Windows 7 Under Fire for ‘Treacherous Computing’

TFA said:
The group is also sending a letter (available at the group's Web site) to top executives at Fortune 500 companies that argues their companies would benefit ethically, technically and, in the long-term, financially, from switching away from Windows and Microsoft Office to free alternatives such as Linux and OpenOffice.org.
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Hmmm.
Our financial software: nope.
Engineering software (CAD, load calcs, Title 24 Compliance, equipment selection tools): nope.
Office: maybe, but everyone here knows MS office forwards and backwards, would be a monumental waste of time and resources to move away from that, not to mention a huge library (100,000+ documents).
Time accounting: nope (uses MS-SQL, does not play nice with MySQL; client uses .Net frameworks).
Hardware support: I _know_ that what I have works with Windows.
Network management tools: the firewall runs a heavily modified Linux system from flash, but the management software is Windows only.
Printers/Plotters/Scanners: the DJ500 we use has no official Unix/Linux driver, the only Unix software for it is one of the firmware updates. No Linux support for out Canon MFDs or our Samsung laser printers, Our LaserJet 5000 _might_ work using a generic LJ PostScript driver.
Server: Active directory, Group Policy, profiles, backups software...while I've heard that there has been progress with LDAP and AD equivalents on Linux, nothing they have beats the ease of use that I have in Windows Server 2003.

This is all for an engineering office of less than 20 people. I cannot even imagine what sorts of things a large corporation would run into in terms of just trying to switch.

Our long term support costs consist of me occasionally (once a month) checking for routine updates to all our software and occasionally fixing a downed workstation (which almost always comes back to user error or a hardware failure, our only BSODs have all been related to bad RAM, or a known issue with an out of date nVidia driver). A properly configured and maintained Windows network will (in general) run fairly trouble free. 90+% of my time is spent actually doing billable work, not troubleshooting our workstations.

Unix/Linux systems have a place, but our office isn't one of them. If it works for other environments then good. I'm all for picking the right tool for the right job.
 
After reading this large thread I decided to chime in with two stories I have.

A couple months back one of our clients bought a new HP server they wanted to add to their Linux/Oracle setup. I was tasked with getting the OS and Oracle software on there to get ready for moving the server to their location. Well let's just say I spent 3 hours trying to get the RedHat 5.2 (latest version at the time) to see the network card. Going to HP's site I found that they had 4 different network adapter driver source (not even binaries). Not knowing which adapter was in the server I began with the first one. After an hour of trying to get the source to compile (RPM dependency hell), I gave up on it. I grabbed our copy of Windows Server 2008 and in 15 minutes was up and running. Another couple minutes later I was able to identify the network adapter (Windows found all devices and drivers for them). After my short lived bliss of having a working server I proceeded to install RedHat again (6 CD's!!) this time installing every single RPM there was (no way in hell was I going to search the 6 discs for RPM's again). Eventually I got the correct driver compiled and installed into the OS and managed to finish off the install. The adapter was an newer Intel adapter, you would thing RedHat would have the driver already for it....

My second story involves our office email server. About two years ago a co-worker was tasked with upgrading our old ass Oracle Collaboration Suite to the then new 10g version. After all was said and done he spend close to 3 months of man hours onit (spread over almost a year) and a dozen Linux reinstalls when something inevitable fucked up. This past Friday and Monday I got a Windows Server 2008 (running in a VM) running and setup with Exchange Server 2007. Not only was it very painless but it works remarkably well in the VM. Also the integration with Outlook, iPhone and (the new) OSX is just miles beyond. So even though Exchange, Windows and the user licenses are more now it's still alot cheapr (when you add the labor) to get it going on Windows.
 
That's the thing about Windows. It's usually not hard to setup, even a server. Not to say that it can't be fustrating but I can't remember the last time I did an install of ANY version of Windows, XP, Server 2003/2008, Vista, 7, and it not pick up a wired network card.
 
I can, but it was 4-5 years ago when WiFi still wasn't ubiquitous. :p Getting wireless cards working properly pre-SP2 was often a royal PITA, it's been smooth sailing since then tho. Once they wrestled control away from all those horrible configuration apps that came with each manufacturer's cards (with the exception of Intel's) and built it right into Windows it all just worked dandy.

With Linux the newer the chipset the worse off you're as far as driver support much of the time.
 
FoxhoundOp said:
No, they don't.
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Yeah, they do.

My last Linux foray took 30 seconds to boot and another 5-10 to login. I just fired up my desktop from a cold boot into Windows 7 in around 15 seconds. And this was the newest Ubuntu with its "improved boot times." (Which admittedly did help: it reduced boot from about a minuted to around 30 seconds.)
 
WTF? It always amazes me how people can believe that software (GOOD software) magically appears?!?
ALL software takes $$ to make (payed salary, donated time etc) . . whether profit is made or not is a choice ( though profit is good for a economy). "free" software is never free as people spend productive time on it (payed or not). I am at a loss how this is good if used as a general rule rather then solely for shareware level stuff. An economy requires the movement of $ . . wasting productive time on something that will not add to your personal or the economy at large is generally a bad thing and gets worse the more widespread. Though I happily doubt this will happen on a large scale I am surprised how eager people are for the economic mess it would create.

For and example of a CO using this for $$. .
My CO Started giving away it's quite proprietary OS away free and made it "open source" . . all happy and crunchy for the current movement . . . . .
Now if anyone thinks customers are really getting the OS for "free" and if they think it is truly 100% "open source" they did not look close enough at the fine print or are quite blind. . . As we charge even more for support and hardware then we have in the past. Also the "open source" is more like, "open" only in areas we designate, and only IF we want to. Which boils down to getting our customers to fix minor bugs and add minor functionally what we do not really care too much about and do not want to put our resources on. (a rather nice twist on that "open source" ideal :) )
Now all of this is legal and I have no qualms about it (we do need to make $$, we need to grow and I like my paycheck) but if people really believe the marketing song and dance . . . they just show how ignorant they really truly are. It is all a marketing ploy that we and any other CO that can will use for profit . . screw the happy happy joy joy ideals.

I think "open source" and Linux "movement?" is rather like the 50's hippie free love / communism movements . . . great ideas but in practice, But totally untenable in reality and will only end in failure due to our rather immutable human nature.
What will most likely happen (again sort of like the current "organic movement" ie now a sham) is that any "true" ideals that may have started it, gets in everyday practice dropped fast and companies large and small just use the now existing and over hyped "feel good" marketing to sell the same old stuff in a slightly different and some times MORE profitable way.

Also, The various flavors of windows, Linux, Unix, and (I guess older non unix apple OS's) currently used are JUST OS's!? people being all religious over them is insane. They all have uses, and good and bad points . . normal users will use the more user friendly and prolific and work/power users will use OS's to fit there work flow . . why would anyone do other? I use 2-3 different OS's daily trying to use one would only cripple my work/play. But I am constantly barraged by propaganda from all directions saying there can be only one?!
I dismiss all of them as effective but quite biased marketing. and dismiss hordes of "true believers" as mindless sheep or simple uneducated idiots.
It is good to see people here that ops out drinking the various "cool-aid" being handed out :) and disturbing to see those who gussle it down . .
 
Vryce said:
It's a general lack of understanding of trade. Not free trade. Not economies. Just a lack of understanding of trade, in general. Trade is the backbone of civilization and a segment of ours just doesn't seem to understand it at all. Complete failure of our educational system (which includes parents).
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QFT, This right here should end this thread...

ta_erog said:
I think "open source" and Linux "movement?" is rather like the 50's hippie free love / communism movements . . . great ideas but in practice, But totally untenable in reality and will only end in failure due to our rather immutable human nature.
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Exactly my thoughts, but then again I'm a business major.
 
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