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Why do people install SSDs on laptops?

V

Vithar

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 6, 2012
Messages
269
Most laptops only have 1 hard drive slot and I notice some people tend to install an SSD here, why is that? I mean sure its faster but with no regular HDD you have all those temporary files being written to the SSD, you have your browser's cache going into the SSD, and bunch of other constant writes being done on the SSD. Correct me if I'm wrong but wont this drastically shorten the life of an SSD?
 
No. The lifespan issue for SSDs has been greatly overblown. You can write gigabytes a day to the drive with no ill effects. Install it like a normal drive, and use it like a normal drive.
 
They are fast, they are silent and they consume less power than a fast harddisk. My Laptop, that is used almost daily for work and browsing is still using an 160 GB Intel G2 and shows 2.54 TB written. Most SSDs can sustain much more than that. If it dies, I will just buy a new one. Intel specifies 7.5-15 TB for that drive, and I know for sure that I will be replacing the drive for a larger one (and the whole laptop) long before I reach that number. The Intel specs are a minimum, I remember reading a test where hundreds of GBs had been written to such a drive till it did not accept new data.
 
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...a laptop is still a computer - just like a desktop. My SSD has 10+ TB reads and almost 10TB write and it's still going strong, shows 100% health...no issues. What I did with my laptop was put my SSD where the hard drive was and use a HDD caddy in the DVD drive slot - 500gb spinner in there for bulk storage.
 
In fact you get only the maximum out of the low access times of an ssd if you put everything that is often and randomly accessed (like temporary files and caches) onto it. The only exception would be for example the hibernation file if it is used very often. If you hibernate a 16 GB computer once a day you would write almost 6 TB per year additionally. While I avoided that for the current laptop (and it boots faster than it wakes up from hibernation), I would do it with a desktop PC I guess.
 
So then why is it that the corsair forum still keeps those stickies there about taking care of your ssd, and that people still say you can't defrag them, and that you still need a regular hdd. Don't get me wrong I'm not doubting you guys but this information is just contrary to what I've been told, by almost everybody I've asked.
 
Plus they are more resistant to drops and bumps while being accessed. I have SSDs in my laptops, if it ever dies I'll put another one in there.
 
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Vithar said:
So then why is it that the corsair forum still keeps those stickies there about taking care of your ssd, and that people still say you can't defrag them, and that you still need a regular hdd.
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You don't NEED to defrag SSDs, the whole point of defragmenting regular spinning disks is to organize the data in a more efficient way so it's no going all over the drive to read the data you are needing access to. SSDs have incredible good (Read instant) read access to any part of the drive since nothing needs to move, so defragging doesn't benefit you at all.

Additionally, defragging unnecessarily reads and writes data, reducing the life of the drive. While I agree that the lifetime of an SSD due to excessive writes is greatly exaggerated, it's just not needed and is not helpful in any way.

If you can get by with the smaller relative side of SSDs, then use them. I don't really store much on my various laptops and desktops since all my big media is stored on a central server, so I can get by with 30GB/60GB/128GB SSDs in all my laptops and desktops.
 
I know you shouldn't defrag ssds but I was recently told on this forum that even defragging wont kill an ssd, which again is contrary to what I've been told all along. So guess my next question is, assuming money isn't an issue do you really need an HDD or can you just use a really big SSD and still not have it fail on you a few years down the line because it has too many writes?
 
If I used up my SSD to the end of its life that just means that there was a lot of time I saved vs using a mechanical HDD. I backup all my stuff anyway so big deal if / when it does break. A quality 128GB SSD can be had for less than than $100 in the worst case.
 
Defragging WILL reduce the lifetime of an SSD. Why would you do it if you get nearly nothing out of it? If the SSD provides enough space, there is really no advantage of using a harddisk.
 
Vithar said:
So guess my next question is, assuming money isn't an issue do you really need an HDD or can you just use a really big SSD and still not have it fail on you a few years down the line because it has too many writes?
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No, if you can get a big enough SSD for your purpose, you don't need a normal HDD. Again, hundreds of terabytes of writes.
 
Vithar said:
I know you shouldn't defrag ssds but I was recently told on this forum that even defragging wont kill an ssd, which again is contrary to what I've been told all along. So guess my next question is, assuming money isn't an issue do you really need an HDD or can you just use a really big SSD and still not have it fail on you a few years down the line because it has too many writes?
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Whoever told you that defragging will "kill an SSD" should be shot for over-aggressive hyperbole.

Yeah you'll get some completely unnecessary writes out of the operation (equivalent to the amount of data moved) but that's not even a drop in the bucket.

Defragging is probably more wear and tear on a mechanical HDD than an SSD, and with modern filesystems I really question the need to do defragmentation at all, but that's a whole other soapbox. Old habits are hard to die.

Also all things like cache, temp files, etc. should be left on the SSD where they can best take advantage of the speed. Unless your laptop intends to be the primary database server for Twitter, you'll never run into write amplification problems.
 
I feel the question is better phrased... who DOESN'T put a SSD in a laptop :)

Expect those wanting 1TB of portable porn.... er... videos....er... um.... math. Those that need 1TB of portable math.
 
The main problem with defragging is that it will hurt performance, not help. It will cause fragmentation, because there is no correlation between the logical addresses of the blocks and the physical addressees in the drive, the controller allocates data on the fly. The way to really defrag one is to make an image with a software that will do it file by file, and then restore that image on the SSD, preferably after a secure erase.
 
Vithar said:
Most laptops only have 1 hard drive slot and I notice some people tend to install an SSD here, why is that? I mean sure its faster but with no regular HDD you have all those temporary files being written to the SSD, you have your browser's cache going into the SSD, and bunch of other constant writes being done on the SSD. Correct me if I'm wrong but wont this drastically shorten the life of an SSD?
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Because I can't stand noisy mechanical drives and will never use an internal one ever again. Also how would an SSD in a desktop be any different in relation to the temporary files, browser's cache, and bunch of other constant writes you mentioned?

Firebug24k said:
I feel the question is better phrased... who DOESN'T put a SSD in a laptop :)
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This^ My M5 Pro finally arrived and I'm officially done with internal hard drives.

img20120926192905.jpg


M5 Pro

m5p95.jpg


M3 (Sata II)

m395.jpg
 
SSD's don't need to be defraged and like others have said they actually decrease performance due to the disconnect between software blocks and physical blocks as stated before. SSD's are made of flash memory which degrades when you write to it, over time. As many have said, that measn 7.5-13TB for intel drives. What this means is that you would have to do general use for 6-7 years for it to break.

Apart from that SSD's use as low as 0.15W at idle and a bit more when in use. Theres no moving parts. If you drop a computer with an ssd... the ssd is less likely to break than a HDD.

One of the main reasons for needing a regular HDD is that SSD's although less expensive then they used to be are still way more expensive per gigabyte so you'll need it for storage. But in terms of Laptops, using a hard drive is kinda pointless unless you need 100s of movies at your fingertips. With most people streaming from netflix or from their desktops, there is no reason to use a HDD on your laptop.

So they are faster, less likely to get damaged from moving, take less power, and have long enough lifetimes where you would probably replace the laptop before the SSD. Theres really no reason not to have them in your laptop unless you have incredible storage issues and at that point I would say re-evaluate where you should be storing things of value (with backups and such).
 
lol op why the hell wouldn't you? They make a world of difference over mechanical sata drives and I just don't see why you wouldn't.
 
Is this even a question? :rolleyes:

I've had an Intel X25-M 120GB in my laptop for going on three years now, just checked the SMART data....

I'm up to 3TB writes. At this rate it will last longer than me. Maybe I'll turn defrag on so I can replace it sooner.
 
Laptops tend to benefit far more performance-wise as a percentage with a SSD than a desktop does. Main reason is that most laptops have crappy slow RPM hard drives optimized for power saving versus performance compared to desktop hard drives. This is exacerbated when you have decent CPU's in laptops that are seriously choked on drive read data acquisitions and will basically come alive with a good SSD. Not to say a desktop does not benefit greatly too, but in regards to laptops, but I will take a run-of-the-mill CPU laptop combined with a fast SSD over a high powered CPU laptop and a laptop hard drive any day of the week.
 
If you guys are giving data about how much you've written it would be nice if you could include some more information such as:

Model of SSD
Capacity in GB
Amount of data written
SMART percentage remaining.

Me, I have an SSD 320 80GB in my laptop and it's really nice. My laptop only has one moving part now, the CPU fan. After writing 162 GB it still shows 100% life remaining.

Also, just got an OCZ Synapse 64GB caching drive for my desktop and after 250 GB of data the SMART indicator is still at 100%.

Honestly OP, you will get years and years of use out of an SSD before it wears out, and these things will sell for pennies when it finally does.

Swank said:
I'm up to 3TB writes. At this rate it will last longer than me. Maybe I'll turn defrag on so I can replace it sooner.
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:D
 
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HeavensCloud said:
Plus they are more resistant to drops and bumps while being accessed. I have SSDs in my laptops, if it ever dies I'll put another one in there.
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Yep. You get speed and don't have to worry as much about vibrations.

xer0 said:
Laptops tend to benefit far more performance-wise as a percentage with a SSD than a desktop does. Main reason is that most laptops have crappy slow RPM hard drives optimized for power saving versus performance compared to desktop hard drives. This is exacerbated when you have decent CPU's in laptops that are seriously choked on drive read data acquisitions and will basically come alive with a good SSD. Not to say a desktop does not benefit greatly too, but in regards to laptops, but I will take a run-of-the-mill CPU laptop combined with a fast SSD over a high powered CPU laptop and a laptop hard drive any day of the week.
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Agree. The cost has come down enough as well. I needed to replace the hd in my work notebook(core 2 dell xfr). I could spend 50 or 60 bucks on a standard sata drive or like 90 on a samsung 128 gig ssd. The system only had like an 80 gig in it before and I didn't need the extra space. The SSD seemed like a no brainier. All I can say is wow you notice the difference.
 
OCZ Vertex 2 (a good one)
240GB
12700GB written in 15555 hours
life remaining 100%
 
Vithar said:
Most laptops only have 1 hard drive slot and I notice some people tend to install an SSD here, why is that? I mean sure its faster but with no regular HDD you have all those temporary files being written to the SSD, you have your browser's cache going into the SSD, and bunch of other constant writes being done on the SSD. Correct me if I'm wrong but wont this drastically shorten the life of an SSD?
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Because 2.5" drives are fucking slow and SSDs don't care about form factor for speed.
(And some of us replace their optical drive with the factory laptop HDD for bulk storage).
 
First test with an SSD was a Vertex 3 120GB in my wife's XPS M1530 (spec'd high). The speed was noticeable especially the boot up time. Won't go back to an HDD now. The more people adopt SSDs we'll see even faster drives and lower prices. SSDs!!!!
 
Vithar said:
Most laptops only have 1 hard drive slot and I notice some people tend to install an SSD here, why is that? I mean sure its faster but with no regular HDD you have all those temporary files being written to the SSD, you have your browser's cache going into the SSD, and bunch of other constant writes being done on the SSD. Correct me if I'm wrong but wont this drastically shorten the life of an SSD?
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the hdd in my laptop is a low spec 5400rpm drive, its crazy slow.

sure the cpu isnt great either but for sure the speed killer is the hdd.

a ssd would transform my laptop, with that said tho your point is valid on temporary internet files. When I made my ram disk for temp internet files it was a gig in size and within 20 minutes of browsing was full. My browsing probably does at least 10 gig a day of writing data, plus its random data making it even worse. So on a hdd temp internet files will be fragment hell, and on a ssd they will be write wear hell, conclusion write temp internet files to ram disks. :)

also the power saving.
 
I have a Crucial M4 in my laptop that really made the difference between annoyingly sluggish and quite zippy. Boots up in about 10-15 seconds. I've had it for about a year now.

I have no other drives in it, so no where else to put temp files. Hibernation/sleep/etc still turned on. The only change I really made was to turn the min/max page file down, since it's got 8gb RAM. SSD life says my SSD should die in about 2020. I don't imagine I will still have this drive or laptop come 2020.
 
I put an SSD in my 7 year old laptop. It's faster than my mothers brand new i3 laptop & the battery lasts a hell of a lot longer now.

SSD's rock.
 
I run a single 256GB SSD in my desktop and that's it.

I want all those temp files and programs and games on my SSD because it's so fast. That's why I bought the SSD, for the speed.

I don't worry about usage. I'm sure i'll get at least 5 years out of it. SSDLife Pro tells me 8 years at my current usage rate.

By then 256GB will be too small and I will want a new, and faster SSD and they will be even cheaper by then too.


But why use a SSD in a laptop?

Lower power (longer battery)
Less heat (burning your lap)
Faster performance
Shock resistant (laptops move around a lot)
 
What program can I download to find out how many TB of writes I have left?
 
Vithar said:
What program can I download to find out how many TB of writes I have left?
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They really do not measure it that way. What I mean is they do not tell you how many thousand TBs you have left or something like that since SSDs do not work that way. There is not really a fixed number of bytes written before the drive can not write but it is more to do with how many times each cell is written/erased. However there are programs that will display % life from the SMART data that drives keep. At last look my 3+ year 80GB G1 Intel SSD on my HTPC had 99% life left.
 
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yea, I find a laptop benefits from a SSD more than a desktop.

-For a desktop you get speed
-For a laptop you get speed, power consumption, heat output, durability and in special cases physical size!

At work we order all out laptops with SSDs. And don't forget about the mini PCie SSD + 2.5" HDD option :)
 
He is right.

With a laptop you are constantly turning it off/on or suspending/resuming. SSD kicks ass at those scenarios.

A traditional desktop is rebooted once a week, has plenty of ram and all of this can minimize the difference between SSD and HD.

For gaming I notice SSD performance mainly in MMOs like WOW and GW2

I(illa Bee said:
yea, I find a laptop benefits from a SSD more than a desktop.

-For a desktop you get speed
-For a laptop you get speed, power consumption, heat output, durability and in special cases physical size!

At work we order all out laptops with SSDs. And don't forget about the mini PCie SSD + 2.5" HDD option :)
Click to expand...
 
i typically install them IN laptops. i suppose an external could be installed ON a laptop though.
 
my rule of thumb... no system what so every without a ssd as the boot/root drive... everything else is just a waste of time ;)
 
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