads up just fine...BUT I installed microsoft's card games pack (solitaire, etc..) and it also will not load...just flashes up for a second then takes me back to the start screen. It happens on his laptop and my desktop. My completely individual and anecdotal evidence would say that the Windows Marketplace is a broken POS.

You know, I ran across that exact same thing as well. I forgot about it until you just brought it up. I'm going to go try it again, but ya the Marketplace is pretty lackluster at the time being.
 

bigdogchris

Fully [H]
Joined
Feb 19, 2008
Messages
18,406
I did not mean to sound like a troll in my previous post.

I just wanted to say that was disappointed in being the only person at that time to of provided a pro and con list, as requested, but was attacked for the cons. I would like to see some of the Windows 8 fans here provide a legitimate con list, which they have been unable to do. That's why it's easy to regress to calling someone a fanboi.
 

Climber

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jul 27, 2007
Messages
5,283
I did not mean to sound like a troll in my previous post.

I just wanted to say that was disappointed in being the only person at that time to of provided a pro and con list, as requested, but was attacked for the cons. I would like to see some of the Windows 8 fans here provide a legitimate con list, which they have been unable to do. That's why it's easy to regress to calling someone a fanboi.

It isn't about being a fan or anything like that nor were you attacked, I disagreed with you. When I made my decision if I liked the OS or not it came down to a few simple questions

Does the OS work? Yes.
Does it make my life simpler, easier, and without hassle as I use it? Yes it does.
Do my programs work? Yes they do.
Can I game on it? Yes I can.
Was there a learning curve? Yes there was.
Is there a difference between Windows 8 and Windows 7? Yes. Hence the learning curve, same as every other release of a Windows OS in their history.

If you want a list of "cons" then I guess I can point to the immature marketplace, transitions of desktop apps, a learning curve; however, if you have an IQ over a baker's dozen it shouldn't take you longer than an hour to get Windows 8, lack of codecs in the Media Center, and a couple other nuances here and there that still pop up.

Those complaints are really not complaints at all to be honest. The marketplace is immature which is to be expected given it is less than 6 months old. If anyone remembers the Android marketplace when it launched it sucked ass compared to the Apple Marketplace. In time it has become considerably better but even still it lacks many apps and games that are found on the Apple store. The Microsoft store will hopefully improve, but if it is anything like Android it will take a couple years to really get some traction under it.

Desktop apps...personal preference here depending on the apps. The Learning Curve really isn't all that bad. I was hesitant to buy Windows 8 but I needed a new OS in a hurry and I could have bought Windows 7 Professional from my school for $199 or Windows 8 Pro for $10...guess which I chose. The whole OS install was the easiest and quickest I've ever done. The quickness and responsiveness of the OS is quite literally the best thing ever for my day to day use. Then came the whole boot up into the "metro" interface and I was like WTF...after 10 minutes of web searching I had the whole thing down, then came the keyboard commands. These took a little bit of time to get down and it felt mostly like I was learning the keyboard commands to SC2 after not playing SC1 in such a long time, they were familiar but not familiar at the same time if you catch my drift. Took about an hour or so to learn how to navigate, use the "metro" interface to suit me, and the various keyboard commands. Really wasn't bad at all and made me scratch my head at all the complaints I had read and was still reading in regards to Windows 8. Don't take this the wrong way Chris but have you even used Windows 8? Your post makes it sound like you haven't and are just repeating fud from various sources because all the things you posted were what were making me hesitant about purchasing it in the first place.

Look, when I first hopped on an Apple Computer after using Windows forever, I had a similar experience and I hated the Apple OS. I thought it sucked, was counter intuitive, and flat out bassackwards. However, since my parents bought one I went out and got me a MBP so I could help them out if necessary. It took me a few days of playing with it to figure it out but once I did there are a lot of things in it that just made sense. I eventually ended up making a lot of tweaks my Windows installation so it was more to my style. Over the years I've used a lot of 3rd party programs, mostly from Stardock, to tweak Windows XP and Windows 7. The majority of those tweaks are standard in Windows 8 or make it easy to do. The learning curve in Windows 8 was considerably easier than the learning curve in OSX and Linux. As such I really don't consider a learning curve as a "con" for an OS.

As far as the lack of codecs in Windows 8 I can understand MS position and to be honest I've always went and got my own so this wasn't much of a hassle. If anything Windows 8 tries to be too much at once if you want a serious con. It tries to appeal to the casual consumer, the enthusiast, and the AV consumers so what is easy for one person isn't for another and what makes sense for another makes no sense to another person. And that is where I think Windows 8 is getting so much flac. People see all these complaints from various consumer and tech sites and think the entire OS is broken. It isn't and it works fine, just each person needs to tinker with it to fit what works best for them IMO.
 

ob1

2[H]4U
Joined
Apr 17, 2000
Messages
2,274
I use 8 almost in the same identical way that I used 7, so I'm probably missing out on some of the new stuff. I like 8 though and wouldn't go back. The only thing I see that I am missing from 7 is the aero desktop GUI, where you had the 3D effects and transparency and things like that, (8 has a flat 2D theme). Other than that, I would say I'm happy with the new OS.
 

DeathFromBelow

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jul 15, 2005
Messages
7,316
As far as the lack of codecs in Windows 8 I can understand MS position and to be honest I've always went and got my own so this wasn't much of a hassle. If anything Windows 8 tries to be too much at once if you want a serious con.

Did you read my post? The loss of codecs is a minor issue. What I'm annoyed about is that they removed Media Center. They're forcing you to buy Windows 8 Pro plus pay another $10 for the 'Media Center Pack' just to put it back in. They didn't even change it, there are no new features at all and it doesn't include DVD playback like Windows 7. This is a feature that was included with regular old $100 Windows Vista/7 Home Premium. What they're doing is idiotic if they actually want to encourage users with HTPC's to upgrade to 8 now that the special pricing deals are over. Why are they nickel-and-dimming users for a feature that has been downgraded?

You're deflecting when you talk about how the 'learning curve' isn't a big deal. Nobody said the interface has a difficult 'learning curve,' we're saying the new interface is a turd. It's a Frankenstein mash-up of the traditional Windows desktop with a crummy tablet interface. It's disjointed, it doesn't make the OS easier to use, and it doesn't add anything useful. I have an actual tablet and I still prefer the Classic Shell start menu over the Start Screen. How the dipshits at Microsoft managed to create a full screen start screen with less functionality than the old start menu is beyond me. Why not let users access all of the computer settings from a button on the start screen rather than putting some of them over on the charms menu? You can log off by clicking the username on the Start Screen... why not put the shutdown options there too? Why can't we have folders? So many bad design decisions...

I don't think faster boot times and Hyper-V make up for all that. There's nothing in the Windows Store that makes the new interface worth the hassle. There's nothing in Windows 8 that makes it a compelling upgrade for current 7 users. You just lose features.
 

Hagrid

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Nov 23, 2006
Messages
9,134
Did you read my post? The loss of codecs is a minor issue. What I'm annoyed about is that they removed Media Center. They're forcing you to buy Windows 8 Pro plus pay another $10 for the 'Media Center Pack' just to put it back in. They didn't even change it, there are no new features at all and it doesn't include DVD playback like Windows 7. This is a feature that was included with regular old $100 Windows Vista/7 Home Premium. What they're doing is idiotic if they actually want to encourage users with HTPC's to upgrade to 8 now that the special pricing deals are over. Why are they nickel-and-dimming users for a feature that has been downgraded?

You're deflecting when you talk about how the 'learning curve' isn't a big deal. Nobody said the interface has a difficult 'learning curve,' we're saying the new interface is a turd. It's a Frankenstein mash-up of the traditional Windows desktop with a crummy tablet interface. It's disjointed, it doesn't make the OS easier to use, and it doesn't add anything useful. I have an actual tablet and I still prefer the Classic Shell start menu over the Start Screen. How the dipshits at Microsoft managed to create a full screen start screen with less functionality than the old start menu is beyond me. Why not let users access all of the computer settings from a button on the start screen rather than putting some of them over on the charms menu? You can log off by clicking the username on the Start Screen... why not put the shutdown options there too? Why can't we have folders? So many bad design decisions...

I don't think faster boot times and Hyper-V make up for all that. There's nothing in the Windows Store that makes the new interface worth the hassle. There's nothing in Windows 8 that makes it a compelling upgrade for current 7 users. You just lose features.

Its a hybrid which is why your probably not going to get the best of both worlds with it.
I like it with classic shell on it, but yes the new "features" dont help me much with anything that I couldnt do in 7 just fine.

If they decide to split it into 2 OS's, then that would be the start of a great OS for both tablets and desktop/laptops.
 

Climber

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jul 27, 2007
Messages
5,283
Did you read my post?

I wasn't responding to you.

What they're doing is idiotic if they actually want to encourage users with HTPC's to upgrade to 8 now that the special pricing deals are over. Why are they nickel-and-dimming users for a feature that has been downgraded?

You're deflecting when you talk about how the 'learning curve' isn't a big deal. Nobody said the interface has a difficult 'learning curve,' we're saying the new interface is a turd. It's a Frankenstein mash-up of the traditional Windows desktop with a crummy tablet interface. It's disjointed, it doesn't make the OS easier to use, and it doesn't add anything useful. I have an actual tablet and I still prefer the Classic Shell start menu over the Start Screen. How the dipshits at Microsoft managed to create a full screen start screen with less functionality than the old start menu is beyond me. Why not let users access all of the computer settings from a button on the start screen rather than putting some of them over on the charms menu? You can log off by clicking the username on the Start Screen... why not put the shutdown options there too? Why can't we have folders? So many bad design decisions...

Not sure why you're continually putting words in my mouth but if you bother to read many of the other Window 8 threads you'll see this as one of the many "common" complaints to which I was responding to bigdogchris. If you'll bother to read between the lines, you're saying the OS is too hard to use which I disagree with hence the learning curve; however, you don't like the new interface or start screen and I can't fault you for that as it was as you said a huge "mashup" which it is. Given time though I have come to actually enjoy it since it automatically adds last known programs used in it and I can see quickly and accurately what I need to. I've only been on Windows 8 for a couple weeks now and to me there is zero difference between 7 and 8. 8 has the uncanny knack of actually being more beneficial and adding more features that I use over Windows 7 on a daily basis, hence I like it considerably more than 7 but they are little things that honestly I wouldn't really miss if I had to go back to 7.

There's nothing in the Windows Store that makes the new interface worth the hassle.
I agree
There's nothing in Windows 8 that makes it a compelling upgrade for current 7 users.
I agree; however, there was nothing in Windows 7 that compelled an upgrade from XP either. Windows 8 is new and if you have 7 then there is no reason to upgrade from that. However, if your on XP or even Vista and need to upgrade then 8 isn't a horrible decision to upgrade to.
You just lose features.
I disagree.
 

Hagrid

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Nov 23, 2006
Messages
9,134
I wasn't responding to you.





Not sure why you're continually putting words in my mouth but if you bother to read many of the other Window 8 threads you'll see this as one of the many "common" complaints to which I was responding to bigdogchris. If you'll bother to read between the lines, you're saying the OS is too hard to use which I disagree with hence the learning curve; however, you don't like the new interface or start screen and I can't fault you for that as it was as you said a huge "mashup" which it is. Given time though I have come to actually enjoy it since it automatically adds last known programs used in it and I can see quickly and accurately what I need to. I've only been on Windows 8 for a couple weeks now and to me there is zero difference between 7 and 8. 8 has the uncanny knack of actually being more beneficial and adding more features that I use over Windows 7 on a daily basis, hence I like it considerably more than 7 but they are little things that honestly I wouldn't really miss if I had to go back to 7.


I agree

I agree; however, there was nothing in Windows 7 that compelled an upgrade from XP either. Windows 8 is new and if you have 7 then there is no reason to upgrade from that. However, if your on XP or even Vista and need to upgrade then 8 isn't a horrible decision to upgrade to.

I disagree.

But you are saying all this which is really only your opinion, which people are going to disagree with you on.
Yes, win 8 is missing stuff, there is no opinion on that, its just a fact.

Like I said, for me, win 8 would of been awesome if it was like win 7, just with the upgrades. Keep the tablet stuff to tablets. For now, it was a good thing that MS kept the code in win 8, so that the 3rd parties could make it better for some people.
 

Climber

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jul 27, 2007
Messages
5,283
Yes but it seems like, including you, that the majority of people disagreeing haven't even used Windows 8 (DFB has just so there is no confusion)

And yes everything has been my opinion not sure why this is even being brought up. DFB and I are discussing the differences we like and don't like. Nothing I ever said was from an adamant position.
 

Godmachine

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Apr 7, 2003
Messages
10,472
Pro: Lightweight OS, fast booting, x86 friendly tablet OS

Con: Obtuse and confusing UI, jarring and annoying desktop/modern UI switching, UI built for touch on keyboard and mouse is not user friendly

Fully agree with this conclusion.

If you are already comfortable with Windows 7 , Windows 8 is unlikely to win you over with any features.
 

Hagrid

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Nov 23, 2006
Messages
9,134
Yes but it seems like, including you, that the majority of people disagreeing haven't even used Windows 8 (DFB has just so there is no confusion)

And yes everything has been my opinion not sure why this is even being brought up. DFB and I are discussing the differences we like and don't like. Nothing I ever said was from an adamant position.

I use it and it works fine, but I do have classicshell.
I didnt think there was anything wrong with anything in 7 for me, so I wanted 8 to be the same, but with the upgrades. :)
 

bigdogchris

Fully [H]
Joined
Feb 19, 2008
Messages
18,406
I'd really like to see a pro and con list from Heat and Eman.

Climber, things like 'lack of maturity/immature market' is not a con as it is something every OS goes through, even 7.

When you list a con, then put a asterisks after it and a list of why it's not "really" a con, you're being subjective.

I don't like Windows 8, yet I am able to say without question what some of the good things are about it. I wish more people were able to have a neutral stance on stuff so we wouldn't have so much bickering.
 
Last edited:

Climber

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jul 27, 2007
Messages
5,283
I'd really like to see a pro and con list from Heat and Eman.

Climber, things like "lack of maturity" is not a con as it is something every OS goes through, even 7.

Exactly which is why I'm perplexed so many people use it as a con.
 

bigdogchris

Fully [H]
Joined
Feb 19, 2008
Messages
18,406
You responded after I changed my quote. However,...
If you want a list of "cons" then I guess I can point to the immature marketplace,
How is this a difference than "so many people use it as a con"?
 

Hagrid

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Nov 23, 2006
Messages
9,134
Exactly which is why I'm perplexed so many people use it as a con.

I wasnt surprised, they changed quite a bit from the previous versions.
Some people like it, some dont.
Maturity is a given, though more and more drivers are coming out which is good.
 

Climber

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jul 27, 2007
Messages
5,283
You responded after I changed my quote. However,...How is this a difference than "so many people use it as a con"?

Because you wanted a list of cons and I was trying to be subjective for you so I wouldn't have to see you spell fanboy like a prepubescent xbox live spaz again;)
 

Hagrid

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Nov 23, 2006
Messages
9,134
I'd really like to see a pro and con list from Heat and Eman.

Climber, things like 'lack of maturity/immature market' is not a con as it is something every OS goes through, even 7.

When you list a con, then put a asterisks after it and a list of why it's not "really" a con, you're being subjective.

I don't like Windows 8, yet I am able to say without question what some of the good things are about it. I wish more people were able to have a neutral stance on stuff so we wouldn't have so much bickering.

But have you tried one of the 3rd party software solutions(if it will help the stuff you dont like)?
MS should be really thankful that the 3rd party software came out, or it would of been even lower sales.
 

odditory

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Dec 23, 2007
Messages
6,482
MS should be really thankful that the 3rd party software came out, or it would of been even lower sales.

It really is quite a phenomenon and obviously one they hadnt foreseen. A few weeks ago pokki reported 1.5 mil downloads of their start menu replacement and Stardock reported when they hit a million as well. And there are many more start menu replacements beyond those - classic shell, etc - with more seeming to appear every day. That goes beyond the silly 'people don't like change' apologist rhetoric, that's a wholesale rejection of metro store o/s as the focal point and hub of windows on the desktop.

Then you factor all the people that either don't know start menu replacements exist but would install if they did, or people that would install but don't know how - you know the technophobes that pick up a PC at office depot or best buy and don't know any better and those PC's all have Window 8 on them, these stores don't even sell 7 anymore so there's no choice if you need to run x86 apps.

I wonder how long MS thinks they can hide their head in the sand that a tablet o/s is just not going to stick on the desktop. They could've saved themselves the entire avalanche's worth of negative press if they'd simply given people an option at boot up when windows doesn't detect a touch display. An actual option.
 
Last edited:

Climber

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Jul 27, 2007
Messages
5,283
...I wonder how long MS thinks they can hide their head in the sand that a tablet o/s is just not going to stick on the desktop. They could've saved themselves the entire avalanche's worth of negative press if they'd simply given people an option at boot up when windows doesn't detect a touch display. An actual option.

You keep repeating this but I never go to the "metro" interface. My PC runs desktop mode fine with zero need to touch any of the tiles unless I want to. Sounds like an option to me.

The only thing that people will notice in desktop mode is the lack of a start button which is easily remedied by a 3rd party app. Outside of that it functions exactly the same as Windows 7.
 

Wrench00

2[H]4U
Joined
Sep 30, 2003
Messages
3,423
Con

Windows 8 and Server 2012 are MUCH BUGGIER then 7 or 2k8r2 was at RTM.

I am talking about corporate market not consumer. 8/2012 I don't think was beta tested at ALL.
 

Hagrid

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Nov 23, 2006
Messages
9,134
You keep repeating this but I never go to the "metro" interface. My PC runs desktop mode fine with zero need to touch any of the tiles unless I want to. Sounds like an option to me.

The only thing that people will notice in desktop mode is the lack of a start button which is easily remedied by a 3rd party app. Outside of that it functions exactly the same as Windows 7.

It doesnt but thats ok, as long as you like it, thats all that counts.
 

Eman D. Rahym

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 23, 2012
Messages
424
I'd really like to see a pro and con list from Heat and Eman.
Why? What possible purpose could this serve other than to stir up yet another pointless debate? I'm not going to change your mind. You're not going to change mine. You don't like Windows 8, while I have no problem with it. If you hadn't noticed, over the last few weeks I've backed away from the endless squabbling over Windows 8.

In this case, in addition to asking for pros and cons, the OP asked specific questions about Windows 8. I tried to answer them and gave additional info on Windows 8 that I thought would be helpful to the OP. Is trying to help people with Windows 8 controversial now?

I don't like Windows 8, yet I am able to say without question what some of the good things are about it. I wish more people were able to have a neutral stance on stuff so we wouldn't have so much bickering.
And yet here you are calling out me and heatlesssun. I can't speak for heatlesssun, but leave me out of it. I will however go on giving what advice I can to people who ask for it or seem to need it. Isn't that really the whole point of the OS forum?
 

maw

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Sep 27, 2000
Messages
4,133
Works great in desktop mode. I have little use for Metro apps and never warmed up to the new Start Screen. However, there are so many awesome third party apps to bring back the start menu that the new start screen is pretty much a non-issue for me now.
If you hate the new start screen, I encourage you to try Startisback, Pokki, or Start8. The couple minutes it takes to download and install any of them will make all your hatred melt away. ;)
 

KENNYB

2[H]4U
Joined
Jul 26, 2004
Messages
3,147
Pro: choose to your optimize your SSD and Windows 8 will trim your drive. At least that's what it says it's doing.
 

heatlesssun

Extremely [H]
Joined
Nov 5, 2005
Messages
44,154
I'd really like to see a pro and con list from Heat and Eman.

Eman probably right about yet another ridiculous debate and it's not like plenty of people that like Windows 8 around here haven't pointed out problems with 8, I certainly have. I've mentioned cons the I've listed here, many, many, many times but yet get called a mindeless fanboy. But what the heck, at least I try to be fair and open about things.

Cons:
1. Lack if multiple monitor support for Modern UI apps
2. Start Screen lacks good automatic management and management tools
3. Can present a learning curve and there really is no in the box training or getting started material

Pros:
1. Much better on tablets and touch than previous versions of Windows
2. Better integration with cloud services that allows for synching of settings, web favriotes, etc.
3. Much simplified file backup tool in File History that while not as advanced as the file versions in 7 & Vista is probably more useful for average users.

I don't like Windows 8, yet I am able to say without question what some of the good things are about it. I wish more people were able to have a neutral stance on stuff so we wouldn't have so much bickering.

It's not so much a matter of being neutral, everyone has their biases. I think it's more of looking at things from different perspectives. But the perspective easiest to understand is one's own. I can't make you like Windows 8 anymore than you can tell me that Windows 8 has problems X,Y,Z and this isn't a good OS or unusable when it is doing everything I want and more than Windows 7 does, but that's from the perspective from a Windows tablet user.
 

odditory

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Dec 23, 2007
Messages
6,482
You keep repeating this but I never go to the "metro" interface. My PC runs desktop mode fine with zero need to touch any of the tiles unless I want to. Sounds like an option to me.

The only thing that people will notice in desktop mode is the lack of a start button which is easily remedied by a 3rd party app. Outside of that it functions exactly the same as Windows 7.

Thats great but I was speaking of the metro store o/s as seen through the eyes of average consumers - again, which typically don't have the knowledge or ability to fix what's broken out of the box. Obviously geeks on a tech forum will have a greater ability to find ways to tolerate or sidestep the tablet interface, that wasn't the point.

I'm sure MS sees the mass Metro-on-desktop backlash as a major irritant to their longterm appstore goals but its not going away until they make some adjustments or concessions.
 
Last edited:
Top